Some basic questions about enemy visible and radar range distances

[MCM]

Hi,

coming back after years to this wonderful game... with some newbie questions i can't find in the search.

• how far is the viewing/visible range of an enemy ship and a destroyer at good weather conditions at day and at night?
• how far can a destroyer hear me underwater at silent running/normal running with speed 1,2 or 3?
• How far can a destroyer hear my ping to determine my deep?
• How far reaches the underwater radar of a destroyer?
• how deep do I have to dive to be sort of save when a destroyer is hunting me? (beginning, middle and end of war)

THX alot for helping me out here
McM

[MCM]

Please can someone at least give me a rough estimation about these numbers? Don't have to be perfectly precise but you guys have an estimation right?

THX alot
McM

[mobucks]

It's not that simple. Many factors are at work such as sea state, weather, time of the day, year of the war and other things I'm sure.

I suggest playing the game with the difficulty settings on low and looking at the map. All the sensors information is shown to you on low difficulty.

One thing to consider is how much of your boat are you showing the AI.

Facing the AI straight on will show them less of you than facing them with a broadside.

Just play the game on low difficulty and watch their sensors on the map and you will see how they change based on whats going on in the environment.

[MCM]

Ah ok I see... But with high settings you guys have a really hard time to estimate when to dive or at which speed you can drive under water with destroyers nearby right?

So I will try that out, thank you very much. One question remains: How far can a destroyer hear my ping to determine my deep?

THX
Oli

[MCM]

What I found out:

Hearing range is about 4km at driving speed 3, 1,5km at driving speed 2. Sight range at good weather at daytime is about 8-10km. Can someone confirm? And the distance for hearing the ping sound for measuring the deepth?

THX
McM

[mobucks]

Look man I'm not going to tell you how to play but my perspective is it takes something away from the gameplay to know exact figures like you're asking for.

Real captains had to rely on intuition and standard operating procedures when engaging the enemy.

Part of the excitement comes from seeing how well you are able to stealth around without being seen/heard. All of which can be improved through learning "on the job" without knowing the exact figures you're asking for.

I guarantee with a bit of experience you will be able to rely on your own judgement for any scenario you face.

Good Luck!

[maillemaker]

How far can a destroyer hear my ping to determine my deep?

If you are asking about your depth finder, in SH3 escorts could not hear it at all. I don't know about SH5.

Steve

[gap]

Originally Posted by maillemaker

If you are asking about your depth finder, in SH3 escorts could not hear it at all. I don't know about SH5.

Steve

U-boat active sonar (S-gerat/Nibelung), can't be detected either in SH5 by enemy ships. But this device was hardly used on type VII u-boats.

On the contrary, the echolot (the device used for measuring the depth under the keel), will give up u-boat's position in any enemy naval unit is in range.

Anyway I think MCM was asking how close an enemy destroyer must be in order to detect our boat's depth with her own ASDIC.

[THEBERBSTER]

At 80 metres I would say is the minimum depth.

The orange hydrophone sensor at this depth will have disappeared on the DD.

You can do some testing using Historical Missions and in TDW's Options File Editor Viewer in both of the Map Tabs you can enable each of the contacts sensors in turn and see how they work in your game.

I took out the BB in Norway medium fog outside when coming up from this depth and they never knew I was there.

I went down to 134 metres with 9 DD's trying to find me and even passing over and not depth charging.

All the depth charging, plenty of it, was random.

I sneaked away at 1 knot at this depth changing course every 15 minutes.

Realism > High 82%

Peter

[mobucks]

Don't forget that the crew level (rookie to elite) and the crew state (alerted or non) has a lot to do with how well they can find you.

I have during my current patrol a small !TASK FORCE! of two armed merchant cruisers (the troopship) and these pigs must be elites, since during the past 5 attempts to sink even one of these suckers at night in perfect conditions (for me) they always end up spotting me; last time I tried to fire from the hip at one and the other rams by boat killing it instantly. (I was at PD on a moonless night)

This is the same career/same mods where just last patrol I was able to con my boat on the surface at 12kts willy nilly through a large troop convoy in even less favorable conditions. We're talking passing ships 100m astern, with his buddy behind him staring right at me.

[maillemaker]

On the contrary, the echolot (the device used for measuring the depth under the keel), will give up u-boat's position in any enemy naval unit is in range.

This is different from SH3 then.

Steve

[MCM]

Great, thank you all very much for your answers. Yes I meant how deep do you have to dive to escape from ASDIC. But I think this will change with the years and I have to dive deeper and deeper.

But good point with the measuring the depth: Will this always be heard of the destroyers when in range or only when they are alertet? And how far is the range? Sure I can find it out slowly ingame but a rough estimate again is always helpful

[Aktungbby]

But good point with the measuring the depth: Will this always be heard of the destroyers when in range or only when they are alertet? And how far is the range? Sure I can find it out slowly ingame but a rough estimate again is always helpful

Some useful info here: http://jproc.ca/sari/asd_et1.html Bottom line: the effective range is 2000 yards BUT the ASDIC's individual operator is the judge of how deep you are..' "A smart submarine commander, with a lot a nerve, would head into the area of the depth charge explosions. He knew, that within this area, nothing could be identified on Asdic for five to ten minutes, especially if the charges had been rigged for detonation at 250 to 500 feet. A safe shelter could be had even if it was only temporary." "While in convoy, operators used Asdic to listen to the engines and propellers of other ships which was very helpful during fog conditions or on nights when everything was pitch black. To say that convoys were well protected by Asdic would be an understatement especially in the early years of the war. Typically, a convoy consisting of 30 to 50 merchant ships created a perimeter distance of 16 to 18 miles. In theory, the escorts were positioned so that their Asdic beams overlapped, providing unbroken coverage of the convoy perimeter. The reality of the situation was different. An escort group usually consisted of one destroyer and three of four corvettes, barely enough to provide proper coverage especially with Asdic whose range limits averaged around 2000 yards under normal conditions. When convoys did have sufficient escorts, not all the Asdic sets were used simultaneously. If two ships were operating in the same area and on the same frequency, there were two options. The primary option would mean shutting down one of the Asdics." IN short: as with the radar that the battleship Bismarck's commander famously and erroneously assumed was giving away his position because it was audible TO HIM but not being received back accurately by the transmitting vessel, Sonar is dependent on the vagaries of water and background sounds, tidal rips and temperature gradients, and the operator may not be receiving an accurate reverberation of the signal 'bounceback' You, in the sub, can (always) hear his sonar; but that doesn't mean the enemy operator (the HSD) is receiving or 'interpreting' his signal correctly especially with a type 123 or 123A asdic sets as on most corvettes for example. Whether the SHV/III games reflects a particular type of ASDIC equipment or the vagaries of a sonar operator and/or water and previous depth charge disruption in the game is unknown to me.

[THE_MASK]

Originally Posted by mobucks

Don't forget that the crew level (rookie to elite) and the crew state (alerted or non) has a lot to do with how well they can find you.

I have during my current patrol a small !TASK FORCE! of two armed merchant cruisers (the troopship) and these pigs must be elites, since during the past 5 attempts to sink even one of these suckers at night in perfect conditions (for me) they always end up spotting me; last time I tried to fire from the hip at one and the other rams by boat killing it instantly. (I was at PD on a moonless night)

This is the same career/same mods where just last patrol I was able to con my boat on the surface at 12kts willy nilly through a large troop convoy in even less favorable conditions. We're talking passing ships 100m astern, with his buddy behind him staring right at me.

Yep , totally unpredictable from one contact to the next . The beauty of SH5 . Also crew fatigue with mods .

[MCM]

Perfect informations, thank you all... one question left: How far can a DD hear me if I ping the depth under kiel/uboot? What are your experiences?

THX everybody