SH3 and GW questions/musings........

[Karl-Heinz Jaeger]

Got sunk on my last patrol, which incidentally was my first career patrol using the Grey Wolves mod. I feel like such a wally but I headed into Scapa flow on intelligence from BdU(Sh3 Gen) that there was a Battleship and an Auxy cruiser at port there. I snuck in through the eastern entrance, having to all stop and bottom my boat several times due to roving patrols, got in close, upped the scope and.......nothing except a line of three Tribal DD's, and a lot closer to land a Troop Transport and Small Tanker. Nice enough targets in the open sea and would have been fair game otherwise, but not in Scapa Flow so I decided to egress safely out through the western exit and on to my patrol grid.


So there I am, holding steady at PD, at all stop when I decide to plot a course for my helmsman to follow. No sooner had I plotted the course than the game automatically orders ahead standard, thereby alerting the patrols to my presence. "We may have been detected, Herr Kaleun" comes the warning too late, so I immediately slow down to 2 knots and attempt to throw them off. No sooner have we straightened up on course than PING! PING!, and they have a sensor lock. Verdammt! Ahead flank, hard to port ,secure from silent routine I order. No use and before long our hydroman reports depth charges in the water. But wait, we catch a break. The extreme shallow water in Scapa Flow saves us from certain annihilation, and the depth charges settle harmlessly on the bottom having failed to reach the depth they have been set to explode. What a stroke of luck! So we were safe, for a while. We managed to get out into slightly deeper waters but had to come up for air eventually which is when the plane spotted us, called in his buddies who in turn ripped us open at a measly 30 meters. U-51 was forced to surface, having lost all her diesel and with many heavily flooded compartments straight into a POW camp for the rest of the war.


I had never encountered that before, the depth charges failing to explode in shallow waters and was wondering if this was modelled in the stock game or was this part of the awesome Grey wolves mod?? Another thing I noticed was that the water seems to be a lot choppier during the day than at night, despite the wind speed and direction remaining constant. Now in reality, during the day when the sun is shining and warming the sea, the particles of water move faster over each other and therefore there is more....."give" for want of a better word than at night. Again my question is does anyone know if this is part of the stock game or part of the GW mod? I've only noticed this since installing GW, and I was quite please when I worked out what was happening.

[bsalyers]

No sooner had I plotted the course than the game automatically orders ahead standard

I've been murdered by that same, helpful little "feature" - does anyone know if there's a way to disable it?

[HW3]

The only way I know of is to set your speed first, then plot your course.

[Kpt. Lehmann]

Originally Posted by bsalyers

I've been murdered by that same, helpful little "feature" - does anyone know if there's a way to disable it?

I think we all have lol. Its SH3 doing it... not GW.

Regarding the DC's this seems to be related with the work I did on DC detonation variance.

Don't worry... you won't always be so lucky.

Did everyone feel that the DD's were agressive enough or behave better than Stock SH3?

[bsalyers]

I just got back from a wedding in Chicago, so I've been unable to play for a few days (Verdammt real life! Always getting in the way ). My GW career is still in first mission, 1939, and I've yet to tangle with a destroyer, so I can't compare. If I haven't said it enough elsewhere, though, man, I love that mod.

[lwallace0048]

On my setup, I have Silent Hunter III patched to v1.4 and the GW Mod installed, no other mods.

So far, I have had the following experiences with 4 careers starting in 1939 out of Wilhelmshaven in a type VIIB sub.

Career 1 going to assigned patrol area by way of the English Channel. Almost through the channel when I find a lone Large Merchant.
Fire 2 torpedoes, set for contact pistols running at 3 meters, targeting the Bridge and the Engine room. First torpedo hits and breaks the
ship in two. Second torpedo detonates in the bow cargo section, whole thing sinks in about 5 minutes. Couple of hours later
while running on the surface at night, I am spotted by a Destroyer and promptly shelled. I dive the boat and on the Destroyer's second or
third DC run, he wastes me.

Career 2 & 3 Again try going to patrol area through English Channel. Both times caught by different patrols, once by an armed trawler,
once by a PT boat. The first time I was submerged, the second I was running on the surface at night.
Each time I was discovered, the patrol called in extra Destroyers, and both times I was DC'ed out of existence.

So I would have to say that I'm not seeing any problems with the Destroyers or other patrol vessels not being "smart" enough.

Patrol 4 Decide it is time to go around England to the north
Somewhere North of Scapa Flow I find a Medium Merchant (C2) traveling by itself at night. I set a torpedo for 3 meters, contact pistol
and fire from about 700 meters. The torpedo explodes in the vicinity of the smokestack and over the next 5 or 10 minutes the target's
speed is reduced from 7 Kts to 2 Kts, over a 20 or 30 minute time period the ship takes on a port list of about 25 degrees and settles
by the stern. After 2 hours, it is appears that the damage is not enough to sink the vessel so I fire a second torpedo into the engine
room. This torpedo takes out the engines, the speed decreases to 0 Kts, the list straightens out and then over the next 20 to 30 minutes,
the ship sinks lower at the stern until she finally slips under. I receive credit for the kill in the patrol log and then we are off again for the
assigned patrol area. I am spotted and attacked by a Hurricane fighter North of Scapa Flow, and have been spotted and attacked by
Swordfish aircraft twice on the northwest side of England (think maybe they are from a carrier, but can't be sure.)

IMO the ship damage model (although only small experience so far) pretty much acts as described by the modders. My general experience
with the British naval forces is they seem to be more present that the stock SHIII game and don't appear to be lacking in their ability to find
and attack me.

Thanks to the whole GW group for bringing this to the SHIII community, you guys definetly rock

[Kpt. Lehmann]

lwallace0048 WELCOME!

What you have described makes me feel GREAT!!! We've worked so hard to fix things that you have described... which now seem to be working more or less PERFECTLY!!!

(but not TOO perfectly too)

The trick now will be for you to learn caution and how to escape.

Run slow and silent. Keep your bow or stern facing the enemy to leave the smallest contact you can.

[Der Teddy Bar]

lwallace0048,
Yes, I am glad that you are enjoying the NYGM Ship Damage Mod Ver 0.1.39

[Kpt. Lehmann]

Originally Posted by Der Teddy Bar

lwallace0048,
Yes, I am glad that you are enjoying the NYGM Ship Damage Mod Ver 0.1.39

Rgr that! I know I am.

Its beginning to look like we nailed it with the DD agression/DC issues too.

[lwallace0048]

Follow up question concerning the Destroyer AI. I ran into a convoy last night, just east of my patrol grid. When I intercepted the convoy, it consisted of 18 - 20 merchant vessels, 2 Black Swan Frigates, and a Light Cruiser (which was steaming in the merchant columns, not on escort duty). On my first pass through, I was able to torpedo and cripple the Light Cruiser and 2 Large Merchants. Naturally the escorts came looking for me and after my first three patrols through the Channel I was expecting a long night of dodging depth charges. The convoy escorts could not find me (at one point one of them steams by in front of my periscope about 40 meters ahead of the sub) and the few DC's they dropped
were not anywhere near me.

Is there a different set of values used for convoy escort AI as opposed to independent units? IMO the AI used in the convoy escort was pretty much what I expected for the first several months of the war, at least based on what I have read. I fully expect the convoy escorts to get very good as time goes on. The surprise was how brutally effective the independent patrol vessels in the Channel were.

I was able to sink the Light Cruiser and the 2 Large Cargo's at a cost of 3 torpedoes each and a total of about 4 hours of game time from the start of the attack to the point where I was able to double back and pick off the 2 merchants that I had disabled earlier. I might have been able to use less ordance, but did not want to chance losing contact with the stragglers I received credit in the log for all the victims.

[Kpt. Lehmann]

The AI itself cannot be modded as it is hard-coded data.

However, the crew efficiency, ASW equipment, number of escorts, and incidence of airpower intervention all increase as the war goes on.

Early on they are pretty much dummies.

Later on they will do their best to eat your lunch and get much better at their assigned task of trying to kill you.