What navies do when a hurricane comes?

[FERdeBOER]

Maybe this should be posted in the "General" forum but, in my opinion is too general and I don't want this post to be buried between other related to football, George Bush, etc.

I'm going to do a work for the university and I would like it to be about what the Navies do when a hurricane (or tropical storm) comes.

Do they send the ships to open sea? Do they protect the ships and subs (and planes, helos... ) in drydocks and/or hangars?
How they face the possible destructions on the Naval bases?
And, when the hurricane leaves the area, what do they do then? As far as I know, the storm are so strong that the seafloor in shallow waters may change, and I think this is very important near naval bases, doesn't it?

I will greatly apreciated comments or just links.

Thank you very much for Your time and help. :up:

[Oberon]

Generally, I believe, any ships that are seaworthy put to sea where the swells are generally easier to ride out, and there's more room to move. Subs have the easier job, just get as deep as they can to ride it out...but the swells can sometimes be as strong as to affect subs at depth.
Shipping that can't go is probably either towed or just battened down like crazy.

[Goat]

Get underway... get out to sea where there are no others doing the same thing...bow INTO the seas... Ahead One Third... or just enough to maintain steerage-way [to KEEP the bow into the seas]... If it is bad enough, go to Condition Zebra... all hatches and doors dogged down tight. Hang on. Stuff outside the superstructure may carry away, but inside will be fine. Depends upon the size of the ship. I knew a guy on a CVA [aircraft carrier] who was in a typhoon bad enough to curl up the front of the flight deck, and HE slept through it! DD's [destroyers] are not so lucky.

[SkvyWvr]

Maybe this should be posted in the "General" forum but, in my opinion is too general and I don't want this post to be buried between other related to football, George Bush, etc.

I'm going to do a work for the university and I would like it to be about what the Navies do when a hurricane (or tropical storm) comes.

Do they send the ships to open sea? Do they protect the ships and subs (and planes, helos... ) in drydocks and/or hangars?
How they face the possible destructions on the Naval bases?
And, when the hurricane leaves the area, what do they do then? As far as I know, the storm are so strong that the seafloor in shallow waters may change, and I think this is very important near naval bases, doesn't it?

I will greatly apreciated comments or just links.

Thank you very much for Your time and help. :up:

They call in all personnel to secure the base. All aircraft evacuate and all ships able to sail leave port as stated by another post. Hell of a ride on a cruiser. I rode out Hurrcanes Hugo and Andrew and left Hong Kong ahead of schedule pecause of Typhoons.

[Goat]

Try it in a 'Can.... :D

[sonar732]

I remember seeing a picture of a submarine in Charleston that was purposely sunk pierside because they couldn't get out to see in time before Hugo came.

[Henson]

We leave.

Those on sea duty leave with the boat, and the ones on shore duty get about a two hour heads up on evacuation orders so we can get a head start.

[Driftwood]

Had the priviledge of touring the DDG USS Higgins (deck tour only) last weekend during Fleet Week in SF. Can't imagine what it must be like riding out a hurricane/typhoon in one of those ships.......:doh: Especially after watching The Perfect Storm!

[SkvyWvr]

Try it in a 'Can.... :D
A Ticonderoga crusier is nothing but a heavy can.:yep:

[Seadawg23]

Well, given enuff warning which in todays age is almost common. Out to sea and get the hell outta the way. My friend on the Uss Truman sailed north when a hurricanne came thru in 2003 i think it was. Up to maine. Most ships try to leave the area within three to four days of it nearing the coast.

As far as, shore based. Nas Oceana here. We rode it out. was not that bad of a storm. Hurricane wise. The next day was clean up time. I found it funny as hell. We were out sweeping WET Leaves off the concrete with push brooms...that works like a lead balloon. And of course moving sandbags etc etc.

if it is bad enough the base personnel will get moved inshore. As for the planes they head away. All our jets went to Kansas and Oklahoma. USAF bases to ride it out.

[Kapitan]

Smaller the ship the bigger the problem god help them guys on tugs and smaller vessels.

[FERdeBOER]

Thank you, guys, very interesting information. :up: :up:

Is allways a pleasure to ask things here.

[ASWnut101]

heres a question for Kapitan (and him only):p


1.Which is faster: Alpha Class or Seawolf
2.Which carries more nukes(total in each missle combined): Typhoon or Ohio
3.Why does Russia have so many active types of subs?
4.What is the diameter of an Ohio's prop?
5.Which american submarine was attacked by a polar bear?

Answer right and you get a cookie!

P.S. no googling or searchengineing

for the rest of you:

1.which is longer, Kilo or Kilo improved?
2.How many active Spruance DD's are there in american service?
3.How many propellor blades does a Nimitz CVN have on each prop

ps. NO GOOGLEING OR SEARCHENGINEING!!!

FIRST TO GET COORECT GETS A CHOCOLATE CHIP COOKIE!

[SeaQueen]

1.which is longer, Kilo or Kilo improved?


The improved one is slightly longer, I believe.


2.How many active Spruance DD's are there in american service?


None any more. They sure did some neat things with them while they were still around. One of the fascinating things to me about ships, is how soon after they're built, they usually start modifying ships, so that they all have the baseline, but then there's all kinds of weird things on top of it. In that sense, each ship is unique.


3.How many propellor blades does a Nimitz CVN have on each prop


Five blades each. Do I get a cookie? I'm hungry.

[Kapitan]

1Which is faster: Alpha Class or Seawolf
2.Which carries more nukes(total in each missle combined): Typhoon or Ohio
3.Why does Russia have so many active types of subs?
4.What is the diameter of an Ohio's prop?
5.Which american submarine was attacked by a polar bear?

Al'fa is the faster submarine however the top speed of the seawolf has never been released so this no one knows apart from the people who serve on it.

With the SALT treatys the ohio does 240 warheads the typhoon 200, but the typhoon can carry 14 warheads on each missile which means a total of 280 can be carried if pushed.

Because they do not have one single type of multi role submarine, for example the Oscar is designed to engauge surface contacts while the akula is designed to engauge submarines.

Ohio's prop id immagine around 16 feet but thats a guess

And the polar bear i have no clue

[ASWnut101]

1.which is longer, Kilo or Kilo improved?


The improved one is slightly longer, I believe.


2.How many active Spruance DD's are there in american service?


None any more. They sure did some neat things with them while they were still around. One of the fascinating things to me about ships, is how soon after they're built, they usually start modifying ships, so that they all have the baseline, but then there's all kinds of weird things on top of it. In that sense, each ship is unique.


3.How many propellor blades does a Nimitz CVN have on each prop


Five blades each. Do I get a cookie? I'm hungry.
Here you go: http://www.solomonscookies.com/gfx/catalog/cookies/black_label/bl_chocolate_chip.jpg

[ASWnut101]

1Which is faster: Alpha Class or Seawolf
2.Which carries more nukes(total in each missle combined): Typhoon or Ohio
3.Why does Russia have so many active types of subs?
4.What is the diameter of an Ohio's prop?
5.Which american submarine was attacked by a polar bear?

Al'fa is the faster submarine however the top speed of the seawolf has never been released so this no one knows apart from the people who serve on it.

With the SALT treatys the ohio does 240 warheads the typhoon 200, but the typhoon can carry 14 warheads on each missile which means a total of 280 can be carried if pushed.

Because they do not have one single type of multi role submarine, for example the Oscar is designed to engauge surface contacts while the akula is designed to engauge submarines.

Ohio's prop id immagine around 16 feet but thats a guess

And the polar bear i have no clue

oooh, almost had it!

heres the answers:

1. what Kapitan said
2.It was 16 per missile without SALT, allowing 384 M.I.R.V.'s (you did your math wrong!)
3.Good answer, just a personal question
4.Your guess is as good as mine
5. I new it! (more at the bottom)
-------
1.Correct K: 63m K-I: 72.6m
2.Correct 0 Spruance DD's left!
3.Correct 5 on each prop


About the Polar Bear: SSN-22 (Seawolf class)

near the north pole.....

During the ICEX 2003 naval exercises near the North Pole, USS CONNECTICUT was stalked and "attacked" by a "hostile" polar bear when the submarine poked its sail and rudder through the ice.

The damage to CONNECTICUT's rudder was reported to be minor.

http://navysite.de/ssn/ssn22_bear1.jpg

http://navysite.de/ssn/ssn22_bear2.jpg

http://navysite.de/ssn/ssn22_bear3.jpg

[swimsalot]

While at NAS Pensacola back in the late 8-'s we had a few storms coem thru. All planes went North a couple days before. Other personnel satyed, dotn't know whaty they did. Went thru a few storms in the Pacific on a CVN (Carl Vinson), wasn't too bad. But landing back on deck was pretty intersting...

[FERdeBOER]

Thank you vey mucho for your answers.
I've got another question: what happens next? If the planes go to safe zones, the ships to open sea and the subs to deep waters... They must return as quickly as they can once the hurrican passes, doesn't they? If not, the base will be unprotected.
But returning too soon may be very dangerous...

[Kapitan]

I would have thought they would return ASAP to help with the clear up operation, and also they would probably take it more cautiously when entering the harbours or they would sit just outside and leave a skellington crew onboard.

[SeaQueen]

If not, the base will be unprotected.


No. This reflects a fundamental misunderstanding of the nature of naval warfare. Ships in port are not there to protect that port. They're there to get logistical support, replace parts, replenish fuel, fix things, rest their crews, etc.

Ships really aren't much protection to a naval base unless they're at sea, and then they only protect that naval base from threats coming from the sea. That's why during the Napoleonic wars, the British navy did so well. They were successful in chasing their enemies back into port, at which point the French and Spanish naval vessels were largely contained, where they couldn't really do a lot. That left the British free to molest other places with land based forces (The Penninsular Campaign, raids against coastal fortifications, etc.) A fleet in port helps NOBODY, not even the port. When the French and Spanish fleets finally felt like they were strong enough to attempt to confront the British fleet, they didn't try to fight them in port. They had to come out (a sortie). The British fleet wasn't going to come after them IN port, because that's too much work for a naval force. There were fortifications and cannons that the British naval forces couldn't compete with. If they assaulted a port at all, it was a major operation involving mostly LAND BASED (Marines) forces that were landed some distance away and then marched to the battle.

Naval bases aren't like castles, in the same sense that a land based force uses it's bases as defensive strong points (for example a Forward Operating Base (FOB) ). A "forward" naval base (ex: Guam, Sasebo, or Diego Garcia) is still probably hundreds or even thousands of miles from where the actual conflict might be. They're logistically important, but they're not places where you want a lot of ships to be at any one time. You strive to keep as many ships out of port and at sea as possible where they are able to influence events on land by making air strikes and amphibious landings, shelling enemy coastal positions, raiding enemy shipping, landing special forces, scouting out the enemy and launching ballistic and cruise missiles. If the choice is to have ships at sea or ships in port, you always want ships at sea.

A fleet in port is actually quite weak, because one of the primary defenses of a ship is it's mobility and the ability to not have it's location pinpointed. When a ship is in port, everyone knows exactly where it is (tied up at the pier) and it can't go anywhere. They're vulnerable to air strikes, cruise missile strikes, and a ballistic missile strikes. That's why Pearl Harbor was such an ideally executed attack. They struck the US fleet at it's most vulnerable. It offered almost no protection and the port was devastated.

Really, naval forces are best on the offensive anyhow. Ships are relatively fragile pieces of engineering compared to the cannons, torpedoes and cruise missiles set against them. Even a single hit is most likely to put one out of action for the duration of a conflict. They're enormously expensive to own an operate. Repairs to combat damage that can be made at sea are really quite limited. Defense only delays defeat for naval forces. To win a naval battle, your only real chance is to strike effectively first.

So... the bottom line is, defending the port is not why you'd put a bunch of ships in port. In you were defending the port, you'd want them out at sea, hunting the enemy fleet that might attack the port from the sea.

[FERdeBOER]

Thank's SeaQueen!:up:
I didn't thought about that! :damn:

Just one correction: the French-Spanish navy fleet didn't go out because they felt strong enought to fighting the English, they went out because Villeneuve, the admiral of that fleet, knew that a message from Napoleon was comming and he will be relieved.
As a desesperate act, he ordered the fleet to sortie... then he ordered a wrong formation, facing port to have a possible retreat to Cadiz (in Spain is famous a phrase of a very good Spanish captain, who died in the battle, when he saw the orders from Villeneuve: "this man doesn't know his job").
There was also a problem in Cadiz with the disease and the food, so...

And the rest is history...

I actually live in Cadiz and here we have a lot of museums and still have the old city-walls, fortifications and watch-towers. Is very nice place to visit, the old city is almost equal as then; the new part of the city is all built outside the walls.

Thanks again for the help.

[SeaQueen]

I actually live in Cadiz and here we have a lot of museums and still have the old city-walls, fortifications and watch-towers. Is very nice place to visit, the old city is almost equal as then; the new part of the city is all built outside the walls.


I'd love to visit it. Spain is on my list of must-visit spots. Between the history and the food, I'm sure I'll be in heaven.

[swimsalot]

Hey ,we protected the base!!! We took turns walking the flight line, armed with a flashlight. Didn't have a radio, of course. Always wondered wha tthey really thought I was gonna do if I saw some terrorists trying to blow up one of our Seahawks...

[SeaQueen]

Hey ,we protected the base!!! We took turns walking the flight line, armed with a flashlight. Didn't have a radio, of course. Always wondered wha tthey really thought I was gonna do if I saw some terrorists trying to blow up one of our Seahawks...

Good job, Barney Fife.