Photo Recon Mission

JALU3 · 12-24-08, 06:03 AM

So I have this Photo Recon Mission in Palua . . . and I am coming from the south, from the deep end, at 1/2 knt, well below the thermal layer (150 ft) @ 190, and regardless of what I try, I am always spotted, usually from an active ping when the pass over me, even when I come to a dead stop, when they are over me, with silent runing on they still here me.
I am running 1.4 stock.
What am I doing wrong?
Should I just do it from the shallows from the opposite end, and forget attempting to damage the Yamato that I know is awating my picture?

Hmuda · 12-24-08, 07:09 AM

Did you rig silent running? Just a thought. I'm no expert, so that's all I can think of. Of course if they ping 24/7, they are bound to find you sooner or later.

Diopos · 12-24-08, 07:31 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by JALU3

So I have this Photo Recon Mission in Palua . . . and I am coming from the south, from the deep end, at 1/2 knt, well below the thermal layer (150 ft) @ 190, and regardless of what I try, I am always spotted, usually from an active ping when the pass over me, even when I come to a dead stop, when they are over me, with silent runing on they still here me.
I am running 1.4 stock.
What am I doing wrong?
Should I just do it from the shallows from the opposite end, and forget attempting to damage the Yamato that I know is awating my picture?

Active pinging does not necessarily mean that you're located. Active pinging and an abrupt change in the DD's course towards your position ... mmm things are getting tough but there is still the possibility to manouver with slow speed + silent running + thermal layer, trying to minimize your sub's profile towards the DD (this means that sometimes you may find yourself actually moving head on towards the DD). When it's on top of you can still make a hard turn (preferably 90 degs relative to the DD's course) at flank speed. Coming to a dead stop with a DD in your immediate vincinity is not a good idea and more so if it's pinging.

Coming in from the deep end and slow is logical. But before you go "in" try to analyze the situation. Are the DDs moving in a pattern? Spend sometime on your sonar or your periscope to find out.

As I said coming from the deep end is ok but it wont be "deep" all the way to the port! So you must be certain about the depth "profile" of your approach. Using your subs bathymeter, to find how close you are to the sea floor, in the vincinity of DDs would be suicidal in a real life situation (it is an active sonar device). Most "experienced" players avoid it but I remember a post saying that this effect is not modelled in the game! Were you using your bathymeter?

Eventually you can always go to periscope depth, sink em all and then take your photos at your own pace!

Soundman · 12-24-08, 08:44 AM

Iv'e had this problem before too. If you aren't already, time your entrance to be at night and you may be able to skirt around them when they are at the far end of their sweep. If that's not possible, as stated above, you might have to sink it/them.

Quote:

Should I just do it from the shallows from the opposite end, and forget attempting to damage the Yamato that I know is awating my picture?

Ah, didn't catch that first time around. Man, that is hard to resist huh?

JALU3 · 12-24-08, 02:15 PM

as stated in the op, it is(silent running) set, and i was travelling at 1/2 knt, 190 ft, 30 feet under the thermal layer.

i was unaware that a visual bathymeter was available in stock 1.4, as it was in sh2. i was on the the south end of their patrol loop, and was attempting to get within maximum distance to get the photo shot, with a damaging shot from the aft torpedoes more as an after shot.

after much consideration, I will just come from the shallows on the east end, to get the photo, and the mission done, and the patrol over with. maybe that is for the best.

zinosumatra · 12-24-08, 02:25 PM

Your stated depth is correct to gain maximum benefit from the sonic layer. However, if the enemy units using active sonar are right on top of you, the transmitted sound does not refract effectively, rendering your tactical positioning useless. Best to keep at least 1k yards of horizontal separation.

12-24-08, 06:02 PM

zinosumatra wrote...

Quote:

Best to keep at least 1k yards of horizontal separation.

easier said than done

Urge

sladecutter3 · 12-26-08, 08:44 AM

had a similar problem wtih Rabaul photo mission. 1:30am, heavy seas, thunderstorm, rigged for silent running, 2 knots, 100ft below thermal layer.
destroyers not actively pinging, but was dectected from 5075 yards out from my port quarter, he ran in and dropped depth charges right across where i would have been had i not taken evasive action, did a few 90's at flank speed, and hauled a--,
tried several times using several approches, couldn't get in, so i gave up and went home. didnt really matter in the end as that was the seventh mission on that particular patrol, got to Pearl, got a new boat, got new patrol orders and im off again, this time an agent insertion on the Chinese mainland. also have you ever noticed on a photo mission in shallow water the seagulls always know where you are?:rotfl:

Aramike · 12-26-08, 10:33 AM

I had a similar situation where I was rigged for silent running but my DC team was activated making loads of noise. You may want to make sure that you've got literally nothing going on if you're trying to remain undetected.

NEON DEON · 12-26-08, 11:38 AM

I wonder if it makes a differance the depth under the layer? Say periscope depth is 16 meters stated depth. Then should you not get the whole boat under the layer say 20 meters under the layer? I am playing a new campaign this week and have a patrol like that comming up. I will see what happens then.

zinosumatra · 01-03-09, 03:05 AM

You want to be assured to get the noisy parts of the boat (the hull) beneath the sonic layer, yet close enough to the layer to gain maximum benefit from refraction. Pull the conning tower plus 5 meters beneath that depth and you should be solid.

01-03-09, 03:20 AM

remember sonar looking down sees more in deep water than shallow water and that by being deep and going slow can and sometimes does guarranty they pass over you at some point so you can actually make yourself easier to detect by going 1 or 2 kts and taking forever and a day to get out of the path of that DD patrol area. i prefer moving in at periscope depth, ahead slow, silent running at 2 kts and wait for an opening to scoot in behind them ahead std when the DD turns away from me. works almost every time but if i am detected i am ready to put a fish in him.

12-24-08, 06:03 AM	#1
JALU3 Grey Wolf Join Date: May 2007 Location: 11SMS 98896 10565 Posts: 756 Downloads: 0 Uploads: 0	Photo Recon Mission So I have this Photo Recon Mission in Palua . . . and I am coming from the south, from the deep end, at 1/2 knt, well below the thermal layer (150 ft) @ 190, and regardless of what I try, I am always spotted, usually from an active ping when the pass over me, even when I come to a dead stop, when they are over me, with silent runing on they still here me. I am running 1.4 stock. What am I doing wrong? Should I just do it from the shallows from the opposite end, and forget attempting to damage the Yamato that I know is awating my picture? __________________ "The Federation needs men like you, doctor. Men of conscience. Men of principle. Men who can sleep at night... You're also the reason Section Thirty-one exists -- someone has to protect men like you from a universe that doesn't share your sense of right and wrong." -Sloan, Section Thirty-One

12-24-08, 02:15 PM	#5
JALU3 Grey Wolf Join Date: May 2007 Location: 11SMS 98896 10565 Posts: 756 Downloads: 0 Uploads: 0	as stated in the op, it is(silent running) set, and i was travelling at 1/2 knt, 190 ft, 30 feet under the thermal layer. i was unaware that a visual bathymeter was available in stock 1.4, as it was in sh2. i was on the the south end of their patrol loop, and was attempting to get within maximum distance to get the photo shot, with a damaging shot from the aft torpedoes more as an after shot. after much consideration, I will just come from the shallows on the east end, to get the photo, and the mission done, and the patrol over with. maybe that is for the best. __________________ "The Federation needs men like you, doctor. Men of conscience. Men of principle. Men who can sleep at night... You're also the reason Section Thirty-one exists -- someone has to protect men like you from a universe that doesn't share your sense of right and wrong." -Sloan, Section Thirty-One

12-26-08, 11:38 AM	#10
NEON DEON Ace of the Deep Join Date: Apr 2005 Location: Los Angeles, CA Posts: 1,207 Downloads: 39 Uploads: 5	I wonder if it makes a differance the depth under the layer? Say periscope depth is 16 meters stated depth. Then should you not get the whole boat under the layer say 20 meters under the layer? I am playing a new campaign this week and have a patrol like that comming up. I will see what happens then. __________________ Diesel Boats Forever!

01-03-09, 03:20 AM	#12
Webster Stowaway Posts: n/a Downloads: Uploads:	remember sonar looking down sees more in deep water than shallow water and that by being deep and going slow can and sometimes does guarranty they pass over you at some point so you can actually make yourself easier to detect by going 1 or 2 kts and taking forever and a day to get out of the path of that DD patrol area. i prefer moving in at periscope depth, ahead slow, silent running at 2 kts and wait for an opening to scoot in behind them ahead std when the DD turns away from me. works almost every time but if i am detected i am ready to put a fish in him. Last edited by Webster; 01-03-09 at 03:22 AM.

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12-24-08, 07:09 AM	#2
Hmuda Electrician's Mate Join Date: Dec 2008 Posts: 133 Downloads: 27 Uploads: 0	Did you rig silent running? Just a thought. I'm no expert, so that's all I can think of. Of course if they ping 24/7, they are bound to find you sooner or later.

12-24-08, 02:25 PM	#6
zinosumatra Watch Join Date: May 2008 Location: Indy, IN Posts: 27 Downloads: 14 Uploads: 0	Your stated depth is correct to gain maximum benefit from the sonic layer. However, if the enemy units using active sonar are right on top of you, the transmitted sound does not refract effectively, rendering your tactical positioning useless. Best to keep at least 1k yards of horizontal separation.

12-26-08, 08:44 AM	#8
sladecutter3 Swabbie Join Date: Dec 2008 Location: 3514N8050W Posts: 13 Downloads: 64 Uploads: 0	had a similar problem wtih Rabaul photo mission. 1:30am, heavy seas, thunderstorm, rigged for silent running, 2 knots, 100ft below thermal layer. destroyers not actively pinging, but was dectected from 5075 yards out from my port quarter, he ran in and dropped depth charges right across where i would have been had i not taken evasive action, did a few 90's at flank speed, and hauled a--, tried several times using several approches, couldn't get in, so i gave up and went home. didnt really matter in the end as that was the seventh mission on that particular patrol, got to Pearl, got a new boat, got new patrol orders and im off again, this time an agent insertion on the Chinese mainland. also have you ever noticed on a photo mission in shallow water the seagulls always know where you are?:rotfl:

12-26-08, 10:33 AM	#9
Aramike Ocean Warrior Best of SUBSIM Chairman Join Date: Dec 2008 Location: Milwaukee, WI Posts: 3,207 Downloads: 59 Uploads: 0	I had a similar situation where I was rigged for silent running but my DC team was activated making loads of noise. You may want to make sure that you've got literally nothing going on if you're trying to remain undetected.

01-03-09, 03:05 AM	#11
zinosumatra Watch Join Date: May 2008 Location: Indy, IN Posts: 27 Downloads: 14 Uploads: 0	You want to be assured to get the noisy parts of the boat (the hull) beneath the sonic layer, yet close enough to the layer to gain maximum benefit from refraction. Pull the conning tower plus 5 meters beneath that depth and you should be solid.