Black swans

[andy_311]

Are these guys a world to there own or what?.They can't be Elite because GW v1.0 suppose not to have elite just vet's.
But like clockwork any convoy with Black Swans in it and I attract them like flies to sh*t.
Am in early 43 January these bastards can detect me from nearly 2800m nobody else can whats going on?

I just worked out run silent run deep (shallow approching a convoy)
gets you killed with them idiots about. I don;t know how you guys do it but if I don't find an answer soon am going to take out all escorts seems a waste of 5 or so but advice is appriciated Im also approching the convoy head on.

[Seminole]

You noticed that too huh?

Same here but I am finding them just as capable of locating me in the spring of 1940....but so far their depth charging is something less than competent. They do have a nasty habit of pranging my periscope though when I pop it up anywhere near a convoy.

Strange...

I'm in October, 41 (15 patrols) and I've never been pinged like that before. I wish I were. For me GW escorts are no threat at all. I never got killed by them in 15 patrols. In stock, that number was like 5, 6. (I'm playing dead is not dead until May, 1945)

Damn, I wish brit dds were more deadly.

SH3 = no challenge at all (so far)

When I played Silent Service II I had to dive deeper right after firing shots to earn more time to escape from escorts, but in SH3 I watch my shots score on peri and get away at leisure.

This is not cool. (I'm playing GW 1.0, everything on except manual
targeting)

[Keelbuster]

Originally Posted by midshipsnake

SH3 = no challenge at all (so far)

When I played Silent Service II I had to dive deeper right after firing shots to earn more time to escape from escorts, but in SH3 I watch my shots score on peri and get away at leisure.

This is not cool. (I'm playing GW 1.0, everything on except manual
targeting)

What year? You have to get lucky to get DCed before 42. In 43 you will be scared, and in 44 you will be killed. You will learn to fear the Black Swan. I _hate_ them. They can drop 10 DCs on you at a time. If you get attack by 2 of them, then kiss it goodbye.

Kb

Yeah I hope so. I want them to kill me for a change.

[Threadfin]

I agree with KB. I see lots of posts about how the ASW ships suck. I just don't see it. My guess is these people

-- haven't played later in the war
-- use mods that affect the capability
-- hang out on the surface with F12 and order rudder changes to counter every move by the ASW surface ships.

I say play in '43-'45 with no externals and there's no way you can say these guys suck at ASW.

And about those Black Swans... they bring a world of hurt in a hurry. They lay out a vicious pattern of depth charges. They are the ship I fear most in SH3.

-- haven't played later in the war

No, I haven't

-- use mods that affect the capability

GW 1.0 is the only mod I use.

-- hang out on the surface with F12 and order rudder changes to counter every move by the ASW surface ships.

Gee, I wish escorts were so deadly that I had to resort to that kinda stuff you talkin about.

I just hope they get smarter in 43-45.

[Wulfmann]

Anyone that wants their convoy attacks more scary just PM me an email address and I will send you a modded GW RND.mis file that has my escorts. Nothing less than a veteran and 2 to 3 times as many as the GW RND which is, IMO, the weak link in the mod.
They modded the rest of the RND but left the IC as they were and by now they are dated and way too easy.
I would guess 4 out of 5 that use this RND will quietly put the old safe one back and not admit it (Girly Men they would be!!).
I will also send you a Black Swan updated roster to include the early Sloop classes (BS was a sloop not a frigate) so you will see more of these sloops when they were used most, in the early years.
Sloops are slower, wider and less armed than DDs (Except for A/S weapons) but have better habitability for long convoy escorting as they carry enough fuel for the whole trip where as corvettes and DDs had to leave and refuel. Because they also have DC throwers they have 3 times the DC pattern when they come after you in latter years than the DDs. This will also be true of the US Lend Lease DE and the River class DE (The River is wrongly named as the model is a C Class type that was modified for convoy escorting) come into the game with their DC throwers.
I can not beat my RND file, it is too hard. But, it forces me to do things real Kaleuns had to do like attack from outside and hope for a hit that disables something use a homi fish to hit the close DD and hope to get away before 2 or 3 others get my scent then if I survive find the disabled merchant and get a kill.

The present career started off with me sinking a US DD as I was mauled. I was saved by the Homing fish but limped back to France with a 3.9 hull integrity. I have 69K tons in 5 patrols and have made it out of France to Bergen for only the second time in over 20 careers (although this had one less mission because my repairs took so long from the 3.96 thingy)
You will not survive long with typical sneak into the convoy tactics using this RND. There are simply too many escorts (although way less than real life).
This is the GW RND.mis file except the convoys have more escorts (and an occasional cruiser and escort carrier).
It is not available as a download.

Wulfmann

[Keelbuster]

That sounds like total hell. I have enough trouble as it is. However, I have to say it's kinda tempting, in a sick sorta way.

Kb

[TAW_CZAREJS]

I have to say that with GW 1.1 ASW is not good. I'm on patrol #16 and I've only had one close shave, never ever came close to 16 patrols in the stock or selectively modified setup. Currently I'm cruising along inside a convoy firing eels left and right, the escorts are nowhere near me and seem to be depth charging something well away from me. I've hardly seen any aircraft either. April of 1944 and I keep thinking it should be harder than this.

[Seminole]

Originally Posted by TAW_CZAREJS

I have to say that with GW 1.1 ASW is not good. I'm on patrol #16 and I've only had one close shave, never ever came close to 16 patrols in the stock or selectively modified setup. Currently I'm cruising along inside a convoy firing eels left and right, the escorts are nowhere near me and seem to be depth charging something well away from me. I've hardly seen any aircraft either. April of 1944 and I keep thinking it should be harder than this.

That is amazing....I'm using GW 1.1/NYGM/UC and my results are just 180 degrees from that. Raise the scope inside a convoy and the merchants start banging away with their deck guns..lucky to get a snap shot off before it is destroyed....and every escort is homing in like they were tied to me with strings.

I consider myself lucky if I get within 1500 meters of a convoy by running silent....ahead slow...at below 100 meters....then rush to periscope depth and get off a salvo shot before I crash back down and spend the next hour dodging DC attacks. And it is only summer '41.

I'm finding it nearly impossible to do an end run around a convoy then lie in wait for it to approach so i can sneak inside the screen. The escorts even in early war pick my boat up on ASDIC from 1000's of meters away.

All of that isn't even mentioning their ramming skills

Only in heavy fog can I cruise on the surface inside a convoy, hoping for a snap shot as a target comes out of the fog bank, and even then it is a mighty dodgy thing. You never know when an escort will appear and start firing at point blank range.

[Wulfmann]

Remember, if you use TC above 256 the radar aircraft will not see you, it is a bug. In 1943 you should dive at least every other patrol grid or more from AC or you are cheating reality.

Sem. go to 13 meters when you dive instead of the default 12 for periscope depth. Keep you peri so low it is under the water more than on top. They will not see you this way.
After 1941 radar prevents you from being on the surface no matter what the weather.

BTW, my RND is tweaked to reflect what I have read on this subject not just a sick desire for toture although sometimes I wonder!! It can be frustrating but when I read Iron Coffins for reference, what I have mimics that more, IMO.
I may not survive many patrols but when I escape 3 or 4 escorts after a 4 hour pounding I am more satisfied than running up and unrealistic score!

I attacked an Arctic convoy tonight in Oct 1944 out of Bergen. It was raining with fog. I heard a wierd motor and suspected it was an escort carrier so went away from the convoy and fired a spread of 4 fish from hydrophone bearings. All missed. I turned and fired a homi at her and disabled her. I waited until the convoy disappeared and finished off the Bogue class and finished my first ever patrol out of Bergen with a U-Boat that escaped France after D-Day. I also ignored my grid orders or I would likely be starting over tommorrow! Patrol 6 tommorrow. I am nervous!

Wulfmann

[Keelbuster]

Originally Posted by Wulfmann

Remember, if you use TC above 256 the radar aircraft will not see you, it is a bug.

I attacked an Arctic convoy tonight in Oct 1944 out of Bergen.

Interesting - didn't know about the 256x aircraft radar bug - good to know for those cases when you _need_ air and can't travel at PD anymore.

Also - I've never encountered an Arctic convoy - i really want to. I've been based at bergen, and my patrol orders have never taken me north, but rather out to the atlantic. What grid co-ordinates do you hunt for arctic convoys?

KB

[Wulfmann]

KB, I lurk north of the patrol grid areas where the convoy routes converge on the map. I just hang around there until one shows up.
Last night I had three all in different directions. I attacked the carrier which was out side the convoy and disabled her and waited for the escorts to leave, finished her off and went after a convoy north of the other and sank a liberty from out side and disabled another large merchant which I hid under until all the escorts departed, about 2 hours.
One carrier and two large merchants and still alive is better than an obituary and a couple more ships.
Shooting farther out is asking for some luck but good procedure improves your luck.
By firing at a distance and moving laterally the escorts will be looking where you are not and at this stage finding you makes your chances slim with all these A/S ships
My assigned patrol was CG so I ignored it.
We must remember our changing bases does not change our grid options and that is an unrealistic order both for range and what would have been a real deployment for that time.
Lose renown and go north.
In fact if you head way up east of Bear Island you can move outside aircraft range and just hang out until something shows.
Later in the war I believe I should protect my crew and do max damage without being stupid.


Wulfmann