how do you do "angle on bow"

Capt.Kronos · 10-18-07, 04:05 PM

plz tell me the best way to do angle on the bow its realy hard
Thanks even if you cnt help

Chock · 10-18-07, 04:39 PM

I usually guess it visually and fire a spread, which is probably how they did it for real most of the time, hence they didn't get the kind of kills you get in SH with all the assistance on.

But... If I have time, I remain stationary, take a bearing and range estimate and mark it on the map, then wait a minute or two and do it again and mark that on the map too. With two marked points on the map, you can draw a line between them and you've got the target's course, and when you have that, you can draw the angle on bow with a protractor on the map.

Of course what usually happens is they then zig zag, so I go back to firing a spread :rotfl:

Chock

GoldenRivet · 10-18-07, 05:15 PM

ill try to explain this as easily as i can, you have to have map contacts ON though for this to work unless you do some extra steps

1. in map view... zoom in all the way on your target and use the pencil tool to make a point on the map view right on the very tip of the target symbol's bow. this will appear as "X mark 1"

for example
ship mark1

===>X1

2. wait about one or two minutes.

3. in map view... zoom in all the way on your target and use the pencil tool to make a point on the map view right on the very tip of the target symbol's bow. this will appear as "X Mark 2"

for example
mark1 mark 2
X1 ===>X2

4. select the ruler tool.

5. Click on "X Mark 1" and draw a ruler line to "X mark 2" but keep going out ahead of the contact for a couple of hundred meters.
for example...

X1----------------X2--------------------->

6. now select the protractor tool

7. click a point starting on the ruler line out ahead of the target symbol. and drag the protractor to the tip of the ship symbol's bow. click again and drag the protractor tool to your own submarine's symbol.

8. the angle of the protractor will be the AOB.

Capt.Kronos · 10-18-07, 05:57 PM

Thanks for the tips people

dmlavan · 10-18-07, 06:47 PM

Two other recommendations:

1. This may be what you're using and having a hard time with, but use the lower images in the recognition guide to help figure out the AOB if you're forward of the beam.

2. In the SH3 Mods section is a tool that may help as well. I've downloaded it, but have not used it yet.

http://www.subsim.com/radioroom/showthread.php?t=123373

codmander · 10-18-07, 06:54 PM

I foUnd the best way for mtdc iS get in close and just use bearing and FAST torp speed for-going the angle and range -- quite suCCesfull

IN OTHER WORDS JUST AIM INFRONT OF THE BUGGERS

NiclDoe · 10-18-07, 08:26 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by codmander

I foUnd the best way for mtdc iS get in close and just use bearing and FAST torp speed for-going the angle and range -- quite suCCesfull

IN OTHER WORDS JUST AIM INFRONT OF THE BUGGERS

Works for me also becuase im leading the target into my torp.

_Seth_ · 10-19-07, 10:54 AM

Look here if you still are wondering, mate;
http://www.subsim.com/radioroom/show...542#post671542

This is the drawing:
(Remember: Line from point 1 to 2 HAVE to be in accordance with the targets course!)

<Jason> · 11-10-08, 09:06 PM

my way of explaining AOB goes something like this: ehem!

first thing you do is lock and ID the ship right.

the first step you do after the ID is use the stadimeter (height and bearing) tool and send the result to the TDC.

now you have some time till your next stadimeter check and you should now set your torpedo(s) for the type of ship your firing at (look at how deep their boat goes in the water aka *draft) remember to open the doors of the tubes you want to fire (quick key is "q")

once the torps are ready go back to the parascope and use the stadimeter again and once again send the results to the TDC.

the next step is to get the speed. since you have two distance and bearing results in the TDC, it can calculate the speed for you. simply go to the right most option on the round data input device and click the obtain speed button (next to the red send results button. dont forget to press the red button after it calculates the speed

)

once you send the speed to the TDC, look at the black dialog box. your crew convienently tell you what the enemy vessels course is. this is the angle on bow and the last piece to the firing solution.

to input it, go to the position keeper (other setting where the torpedo options are) and you'll see the two dials with boats. the bottom one is you the top is the target. on the target dial, you should note that there is an inner dial and an outer dial. using the angle on bow tool (middle option) on the round data input device changes the inner dial (and the boat) of the target on the position keeper. notice also that the targets front end is always on zero of the inner dial.

EXAMPLE: now, say the crew dialog says the target is on course 090. all you have to do is turn the angle on bow till the boats nose (or the 0 from the inner dial) matches the E on the outer dial (or whatever course the crew says in the dialog box). if the crew says the target is on course 325. turn the angle on bow till the nose and inner dial number 0 line up with the outer dial number 325. its really that simple.

now you have to just press the position keeper button to complete the solution. its the grey button on the bottom right of the position keeper (dials area). when it turns red, your ready to fire. send just the bearing once more from the distance option of the round data input device by just pressing the red send button while locked on the target (dont do a height measurement unless you see the targets has changed heading, in which case, if you have time or can be quick, redo the solution)

select your first (or only) setup torpedo tube and send em' swimming!

i suggest you try these steps over and over in the torpedo training mission till you get hits consistantly. best of luck! i hope i didnt confuse you

. just take your time and read every step and you will send many a merchant to the deep.

GreyFox · 11-10-08, 09:09 PM

This is an excellent thread on killing enemy ships, and helped me immensely when I first started.

http://www.subsim.com/radioroom/showthread.php?t=88961

joegrundman · 11-12-08, 06:09 AM

Hitman, OLC and I worked on the U-jagd tools mod about a year ago to deal with exactly this problem, as well as others

you can get the mod from the link in my sig and the thread dealing with it is here

http://www.subsim.com/radioroom/showthread.php?t=123373

EDIT:

oh yes, i also did a quick orientation on the knack of visual estimation of AOB

http://www.subsim.com/radioroom/show...dging+tutorial

JMV · 11-12-08, 01:14 PM

nubse · 11-02-09, 02:12 AM

I've figured out a way to calculate the AoB (at least I think so) but you need to know the targets course. Here's an example:

Your course is 21 degrees
Your target is in your scope bearing 25 (that's at 46 degrees)
Your targets course is 245 degrees

Roughly you're heading NNE (between 0 and 90 degrees) while your target is heading WSW (between 180 and 270 degrees)

The Angle-on-Bow is a simple mathematical solution. You already have one angle, 25 degrees, which is the angularoffset of your periscope in relation to your course.

Since the AoB can not be more than 180 degrees and the angular sum of a triangle is 180 degrees, you can subtract 25 from 180, leaving you with 155 degrees left for the two other angles.

Because that we already have both the sub-course and the target-course, we can calculate the 2nd angle by adding to 90 degrees, the target-course offset from 270 degrees and the sub-course offset from 0 degrees, which is 90 + 25 + 21 degrees, so our 2nd angle is 136 degrees.

This leaves us with these results
Angle 1: 25 degrees (our periscope offset relative to our course)
Angle 2: 136
Angle 3 (AoB) = 180 - 25 -136 = 19 degrees. Jeez :p

Maybe a little more work can reduce the complexity of these reductions... other, maybe larger, triangles and compass-quadrants: A for Sub & B for Target: in my example, A is I & B is III and vice versa.

Sonoboy · 11-02-09, 11:51 AM

nubse, the issue with estimating AoB is that you don't know the target's course. If you do know the target's course, there is no problem at all with getting the AoB.

So far, I have used the recognition book to help me estimate the AoB with pretty accurate results. Look for certain features on the superstructure that will help you out. Also, if you're having difficulty, wait until the AoB more closely matches the next higher angle in the recognition book before making your estimate. All this is assuming that you're in front of your target.

totodog · 11-02-09, 03:39 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by joegrundman

Hitman, OLC and I worked on the U-jagd tools mod about a year ago to deal with exactly this problem, as well as others

you can get the mod from the link in my sig and the thread dealing with it is here

http://www.subsim.com/radioroom/showthread.php?t=123373

EDIT:

oh yes, i also did a quick orientation on the knack of visual estimation of AOB

http://www.subsim.com/radioroom/show...dging+tutorial

Would U-jagd work with GWX 3.0? Which version do I use? Wonderful mod there.

10-18-07, 04:05 PM	#1
Capt.Kronos Swabbie Join Date: Oct 2007 Location: Morecambe Posts: 7 Downloads: 20 Uploads: 0	how do you do "angle on bow" plz tell me the best way to do angle on the bow its realy hard Thanks even if you cnt help __________________ look out for Capt.Kronos

10-18-07, 04:39 PM	#2
Chock Sea Lord Join Date: May 2005 Location: Under a thermal layer in chilly Olde England Posts: 1,842 Downloads: 0 Uploads: 0	I usually guess it visually and fire a spread, which is probably how they did it for real most of the time, hence they didn't get the kind of kills you get in SH with all the assistance on. But... If I have time, I remain stationary, take a bearing and range estimate and mark it on the map, then wait a minute or two and do it again and mark that on the map too. With two marked points on the map, you can draw a line between them and you've got the target's course, and when you have that, you can draw the angle on bow with a protractor on the map. Of course what usually happens is they then zig zag, so I go back to firing a spread :rotfl: Chock __________________

10-18-07, 05:15 PM	#3
GoldenRivet Subsim Aviator Join Date: Mar 2007 Location: Texas Posts: 8,726 Downloads: 146 Uploads: 0	ill try to explain this as easily as i can, you have to have map contacts ON though for this to work unless you do some extra steps 1. in map view... zoom in all the way on your target and use the pencil tool to make a point on the map view right on the very tip of the target symbol's bow. this will appear as "X mark 1" for example ship mark1 ===>X1 2. wait about one or two minutes. 3. in map view... zoom in all the way on your target and use the pencil tool to make a point on the map view right on the very tip of the target symbol's bow. this will appear as "X Mark 2" for example mark1 mark 2 X1 ===>X2 4. select the ruler tool. 5. Click on "X Mark 1" and draw a ruler line to "X mark 2" but keep going out ahead of the contact for a couple of hundred meters. for example... X1----------------X2---------------------> 6. now select the protractor tool 7. click a point starting on the ruler line out ahead of the target symbol. and drag the protractor to the tip of the ship symbol's bow. click again and drag the protractor tool to your own submarine's symbol. 8. the angle of the protractor will be the AOB. __________________

10-18-07, 05:57 PM	#4
Capt.Kronos Swabbie Join Date: Oct 2007 Location: Morecambe Posts: 7 Downloads: 20 Uploads: 0	Thanks for the tips people __________________ look out for Capt.Kronos

10-19-07, 10:54 AM	#8
_Seth_ Ocean Warrior Join Date: Dec 2005 Location: In Tromsoe, @Tirpitz' final resting place.. Posts: 3,277 Downloads: 94 Uploads: 0	Look here if you still are wondering, mate; http://www.subsim.com/radioroom/show...542#post671542 This is the drawing: (Remember: Line from point 1 to 2 HAVE to be in accordance with the targets course!) __________________

10-18-07, 06:47 PM	#5
dmlavan Weps Join Date: Oct 2006 Location: Jacksonville, FL Posts: 351 Downloads: 69 Uploads: 0	Two other recommendations: 1. This may be what you're using and having a hard time with, but use the lower images in the recognition guide to help figure out the AOB if you're forward of the beam. 2. In the SH3 Mods section is a tool that may help as well. I've downloaded it, but have not used it yet. http://www.subsim.com/radioroom/showthread.php?t=123373

10-18-07, 06:54 PM	#6
codmander Seasoned Skipper Join Date: Mar 2001 Location: cape cod mass. Posts: 678 Downloads: 59 Uploads: 0	I foUnd the best way for mtdc iS get in close and just use bearing and FAST torp speed for-going the angle and range -- quite suCCesfull IN OTHER WORDS JUST AIM INFRONT OF THE BUGGERS

11-10-08, 09:06 PM	#9
<Jason> Sailor man Join Date: Oct 2008 Location: Melbourne, Fl Posts: 45 Downloads: 4 Uploads: 0	my way of explaining AOB goes something like this: ehem! first thing you do is lock and ID the ship right. the first step you do after the ID is use the stadimeter (height and bearing) tool and send the result to the TDC. now you have some time till your next stadimeter check and you should now set your torpedo(s) for the type of ship your firing at (look at how deep their boat goes in the water aka draft) remember to open the doors of the tubes you want to fire (quick key is "q") once the torps are ready go back to the parascope and use the stadimeter again and once again send the results to the TDC. the next step is to get the speed. since you have two distance and bearing results in the TDC, it can calculate the speed for you. simply go to the right most option on the round data input device and click the obtain speed button (next to the red send results button. dont forget to press the red button after it calculates the speed ) once you send the speed to the TDC, look at the black dialog box. your crew convienently tell you what the enemy vessels course is. this is the angle on bow and the last piece to the firing solution. to input it, go to the position keeper (other setting where the torpedo options are) and you'll see the two dials with boats. the bottom one is you the top is the target. on the target dial, you should note that there is an inner dial and an outer dial. using the angle on bow tool (middle option) on the round data input device changes the inner dial (and the boat) of the target on the position keeper. notice also that the targets front end is always on zero of the inner dial. EXAMPLE: now, say the crew dialog says the target is on course 090. all you have to do is turn the angle on bow till the boats nose (or the 0 from the inner dial) matches the E on the outer dial (or whatever course the crew says in the dialog box). if the crew says the target is on course 325. turn the angle on bow till the nose and inner dial number 0 line up with the outer dial number 325. its really that simple. now you have to just press the position keeper button to complete the solution. its the grey button on the bottom right of the position keeper (dials area). when it turns red, your ready to fire. send just the bearing once more from the distance option of the round data input device by just pressing the red send button while locked on the target (dont do a height measurement unless you see the targets has changed heading, in which case, if you have time or can be quick, redo the solution) select your first (or only) setup torpedo tube and send em' swimming! i suggest you try these steps over and over in the torpedo training mission till you get hits consistantly. best of luck! i hope i didnt confuse you . just take your time and read every step and you will send many a merchant to the deep. __________________ ------------------------------------------------ Last edited by <Jason>; 11-10-08 at 09:09 PM.*

11-10-08, 09:09 PM	#10
GreyFox Swabbie Join Date: Jul 2008 Posts: 12 Downloads: 0 Uploads: 0	This is an excellent thread on killing enemy ships, and helped me immensely when I first started. http://www.subsim.com/radioroom/showthread.php?t=88961 __________________ If you ever find that violence doesn't work, you haven't used enough.

11-12-08, 06:09 AM	#11
joegrundman Ocean Warrior Join Date: May 2007 Posts: 2,689 Downloads: 34 Uploads: 0	Hitman, OLC and I worked on the U-jagd tools mod about a year ago to deal with exactly this problem, as well as others you can get the mod from the link in my sig and the thread dealing with it is here http://www.subsim.com/radioroom/showthread.php?t=123373 EDIT: oh yes, i also did a quick orientation on the knack of visual estimation of AOB http://www.subsim.com/radioroom/show...dging+tutorial __________________ "Enemy submarines are to be called U-Boats. The term submarine is to be reserved for Allied under water vessels. U-Boats are those dastardly villains who sink our ships, while submarines are those gallant and noble craft which sink theirs." Winston Churchill Last edited by joegrundman; 11-12-08 at 08:18 AM.

11-12-08, 01:14 PM	#12
JMV Sonar Guy Join Date: Jun 2008 Location: Galway-IRELAND Posts: 397 Downloads: 179 Uploads: 0	Gruss Gott Capt.Kronos und wilkommen A good little bunch for you mate : :p http://www.subsim.com/radioroom/showthread.php?t=113866 http://www.subsim.com/radioroom/showthread.php?t=110273 http://www.subsim.com/radioroom/showthread.php?t=137198 http://www.subsim.com/radioroom/showthread.php?t=104536 http://www.subsim.com/radioroom/showthread.php?t=90303 http://www.subsim.com/radioroom/show...anual+plotting http://www.subsim.com/radioroom/showthread.php?t=123699 http://forums.ubi.com/eve/forums?a=t...3&m=4241041052 http://www.subsim.com/radioroom/show...light=tutorial http://www.subsim.com/radioroom/showthread.php?t=110770 http://www.subsim.com/radioroom/showthread.php?t=131188 JMV.

11-02-09, 02:12 AM	#13
nubse Nub Join Date: Nov 2009 Location: Denmark Posts: 4 Downloads: 50 Uploads: 0	AoB calculation I've figured out a way to calculate the AoB (at least I think so) but you need to know the targets course. Here's an example: Your course is 21 degrees Your target is in your scope bearing 25 (that's at 46 degrees) Your targets course is 245 degrees Roughly you're heading NNE (between 0 and 90 degrees) while your target is heading WSW (between 180 and 270 degrees) The Angle-on-Bow is a simple mathematical solution. You already have one angle, 25 degrees, which is the angularoffset of your periscope in relation to your course. Since the AoB can not be more than 180 degrees and the angular sum of a triangle is 180 degrees, you can subtract 25 from 180, leaving you with 155 degrees left for the two other angles. Because that we already have both the sub-course and the target-course, we can calculate the 2nd angle by adding to 90 degrees, the target-course offset from 270 degrees and the sub-course offset from 0 degrees, which is 90 + 25 + 21 degrees, so our 2nd angle is 136 degrees. This leaves us with these results Angle 1: 25 degrees (our periscope offset relative to our course) Angle 2: 136 Angle 3 (AoB) = 180 - 25 -136 = 19 degrees. Jeez :p Maybe a little more work can reduce the complexity of these reductions... other, maybe larger, triangles and compass-quadrants: A for Sub & B for Target: in my example, A is I & B is III and vice versa. Last edited by nubse; 11-02-09 at 04:50 AM.

11-02-09, 11:51 AM	#14
Sonoboy Planesman Join Date: Aug 2005 Location: United States, CA Posts: 195 Downloads: 9 Uploads: 0	nubse, the issue with estimating AoB is that you don't know the target's course. If you do know the target's course, there is no problem at all with getting the AoB. So far, I have used the recognition book to help me estimate the AoB with pretty accurate results. Look for certain features on the superstructure that will help you out. Also, if you're having difficulty, wait until the AoB more closely matches the next higher angle in the recognition book before making your estimate. All this is assuming that you're in front of your target.