Attention Type II Captains! Upgrade question

[Deathfrombelow23]

I am slowly being won over by the Type II. I started my career out in a type IIA in Sept of '39. Originally I couldn't wait to upgrade to a VIIB. After 4 patrols, we've only got 1 small ship to our credit (1,950 tons), but we are close-knit group! The type II's are very cozy! I'm starting to appreciate the small, cozy boats and the smaller crews. I recently got command of a brand new IID. Hopefully more range will equal more tonnage if I can get out to the western approaches. I'm going to stay with my IID through until March '44 and then move up to a XXI (if I'm alive). How many of my fellow skippers out there are loyal to the type II's?
Anyway... my question is about upgrades. As I mentioned, I was just given command of a shiny new type IID. It is late February, 1940. I was wondering if it would be worth my renown to upgrade to the AFA 44 MAL 570 batteries and the GW Kapselgeblase diesels. What are the advantages of these 2 upgrades, if any? Are they worth spending renown on? I read what the descriptions say about them, but I was hoping that someone out there had some practical, first hand experience with these upgrades on their type II. Thanks in advance! Good hunting!!

[Philipp_Thomsen]

Originally Posted by Deathfrombelow23

I am slowly being won over by the Type II. I started my career out in a type IIA in Sept of '39. Originally I couldn't wait to upgrade to a VIIB. After 4 patrols, we've only got 1 small ship to our credit (1,950 tons), but we are close-knit group! The type II's are very cozy! I'm starting to appreciate the small, cozy boats and the smaller crews. I recently got command of a brand new IID. Hopefully more range will equal more tonnage if I can get out to the western approaches. I'm going to stay with my IID through until March '44 and then move up to a XXI (if I'm alive). How many of my fellow skippers out there are loyal to the type II's?
Anyway... my question is about upgrades. As I mentioned, I was just given command of a shiny new type IID. It is late February, 1940. I was wondering if it would be worth my renown to upgrade to the AFA 44 MAL 570 batteries and the GW Kapselgeblase diesels. What are the advantages of these 2 upgrades, if any? Are they worth spending renown on? I read what the descriptions say about them, but I was hoping that someone out there had some practical, first hand experience with these upgrades on their type II. Thanks in advance! Good hunting!!

I think no one keeps using type II after thats no longer necessary. With type II you cant do much at kreigsmarine service, short range, few torpedos, few equipment, you're almost forced to stay forever in shallow waters, witch is NEVER good.

I always start my carrer in 1940 in 2th Flotilla, in lorient, with the type IXB. The difference is gigantic.

If you ask me, i say move out of this type II before u get wasted, you're losing oportunity to sink some serious tonnage and the equipment for the type II doesnt worth the renown you'll spend. Try to go for a IXB or at least for a VIIB, and go patrol atlantic waters... much more fun and over there u can use the deep waters to hide yourself when needed!

Go out there, kaleun!

[papa_smurf]

I do agree, I like the Type II as a U-boat to begin with. But in general I do not upgrade it, as I save the renown for a type VII/B or C as soon as I can.

[Pisces]

I don't know about those upgrades, but I'm sure there is more floating steel around there asking to be sunk than just a small one in 4 patrols. Then the question of spending the renown isn't such an issue I think.

That is to say, I'm talking GWX 1.03, and my career is in a Type IIa from Kiel starting September 1st, 1939. Indeed, it has a perculiar charm to it. I've only made 3 patrols sofar (in 45 days game-time) sinking 6 targets (lone merchants/freighters/cargos: 26120t) that were accounted for and 2 unrewarded (small freighter and a V/W, 3105t) due to recruiting crew in the first patrol. I don't know how much renown I got with all of it but I'm happy. (I also get renown for the patrolzone and ReturnToDock) Considering those Bernard moments I had every patrol atleast once where I shoot more torpedos in vain than really warrant the target's tonnage. I really need to avoid those moments. Our 'fish tank' is only big enough for 6.

The way I find targets is listen every 1 or 2 hours on the hydrophone, or intercept map-contacts assuming they move at worst-case speed (slow<8, med<12; it places you ahead of the target at the same time). And be carefull of you fuel usage, set speed during transit so the needle wobbles around 6 knots (so set higher if waves slow down), go ahead full or flank only when needing to overtake or intercept a near contact. I seize setting up for the attack if I recognise targets to be less than 1000 tonnes.

[Deathfrombelow23]

I thought about it, but there is something cozy about the type II's. Does anyone else know what I mean or is it just me? Staying relatively close to home... 5 torpedoes so you have to make them count... etc, etc. Plus a smaller crew means more commradery! Now that I have a IID I may be able to venture out into the Atlantic a bit. Or, maybe I will try to sneak into Scapa. I'm playing GWX 2.0. Anyone try a Scapa penetration in a type II in GWX 2.0 yet?

[Philipp_Thomsen]

Penetrate Scapa is a hard task, doenst matter the boat you're using. There's a small entrance at east of it, really tight, with some dead merchants blocking most of the path. And yet inside u'll find a large and a medium tanker, a troop transport and some DDs... and there will be 2 o 3 destroyers trying to hunt you down if you put your engines more then ahead 2/3 or when you fire your first torpedo... so its about 50k tons for a really hard escape, shallow waters and some anti-sub nets, so its almost not worth it... much easier is to penetrate Bristol, and a lot more to sink there...

But dont fool yourself, the war is gigantic and your boat is nothing compared to it, so why dont you get a bigger boat and go to the atlantic and do more damage to the british navy? There's a lot of ships out there, sometimes you can get way more tonnes then invading ports, and its much more safe, coz ur in the wide open ocean, and u can dive as deep as your boat can take to evade destroyers and depth charges.

About the upgrades you asked... the range surfaced and submerged of the type II is really humble... if you upgrade a humble engine, it will become a little less humble, but we are talking small stuff here... i really dont think it worth the cost.. and besides, 5 torpedos??? are u kidding me???

[Deathfrombelow23]

I know, 1 merchant for 1,950 tons after 4 patrols sounds like nothing. I'm playing 100% DiD GWX 2.0 and I consider myself lucky to have sunk that! Considering the extremely short range of my IIA and the horrible performance of my torpedoes thus far, I'm lucky to have 1 ship to my credit. Had my torpedoes all worked, I would have 5 merhcants for approximately 15-18,000 GRT. I am going to complete my 5th patrol in my IIA and then upgrade to a new VII on my return to port since I will have enough renown. Scuttlebutt is that there's a new VIIB going to be launched soon, U-102. All of your logic about a bigger boat is making too much sense! Plus with a VIIB and a transfer to the 7th flotilla, in a few months I will be in France, enjoying the French girls, new U-boat pens and a shorter transit to the Atlantic!!

[Brer Rabbit]

I began my career in a IIa out of Williamshaven, patrolled East coast of GB hiding in the deeper holes along th ecoast. I had limited success in the IIA averaging one ship per patrol. I upgraded to the IID and inproved batteries and engines as soon as I got enough renown. Once in the IID I had much better success primarily due to the greater range, and by improvement in by manual targeting. I increased my sinking to an average of 2 ships per patrol. I upgraded to the Type IID after my 8th patrol, primarily because I needed a deck gun and more torpedos. My next patrol resulted in 4 sinkings. I have recently been ordered to Brest and am currently negotiating the channel between Ireland and England enroute to AM68. I sank one small cargo north in GB and misses a shot at a small coastal.

Hopefully I made the right deision to venture through this channel rather than going down th ewest coast of Ireland. During my three missions with the Type VIID weather has prevented full use of th edeck gun, but it has also spared me from the attention of air craft so far, though I have been bombed a few times.

Good luck on your career and enjoy your time in the Type II but you will really enjoy the Type VII. The type II allowed me to improve my targeting, and tactics, befor I ventured into long patrols.

Bring back alive

[Graf Paper]

I've always preferred starting a career in 1939 rather than later in the war.

The Type II U-boat is a very good "warm-up" boat. It's smaller size and crew complement makes it much easier to learn and master the finer points of U-boat warfare during the "Happy Times" era of the war so an aspiring kaleun has a much greater chance of surviving the later years of WWII.

I usually trade up to a VIIB as soon as I have the 2500 renown needed, after about three or four patrols, and then get the GWK engine upgrade after I have the renown to do so because it transforms the VIIB from a sluggish sea cow into a lethal shark, nearly doubling your u-boat's surface speed and making it much easier to intercept merchants or run away from warships closing on your position.

Although many have counseled you to trade up to the VIIB, Deathfrombelow23, I'd say to just go with whatever you like. Although SH3 is a simulation, it is still just a game and the most important feature of any game is fun.

It might very well be fun and quite interesting to play out a u-boat career in the Type II for the entire six-year run of the war (or for as long as you survived). 1943-45 would certainly be challenging, if not downright impossible!

[rizZO_77]

Most of the time i upgrade to a VIIB as soon as possible due to the obvious reasons but i have had a career where i sticked to my type II because of the shorter patrols you have in it.

The dug out canoe has got it's charm, i agree but imho the type VII is too great a step forward to make the decision not to upgrade

[TriskettheKid]

I've now had three full careers in a Type II (going to start one soon for GWX 2.0), and I can honestly say that it is quite the challenge.

I pretty much HAD to stick to the entrance to the Channel, the Med, or the Black Sea, in order to actually sink anything.

But, man, when you're on fire in that thing, you're on fire. I have yet to get a 100k patrol in my trusty Type II, but I've come close (around 89k).

In short, the only way to really succeed in a Type II is to be as cautious as possible....unless you're like me and find the allure of raiding harbors far too great to pass on.

[Rotary Crewman]

Stick with the Type II. I have yet to finish a war but I refuse to let go of my Type II. A few times I have upgraded to the VII but never really liked the big crew and lots of fish to deal with. I feel you have to really pick your targets with the Type II and make sure you have your firing solutions dead on.

Good luck with it, think I need to start a new Type II with GWX 2

[Hanomag]

Herr Kaluen,

BdU wants to know why you do not want a bigger boat, with the capability to do more damage to the enemies of the Fatherland?

In fact so does the Gestapo. There are 2 gentlemen in trench coats waiting at your base, they would like to have a word with you herr kaluen, good luck.

[Javigato]

I am the other way around, I am on the 1st Flotilla since the beginning of the war, and have been patrolling the North Sea and been doing pretty poorly so far (I only have a bit over 5K of renown). and i can't wait to get a bigger boat and venture to the Atlantic!! How much renown in the VIIB? And can I get on the 1st Flot. or should I transfer to the 7th? I am on March 1940.

[Graf Paper]

The Type II does indeed have its strengths that certain kaleuns prefer and there is nothing wrong with that just as those who prefer the larger, deep-water boats are equally correct in their choices as it all boils down to your particular style of command.

From personal experience with the Type II and Type VII boats in GWX 2.0 and stock SH3, I can say it does seem the Type II is more stealthy against ASW than the Type VII, although I've yet to get past 1941 and tangle with the updated ASW devices.
The Type II has a much quieter propulsion underwater. The II can sustain a speed of 2 kts without detection versus the measly 1 kt of the VII and can still navigate at 1 kt even with a pair of hunters right overhead where the VII would have to make a dead stop to avoid being heard.

That being said, I'd still have to question the survivability of any sub that runs patrols in shallow waters, but the Type II is well suited to such missions and the best choice for the tight confines of harbor raids.

So get those engine and battery upgrades, because you'll need them when you're spending eight hours just sneaking up to those ships moored at dock and then trying to avoid the swarm of DDs after those eels of yours score their hits.