4 die, up to 40 held hostage in Binghamton shootings

[longam]

Police arrive at a shooting in Binghamton, New York, where people are believed to be held hostage.

http://www.cnn.com/2009/CRIME/04/03/...ml#cnnSTCVideo

[AVGWarhawk]

That is a shame.

[SteamWake]

Heard about this.. very disturbing.

No mention of a motive yet, although it did occur at an INS office so Im assuming it has something to do with citizinship status.

[UnderseaLcpl]

Originally Posted by SteamWake

Heard about this.. very disturbing.

No mention of a motive yet, although it did occur at an INS office so Im assuming it has something to do with citizinship status.

Could be. Here's another thing about it from msn;
http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/30030756/?GT1=43001


One thing I wonder is where the hell the security was. INS is a government entity, right? Even the DMV has armed policemen standing around, where were they in this case?

[nikimcbee]

Originally Posted by UnderseaLcpl

Could be. Here's another thing about it from msn;
http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/30030756/?GT1=43001


One thing I wonder is where the hell the security was. INS is a government entity, right? Even the DMV has armed policemen standing around, where were they in this case?

My heart goes out to these poor people. The thing that worries me, is when the administration is going to take advantage of this "crisis" and go after the second amendment. It's just a matter of time.

And for the cops at the DMV, here in or-gone, the DMV is more like the Mexican consulate. We are subverting national law and giving DLs to anyone, regardless of citizenship (did I mention you can register to vote on the same piece of paper). I've never seen armed anybody at the DMV. I hate going there!

[SteamWake]

Originally Posted by UnderseaLcpl

Could be. Here's another thing about it from msn;
http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/30030756/?GT1=43001


One thing I wonder is where the hell the security was. INS is a government entity, right? Even the DMV has armed policemen standing around, where were they in this case?

Well it turns out I was wrong (nothing new) it was not an INS office rather a citizenship group of some sort that helps people get their citizenship. Not the kind of place one expects to become a shooting gallery. There was a 'test' going on at the time.

[Yahoshua]

There's a total of 13 dead, 2 B&W were on scene within 5 minutes of the first 911 call, a litte later for SWAT to arrive yet it took over an hour to secure the scene.

What's the point of a SWAT team if they're going to rush to the scene of the crime and then sit on their ass outin the parking lot?

What's the point of a SWAT team if they're going to rush to the scene of the crime and then sit on their ass outin the parking lot?

Because by the time the police arrived it had already developed into a hostage situation .
You can't just go into a building with guns blazing when it is full of innocent people as well as a lunatic gunman .

[Frame57]

Reminds me of an Incident in Russia a few years back. Some dirt bags held some hostages in a theatre. But the Russkies did it right and went in and took of the matter with extreme prejudice.

Reminds me of an Incident in Russia a few years back. Some dirt bags held some hostages in a theatre. But the Russkies did it right and went in and took of the matter with extreme prejudice.

Is that the case where they killed the hostages and the terrorists in the theatre without giving a #### about the hostages ?
Yeah thats the right way to go when the terrorists don't give a #### if they live or die .

[Frame57]

Sometimes you have to break a few eggs to make an Omelet. If I were in a situation where the bad guys seemed hell bent on killing people anyway, then I am all for this type of tactic. People died anyway in this situation, would SWAT have made it worse?

[Platapus]

sorta like "we had to destroy the village in order to save it"?

Sometimes you have to break a few eggs to make an Omelet. If I were in a situation where the bad guys seemed hell bent on killing people anyway, then I am all for this type of tactic. People died anyway in this situation, would SWAT have made it worse?

Bloody hell ??? and you claim to have served?
Well excuse me Mr. Frame , but them people in the basement that the SWAT team finally established were not lunatic murderers but rather innocent victims of the situation , would you go making an omlette down there ?
Hey people died anyway ao what the hell .
BTW sorry about the little league comment earlier , I realise now that you belong in the special league where everyone is a "winner"

[Tchocky]

Out of the hostages that died, I think only one of them hadn't been killed by the gas.

[Frame57]

See there you go again. Labeling "special" people....I think your buddy Barak said something to that effect on Leno and stuck his foot in his mouth, kinda like you....OK, off the hashish again Tribesman. If we keep letting any type of goon take hostages without bringing the hammer down then it will never stop. But if they fear immediate and swift reaction maybe that will save lives. If you want an education on what real world military mindedness is all about, I Invite you to read "RED-Cell" by Richard Marcinko. You can also see him on Facebook and I commented on his article "Ethics on Terrorism". In 2011 we are having our Archerfish re-union in Groton Conn. Stop by and I will buy you a beer, but leave your hallucinogenics at home.