LWAMI4 Final Player Torpedo Control Design
 

Since I had too much cerveza after work today to actually do any work on the mod, I thought I'd at least run by the final design I did at work... (note, all the actual numerical values like specific depth settings can be easily changed depending on player feedback)

ADCAP- The floor, ceiling, and search depth presets are the three preset depths that can be selected using the preenable command while the torpedo is on the wire. If it is left alone, it will go to search depth on enable. This torpedo has two primary modes of function, selected by the Snake/Circle Switch.

Selecting Circle in the presets chooses dedicated ASW mode. In this mode the torpedo defaults to having it's ASuW Safety on, meaning all targets above 40ft in depth will be ignored (ALL surface ships regardless of size and surfaced submarines) by the seeker, but this can be disabled by setting a ceiling depth 40ft or shallower, meaning the torpedo will home on all targets it detects. If you leave the torpedo alone, it will travel its runtoenable distance and enable a passive or active seeker as set and go to search depth. The torpedo will not have a search pattern and will travel in a straight line after enable at searchdepth unless it detects a target. The enable buttons while the torpedo is on the wire have the following functions. A single enable click of a preenabled torpedo will enable straight-running passive mode and keep the torpedo at 40kts, as best the engine can if running very deep. A second enable button click will put the torpedo into straight-running active mode and order the torpedo to move at maximum possible speed for the depth. (The following features have yet to be coded, but are theoretically possible and I hope they work out :-) ) A third enable button click will send the torpedo into a single circle right, and a fourth click will send the torpedo into a single circle left (this can be done immediately after the third click for a single circle left only). If the torpedo is currently homing, this command will be stored in the torpedo memory as a reattack command, and will be executed immediately after the torpedo looses its track, if it doesn't hit a target and explode.

Selecting Snake at the presets puts the torpedo in Multi-Role mode. In this mode, the ASuW safety defaults to off, and cannot be enabled. If you leave the torpedo alone, it will travel its set runtoenable distance and then enable either active or passive depending on presets and go to search depth, then begin searching with a snake pattern of 15-30 degrees (I haven't decided yet). The enable button commands have the following functions. The first enable click of a preenabled torpedo will enable it passively with no snake at 40kts, a second enable click will order the passively searching torpedo to search with a wide snake of 45 degrees, a third enable click will active enable the torpedo with a straight run and send it to maximum possible speed, and a fourth click of the enable button will order the torpedo to search actively with a wide snake of 45 degrees.

When operating in Multi-Role mode, you also have the option of enabling Under-Keel Detonation Fusing/Dedicated ASuW Mode by setting the the Snake button and a Search Depth of 100ft (since this mode can only be used against surface targets it is recommended that you set the floor under the layer for stealth and the ceiling at 10ft for as fast a sprintout to target as possible). In this mode, the torpedo will ignore all submerged targets. The torpedo cannot be changed to another mode after it is fired. In Dedicated ASuW Mode, the ADCAP has the same controls as when operating in MultiRole Mode, only the torpedo will always go to 100ft when enabled actively or passively. If the torpedo detects a surface target, it will home on the ship and detonate under its keel for substantially increased damage.

Ok, I think that's it for the ADCAP... a description of the other torpedoes to follow. :up:

The controls for the UGST and the TEST-71ME-NK (the advanced version of the TEST-71 on the newers Chinese Kilos, although currently modelled in DW as inferior in operation to the TEST-71ME) are very similar.

The ceiling, search depth, and floor presets are the three preenable-selectable search depths. If left alone after fire, the torpedoes will runout at launchdepth to their runtoenable distances and then enable either actively or passively and go to their preset search depths, either searching with snake pattern of 15 degrees for the UGST and 30 degrees for the TEST (the TEST also has a vertical snake/helix in its search pattern that will be addressed later), or running straight if wakehoming mode is selected.

The Snake and Circle buttons select the ASuW safety.

Circle is ASuW Safety on, meaning surface targets will not be tracked by the weapon regardless of depth presets. In this mode the controls are as follows. In addition to the preenable button controlling the depth, the a single click of the enable button will passively enable the torpedo with its snake/helix search pattern. A second click of the enable button will active enable the torpedo with the same search pattern. A third and fourth click of the enable button send the torpedo into circle right or left reattack mode, using the same scripting as the ADCAP reattack, which means (hopefully!) it can be stored in the torpedo when targets are currently being tracked.

With the Snake mode selected, this disables the ASuW safety, meaning the torpedoes can be used against surface targets. All other functions are the same, EXCEPT if you set a searchdepth of 10m, in which case this will switch the torpedoes into wakehoming mode prior to launch. When you enable the torpedo, regardless of depth, they will go to 10m and run straight looking for a wake. I hope to also retain on the second and third enable clicks the same circle right and left reattack functions while on the wire as in the other modes. Needless to say, the torpedoes will not work against submarines and cannot be active or passive enabled when fired in wakehoming mode.

I will address the things specific to the TEST-71ME-NK in my next post about the TEST family. :)

The non-improved Test-71M has the following features.

While on the wire the ceiling, searchdepth, and floor are the three depths that can be selected using the preenable button. If the torpedo is left alone, it will run at its launchdepth until it reaches its preset runtoenable distance, at which point it will enable and conduct the search it was programmed to do.

The snake and circle buttons select for the snake and circle search patterns on this weapon. This weapon has no reattack function. The ASuW Safety is enabled by default as it is a ASW weapon, however, you can disable this feature by setting the ceiling at less than 16-18m ( i haven't decided yet). A single click of the enable button passive enables the torpedo and sets its speed at the max speed of its passive sensor using the designated search pattern. A second enable click active enables the torpedo using the designated search pattern.

The following regarding the TEST family search patterns is relevant to all TEST versions, and the NK version when NOT running in wakehoming mode. (Yes I know the presets are in meters, so I'll redo it in meters when I'm actually doing it). Since the TEST has a fairly limited vertical dimension on its sensors, it employs a helix pattern, oscillating between two preset depths in both circle and snake mode. The floor sets the bottom of the helix and the ceiling sets the top of the helix. If the floor and ceiling are set closer than 200ft, then the torpedo will go to its preset search depth (for a narrow depth band shot or for use in shallow water... it is always your reponsibility to make sure the torpedo doesn't hit the bottom). If the torpedo is not manually enabled, and the floor and ceiling are more than 200ft apart, the search depth will not be used (except for a preenable depth selection) and the torpedo will helix between the floor and ceiling preset depths.

If you choose to enable the torpedo manually, here is the choice you have for depth selection. If the torpedo is set to be at search depth, the torpedo will oscillate between the floor and the ceiling. If the torpedo is set to be at the floor, the torpedo will oscillate between the floor and the searchdepth, and if the torpedo is set to be at the ceiling when you manually enable it, the torpedo will oscillate between the ceiling and the search depth. You can reset the depth search by preenabling the torpedo and programming it to go to the proper depth to begin the search you want... you won't have to wait for the torpedo to actually go to that depth before enabling the search.

That's all I think for the TEST family... now for the rest!

Ok, the wakehomers 65-76 and 53-65 are something of a separate issue. They really just need the physics calculations and some small updates to the doctrine and wakehoming sensor. So, more or less, the function of these weapons will remain more or less the same, along with the implimentation of their very poor performance at depth and long range/slow speed settings. In fact, for the AI, I left the wakehoming doctrine as stock from back in the day... its perfectly good that the AI wakehomers go to the surface immediately, the propulsion on these weapons is very inefficient too far below the surface, so that's the "optimal" way to use these weapons, to pop right up, although the player will probably have the choice.

The USET-80/Yu-8, MK50, and MK54 all share the same controls. All use the variable depth, helix search function.

The snake and circle buttons are to select the snake and circle patterns. The ASuW Safety is default on, but can be disabled by setting the ceiling less than 40 ft, thus allowing for attacks on surface targets or surfaced subs. The floor selects the bottom of the helix pattern and the ceiling selects the top of the helix pattern. The search depth is not used unless you set the ceiling and the floor to be within 200ft of each other, in which case the torpedo will search in a 2-d snake or circle, depending on preset, at that depth only.

Other than setting the ASuW Safety with the ceiling, the floor and ceiling do not effect target homing, only search pattern parameters.

Well, I think that's about all there is to say about the player torpedo controls in LWAMI4.

Cheers,
David

I've made some changes to the UGST control design.

I personally like the idea of having the helix search control functions of the TEST family available on the UGST, so the controls I mentioned above for the UGST/TEST-71ME-NK will now be for the TESTnk only. Details on the actual capabilities of the UGST are some what hard to come by, but it didn't make sense to me to have this feature available on the TEST (which needs the helix pattern because of its limited seeker dimensions) and not have it available on the UGST (the ADCAP doesn't need it at all, the sensor aperature is quite large).

The UGST will have the same controls listed above, with the following changes: the snake button selects the 2-d snake pattern, and the circle button selects the 3-d helix search pattern (this can also be disabled by selecting a combination of the Circle select and setting the floor, ceiling, or search depth closer than 200ft).

When operating in Snake mode, the ASuW Safety defaults to off and cannot be set. In order to set wakehoming mode, set the ceiling at 10m or less (the exact details of things like this will be worked out in early testing and can be changed easily) and the torpedo will operate as a wakehomer only. In circle mode the torpedo operates using the same helix depth controls as the TEST, and the ASuW Safety can be toggled off by setting the ceiling at 10m or less.

You guys have any feedback on any of these controls? :)

Cheers,
David

I'm having some conceptual issues working out the ergonomics of the situations where I have to use the ceiling to set the ASuW Safety function and also have it be a selectable depth for a wirecontrolled torpedo. This goes for the ADCAP as well, but it's less of an issue there, for me.

When I actually sit down to do the coding, the solution should be obvious then, so consider these features to be up in the air (well, actually its all up in the air, since only the core technologies are done).

I hope to make serious progress on some of these doctrines today. :)

Cheers,
David

Congratulation for this fantastic job, LuftWolf ... and Amizaur !
As I currently don't have lot of time for DW, that's all I could say, but your descriptions show how you improved the thing.
Excellent work, usefull and realistic.
The only problem I see it's the need of a clear operation manual, because torpedo use will become a very technical thing now !
Something like a PDF, very clear about the torpedo operations.
With a first chapter about common process, and next chapter about specific things for each family of torpedoes, including under chapter for each specific weapon.

This improvment alone could be a stand alone mod !
so ... very good job, you both are very creative and efficient.
There is now a HUGE gap beetween stock DW and LWAMI, in so many different things, you could say LWAMI is simply a must have for all real sub fans.

Hmm... Looks good, but is there any way to change the labels of those buttons, or are they hardcoded into the game? :hmm:

very good, do u kno when u will be done? jw

Are you planning relasing playtest for new torpedo controls LW ? To have some people test it and check it features controls works ok ?

(P.S. Is a wide snake (any snake?) needed with +/-60 deg seeker cone and wire guidance ?? Even 10deg setting in doctrine gives 20deg snake pattern which gives +/-80deg seeker coverage - almost as wide pattern as you can get. Almost 180deg. Anything beside +/- 85-90deg is just waste of time and speed, am I right ? You would just scan space that was scanned already and not get your scan pattern width any wider...)

And... good question, where are the graphics from game interfaces ? Wait a minute, there was a russian language mod for Kilo interface panels, so there have to be legal way of changing button labels !?!

I hope to have this done within the next week or so.

In regards to the ADCAP Snake options, I have to look at this in operation, but the whole point is to have a lingering torpedo that thoroughly searches a specific bearing column and stays in that datum for some time, something like a more effective version of the circle pattern... no one complaines that a torpedo in circle search repeatedly searches the same area, in some sense this is the point of those search patterns. :)

You guys know me... graphics are always last, after creating the .zip file correctly. :p If someone wants to change the graphics, knock yourself out, but I'm not going to spend my time on it. ;)

In my opinion, all the preset tags and labels are close enough to what they would be changed to. Circle would go to Helix in some cases, Search Depth would be the same, floor and ceiling might go to Search Floor and Search Ceiling, and the preenable and enable buttons don't really have a good replacement name, so they'll probably just stay the same.

Like I said, if a graphic artist wants to make new interface screens, I'll be very happy and include them for sure, but I don't see this as necessary, especially because all the labels are pretty close to what they would be in an ideal world where I could just change them at will without any special effort... but that's just my opinion, obviously the designer thinks the controls are intuitive and easy to remember! :lol:

Cheers,
David

Two things, I looked at the russian panel mod distribution. It appears that the only things Negr was able to change were the button graphics themselves. I can't see anything in the distribution that altered the words that were actually displayed on the firecontrol preset panel (these aren't graphics these are words displayed by the interface files, I think), so tentatively, it doesn't look like the fire control preset graphics can be changed.

Can someone who uses the Russian Panel Mod's please tell me if the language is changed on the fire control text display panels? If so, then yes, we can do this, and I'm primarily interested in "blacking out" the extra non-wakehoming graphics on the 65-76... or maybe I can use these for some kind of extra features on the 65-76 (although at this point it doesn't look like the 65-76 should have any advanced features... it is a wakehomer with default underkeel detonation... I guess I can do something with depth that I couldn't do with the 53-65... ah all these weapons are really so different that I don't know what I have until I sit down to do it and finish up the research!).

In regards to playtests, I have three currently planned: one after the torpedo controls are done, one after the torpedo sensors are done, and one with the complete LWAMI4 changes (this will be thoroughly tested before release, unlike previous LWAMI versions that, because of logistics, were tested "on the fly" by the community after release... LWAMI4 is also MUCH more ambitious, so this is absolutely necessay). Also, these playtests are going to be distributed by email and volunteer/invitation only, so I can keep track of who has what, since I wasn't very happy with the limited feedback I got on the public torpedo playtest (in terms of volumn, not quality :) ).

Cheers,
David

And one more feature for the ADCAP. :)

In dedicated ASW mode, if you set the searchdepth within +/- 50ft of the layer, and the torpedo enables at that depth, the torpedo will oscillate in depth in its straight run between 100ft over the layer and 100ft under the layer, and with it's large aspect seeker, it will cover the whole depth of the water column for that side of the layer.

I think that's about it now. :know:

Two more changes to the AI, and I can finally get to work on these player torpedoes.

Cheers,
David

Isn't this a little bit too "advanced" ?

Why?

These parameters could easily be input as presets, we just don't have the specific commands, so they are entered automatically from a single preset.

The doctrine will encode that as the layer at the launchpoint, so it's not as if the torpedo is "reading" the position of the layer on its own.

The actual ADCAP has dozens of features we can't even touch... so there is just about nothing on our end that we can do that is out of the realm of plausibility.

Mine was simple curiosity.
I just didn't think that the adcap could hop over and under the layer automatically during search without somekind of continuos input from the submarine.
Seeing as the layer is input during launch (in the mod) i don't have any problems with it.
I just though that the adcap would go "intelligent mode" and determine itself where the layer was etc... Kind of too advanced, at least for me.
In any case thanks for clearing the issue Luftwolf.

I just sent the real final AI changes to Amizaur for him to look at... so that means the player torpedo doctrines can finally go on the fire.

Git'er done.

Cheers,
David

PS Since I've spent so much time getting the AI to do variable depth searches correctly, the sensor limits are going to be consistent between the AI and players, or at least that's the plan at this point. The AI should be almost as good at using weapons effectively in terms of the sensor mod as a human player, so I don't see a reason at this point to give them an advantage in this area. If they prove not to be as good as I expect, we can always increase their vertical aperatures somewhat, but it won't be necessary to keep their sensors with no vertical limits.

By making torp to make search at both sides of the layer, you practicly eliminated the layer as effective countermeasure... What is the layer "height" or "depth", I suspect that it may vary even when there is something you can clearly isolate as a layer itself, not only a depth of SSP change. I wonder if in real life someone would set torpedo to search at layer depth or as close as 100ft (30m) from layer depth. If the layer depth at place torpedo starts search was little different than layer depth at launch place, then your "cross layer" torp would effectively become one-layer sided and you even wouldn't know about it or know which side it is !!! Acoustic conditions around the layer depth are probably hard to determine and highly variable, and I suspect it isn't a good depth for torpedo search...
Can real submariners say if setting torpedo to search at or very close to layer depth is used in real life, or maybe depths clearly over or clearly below layer are used and depth changes to other side are only done by wire guidance ?
Of course torpedo as moder as ADCAP has it's own logic, and if it knew (entered before launch) the layer depth, and later locked and tracked a target which disappeared from seeker around the layer depth, it would probably make a check on the other side of the layer to see if it can reaquire it there. Or maybe programmed run when torpedo changes side of the layer (from clearly one side to clearly other side) every mile or so... but oscillating at layer depth 100ft over and below... I'm not sure... if something like that is used as real life tactic. In fact I have no idea if it is or not, so please anyone who know and can say, is it valid tactic or not ?
I have feeling that if layer was so simple to overcome for torpedo, then would not be so important to know on which side the target is or changing layer side wouldn't be valid evasion tactic...
If you really want this mode, then maybe after setting search depth = close to layer depth, the ADCAP would change layer side from let's say 200ft under to 200ft over (or even your 100ft, WE KNOW that layer in DW is a point event and you can set torp even to one meter over or under in DW... you can't in real life) each 30 or 60 seconds or so ? You don't need torp to point down or up for part of the time, to widen seeker depth band, it is very wide
anyway, you only need to change depth from time to time, so maybe better to make it by depth change command in periodic time intervals ?

And second question, what was effective (from point a to b) speed of ADCAP in this mode, such continuos depth changes would decrease effective speed in same way as snake pattern does. If the depth oscillations were quite wide and intense and effective speed reduced considerably, then this mode at least would have a drawback and was not used every time... in other case I suspect that nobody would ever launch an ADCAP in other mode than that against sub target and the layer would be effectively non-existing for torp and targeted sub...

Well, it IS called the ADCAP. :yep: :)

My experience tells me that the ADCAP would experience a loss of speed, in addition of course to the loss of speed caused by the depth increase.

I suppose we could do 200ft on each side of the layer, that of course, is easy to change once the mechanism is established.

I think once the full torpedo seekers are done, this mode will prove to have its drawbacks as well (in certain situations it would be easier to decoy, if you know is heading up and down, drop a decoy on one side and then make sure to get on the other side... when you don't hear the torpedo, you know have gotten away... etc.).

All these controls are great, but they will really be redunant if we don't get the seeker parameters in check. The whole point of these controls is to make a situation where the player gets rewarded for doing careful preparations on his shots, rather than just spraying ordinance around.

I am reminded of a statement by SeaQueen some time ago that the reason that salvoes of torpedoes typically aren't accounted for is that multiple weapons are often not more effective than a single well placed weapon.

We are hoping to make this the case in DW, so the changes to the sensors necessitate better control over weapons, for both the AI and the player. I think it makes sense to give the most advanced weapon modelled for the player in-game the most tools to overcome these limitations.

Cheers,
David

Hey I just thought of a way to have torpedoes have a doctrine specified chance of being decoyed by any single decoy... which means I can set different suseptibility to countermeasures for each weapon.

This is necessary because one consequence of having wide seekers and greater sensitivity, is that the torpedo can also pick up decoys much easier, which may have meant, practically, that the ADCAP would also be easier to decoy than say, an older torpedo...

I had been thinking about a doctrine mechanism to get around this, and I came up with a new conditional: IF Newtrack AND ( TgtName $= "Decoy" ) AND ( Spoofed > 75 ) THEN { SETTACTIC TorpedoHoming Spoofed = ( Rnd 100 ) } ELSEIF Newtrack AND ( TgtName $= "Decoy" ) THEN { Spoofed = ( Rnd 100 ) } ENDIF

The first spoofed value would be set when the torpedo is launched as a random integer between 0-100. When the torpedo detects it first decoy, the value would be checked against 75, and if it were greater, the torpedo would acknowledge the decoy like before and reset the value of Spoofed between 0-100 for the next decoy detected. If the value of Spoofed is less than 75, then the value of spoofed would simply get reset for the next decoy, and the torpedo would store that decoy as a decoy and not attempt to home on it, unless of course it looses the track and detects it again on another pass, in which case the process would start over again.

In order to manipulate the "decoyability" factor of the torpedo, I simply have to change the 75 to some other value.

Keep in mind, this would be *on top* of the 50% failure rate for decoys already in the database, so this is only necessary for the most modern torpedoes that supposedly do not really get spoofed much by decoys.

This is the fun of doing this kind of stuff. :up:

Cheers,
David

PS Don't worry, game balance is always in the front of my mind, but I can't help it if the ADCAP is one mean weapon to have coming your way... this was not really modelled well before in DW, it was simply "one more torpedo." The UGST and appropriate AI torpedoes are the only ones that will have this feature, oh and the Mk 50 and Mk 54, but they will be a bit easier to decoy than the ADCAP.