Is AZ standing up for what is right?

[SUBMAN1]

http://www.azleg.gov/FormatDocument....s/hcr2024p.htm

Good for them.

-S

[SUBMAN1]

More info:

http://www.tenthamendmentcenter.com/...wing/#more-207

-S

[Kapitan_Phillips]

Chalk this up to youthful foreign ignorance, but what exactly does all that mean?

[August]

Originally Posted by Kapitan_Phillips

Chalk this up to youthful foreign ignorance, but what exactly does all that mean?

It means that there is are small movements in several states who feel that the Federal government has overstepped it's constitutional limitations.

Proposed bills don't mean much until they are enacted though.

[AVGWarhawk]

Originally Posted by August

It means that there is are small movements in several states who feel that the Federal government has overstepped it's constitutional limitations.

Proposed bills don't mean much until they are enacted though.

The states are correct, the Fed has overstepped the Constitutional limitations. We were also told that taxes when first enacted were not permanent.

[Kapt Z]

Bye AZ, don't let the federal funding hit you on the way out.

[SteamWake]

But dont you realize that the constitution is outdated and irrelevant in 'modern' times?

I mean "We the people" for cryin out loud.

/sarcasim

[Happy Times]

State rights was the real reason for the Civil War also.

[Kapt Z]

Originally Posted by Happy Times

State rights was the real reason for the Civil War also.

We're definately going a little off topic here, but....

I agree with you in the 'academic' sense, but I wonder if any 'states rights' issue other than slavery would have been severe enough to cause the South to secede.

[Neptunus Rex]

Bully for Arizona! If only more states were to exercise their authority in the Constitution.

[SUBMAN1]

Originally Posted by Neptunus Rex

Bully for Arizona! If only more states were to exercise their authority in the Constitution.

Washington is too.

-S

[SUBMAN1]

Originally Posted by SteamWake

But dont you realize that the constitution is outdated and irrelevant in 'modern' times?

I mean "We the people" for cryin out loud.

/sarcasim

Don't even get me started.

[UnderseaLcpl]

Originally Posted by Kapt Z

We're definately going a little off topic here, but....

I agree with you in the 'academic' sense, but I wonder if any 'states rights' issue other than slavery would have been severe enough to cause the South to secede.

Actually, the war* started over a tariff that the Federal Government wanted to place on good imported from abroad, especially English manufactured goods, thus making it cheaper to buy manufactured goods from the Northern States.

Slavery was just the excuse they offered to get Northerners to fight. A good indication of just how much the Union cared about slaves is the fact that it contained slave states. Even the emancipation proclamation didn't change that.
Inversely, most (if not virtually all) Southerners were not fighting to keep slaves. Only a handful of the populace was wealthy enough to afford slaves, anyway.

Even though the spark that started secession was a tariff, the state's rights issue the South was most concerned about was state's rights itself.


* or alternatively, the secession.

[Kapt Z]

Originally Posted by UnderseaLcpl

Actually, the war* started over a tariff that the Federal Government wanted to place on good imported from abroad, especially English manufactured goods, thus making it cheaper to buy manufactured goods from the Northern States.

Slavery was just the excuse they offered to get Northerners to fight. A good indication of just how much the Union cared about slaves is the fact that it contained slave states. Even the emancipation proclamation didn't change that.
Inversely, most (if not virtually all) Southerners were not fighting to keep slaves. Only a handful of the populace was wealthy enough to afford slaves, anyway.

Even though the spark that started secession was a tariff, the state's rights issue the South was most concerned about was state's rights itself.


* or alternatively, the secession.

I would certainly agree that many in the North(Lincoln included) were more interested (at least at first) in saving the Union than freeing slaves.

But, I don't think slavery was just an 'excuse'. It was the entire basis for Southern society and their economy. The threat that it might not be allowed in the territories and therefore might someday be outlawed in the existing states was too much for them to risk.

That threat was the Federal Gov't personified by Lincoln's election.

Now, what motivated each individual to take up arms and what they would say was their reason for fighting?

If you'd like to debate this further we should probably start a new thread.

[Platapus]

My paramount object in this struggle is to save the Union, and is not either to save or to destroy slavery.

If I could save the Union without freeing any slave I would do it, and if I could save it by freeing all the slaves I would do it; and if I could save it by freeing some and leaving others alone I would also do that.

What I do about slavery, and the colored race, I do because I believe it helps to save the Union; and what I forbear, I forbear because I do not believe it would help to save the Union.

I shall do less whenever I shall believe what I am doing hurts the cause, and I shall do more whenever I shall believe doing more will help the cause. - A. Lincoln