Norway an enemy from 40-45?

jasonsagert · 01-23-07, 02:26 AM

Alright, this is confusing me. When, if at all, is Norway an enemy of germany? I was leaving Bergen, ran into a norweigen ship, checked the flag guide that is in the 'scope view and it showed norway as an enemy by '44 (which was the year).

What?--this seemed odd as I had just left a Norweigen port. OK, so I sink the ship and it goes down with the grey icon--which indicates to me that it wasn't an enemy but a neutral.

Question: Are Norweigen ships ever fare game?--or did I get the grey icon for some other reason. If they are never enemies, why are they listed as such on the flag recognition pull-down with the scope and UZO in GWX?

I'm confused.

J

_Seth_ · 01-23-07, 03:48 AM

Hi jas!
Norway was the enemy during the whole war. German occupied it, and used its ports to their own ships. (Take a look at safe-keepers Norops project, then you'll get the inputs on this).

jasonsagert · 01-23-07, 04:10 AM

Seth,

This makes sense--I'm a student of the war, but why did I get the Grey sunken ship Icon? I was ~10 km from the ship when it went down. Does the grey icon just mean that you know that a ship went down, but not what ship--neutral, enemy, or friendly?

It's the grey icon that's confusing me. Such a simple question, but I torp'ed the ship, turned to leave, it went down, and it showed up as a grey icon--why?

Damn, i've been playing this game since it came out and I really feel that I should know the answer to this

I feel that it was just that I was a little ways from it. Is this how it works?

J

_Seth_ · 01-23-07, 04:27 AM

Hmmm...interesting question. I am used to the sunken ships turning red on the map. It could possibly be, as you said mate, that the ship was "unknown".. If anyone could answer this, i would also like to know this.. (Have actually never thought about it..)

jasonsagert · 01-23-07, 04:45 AM

And to make the point more clear, it was a norweigin ship--Hell, I torp'ed it at 400m. The flag was obvious through the scope at that range. So, I'm sure that it wasn't a "neutral". Hmm....I guess the grey icon is just there to confuse me!!!

Damn Norweigens!!

But I thought of something that would explain it:hmm: If I torp'ed it, and then Goering's boys came and sunk it, well then that would explain it, 'cause then I really didn't sink it--which would explain the grey icon.

Just a hypothesis. And before you ask me if the sinking is in my log--I was pissed off and restarted that patrol without looking

J

Mooncatt · 01-23-07, 08:02 AM

may sound like a stupid question but what was the weather like???
the reason i ask is because in stock sh3 grey icons meant that they had sunk for natural reasons i.e severe weather or collision with another boat etc etc. so your fish may have just damaged her and they weather did the rest.
only a thought though and maybe wrong

_Seth_ · 01-23-07, 08:29 AM

@ mooncatt: that sounds plausible, mate. Good thinking!

meowmers · 01-29-07, 03:54 AM

since it was an occupied country wouldn't the ships be neutral or allied like the French? the neutral icon seems logical.

melnibonian · 01-29-07, 05:55 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by meowmers

since it was an occupied country wouldn't the ships be neutral or allied like the French? the neutral icon seems logical.

I think it has to do with the fact that France did sign a peace treaty with Germany that end the war (surrender basically but let's try to be polite

). If I remember correctly the Norwigean Goverment and King left the country and had no contact with the Germans, so basically there was never any formal peace treaty. I don't know I'm just speculating.

froschman · 01-29-07, 06:12 AM

Germany did start the occupation of Norway (and Denmark) on April 9 1940. The Norwegian Goverment and King managed to escape via Narvik to England, and led the resistance from there for the rest of the war. There was never a peace treaty between Germany and Norway, it was occupied the rest the war. The norwegian merchant fleet, which was pretty big, did work for the allied during the war.

Jimbuna · 01-29-07, 08:32 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by melnibonian

Quote:

Originally Posted by meowmers

since it was an occupied country wouldn't the ships be neutral or allied like the French? the neutral icon seems logical.

I think it has to do with the fact that France did sign a peace treaty with Germany that end the war (surrender basically but let's try to be polite

). If I remember correctly the Norwigean Goverment and King left the country and had no contact with the Germans, so basically there was never any formal peace treaty. I don't know I'm just speculating.

This might interest you mel

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Vidkun_Quisling

@ mooncatt
IIRC your right

if a ship sinks to another cause other than by enemy action ie: floundering in bad weather or minefield (friendly or otherwise) then it's demise is not attributed to you hence the grey coloured icon

melnibonian · 01-29-07, 08:59 AM

Thanks Jim

mookiemookie · 01-29-07, 09:13 AM

Gray ship icons are not neutral (neutrals are green). They most often appear when you sink a ship in poor weather and it's just on the limits of visibility when it goes down. You do still get credit for sinking them, so don't worry. I remember in my last career, I had sunk the Rodney and it appeared as a gray icon, but the tonnage showed up in my totals.

I'm not sure of the exact reason why it happens, but this has been my experience.

01-23-07, 02:26 AM	#1
jasonsagert Torpedoman Join Date: Mar 2006 Posts: 113 Downloads: 2 Uploads: 0	Norway an enemy from 40-45? Alright, this is confusing me. When, if at all, is Norway an enemy of germany? I was leaving Bergen, ran into a norweigen ship, checked the flag guide that is in the 'scope view and it showed norway as an enemy by '44 (which was the year). What?--this seemed odd as I had just left a Norweigen port. OK, so I sink the ship and it goes down with the grey icon--which indicates to me that it wasn't an enemy but a neutral. Question: Are Norweigen ships ever fare game?--or did I get the grey icon for some other reason. If they are never enemies, why are they listed as such on the flag recognition pull-down with the scope and UZO in GWX? I'm confused. J

01-23-07, 03:48 AM	#2
_Seth_ Ocean Warrior Join Date: Dec 2005 Location: In Tromsoe, @Tirpitz' final resting place.. Posts: 3,277 Downloads: 94 Uploads: 0	Hi jas! Norway was the enemy during the whole war. German occupied it, and used its ports to their own ships. (Take a look at safe-keepers Norops project, then you'll get the inputs on this). __________________

01-23-07, 04:27 AM	#4
_Seth_ Ocean Warrior Join Date: Dec 2005 Location: In Tromsoe, @Tirpitz' final resting place.. Posts: 3,277 Downloads: 94 Uploads: 0	Hmmm...interesting question. I am used to the sunken ships turning red on the map. It could possibly be, as you said mate, that the ship was "unknown".. If anyone could answer this, i would also like to know this.. (Have actually never thought about it..) __________________

01-23-07, 08:02 AM	#6
Mooncatt Grey Wolf Join Date: Jun 2006 Location: Keighley UK Posts: 938 Downloads: 78 Uploads: 0	may sound like a stupid question but what was the weather like??? the reason i ask is because in stock sh3 grey icons meant that they had sunk for natural reasons i.e severe weather or collision with another boat etc etc. so your fish may have just damaged her and they weather did the rest. only a thought though and maybe wrong __________________

01-23-07, 08:29 AM	#7
_Seth_ Ocean Warrior Join Date: Dec 2005 Location: In Tromsoe, @Tirpitz' final resting place.. Posts: 3,277 Downloads: 94 Uploads: 0	@ mooncatt: that sounds plausible, mate. Good thinking! __________________

01-23-07, 04:10 AM	#3
jasonsagert Torpedoman Join Date: Mar 2006 Posts: 113 Downloads: 2 Uploads: 0	Seth, This makes sense--I'm a student of the war, but why did I get the Grey sunken ship Icon? I was ~10 km from the ship when it went down. Does the grey icon just mean that you know that a ship went down, but not what ship--neutral, enemy, or friendly? It's the grey icon that's confusing me. Such a simple question, but I torp'ed the ship, turned to leave, it went down, and it showed up as a grey icon--why? Damn, i've been playing this game since it came out and I really feel that I should know the answer to this I feel that it was just that I was a little ways from it. Is this how it works? J

01-23-07, 04:45 AM	#5
jasonsagert Torpedoman Join Date: Mar 2006 Posts: 113 Downloads: 2 Uploads: 0	And to make the point more clear, it was a norweigin ship--Hell, I torp'ed it at 400m. The flag was obvious through the scope at that range. So, I'm sure that it wasn't a "neutral". Hmm....I guess the grey icon is just there to confuse me!!! Damn Norweigens!! But I thought of something that would explain it:hmm: If I torp'ed it, and then Goering's boys came and sunk it, well then that would explain it, 'cause then I really didn't sink it--which would explain the grey icon. Just a hypothesis. And before you ask me if the sinking is in my log--I was pissed off and restarted that patrol without looking J

01-29-07, 03:54 AM	#8
meowmers Bilge Rat Join Date: Jan 2007 Posts: 1 Downloads: 36 Uploads: 0	since it was an occupied country wouldn't the ships be neutral or allied like the French? the neutral icon seems logical.

01-29-07, 06:12 AM	#10
froschman Watch Join Date: Dec 2006 Location: Röstånga, Sweden Posts: 30 Downloads: 0 Uploads: 0	Germany did start the occupation of Norway (and Denmark) on April 9 1940. The Norwegian Goverment and King managed to escape via Narvik to England, and led the resistance from there for the rest of the war. There was never a peace treaty between Germany and Norway, it was occupied the rest the war. The norwegian merchant fleet, which was pretty big, did work for the allied during the war.

01-29-07, 08:59 AM	#12
melnibonian Ocean Warrior Join Date: Jul 2006 Location: Reading UK Posts: 3,473 Downloads: 90 Uploads: 0	Thanks Jim __________________ http://www.thegreywolves.com/ http://wolvesatwar.com/ Download GWX and other goodies: http://hosted.filefront.com/melnibonian

01-29-07, 09:13 AM	#13
mookiemookie Navy Seal Join Date: Nov 2005 Location: Houston, TX Posts: 9,404 Downloads: 105 Uploads: 1	Gray ship icons are not neutral (neutrals are green). They most often appear when you sink a ship in poor weather and it's just on the limits of visibility when it goes down. You do still get credit for sinking them, so don't worry. I remember in my last career, I had sunk the Rodney and it appeared as a gray icon, but the tonnage showed up in my totals. I'm not sure of the exact reason why it happens, but this has been my experience. __________________ They don’t think it be like it is, but it do. Want more U-boat Kaleun portraits for your SH3 Commander Profiles? Download the SH3 Commander Portrait Pack here.