Bullnose BLOWN OFF

[Torpex77]

https://ibb.co/ZSFT4PV

https://ibb.co/NVnVYmK

[Bubblehead1980]

Originally Posted by Torpex77

Ouch!

Cause? Torpedo? Gunfire? Ramming? Only time I have ever had that happen was years ago when I rammed a the Q ship in TMO.

[Torpex77]

Originally Posted by Bubblehead1980

Ouch!

Cause? Torpedo? Gunfire? Ramming? Only time I have ever had that happen was years ago when I rammed a the Q ship in TMO.

Torpedo from an ESCORT! Did Not see that Coming at ALL!

No Internal damage, but it did register as 52% Hull damage.

Here's the Thing...This is the SECOND time this happened. First time was in an S-Class in March 42 in the Sibutu Passage. I thought my encountering a "Task Force" of Sampans was silly until it turned out to be 2 Gyoraitei patrol boats. They seemed confused and shooting way off target so I thought Id finish em off with the Deck Gun.

As Im on the deck gun blasting away, I notice these things drop off the sides. Torpedos??? In SH4 shot at me??? So I turn and put the Bow Directly at the patrol boat, figuring Id drive between them. Well One blew up and is that a hellacious event while on the deck gun..lol it actually stunned me for ma second in real life..

FOTRS 1.7 is EXCELLENT

https://imgbb.com/ZSFT4PV

https://ibb.co/NVnVYmK

[KaleunMarco]

Originally Posted by Torpex77

Torpedo from an ESCORT! Did Not see that Coming at ALL!

it is in the documentation.
very dangerous....you go first.

[Torpex77]

Originally Posted by KaleunMarco

it is in the documentation.
very dangerous....you go first.

Ill Check with my Comms Officer and see why He missed that!

[Bubblehead1980]

Originally Posted by Torpex77

Torpedo from an ESCORT! Did Not see that Coming at ALL!

No Internal damage, but it did register as 52% Hull damage.

Here's the Thing...This is the SECOND time this happened. First time was in an S-Class in March 42 in the Sibutu Passage. I thought my encountering a "Task Force" of Sampans was silly until it turned out to be 2 Gyoraitei patrol boats. They seemed confused and shooting way off target so I thought Id finish em off with the Deck Gun.

As Im on the deck gun blasting away, I notice these things drop off the sides. Torpedos??? In SH4 shot at me??? So I turn and put the Bow Directly at the patrol boat, figuring Id drive between them. Well One blew up and is that a hellacious event while on the deck gun..lol it actually stunned me for ma second in real life..

FOTRS 1.7 is EXCELLENT

https://imgbb.com/ZSFT4PV

https://ibb.co/NVnVYmK

Ouch! Yea, you shouldve been sunk lol.

They will definitely get you. Escorts in FOTRS caught me off guard first time firing torpedoes at me and I expected it was coming as had read about it in the readme.

In TMO I am working on AI DD's having torpedoes. The surfaced and submerged AI submarines can fire them now, as can PT boats. Thanks to FOTRS of course, I learned by example.


I've only been torpedoed once, I was in a Narwhal leaving Pearl in December 1941, on the surface at night, sailing along, no warning. Boom! AI submarine got me.

Had quite a few close closes in various patrols, been shot at by other subs, but never been hit.


US AI subs will attack enemy convoys, so wolfpack ops are now possible, a lot of fun teaming up on enemy convoys, can get intense. Did recently learn in testing to be careful as torpedoes which missed enemy can hit you on other side of convoy (one reason Wolfpack doctrine was to "take turns" attacking from opposite sides.

[Torpex77]

I have no issue with AI Subs, or any Historically accurate Patrol Boat or escort that had them AND historically used them. I just hope it doesn't get like Crash Dive II and turn unrealistic like that arcade game.

I've studied the pacific war my entire adult life, and I play WWII subsims with the experiences and documentation from WWII, plus my own real life submarine life. I pretty much use documentation to know what keys do what LOL

Escorts shooting torpedo's is not documented anywhere in anything I ever read, so it has me raising an eyebrow. Not saying I couldn't have missed it being mentioned, but if it was common (over 75% reported) I think myself and others would have introduced it to WWII Pacific Submarine simulations decades ago. I still think The Modder's here do an excellent Job and greatly appreciate their work.

[Bubblehead1980]

Originally Posted by Torpex77

I have no issue with AI Subs, or any Historically accurate Patrol Boat or escort that had them AND historically used them. I just hope it doesn't get like Crash Dive II and turn unrealistic like that arcade game.

I've studied the pacific war my entire adult life, and I play WWII subsims with the experiences and documentation from WWII, plus my own real life submarine life. I pretty much use documentation to know what keys do what LOL

Escorts shooting torpedo's is not documented anywhere in anything I ever read, so it has me raising an eyebrow. Not saying I couldn't have missed it being mentioned, but if it was common (over 75% reported) I think myself and others would have introduced it to WWII Pacific Submarine simulations decades ago. I still think The Modder's here do an excellent Job and greatly appreciate their work.

I agree. I have taken great steps to prevent things from becoming "arcade " like and maintain historical accuracy much as possible within the limitations of the sim. Encounters with AI subs are pretty rare, but possible. The danger of a lurking AI sub which can torpedo player sub without warning is always there, it encourages vigilance and realistic behavior by player such as setting a zig zag course. To keep things realistic in game , submerged AI subs have to get pretty close to engage. PT boat's can shoot them as well, but if player is operating in proper manner, should never be in situation where a PT boat can shoot torpedoes at them. However, if they choose to put themselves in situation, they run the risk of being torpedoed. Far as the regular escorts, I will not add them .


However, I want fleet type destroyers to have torpedoes for surface battles between different forces, for better immersion, as I have things modified now where they will engage at longer ranges. Actually had BB's engaging one another at about 18000 yards other day in testing(!), which is a huge improvement over the default "always practically at point blank" engagement style of the AI. Best part, is they nor smaller ships like DD's engage subs at such distances, can't detect them. One great improvement was Yamato and others blasting away at the CVE's off Samar in Oct 1944 for example, BB's opened fire at 14000 yards.


To ensure every escort player encounters is not lobbing torpedoes for reasons you mentioned, plan to limit AI torpedoes to select enemy fleet destroyers , submarines, and PT boats and select number of Allied DD, DE, along with subs and PT boats of course. Like always, its about balance.


I do not recall reading about escorts shooting torpedoes at subs either. I highly doubt a fleet type destroyer would have have chanced wasting its torpedoes on a sub, which is a difficult target to torpedo, esp with destroyer's torpedo attack doctrine. A PT boat though, would likely take a shot, especially if guarding a pass or strait and got a shot. Just doubt many, if any , found themselves in a proper position to fire at a sub.

[Torpex77]

Originally Posted by Bubblehead1980

I agree. I have taken great steps to prevent things from becoming "arcade " like and maintain historical accuracy much as possible within the limitations of the sim. Encounters with AI subs are pretty rare, but possible. The danger of a lurking AI sub which can torpedo player sub without warning is always there, it encourages vigilance and realistic behavior by player such as setting a zig zag course. To keep things realistic in game , submerged AI subs have to get pretty close to engage. PT boat's can shoot them as well, but if player is operating in proper manner, should never be in situation where a PT boat can shoot torpedoes at them. However, if they choose to put themselves in situation, they run the risk of being torpedoed. Far as the regular escorts, I will not add them .


However, I want fleet type destroyers to have torpedoes for surface battles between different forces, for better immersion, as I have things modified now where they will engage at longer ranges. Actually had BB's engaging one another at about 18000 yards other day in testing(!), which is a huge improvement over the default "always practically at point blank" engagement style of the AI. Best part, is they nor smaller ships like DD's engage subs at such distances, can't detect them. One great improvement was Yamato and others blasting away at the CVE's off Samar in Oct 1944 for example, BB's opened fire at 14000 yards.


To ensure every escort player encounters is not lobbing torpedoes for reasons you mentioned, plan to limit AI torpedoes to select enemy fleet destroyers , submarines, and PT boats and select number of Allied DD, DE, along with subs and PT boats of course. Like always, its about balance.


I do not recall reading about escorts shooting torpedoes at subs either. I highly doubt a fleet type destroyer would have have chanced wasting its torpedoes on a sub, which is a difficult target to torpedo, esp with destroyer's torpedo attack doctrine. A PT boat though, would likely take a shot, especially if guarding a pass or strait and got a shot. Just doubt many, if any , found themselves in a proper position to fire at a sub.

I agree 100%. DD's shooting Torpedo's at Enemy task force is very legit.
Besides..US Subs had enough worry with our own torpedo's potentially sinking them!

All said though....LOL....pretty proud to have survived two Torpedo Hits!

[propbeanie]

There are several stories of DD shooting torpedoes at subs. The SingleMission in FotRSU "Three Of A Kind" that cdrsubron7 built, is based on such an incident, where a sub on the surface was approaching a stationary DD near Attu. The US at the time was not cognizant of range of the Japanese Long Lance, so the sub was trying to get closer / faster in order to use their torpedoes before the DD got underway. Lookouts reported torpedo tracks coming at them when about 6,000 yards out, so they crash dived, and then heard more torpedoes inbound. I have the boat's name somewhere in my pile of 'stuff'... but there are other subs that have reports of torpedoes shot at them in their War Patrol Reports. They did not happen often, but they were not rare either. From what I can gather, less than the number of friendly-fire incidents, but there were quite a few. Submarines were often mistaken for a DD or subchaser from a distance, and the Japanese loved to shoot their Long Lance from long range. "Surprise" factor...

[Bubblehead1980]

Originally Posted by propbeanie

There are several stories of DD shooting torpedoes at subs. The SingleMission in FotRSU "Three Of A Kind" that cdrsubron7 built, is based on such an incident, where a sub on the surface was approaching a stationary DD near Attu. The US at the time was not cognizant of range of the Japanese Long Lance, so the sub was trying to get closer / faster in order to use their torpedoes before the DD got underway. Lookouts reported torpedo tracks coming at them when about 6,000 yards out, so they crash dived, and then heard more torpedoes inbound. I have the boat's name somewhere in my pile of 'stuff'... but there are other subs that have reports of torpedoes shot at them in their War Patrol Reports. They did not happen often, but they were not rare either. From what I can gather, less than the number of friendly-fire incidents, but there were quite a few. Submarines were often mistaken for a DD or subchaser from a distance, and the Japanese loved to shoot their Long Lance from long range. "Surprise" factor...

Boat was the Growler (I think).

[merc4ulfate]

Originally Posted by Torpex77

I have no issue with AI Subs, or any Historically accurate Patrol Boat or escort that had them AND historically used them. I just hope it doesn't get like Crash Dive II and turn unrealistic like that arcade game.

I've studied the pacific war my entire adult life, and I play WWII subsims with the experiences and documentation from WWII, plus my own real life submarine life. I pretty much use documentation to know what keys do what LOL

Escorts shooting torpedo's is not documented anywhere in anything I ever read, so it has me raising an eyebrow. Not saying I couldn't have missed it being mentioned, but if it was common (over 75% reported) I think myself and others would have introduced it to WWII Pacific Submarine simulations decades ago. I still think The Modder's here do an excellent Job and greatly appreciate their work.

While you are correct about "escort" vessel such as Hiburi-class, Type C and D and other "escort" units did not have torpedo launchers, the DD did. From Momo year 1919 on, DD had 21 inch tubes and varying types of torpedo launchers. The Momo had two triple launchers. Beginning in 1924 Mutsuki-class DD and Cruisers had the 24 inch tubes for the Type 93 torpedo.

I say make them all in the game fire fish. I enjoyed the added challenge they create in the FOTRSU mod.

Did everyone enjoy the coffee today?

[Torpex77]

Originally Posted by propbeanie

There are several stories of DD shooting torpedoes at subs. The SingleMission in FotRSU "Three Of A Kind" that cdrsubron7 built, is based on such an incident, where a sub on the surface was approaching a stationary DD near Attu. The US at the time was not cognizant of range of the Japanese Long Lance, so the sub was trying to get closer / faster in order to use their torpedoes before the DD got underway. Lookouts reported torpedo tracks coming at them when about 6,000 yards out, so they crash dived, and then heard more torpedoes inbound. I have the boat's name somewhere in my pile of 'stuff'... but there are other subs that have reports of torpedoes shot at them in their War Patrol Reports. They did not happen often, but they were not rare either. From what I can gather, less than the number of friendly-fire incidents, but there were quite a few. Submarines were often mistaken for a DD or subchaser from a distance, and the Japanese loved to shoot their Long Lance from long range. "Surprise" factor...

Ive read a load of Books on US subs, patrol reports and Books and nothing I ever read ever mentioned it. If you have a reference Id love to read the report. Not disrespecting you, Id like to see how exactly they concluded it was a DD or a Jap sub. How did the Japanese Know what depth to set? The Long Lance was a contact torpedo, so setting depth would be like shooting at a duck with a rifle at night. I cant imagine any Commanding Officer in any Navy wasting a resource like torpedos. Late war=desperation would seem reasonable.

I dont discount it happened a couple times, but as a matter of normal action, doesnt justify it on large scale in a simulation.

The USS Barb had a rocket launcher at the request of Fluckey..can we get that too?

I just think FOTRS has done really amazing and respectable things, and hate to see it get Arcady like Crash Dive II where the torpedo's go down 200+ ft and take out a sub.
Its also a Historical respect thing IMHO.

[Bubblehead1980]

Originally Posted by Torpex77

Ive read a load of Books on US subs, patrol reports and Books and nothing I ever read ever mentioned it. If you have a reference Id love to read the report. Not disrespecting you, Id like to see how exactly they concluded it was a DD or a Jap sub. How did the Japanese Know what depth to set? The Long Lance was a contact torpedo, so setting depth would be like shooting at a duck with a rifle at night. I cant imagine any Commanding Officer in any Navy wasting a resource like torpedos. Late war=desperation would seem reasonable.

I dont discount it happened a couple times, but as a matter of normal action, doesnt justify it on large scale in a simulation.

The USS Barb had a rocket launcher at the request of Fluckey..can we get that too?

I just think FOTRS has done really amazing and respectable things, and hate to see it get Arcady like Crash Dive II where the torpedo's go down 200+ ft and take out a sub.
Its also a Historical respect thing IMHO.

If I recall, GROWLER attacked three destroyers in the Aleutians on her first patrol in 1942. Hit two of the DD's, then the third DD launched torpedoes at Growler. Growler damaged the third in return, severely. That is going solely on memory, I will check my sources have saved and the patrol report and share with here tomorrow.

IMHO, I am inclined to agree with you overall. I will say that if a class of vessel had torpedoes, should be able to fire them in the sim. If they did not have them, really should not have them in the sim, part of maintaining a simulation.

Per the rocket launcher, I have heard that , as a upgrade (Which would be okay if its costly renown wise and only available at end of war) it is is in the works.

[Captain Wreckless]

Originally Posted by Bubblehead1980

If I recall, GROWLER attacked three destroyers in the Aleutians on her first patrol in 1942. Hit two of the DD's, then the third DD launched torpedoes at Growler. Growler damaged the third in return, severely. That is going solely on memory, I will check my sources have saved and the patrol report and share with here tomorrow.

IMHO, I am inclined to agree with you overall. I will say that if a class of vessel had torpedoes, should be able to fire them in the sim. If they did not have them, really should not have them in the sim, part of maintaining a simulation.

Per the rocket launcher, I have heard that , as a upgrade (Which would be okay if its costly renown wise and only available at end of war) it is is in the works.

Interesting.