Realistic Use Of "Shortcuts"?

Lanzfeld · 12-07-06, 06:39 PM

I like to play this sim with a lean twords realism

. I try to follow the orders and restrictions put on me by the radio orders in TGW and I also have a copy of some standing operational orders for AOD that I try to use. It is more fun to me.

Anyway...from these orders I can read that after Nov 1, 1939 I am ordered not to use the English Channel anymore due to heavy mines

. Fine...no problem.

My question is about the Kiel Canal shortcut. Historically when and why did the Germans stop using it? I imagine it was because it is so predictable for the Allies to check for traffic in there and pound it from the air but when did the Germans stop using it?

Many thanks to you Kiel Canal experts!

Lanzfeld · 12-08-06, 12:13 AM

Wow....

Did I stump all the "experts"???

Tachyon · 12-08-06, 02:14 AM

Uh..no , you just posted the thread when everyone else was sleeping.

Yay-- my avatar changed to the WO from AOD! Roxx0r2 my b047

TarJak · 12-08-06, 04:27 AM

There are not too many mentions of this online. I found references to Operation Bravado which was part of Operation Neptue, the naval component of the Operation Overlord invasion plan, in which the canal was mined from the air. The operation started on June 6 1944 through to 30 June 1944. I can't find a mention of the canal not being used during the war.

The canal was closed in 1936 to free commercial traffic from foreign nations.

_Seth_ · 12-08-06, 04:31 AM

I guess it also was a matter of priority, considering the allied operations before and under D-day. There was probably targets of more importance elsewhere.

TarJak · 12-08-06, 04:42 AM

There were plenty of air raids on the city of Kiel, but the worst of these did not occure until 1945. Over the course of the way about 80% of the buildings in Kiel were badly damaged or destroyed.

Jimbuna · 12-08-06, 06:46 AM

I certainly don't consider myself an expert but IMO the possible factors to take into consideration would be:
1) in the latter half of 40 the French Atlantic bases were operational
2) increasing Allied air sueriority as the war progressed
3) due to the shallow depth of the canal transits would have to be on the surface
4) obvious choke point for mines

just my opinion because as posted earlier there aint much out there on the internet about this topic

Lanzfeld · 12-08-06, 08:52 AM

I play close to realtime so I am not too faar into the war yet.

Has anyone been in the canal later in the war and been attacked from the air???

12-07-06, 06:39 PM	#1
Lanzfeld Grey Wolf Join Date: Jan 2002 Location: New Tripoli, PA Posts: 994 Downloads: 64 Uploads: 0	Realistic Use Of "Shortcuts"? I like to play this sim with a lean twords realism . I try to follow the orders and restrictions put on me by the radio orders in TGW and I also have a copy of some standing operational orders for AOD that I try to use. It is more fun to me. Anyway...from these orders I can read that after Nov 1, 1939 I am ordered not to use the English Channel anymore due to heavy mines . Fine...no problem. My question is about the Kiel Canal shortcut. Historically when and why did the Germans stop using it? I imagine it was because it is so predictable for the Allies to check for traffic in there and pound it from the air but when did the Germans stop using it? Many thanks to you Kiel Canal experts!

12-08-06, 02:14 AM	#3
Tachyon Captain Join Date: Nov 2006 Location: India Posts: 514 Downloads: 0 Uploads: 0	Uh..no , you just posted the thread when everyone else was sleeping. Yay-- my avatar changed to the WO from AOD! Roxx0r2 my b047 __________________ My propellor is faster than yours!!!

12-08-06, 04:31 AM	#5
_Seth_ Ocean Warrior Join Date: Dec 2005 Location: In Tromsoe, @Tirpitz' final resting place.. Posts: 3,277 Downloads: 94 Uploads: 0	I guess it also was a matter of priority, considering the allied operations before and under D-day. There was probably targets of more importance elsewhere. __________________

12-08-06, 06:46 AM	#7
Jimbuna Chief of the Boat Join Date: Feb 2006 Location: 250 metres below the surface Posts: 190,500 Downloads: 63 Uploads: 13	I certainly don't consider myself an expert but IMO the possible factors to take into consideration would be: 1) in the latter half of 40 the French Atlantic bases were operational 2) increasing Allied air sueriority as the war progressed 3) due to the shallow depth of the canal transits would have to be on the surface 4) obvious choke point for mines just my opinion because as posted earlier there aint much out there on the internet about this topic __________________ Wise men speak because they have something to say; Fools because they have to say something. Oh my God, not again!!

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12-08-06, 12:13 AM	#2
Lanzfeld Grey Wolf Join Date: Jan 2002 Location: New Tripoli, PA Posts: 994 Downloads: 64 Uploads: 0	Wow.... Did I stump all the "experts"???

12-08-06, 04:27 AM	#4
TarJak Fleet Admiral Join Date: Jul 2006 Location: Sydney, Australia Posts: 17,052 Downloads: 150 Uploads: 8	There are not too many mentions of this online. I found references to Operation Bravado which was part of Operation Neptue, the naval component of the Operation Overlord invasion plan, in which the canal was mined from the air. The operation started on June 6 1944 through to 30 June 1944. I can't find a mention of the canal not being used during the war. The canal was closed in 1936 to free commercial traffic from foreign nations.

12-08-06, 04:42 AM	#6
TarJak Fleet Admiral Join Date: Jul 2006 Location: Sydney, Australia Posts: 17,052 Downloads: 150 Uploads: 8	There were plenty of air raids on the city of Kiel, but the worst of these did not occure until 1945. Over the course of the way about 80% of the buildings in Kiel were badly damaged or destroyed.

12-08-06, 08:52 AM	#8
Lanzfeld Grey Wolf Join Date: Jan 2002 Location: New Tripoli, PA Posts: 994 Downloads: 64 Uploads: 0	I play close to realtime so I am not too faar into the war yet. Has anyone been in the canal later in the war and been attacked from the air???