I just do not get it.

Frame57 · 06-29-08, 09:47 PM

Anyway until I learn how to tweak files I have to deal with this passion of mine. Let me explain. I set up some scenarios with Seawolf and 688i and found they are similar in accoustic ability. Pitifully! I set it up to intercept and track a Rubis SSN. Simple stuff. Both boats could not detect over 5000 yards with Rubis doing 7 knts. Shameful. For the heck of it, I play the same scenario with a Sierra class boat and the boat picks up the Rubis at 30k yards and even classifies it correctly. The accoustic abilities of these boats need work. there is too great a discrepency here.

Blacklight · 06-29-08, 11:28 PM

Funny you should mention database editing. I've been looking for a copy of SCedit (The Sub Command database editor) for a couple days now. That's the tool that you need to play with the sensors. As far as editing to change the acoustics of the various platforms, I'd have no idea how to even begin doing that... yet.

If I do manage to find a copy of SCedit, I'll let you know.

There is a DWedit on the Subguru site that does the same for Dangerous Waters database. I've been playing with that for the longest time working on my longtime project "The GI JOE mod". I'm working on designing the Cobra navy..slowly but surely... So far, I've been pretty much copying random platform models and re-skinning them to be black with the Cobra symbol on the side. I also need to get in there and do some weapon editing and or adding for the Cobra platforms. At the rate I'm going, it's going to be YEARS before I finish this thing though. It's a labor of love/hate hehe.

clive bradbury · 06-30-08, 03:28 AM

I have a copy. The site on which it was available no longer exists. As it is not my work I cannot put it out for genral release, but if you pm me with an e-mail address I'll send it to you.

Hitman · 06-30-08, 07:33 AM

Clive,

I have 1.01 as latest version, readme says 25.01.2002

Is there any later one?

Thanks

clive bradbury · 06-30-08, 08:06 AM

Same as mine, hitman.

Frame57 · 06-30-08, 07:35 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Blacklight

Funny you should mention database editing. I've been looking for a copy of SCedit (The Sub Command database editor) for a couple days now. That's the tool that you need to play with the sensors. As far as editing to change the acoustics of the various platforms, I'd have no idea how to even begin doing that... yet.

If I do manage to find a copy of SCedit, I'll let you know.

There is a DWedit on the Subguru site that does the same for Dangerous Waters database. I've been playing with that for the longest time working on my longtime project "The GI JOE mod". I'm working on designing the Cobra navy..slowly but surely... So far, I've been pretty much copying random platform models and re-skinning them to be black with the Cobra symbol on the side. I also need to get in there and do some weapon editing and or adding for the Cobra platforms. At the rate I'm going, it's going to be YEARS before I finish this thing though. It's a labor of love/hate hehe.

That would be great! Because these boats need some tweaking. I understand that an older boat with a BQQ-5 would have less accoustical ability than one with the BQQ-5E and so forth. Our 637 boat was good enough to hear how fast another boats coolant pumps were running. So, I think some editing is needed here.

Blacklight · 06-30-08, 09:31 PM

Talk to TLAM Strike or Molon Labe. Maybe you could become an advisor for the next LWAMI version.

I personally think that the reason the sensors and acoustics are the way they are in the interest of playability and evening the playing field a little bit for multiplayer. I know that some things had to be altered a bit in the interest of playability durring the sims' development.

Frame57 · 07-01-08, 10:51 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Blacklight

Talk to TLAM Strike or Molon Labe. Maybe you could become an advisor for the next LWAMI version.

I personally think that the reason the sensors and acoustics are the way they are in the interest of playability and evening the playing field a little bit for multiplayer. I know that some things had to be altered a bit in the interest of playability durring the sims' development.

Agreed on that. An Idea would be to have a profile listing in a "read me". Because let's say I want to drive a "Permit" class boat and you want to drive the "Seawolf". I would not stand a chance in real life. But if we or others chose platforms from the same era then they should be matched somewhat. I think they tried doing that, but they went way too low on the performance of the "Cold war Era" boats. No! Strike that, I think the SSN-21 has a stinky accoustical performance too. But that Sierra can pick up a whale fart at 50k yards. I am waiting for Clive to send me some info on how to properly tweak the files. I just do solo stuff, but crave realism. Thanks for the info!

OneShot · 07-01-08, 12:37 PM

LwAmi is DW only ... and I doubt anybody will spend any further time on SCX2. Since as far as DW goes other playable platforms aside from those already existing are a No Go ... well ...

Of course I dont count the highly illegal mods which can be found on the net which do allow you to play some other units.

However, given that initially this discussion was about SC anyway I think this is a moot point.

Cheers
OS

clive bradbury · 07-01-08, 03:36 PM

Tweaking the files isn't very easy with the editor, I'm afraid. As there seem to be quite a few of you interested, I suppose I had better put a fairly comprehensive guide together. Be patient, though, it will take some time, and I am on holiday shortly.

Blacklight · 07-01-08, 08:32 PM

Quote:

Tweaking the files isn't very easy with the editor, I'm afraid. As there seem to be quite a few of you interested, I suppose I had better put a fairly comprehensive guide together. Be patient, though, it will take some time, and I am on holiday shortly.

It would be so awesome to have a comprehensive guide to file editing for DW and Sub Command !! Having a good modding guide would really do wonders for increasing the number of people in the modding community !! Thanks !!!

Robsoie · 07-12-08, 09:52 PM

It is sad utilities like this one nearly disappear from the internet, as it seems to be the only capable of editing the SubCommand database files.

If anyone is interested, it seems that page have the latest version of SCEdit version 1.0.7.4.

In case the page is down for somereason, this is the direct link

If the file disappear, here are some mirrors for the download that should be working for some time.

A Filefront mirror just in case as it should be more durable.

The date on the readme is 25.01.2002 , but judging from a previous post that state 1.0.1 readme is at the same date, i guess the author did not updated the date on the readme.

Frame57 · 07-13-08, 02:02 PM

Thanks Rob, I did download it and will check it out. This is curious. My autocrew picked up a fast moving Alpha via the Towed array at 20K yards. Finally i thought they are doing their job. Sea stae was one with very little surface traffic. I made sure i was on the same side of the thermal as the Alpha. I let the Alpha het to 6000 yards of me and was in position so my hull array could pick it up and the frigging crew classifies the Alph as a false contact

This is on a 688i platform to boot. I was able to do myself at a much farther distance, but the point here is why does the autocrew act like friggin dupes? I think the arrays might be OK. My suspicion is that the autocrew really are working for the enemy or some crap. I will see if there is a way to boost their efficiency. Thanks for the info!

Robsoie · 07-14-08, 10:09 PM

I always do not understand the AI crew.
Sometime they will pick up and report a signal i can't see at all on any of the different sonars in the sub, and sometime they don't seems to notice the obvious contact.

That's why i guess i prefer to play with them disabled, as they are not constant in their reliability, i have then more fun in trying to do the sonar work myself now.

I wish it was possible to configure their efficiency somewhere, so you could setup them as good crew or bad crew for your own challenges needs in mission.

But now there must be a difference with SC 1.08 and SC with SCXIIc, as it seems SCXIIc seems to lower any submarine sonars abilities to detect an enemy sub , making all of them even stealthier than they were in SC 1.08, i believe it has an impact on the AI crew making them even less good than in SC 1.08

While detecting surfaces ships seems to give no problem at all to the AI crew in both SC 1.08 and SCXIIc, it seems detecting subs is more difficult for not only the player but for the AI too.

Frame57 · 07-15-08, 06:15 PM

I agree! It is funny though. The same folks who made 688i where the boat can pick stuff up at 80k yards, now have it in these newer games to where it is the other way around. I have to remind myself that it is only a game. For me though there is a fun factor and satisfaction in having an efficient crew. In SH4 I get that but I do not really like WW2 games as much as the modern platforms. I can understand folks enjoying the sonar stuff. But the game should be called "Sonar Operator" rather than "Sub Command". Our CO was not an ST and would only go into the sonar shack when we were trailing another sub. But one day a company will make a game that can really put into perspective what a CO really does. The games leave out a vital function for combat tactics and that is using trim angle. I had a couple of fish shot at me and in real life I should be able to produce 30 plus angles. Not here! If you have to get deep fast you are screwed. I can get to 1300 feet faster in an elevator than i can in these "SIMS". If I were filthy rich, I would make a game that would blow your mind and would be as realistic as possible without infringing on classified infomation. They have a good game in SC and DW. But we need dynamic mission like Ubisoft did in SH series, but put into modern day Sub warfare. It could be done and I think would be a hit.

06-29-08, 09:47 PM	#1
Frame57 Sea Lord Join Date: May 2008 Location: 1300 feet on the crapper Posts: 1,860 Downloads: 2 Uploads: 0	I just do not get it. Anyway until I learn how to tweak files I have to deal with this passion of mine. Let me explain. I set up some scenarios with Seawolf and 688i and found they are similar in accoustic ability. Pitifully! I set it up to intercept and track a Rubis SSN. Simple stuff. Both boats could not detect over 5000 yards with Rubis doing 7 knts. Shameful. For the heck of it, I play the same scenario with a Sierra class boat and the boat picks up the Rubis at 30k yards and even classifies it correctly. The accoustic abilities of these boats need work. there is too great a discrepency here.

06-29-08, 11:28 PM	#2
Blacklight Ocean Warrior Join Date: Sep 2006 Location: Connecticut Posts: 2,507 Downloads: 145 Uploads: 0	Funny you should mention database editing. I've been looking for a copy of SCedit (The Sub Command database editor) for a couple days now. That's the tool that you need to play with the sensors. As far as editing to change the acoustics of the various platforms, I'd have no idea how to even begin doing that... yet. If I do manage to find a copy of SCedit, I'll let you know. There is a DWedit on the Subguru site that does the same for Dangerous Waters database. I've been playing with that for the longest time working on my longtime project "The GI JOE mod". I'm working on designing the Cobra navy..slowly but surely... So far, I've been pretty much copying random platform models and re-skinning them to be black with the Cobra symbol on the side. I also need to get in there and do some weapon editing and or adding for the Cobra platforms. At the rate I'm going, it's going to be YEARS before I finish this thing though. It's a labor of love/hate hehe. __________________ Be my friend or be a mushroom cloud. "I am coming at you. You will explode in a couple of minutes !"

06-30-08, 07:33 AM	#4
Hitman Pacific Aces Dev Team Join Date: Sep 2002 Location: Spain Posts: 6,109 Downloads: 109 Uploads: 2	Clive, I have 1.01 as latest version, readme says 25.01.2002 Is there any later one? Thanks __________________ One day I will return to sea ...

06-30-08, 09:31 PM	#7
Blacklight Ocean Warrior Join Date: Sep 2006 Location: Connecticut Posts: 2,507 Downloads: 145 Uploads: 0	Talk to TLAM Strike or Molon Labe. Maybe you could become an advisor for the next LWAMI version. I personally think that the reason the sensors and acoustics are the way they are in the interest of playability and evening the playing field a little bit for multiplayer. I know that some things had to be altered a bit in the interest of playability durring the sims' development. __________________ Be my friend or be a mushroom cloud. "I am coming at you. You will explode in a couple of minutes !"

07-01-08, 12:37 PM	#9
OneShot Grey Wolf Join Date: Mar 2005 Location: Germany Posts: 956 Downloads: 9 Uploads: 0	LwAmi is DW only ... and I doubt anybody will spend any further time on SCX2. Since as far as DW goes other playable platforms aside from those already existing are a No Go ... well ... Of course I dont count the highly illegal mods which can be found on the net which do allow you to play some other units. However, given that initially this discussion was about SC anyway I think this is a moot point. Cheers OS __________________ All the things you always wanted to know about Dangerous Waters but never dared to ask!

06-30-08, 03:28 AM	#3
clive bradbury Captain Join Date: Jun 2004 Location: stoke-on-trent, UK Posts: 492 Downloads: 105 Uploads: 0	I have a copy. The site on which it was available no longer exists. As it is not my work I cannot put it out for genral release, but if you pm me with an e-mail address I'll send it to you.

06-30-08, 08:06 AM	#5
clive bradbury Captain Join Date: Jun 2004 Location: stoke-on-trent, UK Posts: 492 Downloads: 105 Uploads: 0	Same as mine, hitman.

07-01-08, 03:36 PM	#10
clive bradbury Captain Join Date: Jun 2004 Location: stoke-on-trent, UK Posts: 492 Downloads: 105 Uploads: 0	Tweaking the files isn't very easy with the editor, I'm afraid. As there seem to be quite a few of you interested, I suppose I had better put a fairly comprehensive guide together. Be patient, though, it will take some time, and I am on holiday shortly.

07-12-08, 09:52 PM	#12
Robsoie Machinist's Mate Join Date: Jun 2008 Posts: 130 Downloads: 0 Uploads: 0	It is sad utilities like this one nearly disappear from the internet, as it seems to be the only capable of editing the SubCommand database files. If anyone is interested, it seems that page have the latest version of SCEdit version 1.0.7.4. In case the page is down for somereason, this is the direct link If the file disappear, here are some mirrors for the download that should be working for some time. A Filefront mirror just in case as it should be more durable. The date on the readme is 25.01.2002 , but judging from a previous post that state 1.0.1 readme is at the same date, i guess the author did not updated the date on the readme.

07-13-08, 02:02 PM	#13
Frame57 Sea Lord Join Date: May 2008 Location: 1300 feet on the crapper Posts: 1,860 Downloads: 2 Uploads: 0	Thanks Rob, I did download it and will check it out. This is curious. My autocrew picked up a fast moving Alpha via the Towed array at 20K yards. Finally i thought they are doing their job. Sea stae was one with very little surface traffic. I made sure i was on the same side of the thermal as the Alpha. I let the Alpha het to 6000 yards of me and was in position so my hull array could pick it up and the frigging crew classifies the Alph as a false contact This is on a 688i platform to boot. I was able to do myself at a much farther distance, but the point here is why does the autocrew act like friggin dupes? I think the arrays might be OK. My suspicion is that the autocrew really are working for the enemy or some crap. I will see if there is a way to boost their efficiency. Thanks for the info!

07-14-08, 10:09 PM	#14
Robsoie Machinist's Mate Join Date: Jun 2008 Posts: 130 Downloads: 0 Uploads: 0	I always do not understand the AI crew. Sometime they will pick up and report a signal i can't see at all on any of the different sonars in the sub, and sometime they don't seems to notice the obvious contact. That's why i guess i prefer to play with them disabled, as they are not constant in their reliability, i have then more fun in trying to do the sonar work myself now. I wish it was possible to configure their efficiency somewhere, so you could setup them as good crew or bad crew for your own challenges needs in mission. But now there must be a difference with SC 1.08 and SC with SCXIIc, as it seems SCXIIc seems to lower any submarine sonars abilities to detect an enemy sub , making all of them even stealthier than they were in SC 1.08, i believe it has an impact on the AI crew making them even less good than in SC 1.08 While detecting surfaces ships seems to give no problem at all to the AI crew in both SC 1.08 and SCXIIc, it seems detecting subs is more difficult for not only the player but for the AI too.

07-15-08, 06:15 PM	#15
Frame57 Sea Lord Join Date: May 2008 Location: 1300 feet on the crapper Posts: 1,860 Downloads: 2 Uploads: 0	I agree! It is funny though. The same folks who made 688i where the boat can pick stuff up at 80k yards, now have it in these newer games to where it is the other way around. I have to remind myself that it is only a game. For me though there is a fun factor and satisfaction in having an efficient crew. In SH4 I get that but I do not really like WW2 games as much as the modern platforms. I can understand folks enjoying the sonar stuff. But the game should be called "Sonar Operator" rather than "Sub Command". Our CO was not an ST and would only go into the sonar shack when we were trailing another sub. But one day a company will make a game that can really put into perspective what a CO really does. The games leave out a vital function for combat tactics and that is using trim angle. I had a couple of fish shot at me and in real life I should be able to produce 30 plus angles. Not here! If you have to get deep fast you are screwed. I can get to 1300 feet faster in an elevator than i can in these "SIMS". If I were filthy rich, I would make a game that would blow your mind and would be as realistic as possible without infringing on classified infomation. They have a good game in SC and DW. But we need dynamic mission like Ubisoft did in SH series, but put into modern day Sub warfare. It could be done and I think would be a hit.