Help! Help! I'm being repressed!

[MKalafatas]

TMO RSRDC

Dec 16, 1941. Found (and sunk) a Chitose seaplane tender amongst the small islands just north of Luzon, at about 6 a.m, in my S-boat. Weather clear, no clouds, not even any wind.

Escorts include two subchasers and a minesweeper (which seems to carry sonar gear).

I can't get away from these guys! They've been on me like glue for nearly 8 hours. They've apparently run out of depth charges and my sub is undamaged, but CO2 is above 25%; battery is below 25%. Night is about 5 hours away.

I've been at 220' --- near the bottom ---- creeping along at 0.5 knots, less than 100 rpm, and they still hear me. If I don't lose them soon I'll have to fight it out.

Anyone have a secret evasion technique that I might try? Thanks much.

[Mister_Spok]

Maybe, rig for silent running and go for 300-320' ? It makes my day in TMO. I use S-boats.

P.S. Install RSRDC and sonar gear fix for Jap escorts.

See this thread- http://www.subsim.com/radioroom/showthread.php?t=195375

[Bubblehead1980]

Originally Posted by MKalafatas

TMO RSRDC

Dec 16, 1941. Found (and sunk) a Chitose seaplane tender amongst the small islands just north of Luzon, at about 6 a.m, in my S-boat. Weather clear, no clouds, not even any wind.

Escorts include two subchasers and a minesweeper (which seems to carry sonar gear).

I can't get away from these guys! They've been on me like glue for nearly 8 hours. They've apparently run out of depth charges and my sub is undamaged, but CO2 is above 25%; battery is below 25%. Night is about 5 hours away.

I've been at 220' --- near the bottom ---- creeping along at 0.5 knots, less than 100 rpm, and they still hear me. If I don't lose them soon I'll have to fight it out.

Anyone have a secret evasion technique that I might try? Thanks much.

Just wait them out, actually running so slow is not helpful, keep it under 100 RPM's, ahead 1/23runs your boat at around 75 RPM's or so I think, just look at the gauges near the helm.

when the escort makes his run, go ahead flank, then when the move away and youre not masked by the sound of their props anymore, go to all stop and 20 degrees port(left) rudder, allow the momentum to carry you through the turn, when you slowed way down after the speed has bled off or escort is making a run, go rudder amidships and ahead 1/3.Next time they make a run, repeat but go the opposite direction with 20 degrees rudder, which in this case would be the right(starboard). This way, you never stay on the same heading for too long, it does confuse them, even their top guns, eventually, they will lose you.you have plenty of O2 and battery at slow speed, just have to wait them out and not lose your focus.

This is the "Dykers" method of evasion, named after Captain Tommy Dykers, who commanded the USS Jack from 42-44 and on her most successful patrols.After reading about it in the book "Silent Running" by Admiral James F. Calvert a while back(he was a young ensign who ran the TDC), I decided to try it out and guess what? it works pretty much.

Sure you can go deep in TMO, unfortunately S boats are not modeled correctly in any version of S?H 4 from what Ive seen, their listed test depth was around 200 feet but rarely did they go below 150 because they began to spring leaks everywhere.For the challenge, I stay at 150 and I've been just fine and my S boat career I am in 1943, I have been deoth charged severely but made it through, one time I ventured to 197 feet, S boats test depth and this was to shake a super aggressive and cunning DD off Guadalcanal.Just don't give up and freak out, time is on your side, they will give up.

[MKalafatas]

Originally Posted by Bubblehead1980

Just wait them out, actually running so slow is not helpful, keep it under 100 RPM's, ahead 1/23runs your boat at around 75 RPM's or so I think, just look at the gauges near the helm.

when the escort makes his run, go ahead flank, then when the move away and youre not masked by the sound of their props anymore, go to all stop and 20 degrees port(left) rudder, allow the momentum to carry you through the turn, when you slowed way down after the speed has bled off or escort is making a run, go rudder amidships and ahead 1/3.Next time they make a run, repeat but go the opposite direction with 20 degrees rudder, which in this case would be the right(starboard). This way, you never stay on the same heading for too long, it does confuse them, even their top guns, eventually, they will lose you.you have plenty of O2 and battery at slow speed, just have to wait them out and not lose your focus.

This is the "Dykers" method of evasion, named after Captain Tommy Dykers, who commanded the USS Jack from 42-44 and on her most successful patrols.After reading about it in the book "Silent Running" by Admiral James F. Calvert a while back(he was a young ensign who ran the TDC), I decided to try it out and guess what? it works pretty much.

Sure you can go deep in TMO, unfortunately S boats are not modeled correctly in any version of S?H 4 from what Ive seen, their listed test depth was around 200 feet but rarely did they go below 150 because they began to spring leaks everywhere.For the challenge, I stay at 150 and I've been just fine and my S boat career I am in 1943, I have been deoth charged severely but made it through, one time I ventured to 197 feet, S boats test depth and this was to shake a super aggressive and cunning DD off Guadalcanal.Just don't give up and freak out, time is on your side, they will give up.

Bubblehead, thank you! Fascinating technique, I'll be trying it momentarily. I'm at 220'. Perhaps I didn't clarify that the sea bottom is at about 225'. Not entirely sure because I'm afraid to ping.

My CO2 level has never been this high and it was freaking me out. Your assurances are helpful. I'll be patient.

[MKalafatas]

Survived. Thanks again, Bubblehead.

Your assurance that I could be patient was crucial. Without it I would have fired all my torpedoes at these mosquitoes without effect, and battle-surfaced to my doom.

I tried the "Dykers" method, with mixed results. For some reason, even at flank speed, my (undamaged) boat would not exceed 4 knots --- the same velocity as at 2/3 speed. So I ran at 2/3 to conserve the battery when escorts were making their run, and stopped engines to coast and turn.

At one point an airplane dropped depth charges right in the middle of the circling escorts, but without effect to my sub.

"Dykers" did perhaps give me more space but the escorts were still close, still pinging.

Finally I stopped engines to wait for nightfall. At this point the escorts spread out, and also stopped engines, listening. Well after sunset I went to 50 rpms, crept away at 0.25 knots, and escaped.

When I finally surfaced and finished recharging batteries, it was 0300 ---- 21 hours after the Chitose was sunk.

Don't wish to experience that again, but TMO is great!

[Armistead]

If they're making runs and not dropping I agree out of charges...I just set speed to standard and use compression, they'll eventually turn back to the group.

If you ever face needing air, only surface as much as needed, roughly 25-28 ft, get a few gulps and crash dive, u might take a few hits, but usually to the deck. If you surface all the way it take a lot of time to fill ballast and get back down.

[Bubblehead1980]

Originally Posted by MKalafatas

Survived. Thanks again, Bubblehead.

Your assurance that I could be patient was crucial. Without it I would have fired all my torpedoes at these mosquitoes without effect, and battle-surfaced to my doom.

I tried the "Dykers" method, with mixed results. For some reason, even at flank speed, my (undamaged) boat would not exceed 4 knots --- the same velocity as at 2/3 speed. So I ran at 2/3 to conserve the battery when escorts were making their run, and stopped engines to coast and turn.

At one point an airplane dropped depth charges right in the middle of the circling escorts, but without effect to my sub.

"Dykers" did perhaps give me more space but the escorts were still close, still pinging.

Finally I stopped engines to wait for nightfall. At this point the escorts spread out, and also stopped engines, listening. Well after sunset I went to 50 rpms, crept away at 0.25 knots, and escaped.

When I finally surfaced and finished recharging batteries, it was 0300 ---- 21 hours after the Chitose was sunk.

Don't wish to experience that again, but TMO is great!

Just bc they are pinging, does not not mean they have you.Sure, you are close enough to hear it but they are searching, esp if its long scale pings.Mainly, its a game of chicken almost, just stay calm, when they are overhead, go ahead flank so you dont sit through the pattern and have your boat torn apart.Make the constant course changes like I told you, they will lose you, they may stay near you, keep pinging and even make a run your way but they are searching,, battery and O2 is getting low? like I said, dont freak.Really takes a long time for your battery to drain at 1/3 and if igets critical, say 8 percent or below, go to 1 1/2 knot, dont worrk about Co2 until its90- 95 percent or so, still you have a while.There was a time in TMO where escorts keep me down nearly 48 hours, they caught me in the Java Sea in 1943, They were the A team for sure, but like I said, just stay calm, if theyve tracked you that long, they dont really have you, they are just waiting you out.That is one thing I miss about TMO without RSRD, the escorts are more persistent and vicious but cant enjoy the game without RSRD these days.

[sharkbit]

Have you tried this mod out:

http://www.subsim.com/radioroom/showthread.php?t=157608

Lokks like it models S-boats better. You might not have been so lucky in your S-boat.

[Ruff EL]

future reminder....early war stay in waters (or more precisely, intercept and attack in waters) that allow you to go as deep as 300ish feet...thats about the max depth of AI sonar early war...you'll hear the pings but they dont have you unless you screw up and make more noise than you should....

i ran into that same chitose right after i patroled the linguyen gulf (where a huge invasion fleet gave me some nice trophies) and waited in deeper water farther north of Luzon to attack it (and a night surface attack as well).

[MKalafatas]

Originally Posted by sharkbit

Have you tried this mod out:

http://www.subsim.com/radioroom/showthread.php?t=157608

Lokks like it models S-boats better. You might not have been so lucky in your S-boat.

Oh, my! Great idea --- thanks so much!

[Bubblehead1980]

Originally Posted by MKalafatas

Oh, my! Great idea --- thanks so much!

I forgot about this mod, ill try it but tried it one time and think it caused issues with TMO RSRD, not sure.

[Armistead]

Originally Posted by Bubblehead1980

Just bc they are pinging, does not not mean they have you.Sure, you are close enough to hear it but they are searching, esp if its long scale pings.Mainly, its a game of chicken almost, just stay calm, when they are overhead, go ahead flank so you dont sit through the pattern and have your boat torn apart.Make the constant course changes like I told you, they will lose you, they may stay near you, keep pinging and even make a run your way but they are searching,, battery and O2 is getting low? like I said, dont freak.Really takes a long time for your battery to drain at 1/3 and if igets critical, say 8 percent or below, go to 1 1/2 knot, dont worrk about Co2 until its90- 95 percent or so, still you have a while.There was a time in TMO where escorts keep me down nearly 48 hours, they caught me in the Java Sea in 1943, They were the A team for sure, but like I said, just stay calm, if theyve tracked you that long, they dont really have you, they are just waiting you out.That is one thing I miss about TMO without RSRD, the escorts are more persistent and vicious but cant enjoy the game without RSRD these days.

You can adjust the contact time escort will hunt after losing you. I think most mods have it for 30 minutes, simply, they will leave after 30 minutes of losing contact. Set it for a hour or more, they hang around where they had you, if they regain contact the time starts all over, so you do have to be careful to escape.

Someone once made a mod so the escort didn't drop so many charges per run, that way they didn't run out so early......not sure where it is or how well it works, but with that and longer time limits, things can last. Also, setting the escorts crew ratings to elite, they work much better together and hunt you like a coon dog. I hated most escorts in RSRD had such low crew ratings and long ago corrected that. I have several sub killer groups, Matsu's mostly with elite ratings, you don't want to run into them.

[Armistead]

Originally Posted by Bubblehead1980

I forgot about this mod, ill try it but tried it one time and think it caused issues with TMO RSRD, not sure.

Yea, seems I had issues with this mod with TMO, couldn't figure out why, but my game would crash

[Bubblehead1980]

Originally Posted by Armistead

You can adjust the contact time escort will hunt after losing you. I think most mods have it for 30 minutes, simply, they will leave after 30 minutes of losing contact. Set it for a hour or more, they hang around where they had you, if they regain contact the time starts all over, so you do have to be careful to escape.

Someone once made a mod so the escort didn't drop so many charges per run, that way they didn't run out so early......not sure where it is or how well it works, but with that and longer time limits, things can last. Also, setting the escorts crew ratings to elite, they work much better together and hunt you like a coon dog. I hated most escorts in RSRD had such low crew ratings and long ago corrected that. I have several sub killer groups, Matsu's mostly with elite ratings, you don't want to run into them.

Really, what files do i need to look at to change how long they will look for me after losing contact? 30 minutes is a bit too low.I have went back and changed most escorts to vet or elite as well.