Battle of Midway Questions

[Shyzar]

I just refitted at Midway and got a message asking patrol craft to divert to the Midway Area. If I do divert,will I find anything? And if so, where would I find it off the coast of Midway (100nm, 50nm etc.)?Also, if tthere is something, what large warships would be there?

[tater]

I dont remmeber how far NW the IJN force is in the campaign layers, honestly. There are forces out there. Oddly, only 3 CVs, not 4. The ships are packed together like sardines in a can (unhistorically, since the spacing between CVs the morning of June 4th was 8,000m), and there are not the right number of ships. The types are also wrong even though they have many of the correct ships in the roster to use, or better substitutions.

I'd have to look at the mission file, but they SHOULD be ~200nm NW of Midway.

[Shyzar]

Originally Posted by tater

I dont remmeber how far NW the IJN force is in the campaign layers, honestly. There are forces out there. Oddly, only 3 CVs, not 4. The ships are packed together like sardines in a can (unhistorically, since the spacing between CVs the morning of June 4th was 8,000m), and there are not the right number of ships. The types are also wrong even though they have many of the correct ships in the roster to use, or better substitutions.

I'd have to look at the mission file, but they SHOULD be ~200nm NW of Midway.

In the game it's May 29. Should I just sit around 200nm NW of Midway until the attack or should I go farther out?

[orangenee]

You may also find they appear on the wrong date as well, the real battle started on the 4th of June 1942, but in game it's been known to kick off maybe a day or so later than that.

[tater]

If you don't want to take your chances like RL, you can always open the Battle of Midway.mis file with the campaign editor (SH4 folder/Data/Campaigns/Campaign/Battle_ofMidway.miss (or something close to that name)). Don;t save anything once opened, just quit when you are done looking at it. You will see the path they take on the map.

[Shyzar]

Originally Posted by tater

If you don't want to take your chances like RL, you can always open the Battle of Midway.mis file with the campaign editor (SH4 folder/Data/Campaigns/Campaign/Battle_ofMidway.miss (or something close to that name)). Don;t save anything once opened, just quit when you are done looking at it. You will see the path they take on the map.

OK, thanks, will try later

[Shyzar]

When I looked, It looked like a total mess. Waypoints everywhere. But I figured out that two of the best forces are passing aboout 565 KM NW of Midway.
For anyone who also wants this information. 566 km is about 305 nm.

[Jace11]

there was a date bug with midway layer causing main carrier force not to appear..

think some mods have fixed it..

[tater]

Well, the real TF had waypoints all over. Remember that in RL the Cvs need to steam into the wind to launch or receive aircraft.

The Midway mission is just so wrong. They made the right groups (Nagumo, Yamamoto, Tanaka, etc), and they populated them with ships. they didn't pay the slightest attention to putting the right ships in the right places. This is not a substitution issue, they've actually put the wrong ships in places where they actually have the proper ships in game.

The Main Body should have 2xNagato BB, 1xYamato. Nagato isn't in game, so Fuso would be a good sub. They used 2xKongo, no Yamato (I see TFs with multi Yamatos all the time, and the one place I should see ONE, there are none, lol). The Kondo force should have 2xKongo, they used Ise. Most groups have the wrong DDs escorting, even when they actually had the right model to use. Some substitutions make more sense than others, too, since many IJN DDs are visually nearly identical (improved version of previous class). Just sloppy.

I am working on a proper Midway mission for the campaign.

For now, I will just put all the right (or decent substitutions when unavailable) ships in, and not mess with the waypoints. The stock version will be a mess once air assets come into play I think.

[Shyzar]

Originally Posted by tater

Well, the real TF had waypoints all over. Remember that in RL the Cvs need to steam into the wind to launch or receive aircraft.

The Midway mission is just so wrong. They made the right groups (Nagumo, Yamamoto, Tanaka, etc), and they populated them with ships. they didn't pay the slightest attention to putting the right ships in the right places. This is not a substitution issue, they've actually put the wrong ships in places where they actually have the proper ships in game.

The Main Body should have 2xNagato BB, 1xYamato. Nagato isn't in game, so Fuso would be a good sub. They used 2xKongo, no Yamato (I see TFs with multi Yamatos all the time, and the one place I should see ONE, there are none, lol). The Kondo force should have 2xKongo, they used Ise. Most groups have the wrong DDs escorting, even when they actually had the right model to use. Some substitutions make more sense than others, too, since many IJN DDs are visually nearly identical (improved version of previous class). Just sloppy.

I am working on a proper Midway mission for the campaign.

For now, I will just put all the right (or decent substitutions when unavailable) ships in, and not mess with the waypoints. The stock version will be a mess once air assets come into play I think.

But, the main force of carriers will still appear, right? But if not, which mod fixes it?

[Jace11]

Originally Posted by tater

Well, the real TF had waypoints all over. Remember that in RL the Cvs need to steam into the wind to launch or receive aircraft.

The Main Body should have 2xNagato BB, 1xYamato. Nagato isn't in game, so Fuso would be a good sub. They used 2xKongo, no Yamato (I see TFs with multi Yamatos all the time, and the one place I should see ONE, there are none, lol). The Kondo force should have 2xKongo, they used Ise. Most groups have the wrong DDs escorting, even when they actually had the right model to use. Some substitutions make more sense than others, too, since many IJN DDs are visually nearly identical (improved version of previous class). Just sloppy

I dunno, looking at the Nagato, Kongo and Fusos, the Kongo seems the best choice to me for the Main Body, it has the same number of turrets and funnels, a fuso looks a lot different, but each to his own...

I too have had a go at the midway layer, bit of mess at the moment, unfinished etc

http://www.speedyshare.com/166718580.html

[tater]

Good point, I was looking at the years, speeds, etc. For now it's Fuso, Maybe I'll change it to Kongo in version 0.6.

---------------------------------------------------------------------------------


Here is a Midway Mod for your enjoyment. JSGME Ready.

http://mpgtext.net/subshare/270Battl...way%20beta.rar


README:
This is a fixed up Battle of Midway in the CAMPAIGN. This is not a single mission!

The mission is not changed from the layers in the stock SH4 game except for a few things, so don't expect perfect historical accuracy! I might work to make a better version, this is just a version better than the crappy stock version in terms of units used, timing, etc. I only changed IJN units since I don't expect to see the US units much. Except that they move way too far west. I'd delete that, but I haven't gotten that far yet, wait for version 2, lol.

Changes from stock mission:

1. Massive changes in the exact Japanese units shown. All units are now named with their real names. Every DD. All ships except transports. Some substitutions are made. All Kageros Class DDs are subbed with the nearly identical Asashio, Fuso for Nagato, etc.

2. Massive changes in the formations of the ships. The Kido Butai is set up somewhat properly in a 7-8000m box formation. The Guard DDs behind each CV may or may not leave station, unfortunately. The other groups are made up in terms of how they are arrayed. Anyone with a better idea for the formations of the Main BOdy, Invasion Force, etc, please let me know.

3. A few waypoint changes to get the timings at least somewhat right. Units were still set to start on january 1st in the stock Midway mission. this is now fixed, they start June 1st instead.

4. The stock layer has these ships at sea to start---so does this mod. A future version would back them up into port, but that fouls all the timings up, and this was a quick job for version 0.5, so they start at sea like they do in the stock game.

Enjoy!

tater

[tater]

There are a few issues I need to iron out. Will get to it later this evening and up v0.6 after dinner (3-4 hours)

[Shyzar]

Originally Posted by tater

Good point, I was looking at the years, speeds, etc. For now it's Fuso, Maybe I'll change it to Kongo in version 0.6.

---------------------------------------------------------------------------------


Here is a Midway Mod for your enjoyment. JSGME Ready.

http://mpgtext.net/subshare/270Battl...way%20beta.rar


README:
This is a fixed up Battle of Midway in the CAMPAIGN. This is not a single mission!

The mission is not changed from the layers in the stock SH4 game except for a few things, so don't expect perfect historical accuracy! I might work to make a better version, this is just a version better than the crappy stock version in terms of units used, timing, etc. I only changed IJN units since I don't expect to see the US units much. Except that they move way too far west. I'd delete that, but I haven't gotten that far yet, wait for version 2, lol.

Changes from stock mission:

1. Massive changes in the exact Japanese units shown. All units are now named with their real names. Every DD. All ships except transports. Some substitutions are made. All Kageros Class DDs are subbed with the nearly identical Asashio, Fuso for Nagato, etc.

2. Massive changes in the formations of the ships. The Kido Butai is set up somewhat properly in a 7-8000m box formation. The Guard DDs behind each CV may or may not leave station, unfortunately. The other groups are made up in terms of how they are arrayed. Anyone with a better idea for the formations of the Main BOdy, Invasion Force, etc, please let me know.

3. A few waypoint changes to get the timings at least somewhat right. Units were still set to start on january 1st in the stock Midway mission. this is now fixed, they start June 1st instead.

4. The stock layer has these ships at sea to start---so does this mod. A future version would back them up into port, but that fouls all the timings up, and this was a quick job for version 0.5, so they start at sea like they do in the stock game.

Enjoy!

tater

Thanks, will try later.

[tater]

Version 0.6 up
JSGME ready (which is good since I think it'll need to come and go a lot).

http://mpgtext.net/subshare/192Battle%20of%20Midway%20beta.rar

A few internal date changes to make it work (one group was not timed right).