No airplanes in KSDII?

[Kapitän]

Hi Guys,

I left Bordeaux in October 1942, through the Bay of Biscay and I'm now positioned west of Lisbon ... not a single enemy A/C in sight ... is that normal?

I even checked the game files to make sure that there are actually airplanes there, and there are ...

[Kapitän]

Hi Guys,

I left Bordeaux in October 1942, through the Bay of Biscay and I'm now positioned west of Lisbon ... not a single enemy A/C in sight ... is that normal?

I even checked the game files to make sure that there are actually airplanes there, and there are ...


Still trying to figure this out (with my limited understanding of the insides of the game files): Could it have something to do with the fact, that I'm assigned to the 12th Flotilla in 10.1942, but in the Campaign file the Patrol Objectives don't start until 1943, and therefore, no airplanes are scripted into the game yet?

[propbeanie]

The airplane response is generally not in a PatrolObjective file, unless it is something specific to that particular mission assignment. The airplanes might be in any of several of the "layer" and "battle" files for specific "flights" of Random Generated Groups (RGG) or 'regular' groupings of planes or single aircraft, but again, those are generally not too heavily involved either. The main file that 'automatically' will generate airplanes (in the Stock game) is the "Allies_AirBases.mis" file. I do not have my KSDII install available on this particular computer I am on right now, so the authors of the mod may have added more files, or re-named files in the mod, but the "*_AirBases" files and the Carrier Class ships in the area are what can generate the airplanes, and that generation is based upon the settings found in the "Data / Cfg / AirStrike.cfg" file, which controls the type of response, the distance of the response, the timing and the frequency of the response, as well as the 'modifiers' for the math involved. Those are the places to check for that.

The 'luck' of the player can also be involved here, in that you may have left port at a good time, were unobserved, and then traveled along between the paths of aircraft that did generate. If you are not 'seen' by the enemy, they don't know to track you. If you do not have electronic counter-measures, there would be nothing for the enemy aircraft to 'home-in' on to follow your boat. Later in the war, you actually leave 'footprints' as you travel on the surface. Once you are 'observed' you should be constantly followed and bird-dogged by aircraft. Your boat can only travel so far in a given amount of time, and if they keep you submerged, it would be an ever-shrinking circle of the ocean...

[Mad Mardigan]

Still trying to figure this out (with my limited understanding of the insides of the game files): Could it have something to do with the fact, that I'm assigned to the 12th Flotilla in 10.1942, but in the Campaign file the Patrol Objectives don't start until 1943, and therefore, no airplanes are scripted into the game yet?

Some... mod sets, have issues where it pertains to aircraft & not showing up... most notably when high compression aka high TC use is done.


Did you by chance... rely on going past... oh, say... x256 on the TC, by chance... cause if so, then it is likely this is where your issue with not seeing any aircraft, comes into play.


Use of TC higher than that, starting from x512 & up... does have... consequences.



x512, no aircraft sighted... & I believe... anything past 1024, has the propensity... to bork the day/night cycle, as well as... the weather cycle.



Now, if not mistaken... it is possible I believe, to circumvent the borking of the day/night-weather cycle/s... by going into your graphics control panel... & in it, setting the frame rate refresh rate &... locking it in, to either 30 on the low side, to no higher than... 60 fps.


On the TC side of it... it is possible (best done BEFORE running the sim, after its been modded out... of course. :yep:) to edit the main.cfg (found here: drive name\folder (whatever you named it to install said game/sim)\game\sim (in this instance 'SH-4' KSD II: Ace)\Data\Cfg\ Once in the Cfg folder, is but a matter to scroll down through the files until you locate... main.cfg

Then, is but a simple matter to open this file up in notepad &... well... edit the [TIME COMPRESSION] values.


Used as an example, My own edited [TIME COMPRESSION] values:

TimeStop=0
RealTime=1
LandProximity=128
CriticalDamage=1
CrewEfficiency=128;1
AirEnemyDetected=1
SoundEffects=128
CharacterAnim=64
EnemyDetected=1
RadioReport=1
Particles=64
PrayState=256
HunterState=256
3DRender=1024
Maximum=1024




Hope this info helps... as always. :yep: :shucks: :up:





:Kaleun_Salute:


M. M.

[Bubblehead1980]

I was concerned about lack of aircraft in Dark Waters current career, as saw zero on first patrol September-October 39 and in a test career I had spotted one sunderland who was unarmed and ignored me lol. First part of this patrol no contacs were spotted even after attacking close to England (may need to adjust the response in the airstrike file) but now have encountered three.

One of which surprised me just after sundown Dec 24 1939 , close depth charge/bomb while I was on surface (fog hid him apparently, he was maybe 500 meters astern when spotted, flying low) when bombs landed off starboard bow, maybe 10-12 meters distance. . I had hit Alarm and was on the way down when noticed had serious flooding in bow torpedo compartment. I miss the pacific and SD radar sometimes lol.

I tried to level off but could not in time, slammed into the sea floor at 120 meters. Dive planes transmission disabled plus flooding is bad combo. After a few minutes was able to blow ballast and surface.


Anyways, on my end in DW thinking it was just being early in the war.


On your end in KSD, like prop said it may be luck avoided planes, if continues the airstrike.cfg may need adjusting along with air base placement.



I've heard the theory about TC above x256 preventing air contacts but not sure I buy into that yet, as never had issue in other mods and two of three air contacts this patrol...was at TC 1026, other that got me, I was in real time, which was interesting.

[propbeanie]

SHIII does indeed do the TC thang to the planes. I have not noticed it in SH4, but I would definitely believe it possible under certain configurations, given the two games deep deep relationship to each other...

[Kapitän]

The airplane response is generally not in a PatrolObjective file, unless it is something specific to that particular mission assignment. The airplanes might be in any of several of the "layer" and "battle" files for specific "flights" of Random Generated Groups (RGG) or 'regular' groupings of planes or single aircraft, but again, those are generally not too heavily involved either. The main file that 'automatically' will generate airplanes (in the Stock game) is the "Allies_AirBases.mis" file. I do not have my KSDII install available on this particular computer I am on right now, so the authors of the mod may have added more files, or re-named files in the mod, but the "*_AirBases" files and the Carrier Class ships in the area are what can generate the airplanes, and that generation is based upon the settings found in the "Data / Cfg / AirStrike.cfg" file, which controls the type of response, the distance of the response, the timing and the frequency of the response, as well as the 'modifiers' for the math involved. Those are the places to check for that.

The 'luck' of the player can also be involved here, in that you may have left port at a good time, were unobserved, and then traveled along between the paths of aircraft that did generate. If you are not 'seen' by the enemy, they don't know to track you. If you do not have electronic counter-measures, there would be nothing for the enemy aircraft to 'home-in' on to follow your boat. Later in the war, you actually leave 'footprints' as you travel on the surface. Once you are 'observed' you should be constantly followed and bird-dogged by aircraft. Your boat can only travel so far in a given amount of time, and if they keep you submerged, it would be an ever-shrinking circle of the ocean...


Hi propbeanie,


Thanks for responding!


Here are my current "Data/Cfg/AirStrike.cfg" settings (no changes made):


[AirStrikeSettings]
; AirStrike Creation Parameters
; Airstrike Session:
; 1. Compute airbases in range according to their aircraft maximum ranges
; 2. Compute air coverage factors on allies/axis/neutral on the target zone
; 3. Compute airstrike probability from each base
; 3.1 check number of aircraft that can strike at that range and conditions, and compute a coverage factor based on the range of each aircraft type
; and detection area around submarine ( 10 km radius )
; 3.2 multiply coverage factor for the target area with :
; - current airstrike probability againt that side
; - nigft factor ( if necessary )
; - airbase competence
; - close to airbase factor
; 3.3 check probability for airstrike
; 3.4 add more aircraft probabilistically for a large target


Maximum Aircraft Range=1500 ;[>0] in kilometers
Poor Airbase Modifier=0.7 ;[>0] Modifier for poor airbase (carrier) rating
Novice Airbase Modifier=1.3 ;[>0] Modifier for novice airbase (carrier) rating
Competent Airbase Modifier=1.7 ;[>0] Modifier for competent airbase (carrier) rating
Veteran Airbase Modifier=2.2 ;[>0] Modifier for veteran airbase (carrier) rating
Elite Airbase Modifier=2.5 ;[>0] Modifier for elite airbase (carrier) rating
Night Modifier=0.15 ;[>0] Modifier on strike probability at night
Default Air Strike Probability=30 ;[>0] Default probability to send an airstrike from a airbase (carrier)
Enemy Air Strike Probability Increase on Radio Messages Sent=40 ;[>0] Increase over the default probability on a radio message sent
Friendly Air Strike Probability Increase on Contact Report Sent=70 ;[>0] Increase over the default probability on a contact message sent
Enemy Air Strike Probability Increase on Player Detection=50 ;[>0] Increase over the default probability on player detection
Atenuation Factor=10 ;[>0] decrease from an increased probability to default one on each air session
Logic Steps Between Air Sessions=40 ;[>0] steps between air fighting sessions, 10*Logic Interval(90sec)

[Kapitän]

Still trying to figure this out (with my limited understanding of the insides of the game files): Could it have something to do with the fact, that I'm assigned to the 12th Flotilla in 10.1942, but in the Campaign file the Patrol Objectives don't start until 1943, and therefore, no airplanes are scripted into the game yet?


Hi All,

Many thanks for your responses!

About the points you raised:

Time Compression: 99% of the time, I don't go beyond x64 TC.

FPS: I use the Bandicam program for screen shots and videos. In it, one can also select the FPS, which I have set to 30. If this should not be the way to do it, what other means would I have to lock the FPS at 30 (not sure how to do it otherwise)?

Also, the weather hasn't changed in 4 1/2 days (clear, wind 5sm), which is great for these kind of conditions but makes we worry once the weather turns bad. Note: I make frequent game saves (about every 12 hours), which I then overwrite. Always worked fine with Sh3. Could this be a potential source for the weather to "get stuck"?

Another thing I noticed is that so far, the FuMB1 I have installed, has also not given any contact reports. I remember from Sh3, that the FuMB systems picked up A/Cs as well as ASWs and dropped the TC to 1 once picking up any signals. How does this work with KSDII?

Thanks again, All!

[Mad Mardigan]

Hi All,

Many thanks for your responses!

About the points you raised:

Time Compression: 99% of the time, I don't go beyond x64 TC.

FPS: I use the Bandicam program for screen shots and videos. In it, one can also select the FPS, which I have set to 30. If this should not be the way to do it, what other means would I have to lock the FPS at 30 (not sure how to do it otherwise)?

Also, the weather hasn't changed in 4 1/2 days (clear, wind 5sm), which is great for these kind of conditions but makes we worry once the weather turns bad. Note: I make frequent game saves (about every 12 hours), which I then overwrite. Always worked fine with Sh3. Could this be a potential source for the weather to "get stuck"?

Another thing I noticed is that so far, the FuMB1 I have installed, has also not given any contact reports. I remember from Sh3, that the FuMB systems picked up A/Cs as well as ASWs and dropped the TC to 1 once picking up any signals. How does this work with KSDII?

Thanks again, All!

On FPS... the main way I know of, to set it & lock it in... is as I mentioned in My previous posting... am NOT aware of any other means, though... to be frank about it, doesn't mean that there isn't any other means to do so... just that I am not aware of any other. :yep:


As for weather... is 1 of the crazy things ... :yep:

Whatever the weather status is, when you do a save... is on reload is what the weathers going to be... if it's clear, then on reload of your save... the weather will be clear. I don't honestly think.. the weather is ever going to be like it is in real life... I just deal with whatever the weather is while playing & just deal with it. *shrug*



:doh: :o


:nope: :nope: :nope:


On saves.... NEVER... EVER... overwrite any saves... always do fresh ones... & that should NEVER be done in SH3, either.

Overwriting, has the potential to cause save corruption...





:Kaleun_Salute:


M. M.

[Kapitän]

On FPS... the main way I know of, to set it & lock it in... is as I mentioned in My previous posting... am NOT aware of any other means, though... to be frank about it, doesn't mean that there isn't any other means to do so... just that I am not aware of any other. :yep:


As for weather... is 1 of the crazy things ... :yep:

Whatever the weather status is, when you do a save... is on reload is what the weathers going to be... if it's clear, then on reload of your save... the weather will be clear. I don't honestly think.. the weather is ever going to be like it is in real life... I just deal with whatever the weather is while playing & just deal with it. *shrug*



:doh: :o


:nope: :nope: :nope:


On saves.... NEVER... EVER... overwrite any saves... always do fresh ones... & that should NEVER be done in SH3, either.

Overwriting, has the potential to cause save corruption...





:Kaleun_Salute:


M. M.


Okay, thanks for the advise!

Very clear on the game save topic :up:

Just wondering about the FuMB topic: Does it only pick-up A/C signals or also, ASW vessels?

[Mad Mardigan]

Okay, thanks for the advise!

Very clear on the game save topic :up:

Just wondering about the FuMB topic: Does it only pick-up A/C signals or also, ASW vessels?

On the FuMB... would figure likely, the same as it would in SH3... but... take that opinion with a mega sized convoy of C2 cargo ships loaded down with sea salt, for what its worth department... I could well be wrong... I will freely admit... & if so, I will stand corrected. :shucks:

SH4, is basically... built on the bones of SH3... just with more, newer... bells & whistles tacked on, mig/tig welded on, riveted in... than SH3 was.

As I understand it... the team that was around for 3, were... nowhere to be found when the decision was made to do the release up, on 4... so... the dev's for 4... did the best they could in understanding 3 & well... frankenstein'ed in what makes 4, well... 4.

And, that's the bare bones of My understanding of it all... :hmmm:

Am sure is another, with more... detailed info on how that all went down... & could give a more... in depth detail laden, forensics analysis of it all.





:Kaleun_Salute:


M. M.

[Kapitän]

On the FuMB... would figure likely, the same as it would in SH3... but... take that opinion with a mega sized convoy of C2 cargo ships loaded down with sea salt, for what its worth department... I could well be wrong... I will freely admit... & if so, I will stand corrected. :shucks:

SH4, is basically... built on the bones of SH3... just with more, newer... bells & whistles tacked on, mig/tig welded on, riveted in... than SH3 was.

As I understand it... the team that was around for 3, were... nowhere to be found when the decision was made to do the release up, on 4... so... the dev's for 4... did the best they could in understanding 3 & well... frankenstein'ed in what makes 4, well... 4.

And, that's the bare bones of My understanding of it all... :hmmm:

Am sure is another, with more... detailed info on how that all went down... & could give a more... in depth detail laden, forensics analysis of it all.





:Kaleun_Salute:


M. M.

Many thanks!

My FuMB-1 just now gave it's very first report: Just before submerging, it reported radar contact with two ASW vessels (colored in green).
Kind of interesting, seems to work only intermittently ...

I double-checked the FSP setting via Bandicam by pushing Ctrl+F8, and it does infact set the FSP at the setting selected (in my case 30). So, that seems to work.

[Kapitän]

Many thanks!

My FuMB-1 just now gave it's very first report: Just before submerging, it reported radar contact with two ASW vessels (colored in green).
Kind of interesting, seems to work only intermittently ...

I double-checked the FSP setting via Bandicam by pushing Ctrl+F8, and it does infact set the FSP at the setting selected (in my case 30). So, that seems to work.

Okay, just got my second FuMB-1 report: As before, it reported radar contact with two ASW vessels (colored in green), just after the order to dive has been given.

There are no FuMB reports any other times. I wonder if it doesn't report anything, as long as surface vessels can technically be sighted by line-of-sight ...

[Kapitän]

UPDATE: Just had my first A/C encounter:


Came across a British Task Force in Qu.ER31, 5 November 1942: 1 Aircraft Carrier, 3 Cruisers and 6 Destroyers. Noticed them first by FuMB detection signals (Yes, it actually works!) and then also had visible contact but still not close enough to lock on the target (out of eels anyway ...).


Shortly afterwards, was attacked by a single Swordfish with maching gun fire but no bombs. Took me a while to figuer out how to command the Flak crew to actually fire the gun (I think, they can only respond to one of the commands but not to 2 or 3 at the same time ...).


We finally managed to shoot the A/C down but the Rescue Pilot function doesn't seem to be working ...


Afterwards, I sent a radio message just to check if it would attrack another A/C and/or ASW vessel. And it did: Again, a single Swordfish attacked with machine gun fire but no bombs, and was shot down. Again, the Rescue Pilot function didn't work.


So, gradually making progress in learning the game ...

[propbeanie]

The Rescue Pilot (Survivor) only functions for one of your own pilots, Allied for Allied, Axis for Axis. You really should be able to pick-up POWs, but alas, no.

The swordfish apparently is either defaulted to a "dummy bomb" load-out, or perhaps purposefully set, but it appears to be the former, since the CV was most likely the spawn source of the planes. Also, the swordfish of course, is generally considered a torpedo bomber plane, and maybe the circumstances of the plane's approach did not allow for a launch, or perhaps they launched and you did not see the torpedo. btw, Your crew will NOT report incoming torpedoes. I suppose that never happened in real life :roll: :arrgh!:- probably an oversight on the devs part.

[Kapitän]

The Rescue Pilot (Survivor) only functions for one of your own pilots, Allied for Allied, Axis for Axis. You really should be able to pick-up POWs, but alas, no.

The swordfish apparently is either defaulted to a "dummy bomb" load-out, or perhaps purposefully set, but it appears to be the former, since the CV was most likely the spawn source of the planes. Also, the swordfish of course, is generally considered a torpedo bomber plane, and maybe the circumstances of the plane's approach did not allow for a launch, or perhaps they launched and you did not see the torpedo. btw, Your crew will NOT report incoming torpedoes. I suppose that never happened in real life :roll: :arrgh!:- probably an oversight on the devs part.

Ah, okay, didn't realize that about the Rescue Function. Thanks.

Yes, I would also assume that the Swordfish trook off from the carrier. Naturally, Uboats were historically also attacked by Swordfish carrying DCs. In any case, if that's how the game was developed, than that's the way it is.

[propbeanie]

A person could "clone" the swordfish, name it similarly, and make the default "Loadout" one of depth charges, and then assign that particular swordfish to the CV / CVE also... Have like a Torpedo Bomber "Swordfish", and an ASW "SwordfishASW", both in the AirGroups assigned to the ships... You'd never know what to look for from a swordfish attack, kind of like the Betty in the US Pacific side, where it can have bombs, depth charges or torpedo, with each plane having a unique loadout... It might also be though, that the swordfish(es??) you encountered had already used their explosive weaponry, and only had the machine gun left with ammo to use on your boat. lol :salute:

[Kapitän]

A person could "clone" the swordfish, name it similarly, and make the default "Loadout" one of depth charges, and then assign that particular swordfish to the CV / CVE also... Have like a Torpedo Bomber "Swordfish", and an ASW "SwordfishASW", both in the AirGroups assigned to the ships... You'd never know what to look for from a swordfish attack, kind of like the Betty in the US Pacific side, where it can have bombs, depth charges or torpedo, with each plane having a unique loadout... It might also be though, that the swordfish(es??) you encountered had already used their explosive weaponry, and only had the machine gun left with ammo to use on your boat. lol :salute:

Okay, not sure I'm up to a task like this ... I think, I'll stay with what is and not run the danger of messing up my game files, trying to doctor things ...

[Kapitän]

The Rescue Pilot (Survivor) only functions for one of your own pilots, Allied for Allied, Axis for Axis. You really should be able to pick-up POWs, but alas, no.



So, I checked this again and it explicitly mentions in the F1 Captains Manual, that this function is supposed to allow one to pick up enemy pilots or other surviviors, for which one receives merits upon RTB. Just FYI ;-)

[Kapitän]

Okay, let me try to move this conversation over here:

https://www.subsim.com/radioroom/showthread.php?t=243322&page=94

@Bubblehead1980

and

@propbeanie

So, increased these values in port as mentioned here (Bubblehead1980):

- "Default Air Strike Probability=30>>>I increased it to 90 I believe"
- Enemy Air Strike Probability Increase on Player Detection=50>>>changed this to 95 I believe".

I also increased the airplane range to 1600 km.

I left base on 23 Dec.42 and crossed the Bay of Biscay, again, without any enemy A/C encountered.

Seems really odd to me ...

[Niume]

Try this.
https://www.mediafire.com/file/j1dj8tbsc2q2hqw/Reworked_aircraft_bases_temp_fix.zip/file

[Kapitän]

Try this.


Yes, found it - thanks!


How do I apply, by JSGME or copy&paste the files in the game folder?

[Mad Mardigan]

Yes, found it - thanks!


How do I apply, by JSGME or copy&paste the files in the game folder?

I'd recommend... activation via JSGME. :shucks:






:Kaleun_Salute:


M. M.

[Kapitän]

I'd recommend... activation via JSGME. :shucks:






:Kaleun_Salute:


M. M.


Did it ... let's see ...

[Kapitän]

Try this.
https://www.mediafire.com/file/j1dj8tbsc2q2hqw/Reworked_aircraft_bases_temp_fix.zip/file


Hi Niume,

I installed this via JSGME ... apparently, no change:

Left Bordeaux for my second shake down cruise in late Dec.1942 ... what can I say: ZERO A/C in the Bay of Biscay!

Seems very odd to me and in my estimation, is the #1 item to be looked at for the upcoming new game version.

Many thanks!

[Kapitän]

UPDATE: After 8 days at sea, was attacked twice on 31.12.42, north of Cape Verdes, Qu.89DT, by B27 Liberator:


Each time approached from East at AOB 90°, attacking with machine guns and dropping 1 bomb with each run, which all fell wide.


First plane attacked 4 times and flew off on westerly heading :hmmm:, second plane was shot down by flak after the initial run and fly over.


No damages sustained to boat or crew.


Finally, some planes! However, still odd that there is so few and none over the Bay of Biscay ...

[Kapitän]

Another Update:

Started a career with KSD II, Version 1.4.2. Only thing I changed in the airstrike.cfg, is increased the aircraft range to 1600km.

Left with a VIIC boat from the 11. U-Flotilla on 11 March 1943, and set off from Horten/Oslo to simulate the breakthrough into the North Atlantic with my IXD2 boat, U 115.

What can I say: During transit of the Icland Passage, PLENTY of enemy airplanes! Mainly Sunderlands, Hudsons and a few Wellingtons. Had to crash dive several times, so far so good.

Will transit via Qu.AL to my new base Bordeaux and will report back about crossing the Bay of Biscay ..

[Kapitän]

Another Update:

Started a career with KSD II, Version 1.4.2. Only thing I changed in the airstrike.cfg, is increased the aircraft range to 1600km.

Left with a VIIC boat from the 11. U-Flotilla on 11 March 1943, and set off from Horten/Oslo to simulate the breakthrough into the North Atlantic with my IXD2 boat, U 115.

What can I say: During transit of the Icland Passage, PLENTY of enemy airplanes! Mainly Sunderlands, Hudsons and a few Wellingtons. Had to crash dive several times, so far so good.

Will transit via Qu.AL to my new base Bordeaux and will report back about crossing the Bay of Biscay ..


Okay, I arrived in Bordeaux on 4 April 1943. Did not encounter any enemy A/C in the Bay of Biscay, but that could have been because of the bad weather we had.


Only FuMB Detection we had was from our own escort plane Bf110 patrolling the approach path.


Plan to leave Bordeaux on 3 May 1943 ... should be interesting ...

[Kapitän]

Okay, I arrived in Bordeaux on 4 April 1943. Did not encounter any enemy A/C in the Bay of Biscay, but that could have been because of the bad weather we had.


Only FuMB Detection we had was from our own escort plane Bf110 patrolling the approach path.


Plan to leave Bordeaux on 3 May 1943 ... should be interesting ...

I left Lorient with a IXC boat of the 10th Flotilla on 3 May .... was attacked once by Liberators while under escort in the Bay of Biscay ....

Then, Escort Group with Carrier and A/C in 1577CG and 1752CG ...

Further on, a single Sunderland patroling the area of 58/81/79CF, and then protecting a convoy in 12DH/87CF ...

So, seems to be normal now. However, my question is, could it be possible, that somehow any campaign with a IXD2 boat of the 12th Flotilla in Bordeaux, is somehow "bugged" in a way, that there are less A/C?