Hardcode modifications requests

[Mister_M]

So, maybe we could put here all the things we really would like to be working, but which can only work with some modification to the hard code of SH3...

This has been done in the past, so why not hope for future improvements?


Please don't rain on my thread saying that nobody will ever do further hard code fixes, one never knows...

[Mister_M]

#1 Guns' firing behaviour


I will start with something that has bothered me from the beginning.

There are several guns on a ship, and they have their own firing range. But as soon as the ship detects an enemy ship, all the guns (even the light AA guns) will turn towards the enemy ship and fire at it, even if the enemy ship is much farer than the guns' max firing range...

The correct behaviour would be rather this one:

- the gun will start moving towards the enemy target when this target is less than {the gun's max firing range + 1 km} away.

- the gun will start firing only when the target is less than {the gun's max range} away.

[VonDos]

#2, the dream of dreams, remove 32bit\4gb ram limitations :doh:

Best regards,
Vd

[Mister_M]

#2, the dream of dreams, remove 32bit\4gb ram limitations :doh:


Yeah, sure! :yep:

But it's probably not an easy fix, else I believe H.Sie or Stiebler would have fixed it long time ago...

[Mister_M]

#3 ASDIC detection vs. depth


So, Stiebler added a fix where the enemy ASDIC doesn't work very well when your U-Boot is in shallow waters.

In my opinion, this should depend not on the sea bed's depth, but on the distance between the U-Boot and the sea bed. Hence, if your U-Boot lies on the bottom, the enemy destroyers' ASDIC should not be able to detect you whatever the depth.

[Jeff-Groves]

#2, the dream of dreams, remove 32bit\4gb ram limitations :doh:

Only way to do that is to recompile the original source code to 64 bit.
That might sound easy given one has the source code but can open up a lot of bugs, will increase the size of the major files like the exe, dll's, and act files.
Each and every file would need recompiled and tested for problems.

SH3 Commander and other add-ons would no longer work also.

[Tabris]

Adding new crew voice lines for orders that are currently unvoiced. I've been told that current understanding of the code says this is impossible. Probably a minor thing for most people, but more immersion is always good, and having the chief say "raising snorkel," or the radio man saying "detecting radar signals!" would be incredible.

Also, an old SH dream is to be able to manually control which motors are doing the work. In Iron Coffins the author describes using the e-machines while in port and starting the diesels only later. I know American boats in the Pacific would use them during night surface attacks to prevent being heard when the seas were calm. It'd be amazing to get to choose when to use which.

[John Pancoast]

- Escorts in correct escorting positions, numbers and tactics (get rid of the routine wandering off into never neverland, leaving the entire convoy flank exposed "tactic").
- Convoys correct sizes
- Aircraft use correct attack profiles and weapons
- Better damage model; damaged batteries leak chlorine gas, less predictability (always the forward deck, flak guns damaged first, i.e.), fuel/oil leaks which increase the chance of detection, etc., etc.
- better silent running mode vs the invincible state it currently is.
- depth charge noise masking
- convoy noise masking
- enemy a/c that spot you relay that info. to nearby escorts/convoys.
- moonlight affects. (thanks rik007!)
- more wolfpack attacks. Even with H.sie's mod, there are not nearly enough with virtually none in some historically active areas. Pack attacks were the norm, not the exception, and there are way to many single attacks still.

Probably come up with others later :) Btw, all the above were in AOD.

[rik007]

#4
Time compression that works larger than 256X
Correct caps when rain or shine

Seriously:
Step 1: install cheatengine
Step 2: install x32dbg
Step 3: install NASM
Step 4: Fire up sh3
Step 5: Fire up cheatengine
Step 6: Fire up x32dbg
Step 7: After some research:
Step 7: Start coding your solution in NASM
.....

Although the requirments you have are very simple - provided you have the C++ code in front of you. Soon you will learn that they are very complicated in Harde code fixing. For example: how do you know if a gun is an aa gun? How do you know if it is a gun? Where is the check done that a ship is within 1 Km? How do you know if a ship is firing? And which ship? How are the ships stored anyway? How many guns are there on a ship? etc, etc.

It will take a few months to create it (or fail). If you are working full time on it maybe a few exhausting weeks...

[Fluffysheap]

Also, an old SH dream is to be able to manually control which motors are doing the work. In Iron Coffins the author describes using the e-machines while in port and starting the diesels only later. I know American boats in the Pacific would use them during night surface attacks to prevent being heard when the seas were calm. It'd be amazing to get to choose when to use which.


To some degree this is a difference in the design of the American and German subs. American subs had the diesels power a generator and used only electric motors for propulsion, similar to a diesel-electric locomotive. German subs had the electric and diesel motors both attached by clutches to the propulsion shafts and used the same machinery as either a generator or a motor, more like a hybrid car. The American system was bulkier but simpler and more flexible. For example the awkward arrangement where the Germans would have to run on one engine for propulsion while the other charged the batteries was not necessary for the Americans (and was actually only done at slower speeds by the Germans - at high speeds they would drive both propellers with the diesels and clutch in one or both electric motors as generators). The Americans could just run the diesels at full power and always have the most efficient distribution of energy. But both approaches had advantages. German subs could be "jump started" by towing with the electric motors engaged, making it easier to capture them :haha:



It's likely that the Germans had to use electric motors in port because their system would require a minimum speed when on diesel power. This is not implemented in SH3 but any combustion engine has a minimum speed at which it can run.

[derstosstrupp]

The reason for the use of the motors in port is because the diesels (to the extent they were even reversible, see below), were relatively more difficult and time consuming to reverse. You had to shut the engine off, shift the cams over and then restart it. As a weight-saving measure about mid war, reversible diesels were no longer supplied.

The motors on the other hand are very easy to reverse and quick. You simply place the speed rheostat on full field, switch the travel direction switch to the opposite direction, and you are done. This causes a significant initial surge in armature current, but the starting resistors can handle that until CEMF starts building in the opposite direction.

[Mister_M]

When departing from a U-bunker, the electric motor would allow you to have a very slow speed (thus avoiding to create huge waves), and would prevent the emission of toxic vapors from the diesel engines.

Also, if you can't go reverse with the diesel engines, then you can't use them to leave the bunker, because you entered in the bunker moving forward, remember?... :03:



Step 1: install cheatengine
Step 2: install x32dbg
Step 3: install NASM
Step 4: Fire up sh3
Step 5: Fire up cheatengine
Step 6: Fire up x32dbg
Step 7: After some research:
Step 7: Start coding your solution in NASM
.....

Although the requirments you have are very simple - provided you have the C++ code in front of you. Soon you will learn that they are very complicated in Harde code fixing. For example: how do you know if a gun is an aa gun? How do you know if it is a gun? Where is the check done that a ship is within 1 Km? How do you know if a ship is firing? And which ship? How are the ships stored anyway? How many guns are there on a ship? etc, etc.

It will take a few months to create it (or fail). If you are working full time on it maybe a few exhausting weeks...


I understand the point, thank you!

[Doolar]

Player controled "dive planes" and to ba able to use "electric motors" on the surface

[rik007]

Originally Posted by rik007 View Post
Step 1: install cheatengine
Step 2: install x32dbg
Step 3: install NASM
Step 4: Fire up sh3
Step 5: Fire up cheatengine
Step 6: Fire up x32dbg
Step 7: After some research:
Step 7: Start coding your solution in NASM
.....

Although the requirments you have are very simple - provided you have the C++ code in front of you. Soon you will learn that they are very complicated in Harde code fixing. For example: how do you know if a gun is an aa gun? How do you know if it is a gun? Where is the check done that a ship is within 1 Km? How do you know if a ship is firing? And which ship? How are the ships stored anyway? How many guns are there on a ship? etc, etc.

It will take a few months to create it (or fail). If you are working full time on it maybe a few exhausting weeks...

I understand the point, thank you!

If I had the C++ source code in front of my I would not have hesitated to fullfill your request :):)

[Mister_M]

So, the game is coded in C++? :hmm2:

[Jeff-Groves]

So, the game is coded in C++? :hmm2:

Yes. All the way through SH5 in fact.
I've seen some of the source code here and there.

[Mister_M]

Asking a naive question: Why can't we have access to the source code, while SH3.exe can read it...?

[Kal_Maximus_U669]

Asking a naive question: Why can't we have access to the source code, while SH3.exe can read it...?

Because he is not a Hacker... :D:har::har: Working on code requires a lot of knowledge..

No, it is not possible to find the original source code from an executable, for the good reason that a C or C++ source code is in fact a route to be followed by the compiler which will produce code in machine language and even possibly optimize it.

The only exceptions: some disassemblers are intelligent enough to, for example, tell you in comments which object is being accessed when the information is available, but this remains very far from the source code.

It also happens that these executables are compiled with debugging information. In this case, they may embed part of the original source code but, generally, this is only a reference to the source file which must be nearby.

[Kal_Maximus_U669]

Yes. All the way through SH5 in fact.
I've seen some of the source code here and there.
hey Jeff-Groves salutation..

What software do you use???
You can't access the entire code...can you...!!! :ouais:
After 20 years of waiting... even if it's forbidden... there's a statute of limitations... it would be cool to "explode".. I'm tired of waiting... this which does not happen"I'm getting old"... in these naval simulations... Nowadays the devs think much more about money than about satisfying the players... and we are bombarded with "trailers" which do not reflect what was expected...by the majority of us...

[rik007]

Great explanation Kal,

C++ is human readable but your computer cannot execute it. It needs to be compiled in an executable which is machine code. Machine code can be executed but is very hard to understand:

C++ would be something like:
if (wheathertype != previousWheathertype)
{
sunAltitudeAngle = sunAltitudeAngle + changeInAngle;

// etc

}

After a compile the machine code looks like:

https://i.ibb.co/DR3y78S/x32dbg.jpg (https://ibb.co/QKsR6C1)

This is somewhere in the envSim.act. Ebp+68 contains the current wheather, ebp+80 the previous wheather.

[Kal_Maximus_U669]

Thank you...I put a link with a C++ pdf for basic understanding...
I know that on this forum we have some strong, intelligent heads... you never know...
:Kaleun_Wink:https://www.mediafire.com/file/nxlavzxa43bxxf4/Chap_1_Notions_de_base.pdf/file
I add that Python is used the most, then C and C++, then Java etc..
I would have liked to have an answer from Jeff on what program he uses..but he is a mysterious man :timeout::har::salute:"Je ne fais pas de stupide. Alors ne demandez pas."

I think that the creators of "Silent 3ditor" and "Hsie"..have such knowledge on the subject..they are miracle creators of the time...when you see what he had at the time..the work is enormous dejected...these are the people who can turn things around...I think they stopped working on it because of copyright or else they already had this code obstacle..
I'm sure nothing is impossible in IT...

[UrViechAlex]

Hello everyone!


Some of those already mentioned I would surely second! :-)


What I would enjoy:


- prize rules, boarding & explosive charges


- different merchant behaviour --> chance roll, then either irregular (!) zigzags, turning away and going full speed for a couple of hours, trying to ram your sub if very close...


- AI ships not running onshore so often, especially being more careful and clever while chasing you in or close to ports


- ships and aircraft doing torpedo attacks...:Kaleun_Applaud:

[Jeff-Groves]

The bits and snips of the source I have seen was passed to me by some of the Devs.
Those small scraps were only enough to confirm some of what I suspected about different things. Not enough to change how the Game engine processes things.

And if one reads the credits for S3D? You'd see that the Best of the Best contributed information to assist the programmer.
He didn't just wizz bang it out in his own.

[Kal_Maximus_U669]

Hey Jeff-Groves..:D:salute:
Thanks for the detail...
@skwas & @h.sie
From what I understood...

Clarification: all controllers are an integral part of Silent Hunter. Other editors-programs can use them - if the controller "mirror" is registered in the program code. Adding a new controller means creating a new “mirror” that was not previously in the program. To create a controller, it's Devs of SilentHunters. :wah:

Here I understand that it is the program... which acts on controllers... linked to the source codes it creates a mirror... in order to change the situation... it seems that to go deeper... you need the help of the code source in order to locate new " controllers"...to create new interactions..is that right Jeff..?
So without a favorable opinion from the creators of the game it's dead...we need authorization to locate what interests us or a "geek" master of C++ programming...

It’s “turfu” work as we say at home..!!!
https://risibank.fr/cache/medias/0/27/2755/275554/full.gif

[Jeff-Groves]

skwas and h.sie were not on the original Ubisoft Development teams.
Never were.
My sources were.

h.sie and Stiebler hacked the code. And they did a fantastic job. No complaints here.

My reasons were to understand the animations in SH4. Which I posted about.
No one aside from me followed up on that knowledge.
I've also seen no one follow up on the stuff I released to convert from SH5 animations for SH3.

Funny thing is I can also convert animations to a TRUE SH4 animations.
But why bother releasing that? No one would do a darned thing with it.

[Kal_Maximus_U669]

"Ce qui est drôle, c'est que je peux également convertir des animations en VRAIES animations SH4.
Mais pourquoi s’embêter à publier cela ? Personne ne ferait rien avec ça."

Yes I saw this work you are talking about...:yep::up:
But I must admit that my learning curve on the Silent Hunter series
is not finished I have been registered here since 2017.. there is so much to learn in such a short time.. at the start there is "Hsie" understanding modding assembly in order to achieve something correct and functional... then I started using Silent 3ditor..at that moment..I didn't even know what a node was, a zon data file..etc..that's to tell you..lol I "eat" I I don't know how many PDFs and other leems to know that I had to translate them all and the Google translator was not as efficient as now..as well as hours of reading on the Subsim & KSD & Donitzflotte & forum and on the German forum or Hansolo(wac) and Rowie(ccom).. Urmel(lsh) had their activities..then the time came to manipulate some TGA and other files in order to personalize my soup a little more...Now I need to learn C++ & Python... given the time I have it's hard...
I'm the village idiot when you ask me the time I'll give you my watch..!!:har:
I have another question:
- Why modders are pushing hard on sh3...sh4
since these games are 32bits.. we can clearly see today that we are at the maximum in terms of modding with these..?
I know that each silent hunter has its share of problems..But personally I find it more interesting to work on Silent Hunter5 64bits..so no more limitation of "Ram"..Vecko has done a remarkable job with Wolf of Steel.. .
It would be more interesting to have a group working on this one when do you think..??
I can't wait to see Kpt's mod. Lehmann. Official GWX Knight's Cross Edition.. the veterans of GwX
there is also that of Wolves of the Kaiser:1914-1918 Mod iambecomelife..His mod is beyond comprehension and I saw that he seems to have considerable skills in animation..
One thing is sure... I don't regret being part of Subsim thanks to these games, it's incredible what I was able to learn thanks to people like you...
of all the forums where I 'hang out' this is where I happily put my bags..
Yes I wanted to add.. the source code I think it will be impossible to penetrate the "totality"... because some developers introduce subcodes in order to protect their work....without their approval it s dead..

[Jeff-Groves]

I was a Grey Wolf up through GWX 3. :03:
Open TDW's GR2 editor and I am listed as a credit. :03:
Same with S3D if you find the thread that lists credits. :03:
(Those are all listed as privateer, which is me)

And I do assist iambecomelife with Wolves of the Kaiser from time to time. :03:
Rowie was a very good friend that I miss. Anvart has been a very good friend also.

It would take me a few pages to list ALL the people I learned from or assisted!
I still do assist if asked. I share what I was taught and what I have learned freely. Sometimes My threads are WAY over peoples heads. But that's knowledge that some new Guy may find and just drive it to the bank, cash the check, and create the next mind blowing MUST have mod!

[rik007]

So you are Privateer, very funny. :)

[klh]

I would have three wish list items.


Allow us to put the open/close torpedo tube switches in the TDC panels (there is a command given in the config files which doesn't seem to do anything).


Give us an impact angle dial so we can have a complete TDC.


Fix it so the single/salvo dials work in the other menus like they do in the TDC menu.

[Jeff-Groves]

So you are Privateer, very funny. :)

What's funny about it?

[rik007]

What's funny about it?
To take on a second identity! It would be something that you are active from multiple accounts.

[Jeff-Groves]

Nope. Actually requested to have the privateer account locked.
Which was granted. Then started this account.
You can always send Jimbuna a PM and ask him who I am.

[Kal_Maximus_U669]

I warned you...a great talent..he is a mysterious man..so don't be stupid..:har:https://congngheviet.com/wp-content/uploads/2019/05/mysterio-spider-man.gif
Enough jokes...
hey Rik007 & Jeff greetings
SH-3 Night surface attack project 1.18..and on the test bench.. at this very moment.. 3 versions install Onealex.. NYGM Fifi..soon some feedback especially regarding the sky and clouds...

[Jimbuna]

Nope. Actually requested to have the privateer account locked.
Which was granted. Then started this account.
You can always send Jimbuna a PM and ask him who I am.

I can vouch for Jeff and am more than happy to do so. He is a friend of mine who I have met personally at the 2008 Subsim Meet in Houston.

He is a talented modder and in the past was an integral part of The Grey Wolves team and was actually the team leader at one point.

All of what he says above is true.

On that you have my word.

[Jeff-Groves]

I'm not really a mysterious man.
It's just that I do a lot of different things in other areas of interest. Like working on Air Guns, 3D printing, and figuring out how to take 3D objects from other Games just for the challenge.

All posts from me as privateer are now found as Madox58

I decided along ago that new people were afraid to ask me for help as privateer.
I was a really big Richard Cranium back in the early years.
:nope:

[rik007]

I'm already affraid to ask you but did Jimbuna post the "Welcome aboard!" message when you re-entered subsim with your first post? :)

[Aktungbby]

I can vouch for Jeff and am more than happy to do so. He is a friend of mine who I have met personally at the 2008 Subsim Meet in Houston.


All of what he says above is true.

On that you have my word. :sign_yeah: Likewise:Kaleun_Salute: I'll say this for my Friend! Aktung is one of the most intelligent persons I have met through Subsim! And I have met him Face to Face! Not just here online.
He actually showed up at a job site where I was demoing stuff out in California.
Now his head just went up at lest a hat size! When it comes to 'demoing stuff', Jeff's "big bang Theory'' is :subsim:'s best! I know 'cause I survived the visit!https://i.imgur.com/lxRZDbV.gif?1 :shucks:

[Jeff-Groves]

I'm already affraid to ask you but did Jimbuna post the "Welcome aboard!" message when you re-entered subsim with your first post? :)

No. :har:

rik007, You've been around SubSim even longer then I have.
:salute: