Americans - Do your duty and look at these Action Items

SUBMAN1 · 02-21-06, 12:14 PM

Add your names to the list and automatically send a letter on your behalf - Takes 2 seconds and it will definitely help!!

-S

Stop the MPAA and RIAA's Horror Triple Bill!
https://secure.eff.org/site/Advocacy...rAction&id=181

Hollywood Plants Its Flags In Our Homes
https://secure.eff.org/site/Advocacy...rAction&id=205

Stop Congress Mandating Secret Technology
https://secure.eff.org/site/Advocacy...rAction&id=207

Iceman · 02-21-06, 02:28 PM

I'm sorry but this post is along the same lines as your Microsoft post.Locks are meant to keep honest people honest.You must concede that companies must be able to protect they're work somehow.I work in the communications industry so I have seen this problem now for years.A standard must be agreed upon by the manufacturers of equipment as well as distributors,publishers,record companies,movie companies, everyone involed with the process.The customer I'm sorry to say should NOT be involed in this process period.Believe me I understand the consumers dilema...problem is this piracy problem has not been this bad until the last 20 years or so ,,,so the industry is playing catch up.Trying to agree on technology or even wait on it to be created so that they can combat they're imsense problem.From what I read of the "Starforce" problems I can surely understand aprhensions but these types of protections are neccessary for companies to be able to profit and survive....You know how many times I have been in a customers home and they jokingly ask about giving them FREE cable tv service.....My company loses millions in revenue from cable theft...and THEFT is the key word we are talking about....protecting ones blood sweat and tears.

Letum · 02-21-06, 03:24 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Iceman

I'm sorry but this post is along the same lines as your Microsoft post.Locks are meant to keep honest people honest.You must concede that companies must be able to protect they're work somehow.I work in the communications industry so I have seen this problem now for years.A standard must be agreed upon by the manufacturers of equipment as well as distributors,publishers,record companies,movie companies, everyone involed with the process.The customer I'm sorry to say should NOT be involed in this process period.Believe me I understand the consumers dilema...problem is this piracy problem has not been this bad until the last 20 years or so ,,,so the industry is playing catch up.Trying to agree on technology or even wait on it to be created so that they can combat they're imsense problem.From what I read of the "Starforce" problems I can surely understand aprhensions but these types of protections are neccessary for companies to be able to profit and survive....You know how many times I have been in a customers home and they jokingly ask about giving them FREE cable tv service.....My company loses millions in revenue from cable theft...and THEFT is the key word we are talking about....protecting ones blood sweat and tears.

Granted, but its not a one sided argument, these mesures do make legal copys impossible and this infinges on a legal and moral right.

Wim Libaers · 02-21-06, 06:00 PM

It is completely unbalanced. The intent of this intellectual property system is to give more power to the content producers, while reducing the public domain. The idea behind these laws used to be to give incentives to create and publish new things, but the creations would also become available for others to work with (public domain). Lobbying pressure turned this into a system where copyrights last so long that, unless something changes, none of us will ever see anything created today becoming part of the public domain. Take Disney for example, they profited enormously from the public domain (i.e. lifted most of their stories from it) but lobby hard for copyright extensions for their own work. Even if they do go into the public domain, laws that ban "circumvention devices" ensure that nobody will be able to legally do anything with them, even though they have the right.

Also, note that several libertarian economists believe intellectual property, quite unlike real property, is generally harmful.
http://www.mises.org/journals/jls/15_2/15_2_1.pdf

This is not related to "cable theft", which requires tampering with infrastructure that is someone else's property.

SUBMAN1 · 02-22-06, 02:53 PM

Hey Iceman,

This is not just about copyprotection, this is about something as simple as Open Source software like Linux. With this in place, Open Source software will cease to exist as you know it. This is just the tip of the iceberg on what this means for you or me. How about forced advertising in your home? There is much more at stake than just simply trying to protect your code from pirates - and even with this in place, nothing will still prevent those same pirates from copying the data anyway - that is forever a lost cause.

-S

Iceman · 02-22-06, 03:24 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by SUBMAN1

Hey Iceman,

This is not just about copyprotection, this is about something as simple as Open Source software like Linux. With this in place, Open Source software will cease to exist as you know it. This is just the tip of the iceberg on what this means for you or me. How about forced advertising in your home? There is much more at stake than just simply trying to protect your code from pirates - and even with this in place, nothing will still prevent those same pirates from copying the data anyway - that is forever a lost cause.

-S

Exactly...locks are for honest people not crooks....So whats your gripe?You want companies to create products,movies,music,software etc and not have any protection????So you must ..I would anyway if I were a judge...give favor upon the creators of these products and let them try to protect them in whatever means neccessary....your never going to stop a thief ...forced advertising....is someone forcing you to have a TV in your home? or a radio?...computer?

Hehehe welcome to the machine my sons.

SUBMAN1 · 02-22-06, 03:44 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Iceman

Quote:

Originally Posted by SUBMAN1

Hey Iceman,

This is not just about copyprotection, this is about something as simple as Open Source software like Linux. With this in place, Open Source software will cease to exist as you know it. This is just the tip of the iceberg on what this means for you or me. How about forced advertising in your home? There is much more at stake than just simply trying to protect your code from pirates - and even with this in place, nothing will still prevent those same pirates from copying the data anyway - that is forever a lost cause.

-S

Exactly...locks are for honest people not crooks....So whats your gripe?You want companies to create products,movies,music,software etc and not have any protection????So you must ..I would anyway if I were a judge...give favor upon the creators of these products and let them try to protect them in whatever means neccessary....your never going to stop a thief ...forced advertising....is someone forcing you to have a TV in your home? or a radio?...computer?

Hehehe welcome to the machine my sons.

Ahh - no. When I buy something and put it in my home, I expect that it is a thing I can control. These action or bills not only removes that ability, but stiffles legitimate creativity on top of it. So what you are saying is the coming true of George Orwells predictions? If you do not see this and do not take action against it, then you must sit in the bed you made because it is your fault. It is every Americans duty to remove the govenrment and industry from controlling your living room. Plain and simple. If not, this is truely the end of this great country. The squeeze will just tighten over time till nothing is left of what we have, and countries that don't conform to our ideas (such as China) will rule this world on every platform.

-S

02-21-06, 12:14 PM	#1
SUBMAN1 Rear Admiral Join Date: Apr 2005 Posts: 11,866 Downloads: 0 Uploads: 0	Americans - Do your duty and look at these Action Items Add your names to the list and automatically send a letter on your behalf - Takes 2 seconds and it will definitely help!! -S Stop the MPAA and RIAA's Horror Triple Bill! https://secure.eff.org/site/Advocacy...rAction&id=181 Hollywood Plants Its Flags In Our Homes https://secure.eff.org/site/Advocacy...rAction&id=205 Stop Congress Mandating Secret Technology https://secure.eff.org/site/Advocacy...rAction&id=207 __________________

02-22-06, 02:53 PM	#5
SUBMAN1 Rear Admiral Join Date: Apr 2005 Posts: 11,866 Downloads: 0 Uploads: 0	Hey Iceman, This is not just about copyprotection, this is about something as simple as Open Source software like Linux. With this in place, Open Source software will cease to exist as you know it. This is just the tip of the iceberg on what this means for you or me. How about forced advertising in your home? There is much more at stake than just simply trying to protect your code from pirates - and even with this in place, nothing will still prevent those same pirates from copying the data anyway - that is forever a lost cause. -S __________________

02-21-06, 02:28 PM	#2
Iceman Ace of the Deep Join Date: Sep 2002 Location: Mesa AZ, Arizona, USA Posts: 1,253 Downloads: 5 Uploads: 0	I'm sorry but this post is along the same lines as your Microsoft post.Locks are meant to keep honest people honest.You must concede that companies must be able to protect they're work somehow.I work in the communications industry so I have seen this problem now for years.A standard must be agreed upon by the manufacturers of equipment as well as distributors,publishers,record companies,movie companies, everyone involed with the process.The customer I'm sorry to say should NOT be involed in this process period.Believe me I understand the consumers dilema...problem is this piracy problem has not been this bad until the last 20 years or so ,,,so the industry is playing catch up.Trying to agree on technology or even wait on it to be created so that they can combat they're imsense problem.From what I read of the "Starforce" problems I can surely understand aprhensions but these types of protections are neccessary for companies to be able to profit and survive....You know how many times I have been in a customers home and they jokingly ask about giving them FREE cable tv service.....My company loses millions in revenue from cable theft...and THEFT is the key word we are talking about....protecting ones blood sweat and tears.

02-21-06, 06:00 PM	#4
Wim Libaers Samurai Navy Join Date: Sep 2001 Location: Flanders Posts: 569 Downloads: 4 Uploads: 0	It is completely unbalanced. The intent of this intellectual property system is to give more power to the content producers, while reducing the public domain. The idea behind these laws used to be to give incentives to create and publish new things, but the creations would also become available for others to work with (public domain). Lobbying pressure turned this into a system where copyrights last so long that, unless something changes, none of us will ever see anything created today becoming part of the public domain. Take Disney for example, they profited enormously from the public domain (i.e. lifted most of their stories from it) but lobby hard for copyright extensions for their own work. Even if they do go into the public domain, laws that ban "circumvention devices" ensure that nobody will be able to legally do anything with them, even though they have the right. Also, note that several libertarian economists believe intellectual property, quite unlike real property, is generally harmful. http://www.mises.org/journals/jls/15_2/15_2_1.pdf This is not related to "cable theft", which requires tampering with infrastructure that is someone else's property.