poll concerning small charge for big mod and alot of work [Archive]

KiloAlpha4

08-01-05, 05:59 AM

Ok I've been contemplating selling the completed mod for $5 dollars U.S. plus shipping. Of course it is to cover the cd prices etc. End price is roughly 15 dollars U.S. (have to check to make sure) to send internationally and is insured for 60 Dollars. I would most likely do the transactions through paypal and money order for people who can't use paypal. I was also thinking for ease of the community of possibly adding all current up to date mods as well on the cd. I may also incorporate their installs into my mod main install for further ease for the user. Note that my own completed mod will be approx 300+ megs in size. Let me know what you guys think.

The mod will have:

-of course all graphics done, planes, ships, subs,interior work etc etc and multiple skin choices
-new or upgraded sounds
-new multiple skies, moon, land, trees etc etc
-whatever else I can throw in there lol
-new missions

Future mod additions/updates of course would be free.

The end list is a big one so you'll have to wait until completion for a final of the changes

Don't flip out it's just a idea. Remember it's hundreds of hours of work that is going into this mod.

daldrum

08-01-05, 06:19 AM

It could be a problem for some people. It all depends on where one lives. The problem is that in some countries there are quite high additional cost for example money transfer and the shipping costs for the CD in some cases could be much higher than the actual product price.

kriller2

08-01-05, 06:25 AM

I think I would if the mod where downloadabble and you paid with a creditcard (maybe thats wishfull thinking...), I'm not so keen about the idea of a shipment abroad, then I have to wait longer for the excellent mod! :up:

The Avon Lady

08-01-05, 06:36 AM

First of all, you better check whether you're legally allowed to sell modifications to a commercial game without the owner's approval.

Next, I would much rather pay less for a downloadable copy, which I would receive much faster, too.

Finally, with all the great mods already available for free, I just cannot picture how this is going to be that much better to justify paying for it.

:-?

vois2

08-01-05, 06:39 AM

I think a charge of one ($1) U.S. Dollar is appropriate through a Paypal transaction, for either access to a downloaded version or the CD. (Obviously for the CD, a nominal shipping charge of $2 or so, in addition.) This would establish your good will among a group which (mostly) vehemently defends the rights of an open, friendly and free mod community. It's been noted many times among these forum pages that folks here are all too willing to share and help others. A nominal charge of $1 would (I feel) seem reasonable to compensate you for hundreds of hours of your time doing your *hobby*. I don't think many would blink at it.

Paypal is now fully integrated with the UK banking community, by the way. Getting a copyright or other intellectual protection on your material is easy and would further support your position, but the key would be the nominal $1 charge. If your work is good enough (and your release details *detailed* enough) I would think thousands would send $1 your way. I would also communicate that 5% or so of funds would be passed along to this forum to help Neal, since almost 100% of your customers would learn about the product here.

I have a 5.0 Mbps cable connection, so I would appreciate access to a downloadable version.

terrapin

08-01-05, 06:40 AM

I'd ONLY consider to buy a payware SH3 mod IF it would be available as a instant download.

BUT I agree with all said by Avonlady.

Ah, another thing: Please do NOT include mods obtained through my site if you should decide to sell a CD. Thanks!

daldrum

08-01-05, 06:46 AM

No PayPal in the Czech Republic:-)

Ooops. Paypal has finally arrived in the Czech republic:-)

daldrum

08-01-05, 07:01 AM

Yeah, provided your mode will not create any legal and ethical issues I will gladly pay 5 dollars for download version. Of course it will depend on what your mod will have to offer.

HundertzehnGustav

08-01-05, 07:08 AM

Depends... but basically sending you &( bucks to se'nd me a CD with that stuff in it is okay to me :D

but the laws... beurk

KiloAlpha4

08-01-05, 07:16 AM

for one avon lady has no clue because no one has done a full graphics sound etc mod upgrade of sh3 yet only bits here and there or some good additions to the game like sh3 commander.

And $1 dollar is cheaper than the cost of buying the cd unless you get the cheapest brand. Not to mention your time burning it and doing the installer from hell setup. I wouldn't waste my time for a buck.

Besides that any and all original textures have nothing to do with ubi's ownership of the game for the simple fact that their mine. They may own the game but not my textures lol..

My textures are better than UBI's released ones. Compare mine to ubi's released work :)

This isn't a seawolves $29.99 pirate cd of other peoples work, this is hundreds of hours of my work.

vois2 show me international shipping for $2 with a 60 dollar insurance. Cheapest insured international shipping is 15.

hmm instant download & credit card is doable. This of course will increase the price because I'd have to pay a company to take care of the card transactions so they would be secure.

Getting a copyright or other intellectual protection on your material is easy

it's as easy as the date stamping on my computer and mailing myself the finished product first by registerred mail unopened. The legallity of copyright ownership holds up in any court.

Ah, another thing: Please do NOT include mods obtained through my site if you should decide to sell a CD. Thanks!

That was a thought as a addition for peeps who may want other peoples mods included on the cd or in a all in one installer with their mods as options. All mods on your site can be obtained elsewhere. This is up to the individual owners of the mods because they are not mine. I have no idea why you stated that it makes no sense logically.

terrapin

08-01-05, 07:30 AM

for one avon lady has no clue because no one has done a full graphics sound etc mod upgrade yet only bits here and there or some good additions to the game.

And $1 dollar is cheaper than the cost of buying the cd unless you get the cheapest brand. Not to mention your time burning it and doing the installer from hell setup. I wouldn't waste my time for a buck.

Besides that any and all original textures have nothing to do with ubi's ownership of the game for the simple fact that their mine. They may own the game but not my textures lol..

My textures are better than UBI's released ones. Compare mine to ubi's released work :)

This isn't a seawolves $29.99 pirate cd of other peoples work, this is hundreds of hours of my work.

Yup. Dozends of other modders (mod mothers?) are putting in thousands of manhours into their work without ever thinking about to release their work for money. I've worked also hundreds of hours on my site, Neal and his moderators may have worked ten thousands hours...

Besides any free-/payware debate, I prefer the research/realism stuff Beery, the 'Ops Mod' team and others are doing much more than any gfx enhancements. IMHO SH3 is good enough in the 'eye candy' department, the realism in the 'simulation' aspects needs tweaking, though (and is constantly tweaked).

But, don't get me wrong, I respect every one who does good mod work. and is it no question that I prefer freeware over payware.

KiloAlpha4

08-01-05, 07:35 AM

glenno

08-01-05, 07:39 AM

Yeh gimme money THAT'S WHAT I WANT
A little money THAT'S WHAT I WANT
That's what I want THAT'S WHAT I WANT
So gimme money THAT'S WHAT I WANT
That's what I want, ye-ye-yeh,
That's what I want.

terrapin

08-01-05, 07:39 AM

Your not the only one I've had 5 sites myself in the past.

IMHO SH3 is good enough in the 'eye candy' department

Your joking right ?

Not at all. I don't doubt that you've done huge gfx enhancements, but as I said, the things done so far are good enough for me...I'm modest and patient...

But it's just my 2c - I'd pay much more than I've paid for SH3 IF the realism would be enhanced.

KiloAlpha4

08-01-05, 07:42 AM

I'd pay much more than I've paid for SH3 IF the realism would be enhanced.

No you wouldn't it's easy to say. The realism actually isn't bad but it does need the tweaking. I haven't really seen any major realism improvements myself . Flying torpedoes do make me laugh though.

Yeh gimme money THAT'S WHAT I WANT
A little money THAT'S WHAT I WANT
That's what I want THAT'S WHAT I WANT
So gimme money THAT'S WHAT I WANT
That's what I want, ye-ye-yeh,
That's what I want.

Tools are everywhere I suppose you got a pirated copy of sh3 ? $5 bucks just covers the costs read up. I'm not making any money.

terrapin

08-01-05, 07:43 AM

KiloAlpha4

08-01-05, 07:46 AM

I'm currently trying sh3 commander but haven't tried berry's uboat so I can't really comment on those myself until I do. Any more ?

glenno

08-01-05, 07:47 AM

SH3 cost me $89.95 australian dollars actually .

terrapin

08-01-05, 07:48 AM

I'm currently trying sh3 commander but haven't tried berry's uboat so I can't really comment on those myself until I do. Any more ?

Again: These are enough for me for now. But I'm aware more is in the pipelines...

anyway...I won't derail this thread nor say anything against your business plan. You asked for opinions, I said mine...

KiloAlpha4

08-01-05, 07:48 AM

alrighty I dl'd berry's real uboat I'll have to try that out.

You need to read there's no business plan because in business you MAKE MONEY (or at least that's the Idea about being in business) and I wouldn't be ....and that's still only 2, more in the plans doesn't count lol. What other mods are good for realism I'm currious to try them out. What happens when you spend far more time modding than actually playing lmao. Come to think of it I haven't finished one campaign yet (to the end of the war) lol.

SH3 cost me $89.95 australian dollars actually

wow why so much ? I thought we paid alot in canada for games. The average game here is $59.99 which I personally think is expensive.

I won't derail this thread

Well it's your forum you can pretty much do whatever you want. I have nothing against people getting as much as they can for free, heck If someone offerred me a huge redo of a game for free I'd take it over buying it myself, it's just human nature ;) Besides you have to look at the law of averages. No matter how good the mod was if it was released for any amount people in this forum would still "pirate" and share copies again it's just human nature. I mean can you actually believe someone said they'd pay $1 lmfao.

Duncan Idaho

08-01-05, 08:21 AM

Your not the only one I've had 5 sites myself in the past.

IMHO SH3 is good enough in the 'eye candy' department

Your joking right ? I have a pic of the original bf109 in my sh3 overhaul section look at that one again for a example.

and is it no question that I prefer freeware over payware.

Show me one person who doesn't lol.

There's a point about the planes though...who often really stops to admire the looks of them? I don't, I'm too busy running from them trying to escape. lol

terrapin

08-01-05, 08:24 AM

Well it's your forum you

No, it's not mine. Neal Stevens is the owner of subsim.com and this forum.

Drebbel

08-01-05, 08:41 AM

I would only pay for it if it introduces new stuff into the game, not if it just alters existing stuff. But probably I wouldn't be ablke to control myself and buy it anyway :D

I also think you should be carefull asking money for new sounds, unless you earn the copyright of those sounds of course. But AFAIK most sound mods these days mainly contain ripped sounds.

timetraveller

08-01-05, 08:58 AM

KiloAlpha4 and All,

A good example of payware/freeware mods co-existing peacefully is the MSTS (Microsoft Train Simulator) and Auran Trainz simulator world. It can work and can be appreciated by the right group. I was involved in that gaming world for awhile and I liked the general positive attitudes people had for them.

Now, other readers, don't get me wrong here, I don't go for the ripoff's of existing ideas and mods like what X-1 is trying to pull. Payware mods for original work, like KiloAlpha is doing ought to be okay, assuming UBI copyright law is not breached.

What many Internet freeware junkies don't seem to understand is the uncountable hours that modders and reskinners put into their work, which they enjoy for NOTHING. The biggest gripe I have is many come to almost demand that it be free. Ain't no free lunch in life, friend. What you are enjoying for free cost someone weeks or months away from family and life to produce. Some do it for the love of the game, and some would like to have some kind of return on all that effort, a little bit back to make it sort of worthwhile for efforts expended if they are going to continue.

I have spent tens of thousands of hours of my life modding games, writing freebee software, and giving free scripting help in another area of the Internet, so I know what this feeling is about. Recognize that a person "can" get to a point where he wants a little in return if he forsees a few hundred or a few thousand more hours in front of him.

Don't have a cat over this guys. Good payware mods ought to be welcome too. KiloAlpha4 has some quality skins which are certainly worth the few bucks he's asking for his time.

TT

glenno

08-01-05, 09:08 AM

In australia pc games are expensive when they come out but also stay expensive for a longtime .

Immacolata

08-01-05, 09:11 AM

Id pay if the mod contained stuff I'd be interested in and it is original work. I don't think I'd pay for this particular mod because it seems to be skinning, and that is an area where I have no gripes with the original game.

vois2

08-01-05, 09:40 AM

vois2 show me international shipping for $2 with a 60 dollar insurance. Cheapest insured international shipping is 15.

hmm instant download & credit card is doable.

Then I believe you have your solution, KiloAlpha4. Although I feel associating it with any credit card transaction is extraneous. Paypal is sufficient, even for users in the Czech Republic per the posting above. Set up a download site, and you won't have to 'waste' your time on CDs or shipping.

Just to clarify, yes I would pay $1.00 :|\
Keep in mind that this is a mod community unaccustomed to paying anything at all for mods. If you want a lot of people to just copy and pass around for free your product, charging $5 will lead to that. On the other hand, I know a respectable majority wouldn't mind sending you $1 to see your work.

You are not the only mod maker around, and it's arguable that your work would be superior to all or anyone else's. :know: There are so many quality mods available for free here. I would still gladly send you $1 to download a good working mod.

.
.
But not $5.00 . :up:

.
.
.

daldrum

08-01-05, 09:49 AM

On the second thought, I do not think I am so crazy about the stuff you are going to offer, as, like some other players, I am quite happy with the looks and sounds of the game, and I can see that your mod is a lot about new skins, textures and sounds. So, probably, I would not buy it.

Duke of Earl

08-01-05, 09:57 AM

I would only pay for it if it introduces new stuff into the game, not if it just alters existing stuff.....

Ditto for me...

When Pacific Aces came out for SH2... I sent a small donation to SubSim (iirc)... perhaps by PayPal... and it was worth it because it added totally new content to SH2... due to the fact that the modders had access to the source code (not the case for SH3)...

So, until that is possible for SH3, I remain very skeptical about 'payware' mods in any shape, form or fashion...

Cordialement, Duke of Earl

sergbuto

08-01-05, 10:45 AM

When Pacific Aces came out for SH2... I sent a small donation to SubSim (iirc)... perhaps by PayPal... and it was worth it because it added totally new content to SH2... due to the fact that the modders had access to the source code (not the case for SH3)...

Correction. We did not have an access to the SH2 source code when we made Pacific Aces.

Drebbel

08-01-05, 10:55 AM

Two SubSim programmers had access to the SH2 code. First there was Duane and he coded Programm Messerwetzer. But the second programmer that would code the bug fixes for Programm Messerwetzer and/or more improvements never actually started coding. :-?

KiloAlpha4

08-01-05, 10:58 AM

This topic was worth starting for the comedic value of posts alone.

The key here is no one and I mean NO ONE even stopped to consider how much it actually costs to make a cd and ship it. The actual cost is $7.50 to $10 if you factor in your time aswell. It's actually the amazing amount of excuses against purchasing a hypathetical cd but everyone who posted even with the "It's not something I would be interested in" would definately download it freely if available and if they say no they're lying.

The point of the thread which most missed, well actually there was a few points but I'll just stick to the main one, was that the cd was for people that wanted a "hard copy" and was at no profit (actually a loss) which means it was a favor essentually to fellow people in the community. I was actually going to even throw on other mods for them for their convenience and maybe even make a all in one mod installer because some people posted that they wish there was one.

Not only did terrapin jump on it quickly but he couldn't resist to come back when he stated he wasn't going to post further in the thread. He even went so far as to insinuate I was starting a business adventure to sell the mod for a profit. You guys can read up and read his post easier than I can quote it lol-I'm too lazy ;) Pi$$ing on my leg and trying to tell me it's rain doesn't work. have nothing against the guy, I don't even know him. Most and I mean most totally didn't even obviously bother to read the first post which stated the above concerning it was a fee for people who may want it on a cd and that it was at no profit which totally amazes me.
Everyone go back to the very first post and slowly read each post carefully to see how almost everyone totally jumped the gun.

I don't hold it against you all because I've done it before myself. It's again human nature and was shown to me in my psychology class the very first day. The teacher handed out 1 sheet of paper with instructions and the very first line was "if you are reading this then place it on your desk and turn it over" the rest after that was a list of instructions such as shout out this word or that word and do this or that. At least 1/3 of the class missed the first line because they had jumped to the middle of the directions. A effective demonstration of human nature.

The actual fact that no one stopped to factor in is that the cd is $5 dollars plus the cheapest shipping for those who want it but as stated the actual cost is around $7.50 plus the time to do it. here's why:

-the cost of a good quality cd: approx $1.50
-the cost of fuel to get the cd's and to go each time to ship a cd $1.09 per LITRE
-the cost of packaging for shipment- around $ 4.00
-if I was to do a direct download-cost of site not in amount
-credit card-cost of transaction not factored in
-paypal-transferring money from my paypal account to my checquing account costs me money that paypal takes for a transaction fee
-my time isn't even factored in

I hope people think (actually read slowly lol) a bit in the future before they leap and I hope the people who stated it's not a mod they are interested in, won't download and use it when it is released, but the rest of us all know the answer to that. the discussion was would people pay for a cd ( a minimul amount ) and shipping if they wanted a cd copy but instead it was "insinuated" as though I was trying to start a business selling the mod to make a profit by 1 person in particular which after the X1 thing kind of surprised me.

But anyhow when I thought further of the time to do this for people I began to realise that it wasn't a good idea because 10 trips to ship 10, then i pictured 20 then 30 and my thought was no freaking way that's too much of a hassel. I don't want to have to make a site either for direct download etc I have enough with starting up my clan again etc etc.

Anyway all have a good one.

terrapin

08-01-05, 11:06 AM

I even jump now in and come back. My calculation:

Euro 0,65 for a quality (Verbatim or similar) CD, in fact much lower if you buy them in 100 piece packs

Euro 2,50 for actual postal fees

Euro 0.10 for a bubble-wrap packaging

----

Subtotal : EUR 3,25

Now, if you intended to charge 15 USD, that would clearly be a commercial venture. Nothing against it, as I said. But I wouldn't buy it - as stated.

KiloAlpha4

08-01-05, 11:13 AM

Show me international shipping with a $60 dollar insurance for that price please and those costs for packaging in canada, because the prices I stated are canadian and here it goes by package dimensions and weight (which is how they get you) If I was to use puralator courier as a example it would be roughly 30 bucks us to ship to the states alone. A example well 2 examples:

1) I got a guitar pedal from the states to here cost me 36 bucks in shipping fees for a guitar peddal !

2) I sent my brother 3 standard mail sized letters because he moved..cost $6.99 for 3 letters !

Again it doesn't negate the fact alot of you's jumped the gun. Backpeddling doesn't change it. Your amounts are local letter mailing fees and not international shipping fees obviously.

You still failed to factor in my gas to do it and time to do it and the money paypal takes off to transfer it to my chequing account or to do credit card transactions. There not free you know lol though I wish they were. Remember I'm not in Europe..

Euro 0.10 for a bubble-wrap packaging

Man if it's that cheap there I live in the wrong country.

Nothing against it, as I said. But I wouldn't buy it - as stated.

You don't have to so why keep posting it ? A simple sorry would suffice or just say hey man I jumped the gun my bad...It takes a bigger man to admit when he's wrong.

KiloAlpha4

08-01-05, 11:22 AM

I forgot purolator nailed me with a added 24 bucks for border fee crap aswell. So much for free trade.

Shadow9216

08-01-05, 11:28 AM

You should try to sweeten the deal for these guys- offer a trial pack of Viagra or some of these other discount medications we keep hearing about from Canada :yep: I bet they'd shell out to get their pills for cheaper than you get them here!

KiloAlpha4

08-01-05, 11:30 AM

rofl that's a good one. Like I said putting it on a cd and sending it to peeps is too much of a hassel. It was a nice thought but .... :damn:

jasonb885

08-01-05, 11:38 AM

Never.

I already shelled out for the game.

By the time a superior mod is developed, if that's possible -- keep in mind we do NOT have the SDK for the game -- anther game with superior gameplay and graphics is likely to be released.

I'd rather save my $10 for something else, given I buy a game maybe once a year anyway.

lemon

08-01-05, 12:02 PM

It would be nice if someone (KiloAlpha4) would create CDs for those who can't download things from the internet or don't want to do it.
I know a Close Combat site where one guy is doing this. You can send him money to burn the contents to a cd. He has done some additional stuff to make installation easier. So the main idea is ok for me but I would like to have the chance to download your mod KiloAlpha4 and see the payment option as an additional oppertunity for those who don't can download your mod.
Or is it because the download is to big and the bandwidth coasts are to high (the Close Combat site http://www.closecombat.org/CSO/index.php had lot's of trouble with the monthly coasts).
If it's a payment for your work I wouldn't mind because everone can free decide if they wish to pay you for your work.

KiloAlpha4

08-01-05, 04:53 PM

The payment was only to cover the costs and shipping. To make a actual small profit I'd have to charge $29.99 plus shipping which I wasn't doing that's why the cost was $5 plus shipping. So say if you paid 20 bucks total and it got lost in shipping, it would be insured for $60 so you'd be making a 200% profit lmao. $60 dollars is the standard insurance. The point again is that it was a idea I was tossing around.

By the time a superior mod is developed, if that's possible -- keep in mind we do NOT have the SDK for the game -- anther game with superior gameplay and graphics is likely to be released.

Highly doubtful there is going to a better sim besides sh4 and that wont be for another 2 years I estimate. Although I don't know what they have planned for the addon.

KiloAlpha4

08-01-05, 05:02 PM

SH3 is no longer supported by UBI.
You have self stated that it wont be any more patches for this game and the developers have moved on to some other projects.

ubirazz....that kind of sucks. I have read aswell that every modder has essentually broke the sh3 eula agreement for sh3 in all mods made lol

From the license EMEA EN.txt

It is not permitted:
- To make copies of the Multimedia Product,
- To operate the Multimedia Product commercially,
- To use it contrary to morality or the laws in force,
- To modify the Multimedia Product or create any derived work,
- To transmit the Multimedia Product via a telephone network or any other electronic means, except during multi-player games on authorised networks,
- To create or distribute unauthorised levels and/or scenarios,
- To decompile, reverse engineer or disassemble the Multimedia Product.

I assume that unpacking any .dat file is covered in the last one lol. According to the EULA everyone making or using mods are :arrgh!:

Now that' a harsh eula ;)

Drebbel

08-01-05, 05:05 PM

Huh, who are you quoting ?

KiloAlpha4

08-01-05, 05:08 PM

I was looking around for any sh3 official addons info and I found this thread on X1's addon http://forums.ubi.com/groupee/forums/a/tpc/f/857101043/m/9931037933

I thought I had seen somewhere that ubi was releasing a addon for sh3. Maybe it was just wishful thinking on my part.

GERMANY (July, 19, 2005) X1SOFTWARE announces a add-on for Silent Hunter III. SEEWOLVES - this is the name of the add-on for Silent Hunter III which is currently under developement. Many enhancements and new stuff inside like new campaign script, new missions, new sounds and graphics fixes to DD hydrophones. Roughly sixty new cities, including ports and industry naval and airbase locations in Europe, North America, Britain and the Pacific region. New objects including ships, search lights, bunkers, minefields and air defenses. Enhancements to sub interior and exterior. Stationary ships in harbors and harbor patrols. Historical activity such as Dunkirk, Dieppe and D-Day. New radio messages. Optional installations like navmap aids, fatigue mod. Player can use historical maps showing French harbors and the PTO grid. The add-on includes 22 single missions and four multiplayer missions, as well as tutorials for „Fire and Spread“ and convoy attacks. Players even can resupply their U-boat now during missions. A powerful package to come, so watch out! Release August 2005!

Wow everything in there was a released mod. I didn't read the full post until now. Of course it doesn't state the quality of the 22 missions lol. I'm wondering if he's still going to try and release it for $29.99 now that he was busted. Anyone know what's going on with the X1 saga ?

Lmao I also found this http://www.subsim.com/sh2fleet_forms/donation_downloads.htm

Now I know why terrapin was trying to discourage anyone from buying the cd ;)

Das Boot Sound Module

Is that even legal to sell taken it's from a movie protected under copyright law ?

I wouldn't buy it ;) That stuff should be free right terrapin. Any realism mods in there ?

Oesten

08-01-05, 05:58 PM

I wouldn't pay for a mod unless it was programmed like shareware.

Which means you could install it, try it out, then after 30 days or 30 runs or whatever you can't play it anymore unless you register and pay the fee.

Because with a payware mod there's no quality assurance, no refunds, and no reviews. You don't know what kind of quality you're going to get until you buy it. The maker might claim it's wonderful and bug-free, but you've only got his word for that. And with a payware mod, you don't know how good it is until after you've paid your money and tried it.

For all you know, you might be paying for a mod which causes a CTD and is useless to you.

So no, unless the payware mod distribution, installation and payment procedure was EXCEPTIONALLY user-friendly, I wouldn't risk buying it.

What a payware mod-maker might consider doing, that I would appreciate, is to create two versions of his mod - a lite version with limited features which is intended as a taster, this can be downloaded free. And a full version, which people pay for.

clive bradbury

08-01-05, 06:06 PM

Personally, I have no problem with a modder charging for his work. As with all business transactions, this will be self-regulating. If the product is 'worth' whatever price is set on it then some customers will buy it. Charge too much for what the user gets, then you get no sales.

As with several other people, I am quite happy with the graphics (don't see much of them @ 100% realism anyway), so I am unlikely to be a customer.

Generally we get a fantastic level of free mods on this community, so maybe we are a little spoiled expecting everything for nothing. We are lucky, and I assume it is for the same reason I make my mods available to others. Not claiming anything great - my mods are always small tweaks, nothing like the complexity some people get up to. However I don't make them for everyone else, I mod sections I think need improving for my own benefit, and usually thoroughly enjoy doing it. The additional time spent making them available to others is nothing. The point being that I would mod anyway for myself, and to then make the mods available for anyone who wants them is by far the shortest time and effort of the whole process, so why would I want to charge for 2 minutes uploading them to a website or e-mailing them to the nealmeister?

The final point is that we are damn lucky to have a vast resource of free mods, so if a few people want to charge that's ok, as you can always choose not to buy.

terrapin

08-01-05, 06:14 PM

Onkel Neal

08-03-05, 08:28 PM

KiloAlpha4

you can download any of the mods you want, Subsim asks for a donation to keep the website going (bloddy exensive beast) for the CD. cheers :)

Neal

Gunfighter34

08-03-05, 10:42 PM

I think Lemon has the right idea. Host your stuff on one of the many mod sites for those who have the ability to download them for free, and then charge a nominal fee to ship to those who have low-speed connections or would benefit from having an auto-installer.

I personally don't think you're trying to grift anyone. I live in S. Carolina and have a friend who lives in Scotland who used to be on dial-up, so I know how much it costs to burn mods, etc. on to CDs and send it internationally. The costs you're listing, in Canadian dollars (which are different from and worth substantially less than US dollars, a fact I think some are overlooking), don't seem unreasonable.

Your mod doesn't hold a lot of interest for me personally, as it seems to be built mainly around retexturing. I like new skins, but in a game like SH3 when a plane shows up I disappear, so I don't see too much of what they look like. Same with vessels other than merchants and DD and smaller escorts. I rarely see 'em, so I don't much care, and I've got the MVP to cover the merchants so I'm happy.

Don't get me wrong, I'm not criticizing it, as I haven't seen your work and I don't doubt it's good, it's just not my cup of schnapps. And I think you have to understand some of the skepticism in light of the recent X1 situation. I don't think this is analogous for several reasons, but your timing in coming up with this idea probably wasn't ideal.

Anyway, good luck with whatever you decide to do, and don't take the criticism too hard. If it's constructive it helps you, and if it's just flaming you shouldn't give a crap about it, anyway.

Damo1977

08-04-05, 08:42 PM

In australia pc games are expensive when they come out but also stay expensive for a longtime .

and I also do beleive we in Australia ain't allowed to import game CD's from The Americas due to some trade thingy......

jasonb885

08-04-05, 09:59 PM

Sigh.

The BB software screwed up the thread ordering, again.

Sigh.

:nope:

jasonb885

08-04-05, 10:05 PM

rofl that's a good one. Like I said putting it on a cd and sending it to peeps is too much of a hassel. It was a nice thought but .... :damn:

???

The whole thing sounds like a commercial venture.

I did go back and reread your post. You spoke of hours of time investment in some new mods and junk.

Why on Earth couldn't you host it on Subsim or Realsimulation again?

NZ_Wanderer

08-05-05, 06:17 PM

In australia pc games are expensive when they come out but also stay expensive for a longtime .

Yea, same here in New Zealand.. - It cost me $99 for SH3 here :( :( - The killer exchange rate is why I have answered no to this poll.. (Besides that, I can get all the mods I want from these amazing forums :rock: :rock: )

Farside

08-05-05, 07:19 PM

I gotta ask though, why would you make people pay for it anyway?, it might be your work, but so what? the Real U-boat crew dont sell their mod and i think it changes hundreds of parts of the game, if your talking about Total Conversions, everything entirely different. Then again why not just release it for free? have you personally lost money in the process of making the mod that you feel you must be re-embursed?

reading back this might have sounded cheeky or rude, please dont interpret it that way :)

Shadow9216

08-05-05, 07:39 PM

MAN! What's up with New Zealand and Australia?
So...could you guys have someone Stateside buy it and send it to you? $99 is criminal!

NZ_Wanderer

08-05-05, 09:36 PM

Yea, I know, the prices we have to pay here for games etc makes buying a lot of games nearly impossible...

Getting someone to mail it from the states would be good, however apart from the exchange rates there would also be shipping charges and then there would be bank charges for transferring the money across :( (Mind you using paypal would eliminate that transfer charge) .. - So on a $40 (US) product we here "could" be looking at still $70-$80 (NZ)

It a no-win situation....

Reece

08-05-05, 11:15 PM

Wow, talk about a lot of overdone Kafoffel :rotfl:
I think if you put a lot of time and effort into this KiloAlpha4, then I think it's not too much to ask for a donation to help with costs, as long as the product is worth it. :up:
I have access to 56k modem only (live in bush) and would pay gladly for a CD copy to be sent, blow trying to download 300+meg of data.
Lets face it SH3 is shot full of bugs & any large mod to improve it is welcome to me. So far there are so many mods, I have about 35 installed but soooo many conflict with each other, it would be good for a major update but to download such a mod would be out of the question on a 56k modem. I love all the free mods and certainly very grateful to the modders for all the effort they have put into their mods but not much time is going into playing the game, as soon as I start a campaign a new mod comes out & vertually got to start again, in fact I'm starting to lose interest in SH3, therefore a large mod to put it all together is a great idea to me, and would gladly pay. :yep: :lol: :up:

Dave Kay

08-07-05, 11:11 AM

Ahem... well; it looks like the poll results speak for themselves...

Nopileo

08-10-05, 01:56 PM

Having been a flight sim fanatic for many years, I have spent hundreds, if not thousands of dollars on 3rd party add-ons for MS Flight Simulator. But I only buy stuff that is truly revolutionary and inventive.

This is possible for FS 'modders' because MS always release the SDK's for the program. So dedicated programmers can create aircraft/cockpits/dynamic scenery etc. that is far more complex and realistic than what comes in the box, and those products are often created by people who do this for a living - full time. There are hundreds of commercial companies that are based on FS add-ons.

I would be hesitant to pay for something that only modified existing features of a product, which is probably only possible with SH3 since there is no released SDK.

But I did 'buy' (donate money for) Pacific Aces (or the SuperCD), as I think that altered so many things in SH3 that it became practically a new product.

And, I would also gladly buy/donate money to such great products as RUb, especially now that it's becoming such a great collection of the works of so many modders.

Oh, and I would gladly pay for a collection of scripted campaigns like in SH2, btw... :ping: The dynamic campaign in SH3 is great, but I would like to try some historical/fictional campaigns as well, with other goals besides sinking ships and reaching a patrol grid. Espionage missions, rescue missions, photo recons, 'stalking' missions, sabotage missions etc would be a great addition to SH3 (hint hint to any modders :cool: ).

Finally, I would only pay for downloadable software that could be paid with a credit card, unless it was a huge package with maps, written manuals etc.