Upscaled res? (Massive Screenshot)

Boris · 04-03-07, 07:09 AM

I just got SH4 today an am starting to play around with it, looking for all the things people were complaining about.

Now, I'm not sure I'm experiencing the upscaled res thing people have been talking about in 3d views.
Sure, no AA, but 1680x1024 seems to be working fine.

DragonRR1 · 04-03-07, 07:16 AM

Basically.. If you see major jaggies at 1680x1024 the problem is resolution AND FSAA. Your screenshot has these jaggies!

At TRUE 1680x1024 on, for example, a 22" screen the pixels would be tiny and whilst without AA you would see jaggies they would be barely discernable.

Boris · 04-03-07, 07:25 AM

Yes, but there was talk that the res in 3d views was just an upscaled 1024x768, which would make the jaggies massive on a 22 incher.

alexoscar · 04-03-07, 07:47 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Boris

Yes, but there was talk that the res in 3d views was just an upscaled 1024x768, which would make the jaggies massive on a 22 incher.

I see massive jaggies in that picture. Horrible I would say. Moreover, UBI has recognized this question and the Dev. Team have stated they are working to solve this question together other questions/bugs.

Its only a upscaled image.

Regards

DragonRR1 · 04-03-07, 08:49 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Boris

Yes, but there was talk that the res in 3d views was just an upscaled 1024x768, which would make the jaggies massive on a 22 incher.

Effectively each pixel on an image upscaled from 1024x768 to 1680x1024 would be:

Horizontally 1680/1024= 1.64 times larger
Vertically 1024/768 = 1.33 times larger

Very roughly each actual pixel on your 22" is around 0.3mm square so each game pixel is about 0.4mm to 0.5mm of screen area or 1 and a bit pixels.

This is basically as your screenshot shows. To me the jaggies are pretty massive! But everything is of course relative!

flintlock · 04-03-07, 10:34 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by DragonRR1

Effectively each pixel on an image upscaled from 1024x768 to 1680x1024 would be:
Horizontally 1680/1024= 1.64 times larger
Vertically 1024/768 = 1.33 times larger
This is basically as your screenshot shows.

Yes, the game engine is unfortunately still very much shackled to a dated 1024x768 fixed resolution.

If you run the game on a 4:3 15" LCD at a resolution of 1024x768, then run it on a 16:10 22" LCD with a native resolution of 1680x1050, you'll notice immediately that you don't have a wider field of view that a widescreen compliant res would offer. What you will notice is that you actually see less on your 22" widescreen than the 15" 4:3 LCD user sees, because the fixed 1024x768 resolution is upscaled, then cropped accordingly.

I'm sure the design decision behind this was one of necessity. Getting SH4 to natively support 16:10 aspect ratios with a wider field of view would have been a major technical undertaking.

RocketDog · 04-03-07, 10:45 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by flintlock

I'm sure the design decision behind this was one of necessity. Getting SH4 to natively support 16:10 aspect ratios with a wider field of view would have been a major technical undertaking.

I would be interested to know a bit more about why the devs did lock it into 1024x768, 4:3 and no FSAA. Out-of-the-box SH3 is locked in 1024x768, but the community hack makes it perfectly playable in other resolutions. I use 1600x1200 with 4xFSAA and 4xAF and it storms along without any problems at all. If a hack could make it work, it can't be that much of a problem so why on Earth did the devs not do the same thing in both SH3 and SH4? Perplexing.

Cheers,

RD.

flintlock · 04-03-07, 10:54 AM

To the OP, here's a graphical representation (provided by another user) of what SH4 does with the it's native 4:3 resolution in terms of upscaling then cropping the image to accommodate much higher 16:10 aspect ratio resolutions.

ParaB · 04-03-07, 10:57 AM

IMO the pic looks horrible. Look at the front of the conning tower and the bow. Much worse jaggies than @ 1024x768 on my CRT. With a resolution of 1680x1024 you should see no jaggies at all.

DragonRR1 · 04-03-07, 11:21 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by RocketDog

Quote:

Originally Posted by flintlock

I'm sure the design decision behind this was one of necessity. Getting SH4 to natively support 16:10 aspect ratios with a wider field of view would have been a major technical undertaking.

I would be interested to know a bit more about why the devs did lock it into 1024x768, 4:3 and no FSAA. Out-of-the-box SH3 is locked in 1024x768, but the community hack makes it perfectly playable in other resolutions. I use 1600x1200 with 4xFSAA and 4xAF and it storms along without any problems at all. If a hack could make it work, it can't be that much of a problem so why on Earth did the devs not do the same thing in both SH3 and SH4? Perplexing.

Cheers,

RD.

My guess.. as I've said in other posts is that either they just cut the time needed to finish and test high res... OR based on the fact that I still think the periscope view is in a higher res.. that the 3D was supposed to be dynamic, that it would auto-adjust to a set FPS speed, they didn't implement for time contraints.

E.Hartmann · 04-03-07, 12:18 PM

SH4 is nothing but SH3 in new clothes guys. (ok fan boys dont beat me up I generalized the statement) Its been brought up countless times. The Devs said they are going to fix it and maybe its because of all the money they made on the release they can no afford to do it right? Who knows. They said they are putting FSAA and AA and all that other AA stuff in soon enough.

Look at it this way, your playing the sim, the sim is fun, you paid $39 US to maybe even $150US to play it and you just gave UBI and the Design squad a large influx of cash and the subsim mod squad a new game to improve.

Lets wait and see what happens.

Chuck B. · 04-03-07, 02:31 PM

Agree with most posters here - jaggies in this shot are terrible. Just for clarification purposes, I have attached a screenshot of SHIII in real 1600x1200 with 8xFSAA and 16xAF. I have cropped the image to make it smaller, but the resolution is shown 1:1, so you can see what 1600x1200 with FSAA really looks like (you can see it especially well with the rigging)

Shakermaker · 04-03-07, 02:41 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Chuck B.

http://i70.photobucket.com/albums/i119/ChuckB_01/SHIII.jpg

I want my SH4 to look as smooth as that

DragonRR1 · 04-03-07, 03:21 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Chuck B.

Agree with most posters here - jaggies in this shot are terrible. Just for clarification purposes, I have attached a screenshot of SHIII in real 1600x1200 with 8xFSAA and 16xAF. I have cropped the image to make it smaller, but the resolution is shown 1:1, so you can see what 1600x1200 with FSAA really looks like (you can see it especially well with the rigging)

I don't know whether peeps have noticed but the old s/w AA SHIFT+PGUP key in SH3 makes SH3 look a lot like SH4! If you use it on SH3 running without h/w FSAA but @ 1600x1200 it messes up rigging etc..

Chuck B. · 04-03-07, 03:23 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Shakermaker

Quote:

Originally Posted by Chuck B.

http://i70.photobucket.com/albums/i119/ChuckB_01/SHIII.jpg

I want my SH4 to look as smooth as that

Believe me - you are certainly not alone!

04-03-07, 07:09 AM	#1
Boris Sea Lord Join Date: Jun 2005 Location: Hamburg, Germany Posts: 1,691 Downloads: 41 Uploads: 0	Upscaled res? (Massive Screenshot) I just got SH4 today an am starting to play around with it, looking for all the things people were complaining about. Now, I'm not sure I'm experiencing the upscaled res thing people have been talking about in 3d views. Sure, no AA, but 1680x1024 seems to be working fine.

04-03-07, 10:54 AM	#8
flintlock Ace of the Deep Join Date: Oct 2006 Posts: 1,177 Downloads: 0 Uploads: 0	To the OP, here's a graphical representation (provided by another user) of what SH4 does with the it's native 4:3 resolution in terms of upscaling then cropping the image to accommodate much higher 16:10 aspect ratio resolutions. Last edited by flintlock; 04-03-07 at 12:04 PM.

Thread Tools
Show Printable Version Email this Page
Display Modes
Linear Mode Switch to Hybrid Mode Switch to Threaded Mode

04-03-07, 07:16 AM	#2
DragonRR1 Officer Join Date: Mar 2007 Location: UK Posts: 246 Downloads: 0 Uploads: 0	Basically.. If you see major jaggies at 1680x1024 the problem is resolution AND FSAA. Your screenshot has these jaggies! At TRUE 1680x1024 on, for example, a 22" screen the pixels would be tiny and whilst without AA you would see jaggies they would be barely discernable.

04-03-07, 07:25 AM	#3
Boris Sea Lord Join Date: Jun 2005 Location: Hamburg, Germany Posts: 1,691 Downloads: 41 Uploads: 0	Yes, but there was talk that the res in 3d views was just an upscaled 1024x768, which would make the jaggies massive on a 22 incher.

04-03-07, 10:57 AM	#9
ParaB Chief Join Date: May 2005 Location: Germany Posts: 327 Downloads: 16 Uploads: 0	IMO the pic looks horrible. Look at the front of the conning tower and the bow. Much worse jaggies than @ 1024x768 on my CRT. With a resolution of 1680x1024 you should see no jaggies at all.

04-03-07, 12:18 PM	#11
E.Hartmann Soundman Join Date: Mar 2007 Posts: 147 Downloads: 0 Uploads: 0	SH4 is nothing but SH3 in new clothes guys. (ok fan boys dont beat me up I generalized the statement) Its been brought up countless times. The Devs said they are going to fix it and maybe its because of all the money they made on the release they can no afford to do it right? Who knows. They said they are putting FSAA and AA and all that other AA stuff in soon enough. Look at it this way, your playing the sim, the sim is fun, you paid $39 US to maybe even $150US to play it and you just gave UBI and the Design squad a large influx of cash and the subsim mod squad a new game to improve. Lets wait and see what happens.

04-03-07, 02:31 PM	#12
Chuck B. Watch Join Date: Aug 2004 Posts: 28 Downloads: 1 Uploads: 0	Agree with most posters here - jaggies in this shot are terrible. Just for clarification purposes, I have attached a screenshot of SHIII in real 1600x1200 with 8xFSAA and 16xAF. I have cropped the image to make it smaller, but the resolution is shown 1:1, so you can see what 1600x1200 with FSAA really looks like (you can see it especially well with the rigging)