This is probably why SH4 medals are not historical correct !

[Drebbel]

Why are the SH4 medals not historical correct ?

Most of you probably already know the answer but it just came to my attention and I thought it might be new to atleast a couple of other skippers as well.

The reason for the non-historical medals is US law:

Whoever manufactures, sells, or possesses any badge, identification card, or other insignia, of the design prescribed by the head of any department or agency of the United States for use by any officer or employee thereof, or any colorable imitation thereof, or photographs, prints, or in any other manner makes or executes any engraving, photograph, print, or impression in the likeness of any such badge, identification card, or other insignia, or any colorable imitation thereof, except as authorized under regulations made pursuant to law, shall be fined under this title or imprisoned not more than six months, or both.

http://www.law.cornell.edu/uscode/ht...1----000-.html

[CCIP]

Yea, that's what I thought. Thanks for confirming

[SteamWake]

Lawyers...

[Hans Schultz]

its a really vague law, may collectors of US militaria are very worried about this law. Its quite silly IMHO. I hope a "random" modder will fix the medals.

[hyperion2206]

Originally Posted by Drebbel

Why are the SH4 medals not historical correct ?

Most of you probably already know the answer but it just came to my attention and I thought it might be new to atleast a couple of other skippers as well.

The reason for the non-historical medals is US law:

Whoever manufactures, sells, or possesses any badge, identification card, or other insignia, of the design prescribed by the head of any department or agency of the United States for use by any officer or employee thereof, or any colorable imitation thereof, or photographs, prints, or in any other manner makes or executes any engraving, photograph, print, or impression in the likeness of any such badge, identification card, or other insignia, or any colorable imitation thereof, except as authorized under regulations made pursuant to law, shall be fined under this title or imprisoned not more than six months, or both.

http://www.law.cornell.edu/uscode/ht...1----000-.html

I talked to a JAG officer (not Harmon Rabb:p) and he said that you have to ask permission to use these medals but the DOD actually never prosecuted anybody who did not ask for the permission. So you could use the medals without having to fear prosecution.

[Snowman999]

The reason for the non-historical medals is US law:

Whoever manufactures, sells, or possesses any badge, identification card, or other insignia, of the design prescribed by the head of any department or agency of the United States for use by any officer or employee thereof, or any colorable imitation thereof, or photographs, prints, or in any other manner makes or executes any engraving, photograph, print, or impression in the likeness of any such badge, identification card, or other insignia, or any colorable imitation thereof, except as authorized under regulations made pursuant to law, shall be fined under this title or imprisoned not more than six months, or both.

http://www.law.cornell.edu/uscode/ht...1----000-.html

1. Is a medal a "badge"? Maybe not. The intent of the statute is to prevent impersonation of military uniforms by civilians.

2. What are the noted regulations?

Dozens of games back to the early 1980s have shown US medals in award screens. I have probably eigth or ten Microprose games alone that did so.

[AVGWarhawk]

The DOD is a little busy at the moment to concern themselves with a replica on a computer game. I don't suspect a large outcry by the DOD for using a likeness of medals.

[daft]

Just what I suspected. But where does this leave moddining and user created tools?

[AVGWarhawk]

OK, the only time I could see the DOD possibly pressing charges is for the MOH. The MOH can only be worn by the recipient of the medal. Maybe, just maybe the DOD would do something about it....and that is a big maybe. Now, I know for a fact I can pick up a replica of the Purple Heart at a local store in Maryland. No one is arresting this store clerk or the company that made the replica. Correcting the replica in game should not be a problem.

[SteamWake]

Originally Posted by AVGWarhawk

The DOD is a little busy at the moment to concern themselves with a replica on a computer game. I don't suspect a large outcry by the DOD for using a likeness of medals.

While this is quite true I would not be shocked to see pressure brought to bear by "others" forcing him to waste his time on such trivial issues.

[Drebbel]

Maybe the DOD is too busy. But if it is law then any US citizen could use this law to take UBI to court. Or am I wrong ?

[akdavis]

FYI, whether it would hold up in court or not is irrelevant. If the Ubi lawyers think there is even a possibility of the content prompting any form of legal action, then they will bar inclusion of the content. The likelihood of someone taking action or the potential outcome of a lawsuit is irrelevant.

There are other rather clear signs of this in the game...

[davejb]

Well I don't see what all the fuss is about, I've sunk a variety of Japanese ships - from Shokaku down to a trawler that looked at me funny, and I've had some truly splendiferous medals handed down to me by a grateful admiral. Let's see, I got the wound medal, the patrol medal, the golden wazooney, err, I think I got one for spelling...there was a bronze something in there as well I think .... what's not to like?

I got a real medal (well, I got two real ones, but the second was primarily for not getting caught doing bad things) and my real 'went somewhere moderately at risk' medal has a sheep on it - now, call me silly if you will, but I'd much rather have one with a submarine on it than a sheep. I've always considered in game medal ceremonies a bit lame - I mean, if you got 230 volts from the mouse when your sub got nerfed then maybe, but who cares what a bunch of pixels thinks?

[AVGWarhawk]

I believe the DOD would have to press charges. But...to what end? Ubi is cautious because some airplane manufactures went after UBI because IL2 was going to put some of their WW2 planes in the game. Same people went after MS for CFS2. This was a company and not the DOD. I believe the DOD would not care one way or the other.

Like I said, I can get a Purple Heart medal, just like the real thing at a store in my neck of the woods.

[SteamWake]

Originally Posted by Drebbel

Maybe the DOD is too busy. But if it is law then any US citizen could use this law to take UBI to court. Or am I wrong ?

See my post about "others" above.