Submerged boats and rafts.

Sniper297 · 12-16-14, 10:30 PM

Normally this is just an irritation, when I get one of those missions to launch a raft the raft is submerged 10-20 feet deep. Problem is when there's a big task force, sink a cruiser and fire at another - the torpedo depth is set for 20 feet, but sure enough if it goes through a debris field there's a boat or raft rowing along 20 feet beneath the waves, another wasted torpedo.

Which file or files controls either the depth of these silly boats and rafts, or the density/duration of the debris from a sunken ship?

TorpX · 12-17-14, 12:12 AM

In my game, the rafts and lifeboats seem to be at proper draft. The debris seems to bob up and down, above and below the surface. I have no idea how to change it, though.

Sniper297 · 12-22-14, 05:27 PM

Well, I still can't chase this down. Got a couple battleships, sink one then try to fire at another through the debris field I hit rafts and boats with the fish set for 30 feet depth.

This is what it looks like under the debris field;

And same thing when launching a liferaft for a mission;

I have no idea what that's all about, the rafts used to flip over occasionally but they were always on the surface before. Now they launch 20-30 feet underwater.

TorpX · 12-22-14, 08:18 PM

Hmmm.. That's weird.

That isn't debris, those are lifeboats. I didn't realize you were talking about those.

If you haven't done this already, open up NLifeBoat_01.sim and NLifeBoat_02.sim with S3d, (in the Sea folder) and check the surface drafts. I used 0.3 for the first and 0.5 for the second. The ones you have there are the NLifeBoat_01 (life raft); the NLifeBoat_02 is the life boat made of wood and is larger.

Sniper297 · 12-22-14, 08:45 PM

Hmmm. Looking in the \Data\Sea\NLifeboat_01\ folder, I have files dated 2006 and 2007, with 2 files dated 2008, NLifeBoat_01.sim and NLifeBoat_01.cfg. Possibly that was from the original ship acceleration fix or something.

In the CFG;

[Unit]
ClassName=LifeboatSmall
3DModelFileName=data/Sea/NLifeboat_01/NLifeBoat_01
UnitType=105
MaxSpeed=2
Length=4.8
Width=2.8
Mast=1
Draft=0.2
Displacement=0.0375
DisplacementVariation=0
RenownAwarded=0
CrewComplement=4
SurvivalRate=0
SurvivalPercentage=60

[Loadout 1]
Name=Axis
Type=0

[Loadout 2]
Name=Allied
Type=0

In the SIM file;

UnitShip
ObjHydro

Surfaced
Displacement 0.0
Draught 0.0

Submerged
Displacement 0.0
Draught 15.0

Why it has a submerged draft at all is a mystery, but 15 meters would place it at 48 feet, so the fish should just pass over instead of hitting it.

Looking at my backup the SIM and CFG files are both January 2007, so my best bet is to try replacing the raft folders with the originals from the backup, see if that fixes it.

TorpX · 12-22-14, 09:18 PM

I was never able to make any changes to ships physics with the *.cfg file. Everything I did had to be done with the *.sim file.

Like so:

mass = 2.0

surface
displacement = 0
draught = 0.3

submerged
displacement = 0
draught = 0

Imo, the submerged displacement/drafts are best left to the subs. The game does have values for the ships, but I found issues with ships not sinking if the submerged draft wasn't low enough. Setting the submerged values to zero gives the game control, and seems to work well. One can set the surface values to zero, too, but I wanted to be able to control these to correct any instability or such.

You might also check/change the put_on_water = True item.

Sniper297 · 12-23-14, 12:05 AM

I'm guessing what I got here is one of Webster's game fixes adapted to 1.4 (several mods say "for 1.4 and 1.5" but they actually crash 1.4 since they include CFG files for ships that 1.4 never had), and since it had to be tweaked to eliminate incompatible 1.5 files I installed manually without JGSME. Apparently that was it though, rafts bob up and down on the surface the way they're supposed to, although during a busy battle I sank a BB and a CV, then went over to look at the debris field a couple minutes later - all the rafts and lifeboats were in the process of sinking.

Not actually a problem since they sank all the way down rather quickly, the trouble I was having was the blasted things hovering with neutral buoyancy where I couldn't see them and they kept setting off torpedoes.

Aside from the one incident of sinking survivors (oh the humanity) the problem looks solved.

12-16-14, 10:30 PM	#1
Sniper297 The Old Man Join Date: Dec 2005 Location: Philadelphia Shipyard Brig Posts: 1,386 Downloads: 160 Uploads: 19	Submerged boats and rafts. Normally this is just an irritation, when I get one of those missions to launch a raft the raft is submerged 10-20 feet deep. Problem is when there's a big task force, sink a cruiser and fire at another - the torpedo depth is set for 20 feet, but sure enough if it goes through a debris field there's a boat or raft rowing along 20 feet beneath the waves, another wasted torpedo. Which file or files controls either the depth of these silly boats and rafts, or the density/duration of the debris from a sunken ship?

12-22-14, 08:18 PM	#4
TorpX Silent Hunter Join Date: Sep 2010 Posts: 3,975 Downloads: 153 Uploads: 11	Hmmm.. That's weird. That isn't debris, those are lifeboats. I didn't realize you were talking about those. If you haven't done this already, open up NLifeBoat_01.sim and NLifeBoat_02.sim with S3d, (in the Sea folder) and check the surface drafts. I used 0.3 for the first and 0.5 for the second. The ones you have there are the NLifeBoat_01 (life raft); the NLifeBoat_02 is the life boat made of wood and is larger.

12-22-14, 09:18 PM	#6
TorpX Silent Hunter Join Date: Sep 2010 Posts: 3,975 Downloads: 153 Uploads: 11	I was never able to make any changes to ships physics with the .cfg file. Everything I did had to be done with the .sim file. Like so: mass = 2.0 surface displacement = 0 draught = 0.3 submerged displacement = 0 draught = 0 Imo, the submerged displacement/drafts are best left to the subs. The game does have values for the ships, but I found issues with ships not sinking if the submerged draft wasn't low enough. Setting the submerged values to zero gives the game control, and seems to work well. One can set the surface values to zero, too, but I wanted to be able to control these to correct any instability or such. You might also check/change the put_on_water = True item.

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12-17-14, 12:12 AM	#2
TorpX Silent Hunter Join Date: Sep 2010 Posts: 3,975 Downloads: 153 Uploads: 11	In my game, the rafts and lifeboats seem to be at proper draft. The debris seems to bob up and down, above and below the surface. I have no idea how to change it, though.

12-22-14, 05:27 PM	#3
Sniper297 The Old Man Join Date: Dec 2005 Location: Philadelphia Shipyard Brig Posts: 1,386 Downloads: 160 Uploads: 19	Well, I still can't chase this down. Got a couple battleships, sink one then try to fire at another through the debris field I hit rafts and boats with the fish set for 30 feet depth. This is what it looks like under the debris field; And same thing when launching a liferaft for a mission; I have no idea what that's all about, the rafts used to flip over occasionally but they were always on the surface before. Now they launch 20-30 feet underwater.

12-22-14, 08:45 PM	#5
Sniper297 The Old Man Join Date: Dec 2005 Location: Philadelphia Shipyard Brig Posts: 1,386 Downloads: 160 Uploads: 19	Hmmm. Looking in the \Data\Sea\NLifeboat_01\ folder, I have files dated 2006 and 2007, with 2 files dated 2008, NLifeBoat_01.sim and NLifeBoat_01.cfg. Possibly that was from the original ship acceleration fix or something. In the CFG; [Unit] ClassName=LifeboatSmall 3DModelFileName=data/Sea/NLifeboat_01/NLifeBoat_01 UnitType=105 MaxSpeed=2 Length=4.8 Width=2.8 Mast=1 Draft=0.2 Displacement=0.0375 DisplacementVariation=0 RenownAwarded=0 CrewComplement=4 SurvivalRate=0 SurvivalPercentage=60 [Loadout 1] Name=Axis Type=0 [Loadout 2] Name=Allied Type=0 In the SIM file; UnitShip ObjHydro Surfaced Displacement 0.0 Draught 0.0 Submerged Displacement 0.0 Draught 15.0 Why it has a submerged draft at all is a mystery, but 15 meters would place it at 48 feet, so the fish should just pass over instead of hitting it. Looking at my backup the SIM and CFG files are both January 2007, so my best bet is to try replacing the raft folders with the originals from the backup, see if that fixes it.

12-23-14, 12:05 AM	#7
Sniper297 The Old Man Join Date: Dec 2005 Location: Philadelphia Shipyard Brig Posts: 1,386 Downloads: 160 Uploads: 19	I'm guessing what I got here is one of Webster's game fixes adapted to 1.4 (several mods say "for 1.4 and 1.5" but they actually crash 1.4 since they include CFG files for ships that 1.4 never had), and since it had to be tweaked to eliminate incompatible 1.5 files I installed manually without JGSME. Apparently that was it though, rafts bob up and down on the surface the way they're supposed to, although during a busy battle I sank a BB and a CV, then went over to look at the debris field a couple minutes later - all the rafts and lifeboats were in the process of sinking. Not actually a problem since they sank all the way down rather quickly, the trouble I was having was the blasted things hovering with neutral buoyancy where I couldn't see them and they kept setting off torpedoes. Aside from the one incident of sinking survivors (oh the humanity) the problem looks solved.