Tough laws on illegal aliens seem to be working

SUBMAN1 · 07-31-08, 02:49 PM

Check this article:

http://www.azcentral.com/news/articl...ghbor0730.html

-S

Quote:

Latino neighborhood slowly disappearing in central Mesa

Family by family, business by business, a central Mesa neighborhood is vanishing.

Already struggling with blight, the Reed Park area near Gilbert and Broadway roads is taking another hit as undocumented immigrants leave the neighborhood, pressured by the state's employer-sanctions law, stricter immigration enforcement and a sagging economy....

Frame57 · 07-31-08, 02:51 PM

It aint workin here in Kalifornia, that is for damn sure!

SUBMAN1 · 07-31-08, 02:54 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Frame57

It aint workin here in Kalifornia, that is for damn sure!

Last I checked, you need the laws first! not ones that cater to them and give them special privilages!

In WA for example, its easy to go to the University of Washington if you are an illegal alien. The state even pays your way. Try being white, hard working, have a 3.9 GPA and a good upstanding citizen and guess what? You're screwed!

They come first, you second for any opening.

-S

DeepIron · 07-31-08, 02:57 PM

Quote:

"If every undocumented resident was removed in Mesa, it would take about 50 percent of my business," he said.

Geez... if you build your business on a clientele that runs and hides every time an ICE vehicle shows up, the bottom will fall out eventually.

And so it has...

SUBMAN1 · 07-31-08, 03:27 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by DeepIron

Quote:

"If every undocumented resident was removed in Mesa, it would take about 50 percent of my business," he said.

Geez... if you build your business on a clientele that runs and hides every time an ICE vehicle shows up, the bottom will fall out eventually.

And so it has...

Old adage - no matter what you do, someone will not be happy. This leads in to - You can't please them all!

-S

UnderseaLcpl · 07-31-08, 09:16 PM

I am inclined to believe that the economic situation is more likely for their migration rather than the laws.

Personally I am sad to see them go. I like Mexicans and they provide economic benefit to the country. Too bad liberal welfare policies essentially cancel out that benefit. I wish Mexicans, or anyone, for that matter, could come here to enjoy higher wages and hope for their future, I just don't support giving them one cent of taxpayer money until they go through the proper porcess of becoming citizens. (And that doesn't mean coming here and having a baby)

On the subject of California, well what can I say? A bastion of liberalism. Also has gone bankrupt and is horrendously expensive to live in. Despite it's glut of rich people who care so much about the poor, there are still people in poverty, and those rich people are still, curiously, fabulously wealthy.
If there has ever been a more clear cut example, so clearly juxtapositioned with more conservative areas (say, Texas), that is an infallible argument against leftist policy, this state is it.
California is probably the best argument ever against liberalism, and yet liberals simply shrug it off. It's like talking to a brick. A brick that wants you to pay for everything.
Of course, I am talking about economic liberalism here. As far as their values are concerned I could care less. Want gay marriage? Fine. Allow gays to ordain themselves as living gods for all I care, as long as they don't get tax breaks and aren't permitted guardianship of children (I'm still not totally sure about that one, links to studies about the effects of having gay parents on children or related information would be appreciated) I could not care less. Social conservative? Feel free to approach them and try to convert them. I can tell you right now that statistically speaking, it won't work, but as long as you leave them alone when they invariably ask you to, I have no problems with it. So they go to hell

, what should a Christian care if they tried, right? An oft-cited Bible reference is the story of Sodom and Gommorah (sp?) Lot was a righteous person, he made no effort that I can recall to convert the populace ( may be wrong, but even if he did doesn't change a thing) God destroyed the cities with fire and brimstone but Lot and everyone in his family but his wife were saved. So by the same token that I would ask liberals not to vote for feel-good economic policies, I would also ask social conservatives not to vote for feel-good moral policies.

Most perturbatory, I seem to have totally derailed the thread, but I maintain that the spirit of it remains the same given the diviseivness of liberals and conservatives over immigration issues and the complete inability of Libertarians like myself to understand what is causing all the fuss. I don't think subman will take exception though, he thrives in discord like I do (right, ol' buddy ol'pal?)

jumpy · 08-01-08, 10:37 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by DeepIron

Quote:

"If every undocumented resident was removed in Mesa, it would take about 50 percent of my business," he said.

Geez... if you build your business on a clientele that runs and hides every time an ICE vehicle shows up, the bottom will fall out eventually.

And so it has...

I think that's a little unfair, considering the figures involved - I suspect because of the area the guy has his shop, he has no real choice but to sell to those 'undesirables' or face loosing 50% of his business or closing down. It's only good business sense to orientate your products/business to the community around you; after all, for example, you wouldn't target upmarket goods and shopping in a down and out area, now would you? Or sell polish goods in a chinese community area - It'd just be dumb.

This seems obvious to me. Blaming the shopkeeper for running his business in tune with the local community, basically saying 'serves you right for trading with those damn illegals' is not very progressive thinking. What other choice (apart from shutting up shop for good) does a trader have?

Frame57 · 08-01-08, 11:23 AM

There is no "undesirable immigrant" if they come here LEGALLY! Pay their taxes like the rest of us.

FIREWALL · 08-01-08, 11:37 AM

When itcomes to Politicians make policy...

It's like letting the NUTS run the MADHOUSE.

Iceman · 08-03-08, 11:00 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by SUBMAN1

Check this article:

http://www.azcentral.com/news/articl...ghbor0730.html

-S

Quote:

Latino neighborhood slowly disappearing in central Mesa

Family by family, business by business, a central Mesa neighborhood is vanishing.

Already struggling with blight, the Reed Park area near Gilbert and Broadway roads is taking another hit as undocumented immigrants leave the neighborhood, pressured by the state's employer-sanctions law, stricter immigration enforcement and a sagging economy....

Quote:

"It used to be a mostly Hispanic community. Now I have all kinds of different families," she said.

Funny how that goes...I grew up in this neighborhood right next to the park and 25years ago it was mostly a normal neighborhood....until illegals swarmed to Mesa....Sherriff Joe does a fine job keeping people on they're toes...It was never a Latino neighborhood....amazing.

07-31-08, 09:16 PM	#6
UnderseaLcpl Silent Hunter Join Date: May 2008 Location: Storming the beaches! Posts: 4,254 Downloads: 0 Uploads: 0	I am inclined to believe that the economic situation is more likely for their migration rather than the laws. Personally I am sad to see them go. I like Mexicans and they provide economic benefit to the country. Too bad liberal welfare policies essentially cancel out that benefit. I wish Mexicans, or anyone, for that matter, could come here to enjoy higher wages and hope for their future, I just don't support giving them one cent of taxpayer money until they go through the proper porcess of becoming citizens. (And that doesn't mean coming here and having a baby) On the subject of California, well what can I say? A bastion of liberalism. Also has gone bankrupt and is horrendously expensive to live in. Despite it's glut of rich people who care so much about the poor, there are still people in poverty, and those rich people are still, curiously, fabulously wealthy. If there has ever been a more clear cut example, so clearly juxtapositioned with more conservative areas (say, Texas), that is an infallible argument against leftist policy, this state is it. California is probably the best argument ever against liberalism, and yet liberals simply shrug it off. It's like talking to a brick. A brick that wants you to pay for everything. Of course, I am talking about economic liberalism here. As far as their values are concerned I could care less. Want gay marriage? Fine. Allow gays to ordain themselves as living gods for all I care, as long as they don't get tax breaks and aren't permitted guardianship of children (I'm still not totally sure about that one, links to studies about the effects of having gay parents on children or related information would be appreciated) I could not care less. Social conservative? Feel free to approach them and try to convert them. I can tell you right now that statistically speaking, it won't work, but as long as you leave them alone when they invariably ask you to, I have no problems with it. So they go to hell , what should a Christian care if they tried, right? An oft-cited Bible reference is the story of Sodom and Gommorah (sp?) Lot was a righteous person, he made no effort that I can recall to convert the populace ( may be wrong, but even if he did doesn't change a thing) God destroyed the cities with fire and brimstone but Lot and everyone in his family but his wife were saved. So by the same token that I would ask liberals not to vote for feel-good economic policies, I would also ask social conservatives not to vote for feel-good moral policies. Most perturbatory, I seem to have totally derailed the thread, but I maintain that the spirit of it remains the same given the diviseivness of liberals and conservatives over immigration issues and the complete inability of Libertarians like myself to understand what is causing all the fuss. I don't think subman will take exception though, he thrives in discord like I do (right, ol' buddy ol'pal?) __________________ I stole this sig from Task Force

08-01-08, 11:37 AM	#9
FIREWALL Eternal Patrol Join Date: Mar 2006 Location: CATALINA IS. SO . CAL USA Posts: 10,108 Downloads: 511 Uploads: 0	When itcomes to Politicians make policy... It's like letting the NUTS run the MADHOUSE. __________________ RIP FIREWALL I Play GWX. Silent Hunter Who ???

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07-31-08, 02:51 PM	#2
Frame57 Sea Lord Join Date: May 2008 Location: 1300 feet on the crapper Posts: 1,860 Downloads: 2 Uploads: 0	It aint workin here in Kalifornia, that is for damn sure!

08-01-08, 11:23 AM	#8
Frame57 Sea Lord Join Date: May 2008 Location: 1300 feet on the crapper Posts: 1,860 Downloads: 2 Uploads: 0	There is no "undesirable immigrant" if they come here LEGALLY! Pay their taxes like the rest of us.