Thing is, you can make an entertaining movie that is reasonably historically accurate. Pearl Harbor and U-571 have excellent and pretty much historically accurate counterparts, 'Tora Tora Tora' and 'Das Boot'. The story line in 'Enigma', outside of the romance and spy in Bletchley Park, is historically accurate and based on actual events.

It can be done.

There is a big difference between U-571 and Pearl Harbor. U-571 changes history. Pearl Harbor just pretties it up. I think the former is worst.

If they made a movie along the lines of Tora Tora Tora or Das Booty, nobody would go and watch it. Movie making has moved on. You have to include something for the girls (romance) etc.

Though Das Boot is definitely a movie to watch on your own. Certainly hide it if a girl you're trying to impress comes round to your house. :up:

Yeah, I can't fathom (pardon the pun) U-571 for this very reason. It's non-conformance to history just ruins it for me. Pearl Harbor - at least beyond the American flag waving - is kinda sorta nearly based on something that actually happened, so is more palatable to me.

We are all as bad.
 

My only problem with the U-571 movie was that it was sold as reality. It's as accurate a depiction of submarine warfare as James Bond movies are of the real world of espionage. Sold as entertainment they are both fine.

One of my favourite sub movies is "We Dive At Dawn", which is as believable as U-571. A sub, short of fuel, sails into an enemy held harbour and boards a tanker, from which it then refuels, whilst under fire!! However, it never claimed to be a true story. It was also made during the Second World War so it must be seen as propaganda.

Pearl Harbor is in a class of its own. It is an insult to just about everyone, especially any fool, like me, who paid money to see it. Rather than write the longest post in history, listing its faults; I'll list its good features, which are :-:hmm:
Well none, actually.

I remember back when U-571 came out the director, Jonathan Mostow, said that Das Boot's depiction of the U-boat war was innacurate and his movie was far more realistic.

Prick. :roll:

Enigma is a pretty good movie :D.

Bull. You have fallen for Hollywood propaganda. Ever since 'Jaws' and 'Star Wars', the studios have been looking for the next big blockbuster, which is why they make movies that try to be all things to all people, all people being defined as the 12 to 24 year old demographic. So, they won't take a chance on a film that might be somewhat quirky by their standards, because they don't see it bringing in a bazillion dollars of gross.

By the way, I don't go to movie theaters anymore. I can see no advantage in paying 9 or 10 bucks, along with overpriced concession stand crap, to sit in a theater with people who hold inane discussions or worst yet, use their cellphone, to see a movie I could rent for 5 bucks and watch in the comfort of my own home in 3 or 4 months.

But I'm not bitter...

Indeed :roll:

Let's face it, U-571 came out way, way after Das Boot, and hadn't even touched any of the level of quality of that movie. It could be excused if there was no "U-boat movie done right" before. But frankly, after Das Boot did it so well and showed that a (relatively) more realistic U-boat movie is a really a very good thing, making THIS and then going around and talking crap about Das Boot is just moronic.

I hate to even mention U-571 and Das Boot in the same sentence. There doesn't need to be a comparison. One is a piece of hollywood vanilla, the other is a piece of film history. Everyone in this thread must go and cleanse themselves by watching the directors cut twice, and/or the full original version :88)

I just finished watching the Full-lenght version two days ago; but you're right, one more time won't hurt. Maybe this weekend.

Or maybe I'll just jump back into one of my SHIII careers. Now THERE's a realistic u-boat movie!

You should go to the Alamo Drafthouse theater in my town. The food is overpriced, 'tis true, but it's decent food! Quite good, actually, IMO. and they serve you beer!

(added bonus: they will eject people making noise)

www.alamodrafthouse.com
Link to menu (pdf): http://www.alamodrafthouse.com/lakecreek/menu.pdf

(sorry if this is OT, but I couldn't resist the chance to plug my favorite theater!)

Why didnt i see this before :roll:
I can tell anyone from personal experince from having to do a few trash/scrap burning details while deployed, that Diesal does not burn very well at all. Its enough to make you go mad for want of MoGas. So ya, 4 human torchs at the beginning of U571.... suuuurrrreeeee.

He has a point sadly enough. I did not know this, and i woudlnt have believed it until i saw it first hand. There are American's who do not know:

- why we celeibrate the 4th of july. To some its a day to bbq, drink beer, set off firecrackers, and thats it. No clue as to why.

- Anything about or dealing with, the American revolutionary war. or the signficance of 1776. (see 4th of july)

- what POW/MIA means. My own spouse went unto me oneday and asked, "hon, whats Pow Mia?" ( she said it exactly how it sounds. pow.. meeya)


I think i can stop there, thats enough. you may think im full of it, but its sadly true. So ya, hollywood movies will most definatly be beleived as factual information to some people. :roll:

At least with U-571 they used something that at least looked like a german submarine (I'm wondering where the lounge was too). In Pearl Harbor, both sides apparently used modern slant deck aricraft carriers. Before anyone makes any excuses, consider the size of the budget on Pearl Harbor. 1/10,000 of the budget could have been used on good looking models/cgi for the carriers. The japanese carriers were ugly beasts so it was an opportunity lost to do something interesting on screen.

Instead we have Alec Baldwin lecturing Ben Affleck next to the steam catapults on the WHAT? 1941 era carrier!

And when did FIGHTER pilots join BOMBER squadrons flying aircraft they never trained for????

Geez you no nothing. Haven't you ever heard the song "O Pow Mia", the old Italian Operatic theme...:rotfl:

But I can tell you from my interactions with Americans abroad (are they a different breed at all? Because Americans in America are generally nice people on the whole, with the exception of any that utter "Have a nice day y'all" :lol:), I totally agree with your comments.