We didn't give a huge and grand formal declaration of war on Iraq like Roosevelt did against Germany and Japan, but in this case Congress still approved our military to engage in armed conflict with Iraqi soldiers who were, according to Bush, the enemy. Additionally, he gave a lengthy televised speech to us about it.

War is war, no matter what you try to call it or how you go about initiating it. If you openly engage in armed combat with someone, then you are at war; pure and simple. Too many people run around nowadays trying to call things like Korea and Vietnam "police actions", when by definition, they were wars.

That doesn't mean we should lie about the whole thing or try and sweep it under the rug like it never happened. Honesty is another standard which we supposedly hold as important; something that seemingly faded away in the aftermath of September 11th.

Indeed, perhaps made most evident by the backlash against us from friendly nations after we initially went to war with Iraq in March 2003.

Our "reputation" was not damaged by an act of apologetics by Obama; if anything, it helped. The world (and many fellow citizens) knew for years that what we had done in Iraq was wrong, and we weren't going to fool anybody by trying to ignore our past mistakes there, nor were we going to repair our social status.

The previous President's main base of support was people who wanted to force me to go to Church. They force me to say I believe in God in order to pledge my allegiance to this country. They try to force teachers to teach religion in science classes (we all know what "intelligent design" really is). They use their religion to prevent women from making their own choices about their health. They force people to suffer and die from diseases that could very well be curable with the proper medical research (stem cells). They may not be at my door telling me to go to church, but they're still forcing me to live my life by their religion.

And you can stop paying for "socialist" social programs when I can stop paying for absurd and unnecessary weapons purchases. Deal?

Nobody can force you to do anything of the sort :shifty: i supported the president... i havnt been to church in years, but i do believe in a supreme being.

i dont once recall Bush's campaign revolving around "Forcing Max2147 to go to church" thats absurd

Say the pledge without that part... you say it without ill say it with :up: seems fair enough :03:

ahhh the abortion issues. When a womans health is in jeopardy... kill the little spawn.

otherwise there are thousands of young couples out there who would GLADLY adopt it ;) its un-nerving to know how many young women out there resort to abortion because they just dont want the kid. (one such young lady in my family :( )


Fund it... i think that most on the right side would agree that stem cell research is a good channel for research... we just dont see the sense in killing a child to do it.

Take 3 seconds out of your busy day to say "no thanks" and close the door in their faces (thats what I do) i would like you to tell me what major changes and challenges you faced in life today because of my religion.

Deal :yeah:

Dont buy guns if you dont like it.

personally i think we should be able to choose what we pay into... you can pay for the inner city youths 500Db stereo system.... ill fund the national defense! heck of a deal.

we are not nearly in as much difference of opinion as you guys love to think.:|\\

the problem is you have the FAR EXTREME LEFT and the FAR EXTREME RIGHT

unfortunately, most folks (self included) are cought up more or less in the middle

Sure, thats is why there are no kids in state care...oh wait:doh:

While I do not much like abortion, it is preferable to bring an unwanted child, or a child the people involved are unable to support, into this world.

Sure does. Did you listen to the entire thing? Or did I post the wrong video? You need to watch the entire thing. Right in front of a Muslim audience. He just authorized their holy war.

-S

of course there are a lot of kids in state care.

the older the kid gets the less likley it is they will be adopted... sad fact but people want "babies".

infants are a HOT commodity when it comes to adoption children under 6 months are generally the first to go.

Did not see that quote, not in that video. Maybe you can tell me the minute mark it occurs at, since most of that 10 minutes is filled with talking heads.

Here's the entire text of his speech, where did he say "the extremists were right all along"?

Sounds like the kind of thing I would have applauded Bush for.

You know, when "conservatives" spout this kind of bs, it sounds just like the "liberals" when they bash Bush. What a waste of my time, you owe me 10 minutes.

He didn't say it in those exact words. He didn't have to. He implied it. Same thing. He threw our military under the bus by saying we tortured for one. Need I go on?

-S

No, you need to stop. And I'm not implying it, I'm saying it. Obama didn't say anything of the nature that you claimed. The blowhard commentator made all kinds of accusations that the mindless conservatives eat up, but Obama did not "authorize their holy war".

I'm really beginning to wonder about which side I'm on.:nope:

Join us, Neal...

We have the cookies.

http://www.marlerblog.com/uploads/im...se_cookies.jpg

:ocookie...:o

:up::up::up: Now lock the thread.

Do they have nuts?

Wow, Neal ... right on, brother.

Don't let the extremists influence your views, though - just join myself and others like me as independents. :cool:

Too many people feel that they need to listen to their party's talking points. Sure, most of my opinions are conservative - but not all. And I don't need Rush Limbaugh or Hannity to tell me right from wrong. Indeed, I don't necessarily disagree with them, but they aren't my benchmark (which is something I'm afraid Subman's succumbed too).

Do I like Obama? Nope. The so-called stimulous package has demonstrated that he has a complete disregard for consequence when extreme measures are taken. But see, I don't feel the need to invent things to dislike. If he does something I agree with, I'll agree with it - despite the source.

Personally, I think that's how people should behave when it comes to politics. But alas, Talking Point Artists and Spin Doctors abound, and we'll never be able to have a true, honest national dialogue.

I think the people should have alittle opinion of some of these moves...

I myself am going into the task force party...