Thank You!!!

[thumper]

For an absolutely beautiful subsim ubisoft.. But the REAL thanks go to the modders who got down amongst the nuts,bolts,and grease to really make this sim what it is.. Again THANK YOU!!

[Rockin Robbins]

I remember we tried that with the devs. They weren't having any of it. "We ARE Ubi," they said. "Without Ubi there would be no devs" they said. I hear a faint echo of that now, growing in volume as their numbers grow.

This is not a chicken or the egg riddle. Clearly there must be a game before the modders have anything at all to do. Clearly modders can only do what the design of the game permits them to do.

I admire the modders greatly, but they admire the game and the people who made it. Who am I to argue with superior reasoning?

[SteamWake]

Forgive me if Im wrong but wasent UBI just the publisher?

[Seminole]

:hmm: ...Ah..pshaaa....where would any of them be without the bottomless wallets of gamers to grease the way?.....


Don't we deserve some credit too ?... ...you think its easy sititng in front of a computer hour after hour while the world passes us by and our arteries turn into clogged canals of stone ?...

They ought to erect us a monument....come to think of it ....they probably will...eventually... over in Shady Acres...

[Diopos]

Yeap. And a special monument for those trying to play the game after reading the manual... only.

[Quillan]

Originally Posted by SteamWake

Forgive me if Im wrong but wasent UBI just the publisher?

Technically, no. It was the Ubisoft studio in Romania that developed the game; it wasn't an outside firm that did the game and handed it off to be published.

[Arclight]

Originally Posted by Diopos

Yeap. And a special monument for those trying to play the game after reading the manual... only.

Think you're more likely to end up in an asylum then in a grave in that case.

[Nunya]

The very first computer game I bought back in 1990 was Silent Service II. I was just thinking the other day how far subsims have progressed since then.

So, yes, I am very gratefull for the developers and the modders that have kept subsims going and improving over the years.

[Seminole]

Yes...and look just how far manuals have digressed?... ..over that same time peroid...

One of my early titles was Their Finest Hour....The Battle of Britain by Lucas Arts.

The game though tons and tons of entertainment, is positively stongeage by today's standards.

BUT....that manual.... ....I still have it in my reference library as it is a pretty comprehensive resource on the history of the BoB, as well as a detailed gamer's guide to playing the game.


...and come to think of it..I still have those 5 1/2 inch floppies somewhere too...

[Diopos]

Ah the manual thing!
In the B.C. era (Before Computer that is) wargaming manuals had to include fundamental things as! Combat Result Tables, Terrain Effect Modfiers and so on. So you had the "numeric soul" of the game staring you in the eyes. Throw in the rest of the rules and voila! here are you're game tactics/strategy! Some times it was easy, some times not, some times they had an "air" of their own and some times they were just plain difficult for the sake of being... uhm plain difficult. But the game manual was a there. Even if it was badly written you could always introduce some "home rules" if you had some "experience" (the equivalent of "modding").

Than came the A.C. era (After Computer obviously eh!). Hey no need any more to sum attack and defense values and throw the dice and consult this or that table. The puter does that! Right? Well yes! So If you don't use the tables and the charts and all that frustrating items any more why should you even be "exposed" to them!
So the developers, promoters, etc decided:
1.) Informative manuals can be complicated and "scare off" casual players
2.) We can "hide" major portions of the game engines/rules as "hardcoded" and/or "protecetd"
Now you need to experiment more with the game you choose to play. This maybe good or bad. Imagine spending your little free (gaming) time for weeks on a game that is too simplistic or too complex for you. Now this could happen in a table top game too but as soon as you opened the box and had a glimpse on the manual and the game components... well somehow you Knew if the game was right for you or it would end up in the top shelf...unused.

...of course you have movement and graphics that get better all the time and hidden enemy units... but I was born in the B.C. era.

[doulos05]

Yeah, sadly that's a reflection on the mainstream attitude towards computing. When games like that were being written, people viewed computers like houses. Obviously if you're going to be spending any length of time in it, you want to see how everything works and maybe even do a bit of home improvement. Now, it seems the majority of people see computers like most people see the airplanes they fly on.

They don't care how it works, why the wingtips are bent (fuel economy, for those who are curious. It can reduce fuel consumption by 5-10% because it reduces the turblence created by the wings) or how the controls work. They only care that they get on at one airport and get off safely at another (preferably the airport listed as the "destination" on their tickets). While I'm a bit young to remember first-hand things written with the "your computer is your virtual house" attitude, I'm a sucker for retro-tech and Linux so I'd like to think I see my computer like I see my house (and I'd also like to think I'm a bit of a handy-man in my computer, because I certainly don't think I am when it comes to my real house ), and I try to crawl around in the attic and basement every so often to see what's there and even make a few changes. It's kinda sad to me that most people don't see it that way (especially since, just like home repair, once you know a little it goes a long way).

The devs did a great job building the house, but I'm glad that the modders have gone in and moved a few walls, added that extra half-bath, and completely renovated the kitchen. It adds a lot of value to what would otherwise just be a slightly above average house for this neighborhood.

What? Too much? I carried the metaphor too far, didn't I. I know, I felt it too but I just couldn't stop.

[Diopos]

Did you get a permit for the house renovation????