View Full Version : Ops mod question
In the 11th Flottila from Bergen, my second SH3 comm campaign (RIP Kpt. Lehmann and crew of U-553 :cry: ) with Kpt. Popp and U-67. In June 23-July 14 42 (so far still on patrol)....and I got assigned AK66 for a 2nd patrol. Rather far from what I was expecting. Thinking of the PQ-17 and other artic convoys. I did get reports of a fast TF from Scapa heading east but was already well on my way...and then got a message about a friendly TF near Norway (I assume got the coordinates in longitude and latitude....which is a pain to figure out on the map we have) the Tirpitz battle group perhaps?
So the Ops mod adds these ops but if you want to participate you have to ignore your assigned patrol grids? Same thing are you assigned Operation Drumbeat in the IX equipped flotillas? Would ii be possible to mix in some scripted patrol grids for some patrols as well as the random ones or am I misunderstanding the Ops mod?
Kpt. Lehmann
08-26-05, 07:50 AM
WAIT!!!!
I AM SOOOOO NOT DEAD!!!
:sunny: :sunny: :sunny:
Glad to see you back Kaleun! :up: You escaped from the Tommy prison camp then and got to the u-boat pick up point ... :rotfl:
Anyway, a bump for my questions.
So the Ops mod adds these ops but if you want to participate you have to ignore your assigned patrol grids? Same thing are you assigned Operation Drumbeat in the IX equipped flotillas? Would ii be possible to mix in some scripted patrol grids for some patrols as well as the random ones or am I misunderstanding the Ops mod?
As I understand it, the Ops mod is a work in progress, so some things are added at this point, other things are not - yet. However, some historical operations have already been addressed in RUb (since RUb 1.41) - at least as far as grid destinations are concerned. So in Type IX-equipped flotillas you will find yourself heading to the US coast in early 1942, and to the Caribbean in late 1942. Also, the Norway invasion has been addressed to a certain extent, as has the invasion of France. Other areas are being addressed as quickly as the teams can get to them.
It's a big job: to change a single year's worth of grid destinations for a single flotilla would require 180 separate grid locations to be typed in by hand, and each one needs to be researched to make sure it's suitable for the date, and you need to make sure that the boats can get to the patrol area, which sometimes means taking some long cruises in the game. Some destinations can be copied and pasted, but they have to appear random to the player. Just for Operation Drumbeat I had to change about 360 grid locations, and that was just one operation involving only two flotillas over a 12-month period.
Part of the problem is that you do the work, and the results are very subtle: no one has ever mentioned on these forums that they noticed that Operation Drumbeat, or Plan Yellow, or Weseruebung have been added to the game (and these things have been in RUb for two months), so it's literally days of work with little to show for it in terms of anyone noticing. Basically I can run off a quick skin for a plane in a short evening, show a screenshot, and the 'Wow!' factor for it is MUCH greater than I get for 3 full days spent putting the grid destinations for Operation Drumbeat in the game (for which there is no way to take a screenshot). Not that any of us need the attention, but some quick and easy jobs generate more positive feedback than other very tough and monotonous jobs. So we modmakers tend to get steered towards the cheap chrome rather than the more subtle stuff that gives the game real depth.
The Ops and RUb teams are very small teams, and only one person at a time can work on the Flotilla.cfg file. Then you have the adjustments in the RND and SCR layers, which are MUCH bigger files than the Flotilla.cfg file, and this is by necessity a one-man job too. So, to make a long story short, it is going to take a good long while to be complete, if it ever is.
I've heard that irishred was planning a historic patrol grid mod later on. Let's see if he comes through with that.
I'd love to see that myself, but it hasn't been done for Ops just yet. With the amount of stuff we have to work with, and on limited resources (mostly manpower, really) that we have - getting a lot of features might take quite a while.
But stuff is happening. One day you'll see that too :up:
If anyone can give me general ideas on what general changes need to be made - i.e. stuff that's very wrong, I can fix it. Just tell me what time period, what flotilla, where the flotilla is being sent, and where it should be sent, and I'll make the changes. If, for example, 33rd Flotilla is being set to the Atlantic from June 1944 to February 1945 when it should be in the Baltic at that time, let me know, and I'll set it up with some random Baltic patrols for the next RUb release.
Well one thing that I'd like to see is more focus on Drumbeat. Seems like all the IX patrols that I've been on in early '42 sent me to the good old African coast....
Well one thing that I'd like to see is more focus on Drumbeat. Seems like all the IX patrols that I've been on in early '42 sent me to the good old African coast....
Are you using the RUb Flotilla.cfg file? All of the Type IX flotillas get sent exclusively to the US or Caribbean between January and June 1942. There are no African patrols for a Type IX flotilla between those dates as far as I can see. It's all Drumbeat, all the time, nothing else, for six solid months.
Ah, alright. Maybe that was just before RUb 1.43 - I haven't actually played in 1942 in the last few weeks (it's all either before or after for me lately) :)
antidotos
08-27-05, 03:20 AM
Hi, Beery,
you mentionned the fact that your efforts correcting the game (operations) are not perceived by the players. I could suggest that radio messages announcing operations can improve this perception. I m thinking about the radiolog mod which I find really immersive. It could be integrated into Rub-Ops.
Ahh that's why. Never tried a IX career yet. :know: Well we'll see what comes up.
Let us know the results. It's always good to get feedback.
jasonb885
08-27-05, 12:07 PM
I've seen that patrol grid assignment file once. It's scary. It's odd the game doesn't just give you a random patrol on its own given how poor the stock patrol file is.
I could quite easily write something to redo all flotillas and patrol groups much as I did with convoys.
I just need the meta information of which, where to, and when for each.
:up:
And, yes, the patrol grid is definitely something you notice, even if no one ever mentioned it. I haven't done an IX, ever, so I never noticed the ones already done, but I do notice when I get strange patrol grids (no Arctic for 11th in '43?).
I just completed an IXC career that started in January 1942. My first two patrols were to the US, and I found a lot of lone merchants going up and down the coast (historically accurate). I was really pleased because I had tried IX careers before (pre RUb) and never made it to the US coast. If I'm not mistaken, I think I read that the Improved Convoys mod that's in RUb 1.43 increased the number of single merchants in that area which was a very nice touch. Very realistic and much appreciated.
I would have moved on from SH3 a while ago if it wasn't for RUb and all the excellent mods it contains. Thanks to everyone who contributes to it and makes the game increasingly interesting.
...I do notice when I get strange patrol grids (no Arctic for 11th in '43?).
Where were 11th Flotilla boats sent? I mean, what was its area of operations, and if I give it Arctic patrols, where am I sending them, and how many Arctic patrols versus other patrols? Also, when in 1943 is this a factor?
I think arctic flotillas are a bit of a problem, mostly thanks to the lack of the grid extending northward. In fact, that was THE Norway Flottillas' area of operations. They would operate basically between Greenland and Novaya Zemlya - and in the game, you can only realistically assign sectors that are in the Denmark Strait or between Iceland and Norway.
I wonder if we could somehow extend these grids or at least introduce assignments based on coordinates (since, for instance, convoy reports outside of regular sectors are reported as lat/long). :hmm:
So in my current 11th flotilla campaign I can't expect any assignments to intercept PQ convoys?
I think you can, but only within the limits of AD/AE/AF sectors.
You'll get reports further north by coordinates though - if you can figure out where those coordinates point to...
jasonb885
08-28-05, 12:47 AM
...I do notice when I get strange patrol grids (no Arctic for 11th in '43?).
Where were 11th Flotilla boats sent? I mean, what was its area of operations, and if I give it Arctic patrols, where am I sending them, and how many Arctic patrols versus other patrols? Also, when in 1943 is this a factor?
In '43 I was sent all the way around to off the coast of France, which made little sense with three floatillas _right_ there. No idea what is and is not historically accurate, though. I just know that, given the factual information, I could write something to correct the whole of the patrol grids for all floatillas.
Just like with IC, I can get the job done, given some historical background, like Observer's information on convoy composition. (I couldn't have effective done that myself and IC would've been less historical.)
the arctic thing is as dodgy as the med thing, imho. when comparing the stats from boats who participated in those theatres, you see a above average number of patrols, with very few sinkings. since im into editing the rnd layer myself, i think its very hard to created a belivable shiptraffic, with the current base.
the arctic thing is as dodgy as the med thing, imho. when comparing the stats from boats who participated in those theatres, you see a above average number of patrols, with very few sinkings. since im into editing the rnd layer myself, i think its very hard to created a belivable shiptraffic, with the current base.
I'm adjusting some of the wackier wackiness in the Flotilla.cfg destinations for RUb 1.44. So far with 11th Flotilla I've deleted all the 'GR' (Capetown, South Africa :doh: - I doubt that a Type VII could sail even one way from Bergen to Capetown, let alone get there and back again) destinations and replaced them with destinations as close to the historical Arctic locations as I can. Some are off the coast of Norway, some are north of Iceland.
Regarding the subtlety of changes;
One thing that wouldn't be subtle but obvious would be d-day activity. Essentially this would turn a stretch of the channel into an area completely impassable for u-boats - well, more so than it is already.
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