Regarding "Dive Time"

Erich dem Roten · 10-21-08, 11:52 AM

When looking at the specs for various boats and their dive time is mentioned, what is that in terms of? Time from surface to 70m with a crash dive, or merely time to fully submerge the vessel at a normal down angle on the planes?

meduza · 10-21-08, 12:28 PM

I'd say it's the latter one.

richardphat · 10-21-08, 12:30 PM

I dont think it is the crash dive. It usually needs more than that if you want to reach the 60m+.
SO i think it is the normal dive

Graf Paper · 10-21-08, 03:29 PM

Using the Type VII boats as an example...

The dive time given is defined as the average number of seconds, at a speed of 10 knots, that it takes for a fully surfaced u-boat (running at a keel depth of ~5 meters for the Type VII) to completely submerge once dive procedures are initiated, in optimal conditions.

A u-boat is considered completely submerged once the conning tower (turm) no longer breaks water and the keel passes a depth of 10 meters (the height of the Type VII from keel to bridge being about 9.6 meters.).

So the dive time, measured in seconds, is how long it takes during a normal dive to achieve a depth of 10 meters running at 10 knots in speed.

Erich dem Roten · 10-21-08, 05:52 PM

Ahhh, thanks. Maybe I should have my whole crew start jumping up and down in the bow torpedo room...seems like the IXB I drive is allergic to water sometimes.

CCIP · 10-21-08, 06:04 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Erich dem Roten

Ahhh, thanks. Maybe I should have my whole crew start jumping up and down in the bow torpedo room...seems like the IXB I drive is allergic to water sometimes.

Hey now, compare that to some of the US subs and she's lightning-fast :p

(actually in general, the IXs are quite a swift diver given their size)

I should also say that the dive times cited in literature are also for a fully-prepared, alert crew that's anticipating the dive at any moment and has the boat prepared and trimmed for a quick and efficient dive. This isn't the case at every point in a patrol, of course, and a boat that's not completely prepared to dive might take several minutes to get under. Of course in SHIII, it'd be a bit harsh on the player to base the dive time on anything but the optimal dive time.

Commander Gizmo · 10-21-08, 08:54 PM

Keep in mind too that there is a difference in giving the 'dive' order, giving the 'pariscope/snorkel depth' order, and the 'crash dive' order. If you order just periscope depth, the crew will not angle the planes and keep then angled such that the sub passes the shallow depth requested. This will slow your sub's decent. Also, crash dive means full throttle for more preasure on the dive planes, as well as flooding the tanks fully for even faster diving.

Didn't I read somewhere around here that the game really does simulate the extra weight of the crew rushing to the fore torpedo room when you move them all forward? I can't find the post I'm thinking of, but I seem to recall that it was confirmed, and seeing a difference in my games.

Erich dem Roten · 10-21-08, 10:33 PM

Well my main concern is planes. Sometimes, even if I hit 'p' and going flank after getting the first sign of airborne radar, planes can still manage to drop close enough to cause damage. It gets annoying crash diving every time, though. Wish there was a command for 'dive planes max down angle' or something.

rifleman13 · 10-21-08, 10:41 PM

I think it's "D" by default...:hmm:

After hitting "D" the boat will continue to dive until
1. You intervene i.e. hit "A" to level off

or
2. You leave the boat alone in shallow waters and incur some type of damage...

or
3. You leave the boat alone in deep waters and continue to dive past crush depth and ... you know the rest

I think that's the closest thing you have to maxing your planes down.

Steeltrap · 10-21-08, 10:49 PM

Note you can also edit the crash dive depth for each sub.

I have 'crash' set for 50m - deep enough to avoid aircraft weapons, shallow enough not to take too long before levelling out.

I recall Peter Cremer (U-333: the Story of a U-Boat Ace) pointing out that the required standard in training (as conducted in the Baltic) was to go from surfaced to 20m in 25 seconds (pretty sure that's right but I can check), so I think the dive time for the type VII is possibly a little long if anything.

Erich dem Roten · 10-21-08, 10:49 PM

Hmm I'll give it a try, thanks

I thought 'D' was just a regular, slow dive, like going to periscope depth except you kept going.

Erich dem Roten · 10-21-08, 10:51 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Steeltrap

Note you can also edit the crash dive depth for each sub.

I have 'crash' set for 50m - deep enough to avoid aircraft weapons, shallow enough not to take too long before levelling out.

I recall Peter Cremer (U-333: the Story of a U-Boat Ace) pointing out that the required standard in training (as conducted in the Baltic) was to go from surfaced to 20m in 25 seconds (pretty sure that's right but I can check), so I think the dive time for the type VII is possibly a little long if anything.

Through the various sub config files, I'm guessing? It'd be nice to have a crash depth a little shallower. And I'd love to get under in 25 seconds. Even if the IX's were fast for their size, it's still damn slow when you can see the planes angling down for their dive :p

Steeltrap · 10-21-08, 10:55 PM

Yes, in the config for each sub you'll find 'CrashDepth=Xm' (or something like that).

Change it and the sub will then level out of a crash at that depth.

I find 50m a good compromise - useful in all but the most shallow water and deep enough to get away from bombs/DCs dropped from aircraft.

Graf Paper · 10-21-08, 10:57 PM

That's why you try to run with "decks awash" during daylight hours when you're sailing in areas heavily patrolled by aircraft.

It does slow your boat's surface speed down a bit but it also cuts dive time in half.

Commander Gizmo · 10-21-08, 11:04 PM

Isn't there a way to adjust the dive planes manually using the 3d dials? Seems like I used to know how to do that. Was that a mod or something?

10-21-08, 11:52 AM	#1
Erich dem Roten Electrician's Mate Join Date: Aug 2008 Location: Connecticut Posts: 134 Downloads: 15 Uploads: 0	Regarding "Dive Time" When looking at the specs for various boats and their dive time is mentioned, what is that in terms of? Time from surface to 70m with a crash dive, or merely time to fully submerge the vessel at a normal down angle on the planes? __________________

10-21-08, 12:28 PM	#2
meduza Ace of the Deep Join Date: Apr 2007 Location: on patrol Posts: 1,035 Downloads: 40 Uploads: 0	I'd say it's the latter one. __________________

10-21-08, 03:29 PM	#4
Graf Paper Ace of the Deep Join Date: Jan 2008 Location: Pacific Northwest United States Posts: 1,146 Downloads: 41 Uploads: 2	Using the Type VII boats as an example... The dive time given is defined as the average number of seconds, at a speed of 10 knots, that it takes for a fully surfaced u-boat (running at a keel depth of ~5 meters for the Type VII) to completely submerge once dive procedures are initiated, in optimal conditions. A u-boat is considered completely submerged once the conning tower (turm) no longer breaks water and the keel passes a depth of 10 meters (the height of the Type VII from keel to bridge being about 9.6 meters.). So the dive time, measured in seconds, is how long it takes during a normal dive to achieve a depth of 10 meters running at 10 knots in speed. __________________ Still sailing the high seas, hunting convoys with those who join me.

10-21-08, 05:52 PM	#5
Erich dem Roten Electrician's Mate Join Date: Aug 2008 Location: Connecticut Posts: 134 Downloads: 15 Uploads: 0	Ahhh, thanks. Maybe I should have my whole crew start jumping up and down in the bow torpedo room...seems like the IXB I drive is allergic to water sometimes. __________________

10-21-08, 10:33 PM	#8
Erich dem Roten Electrician's Mate Join Date: Aug 2008 Location: Connecticut Posts: 134 Downloads: 15 Uploads: 0	Well my main concern is planes. Sometimes, even if I hit 'p' and going flank after getting the first sign of airborne radar, planes can still manage to drop close enough to cause damage. It gets annoying crash diving every time, though. Wish there was a command for 'dive planes max down angle' or something. __________________

10-21-08, 12:30 PM	#3
richardphat Seasoned Skipper Join Date: Apr 2008 Location: Canada Posts: 682 Downloads: 17 Uploads: 0	I dont think it is the crash dive. It usually needs more than that if you want to reach the 60m+. SO i think it is the normal dive

10-21-08, 08:54 PM	#7
Commander Gizmo Watch Officer Join Date: Jan 2007 Posts: 339 Downloads: 76 Uploads: 4	Keep in mind too that there is a difference in giving the 'dive' order, giving the 'pariscope/snorkel depth' order, and the 'crash dive' order. If you order just periscope depth, the crew will not angle the planes and keep then angled such that the sub passes the shallow depth requested. This will slow your sub's decent. Also, crash dive means full throttle for more preasure on the dive planes, as well as flooding the tanks fully for even faster diving. Didn't I read somewhere around here that the game really does simulate the extra weight of the crew rushing to the fore torpedo room when you move them all forward? I can't find the post I'm thinking of, but I seem to recall that it was confirmed, and seeing a difference in my games.

10-21-08, 10:41 PM	#9
rifleman13 Grey Wolf Join Date: May 2008 Location: Depth-charged to Kingdom Come Posts: 927 Downloads: 28 Uploads: 0	I think it's "D" by default...:hmm: After hitting "D" the boat will continue to dive until 1. You intervene i.e. hit "A" to level off or 2. You leave the boat alone in shallow waters and incur some type of damage... or 3. You leave the boat alone in deep waters and continue to dive past crush depth and ... you know the rest I think that's the closest thing you have to maxing your planes down.

10-21-08, 10:49 PM	#10
Steeltrap Grey Wolf Join Date: Mar 2001 Location: Sydney, Australia Posts: 818 Downloads: 3 Uploads: 0	Note you can also edit the crash dive depth for each sub. I have 'crash' set for 50m - deep enough to avoid aircraft weapons, shallow enough not to take too long before levelling out. I recall Peter Cremer (U-333: the Story of a U-Boat Ace) pointing out that the required standard in training (as conducted in the Baltic) was to go from surfaced to 20m in 25 seconds (pretty sure that's right but I can check), so I think the dive time for the type VII is possibly a little long if anything.

10-21-08, 10:49 PM	#11
Erich dem Roten Electrician's Mate Join Date: Aug 2008 Location: Connecticut Posts: 134 Downloads: 15 Uploads: 0	Hmm I'll give it a try, thanks I thought 'D' was just a regular, slow dive, like going to periscope depth except you kept going. __________________

10-21-08, 10:55 PM	#13
Steeltrap Grey Wolf Join Date: Mar 2001 Location: Sydney, Australia Posts: 818 Downloads: 3 Uploads: 0	Yes, in the config for each sub you'll find 'CrashDepth=Xm' (or something like that). Change it and the sub will then level out of a crash at that depth. I find 50m a good compromise - useful in all but the most shallow water and deep enough to get away from bombs/DCs dropped from aircraft.

10-21-08, 10:57 PM	#14
Graf Paper Ace of the Deep Join Date: Jan 2008 Location: Pacific Northwest United States Posts: 1,146 Downloads: 41 Uploads: 2	That's why you try to run with "decks awash" during daylight hours when you're sailing in areas heavily patrolled by aircraft. It does slow your boat's surface speed down a bit but it also cuts dive time in half. __________________ Still sailing the high seas, hunting convoys with those who join me.

10-21-08, 11:04 PM	#15
Commander Gizmo Watch Officer Join Date: Jan 2007 Posts: 339 Downloads: 76 Uploads: 4	Isn't there a way to adjust the dive planes manually using the 3d dials? Seems like I used to know how to do that. Was that a mod or something?