Japan protests as Chinese ships enter disputed waters

[Gerald]

(Reuters) - Four Chinese ships briefly entered what Japan considers its territorial waters near disputed islands in the East China Sea on Monday, prompting an official protest from Tokyo and renewed diplomatic efforts to cool tensions between the rivals.In a move that could further complicate the territorial row that is threatening relations between Asia's biggest economies, a group of fishermen from Taiwan -- which also claims the rocky isles -- said as many as 100 boats escorted by 10 Taiwan Coast Guard vessels were headed for the area.

China's Xinhua news agency said in the morning that two civilian surveillance ships were undertaking a "rights defense" patrol near the islands, citing the State Oceanic Administration, which controls the ships. Two fishery patrol vessels were also detected inside waters claimed by Japan.

http://www.reuters.com/article/2012/...88N01M20120924

Note: Mon Sep 24, 2012 8:57am EDT

[August]

"Civilian Surveillance Ships"?

[TLAM Strike]

Originally Posted by August

"Civilian Surveillance Ships"?

The PRC has a civilian naval security agency called "China Marine Surveillance" sort of like our Coast Guard, but not exactly. This agency reports to the State Oceanic Administration (kind of a branch of their version of the Department of the Interior). They are tasked with EEZ protection, charting and SAR. This is not to be confused with the China Coast Guard, Fisheries Law Enforcement Command, China Maritime Safety Administration and General Administration of Customs which also operate ships with tasks similar to our Coast Guard.

Normally such an Agency would be called "Paramilitary" and not "Civilian". Such reporting is coming from a journalist who is obviously not an expert on such things (and plus Paramilitary has a negative connotation to it).

These are some of the vessels they have sent:

[Jimbuna]

Originally Posted by TLAM Strike

The PRC has a civilian naval security agency called "China Marine Surveillance" sort of like our Coast Guard, but not exactly. This agency reports to the State Oceanic Administration (kind of a branch of their version of the Department of the Interior). They are tasked with EEZ protection, charting and SAR. This is not to be confused with the China Coast Guard, Fisheries Law Enforcement Command, China Maritime Safety Administration and General Administration of Customs which also operate ships with tasks similar to our Coast Guard.

Normally such an Agency would be called "Paramilitary" and not "Civilian". Such reporting is coming from a journalist who is obviously not an expert on such things (and plus Paramilitary has a negative connotation to it).

These are some of the vessels they have sent:

They look like civilian craft to me...certainly nothing looking like military weapons are on view.

Who's hiding in the cabins though?

[Kazuaki Shimazaki II]

It is really hard to call China Maritime Surveillance paramilitary, or at least they must be substantially less paramilitary than the Coast Guard considering they are unarmed (not sure if their personnel may have a pistol somewhere but at least the ships don't have big obvious guns or cannon on them).

[nikimcbee]

They are just counting jellyfish.

[August]

Originally Posted by Kazuaki Shimazaki II

It is really hard to call China Maritime Surveillance paramilitary, or at least they must be substantially less paramilitary than the Coast Guard considering they are unarmed (not sure if their personnel may have a pistol somewhere but at least the ships don't have big obvious guns or cannon on them).

It's a government ship with a government crew on a mission of national security. So maybe not paramilitary but it's also definitely not civilian.

[TLAM Strike]

Originally Posted by Kazuaki Shimazaki II

It is really hard to call China Maritime Surveillance paramilitary, or at least they must be substantially less paramilitary than the Coast Guard considering they are unarmed (not sure if their personnel may have a pistol somewhere but at least the ships don't have big obvious guns or cannon on them).

Originally Posted by jimbuna

They look like civilian craft to me...certainly nothing looking like military weapons are on view.

Who's hiding in the cabins though?

This ship was not one of those dispatched (this is one of their latest patrol craft, note the Quad Type 56 heavy machine gun on the bow) but CMS ships are sometimes armed.


Also some USCG craft are not armed with more than a few pistols and a shotgun (if that), but they are not civilian and they are not military.

EDIT: Also note on the first pics I posted how the forward decks are very empty but have no VERTREP markings etc. Gee wonder what that space is reserved for...

[Jimbuna]

Originally Posted by TLAM Strike

EDIT: Also note on the first pics I posted how the forward decks are very empty but have no VERTREP markings etc. Gee wonder what that space is reserved for...

Well it's obvious....a quick and easy means of effecting a pizza delivery whilst at sea

[nikimcbee]

Originally Posted by TLAM Strike

Also some USCG craft are not armed with more than a few pistols and a shotgun (if that), but they are not civilian and they are not military.

You mean the bouy tenders? They'll drop a bouy on your deck!

[Jimbuna]

Good job they don't have 'buoys' aboard then because they can be heavy

[TLAM Strike]

Originally Posted by nikimcbee

You mean the bouy tenders? They'll drop a bouy on your deck!

I'm sure there is a 5" gun on there somewhere...