I find it so amazing all the lambasting the Bush administration took for "gaffes", when this current administration has had so many of their own. And people who are more inclined to left wing views tend to question the large liberal media bias perpetrated in most news outlets. I don't know how they can honestly not see it. Some of these instances aren't really all that important in the scheme of things. And this gaffe is certainly not such a big deal. To me the big problem is President Obama basically begging people to invest in the stock market and be confident consumers, and somewhere in the same speech talk about capital gains tax increases to those most likely to have the most impact to charge up the markets. Making it viable for other income people to have the confidence to do the same. He doesn't get it, because he is too mired in Class envy politics IMO. To me, that is the most troubling aspect. So far, the President doesn't seem to understand anything about capital investments or incentive and risk. All of this doesn't actually inspire me to have much confidence in this administration.

In terms of real foreign policy, I'm not sure the Obama people truly have a plan yet. And they should have had one long ago. This Clinton gaffe is no big deal. Much more troubling things than this.....

I'm not sure August meant anything bad, although I was curious at first. I won't speak for him, but I think he was making an obvious point to Enigma that was SO obvious that our first reaction is it must be sarcasm. But, I'm pretty sure he was being sincere. The point shouldn't have had to be made, but alas, look where the certain individuals took the discussion...

But good lookin' out. :rock:

In any case, right on with the rest of the post.

You know, I try to do my best to approach every argument from a neutral standpoint. I make a point of weighing the pros and cons of both sides, and I try hard to look at things from different perspectives. Then, I come to my final conclusion, which is always open to being changed by new information.

Maybe it's arrogant to think so, but that's how I believe everyone should approach the issues.

Yes, I do more often than not come down on the conservative side of the issues (but not always). But I do so not approaching the issues from that side but rather merely concluding there. The difference between me an someone who's an ideologue is that my conclusions are indifferent to the perspective I started from. With Enigma, for example, it seems, "Obama's a liberal; I'm a liberal, ergo, Obama and extensions of Obama policies are correct".

Enigma somehow got the idea that I've never been critical of the Bush administration. Well, on this board, he's mostly correct - although the fact that I didn't join here until the administration was effectively over would seem to explain that discrepency. I have often been harshly critical of Bush and his policies. But I never disagreed with a policy just because it was Bush's. Just like I don't disagree with Obama just because it's Obama.

This is just some perspective on me. People who think that I'm nothing than a right-wing shill should consider this question: does being critical of the idiotic mistakes made by the left automatically mean that someone is firmly implanted on the right?

Or, does it simply mean that someone believes that there are idiotic mistakes being made?

This is spot-on. One also has to consider that the Bush administration lasted for 8 years. Obama's is barely two months old.

Xabba and Neil are correct.

Enigma - if you thought I was talking down to you, then I regret that. That has never been my intent. I haven't called you names, or insulted your intelligence. I do realize that in another thread I indicated a response you posted to me indicated a certain level of cluelessness - only because your response directly ignored what I stated. I would rather give you the benefit of having unintentionally missed that portion of my post, as compared to being intellectually dishonest and intentionally ignoring it. That was also limited to that particular post and response. This is, after all, an imperfect medium to communicate.

I have however noted your pattern of stating a view without offering any backing for it, or willingness to discuss it. That can be rather frustrating when people are trying to understand and give proper weight to your view. Heck, you might have great views that some of us never have considered, but we don't know because you don't discuss them.

I have not meant to attack you personally. I instead would love to see you add to the discussion in a meaningful way. Aramike, August and I went through a similiar "spat" and when I offered them an opportunity to put forth their ideas, I recall they did. While we all 3 still likely disagree on that particular issue, its safe to say that instead of the bickering, we each see that the other people have deeply thought out positions that are reasonable. I am sure yours are too. Just those of us that see things differently can't sea the reasoning behind yours.

Its great to disagree or have a different view than someone else. Discussion is an opportunity for you to present your views in a way that can enlighten or educate someone else, like me for example. Its also a way for you to perhaps learn something you didn't know as well, or refine your own views if you have an open mind. By all means, I encourage you, and everyone else - to take those opportunities.

I will stop here as I don't want to end up brigged, and instead simply want to help clear up any bad air.

*nerve pinches this thread*

Thread: What the hell are you doing?

KapitanPhillips: Uh..... the Vulcan nerve pinch?

Thread: No no no, stupid. You've got it much too high. It's down here where the shoulder meets the neck.

Kapitan Phillips: Like THIS!

Thread: Yeaaaaah...........<passes out>