What causes this and how to fix (sound)

[Bubblehead1980]

Issue I found in testing but forgot to address in TMO.


The AI Type IX U boat imported from FOTRSU has no audible sound on the hydrophone, the light does not even light up, yet the sound operator can hear and track him. If have map contacts on, the sonar line will show.

Fix? This and some others have the issue.

[KaleunMarco]

Issue I found in testing but forgot to address in TMO.


The AI Type IX U boat imported from FOTRSU has no audible sound on the hydrophone, the light does not even light up, yet the sound operator can hear and track him. If have map contacts on, the sonar line will show.

Fix? This and some others have the issue.

the fix is to stay away from SE Asia where the Type 9 uboat may patrol.

[Bubblehead1980]

the fix is to stay away from SE Asia where the Type 9 uboat may patrol.


lmao. Well, now in TMO have some time in European waters and on US East Coast, kind of difficult to avoid sometimes.

[propbeanie]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YcVLWgwIKn4

See the notes in the vid. I'll try a few things, and do this again. In the meantime, pay attention to the sound of the "motors"... :salute:

[Jeff-Groves]

possible related clues.
https://www.subsim.com/radioroom/showpost.php?p=2760407&postcount=52
https://www.subsim.com/radioroom/showpost.php?p=2595773&postcount=2

CapnScurvy from 7-18-2017
"However, I have had success in getting ships to be heard at low speeds,
by increasing their engine-power rating and fiddling with their "mass" figure to compensate for their increased horsepower. "

More from CapnScurvy.
https://www.subsim.com/radioroom/showpost.php?p=2505237&postcount=5133

[propbeanie]

Some of what KM found there was in FotRSU also, and the engine rpm versus "power" seems to matter. If certain ships fall below roughly 3 knots, they will "disappear" to sonar. The DD disappear at around 12 knots. Roughly 1/3 of a ship's speed, but it is dependent upon the rpm, power, etc in the sim file. But, in this case, I think it's the electric motor sound on a surface vessel, instead of the diesel sound. I'm doing some noodling right now, and might have the test finished in a bit - if I don't fall asleep before hand... lol

Edit: Fourth try now, and I'm still getting the same high-pitched electric engines, trying to push the boat along at 9 knots on the surface, and no diesel sound... the names all look good, the links all look good, the SH.sdl looks good, the actual diesel sound sounds like a diesel... I am overlooking something... sigh. It's too late for my mind to be attempting to function for this... lol :salute:

[Bubblehead1980]

Some of what KM found there was in FotRSU also, and the engine rpm versus "power" seems to matter. If certain ships fall below roughly 3 knots, they will "disappear" to sonar. The DD disappear at around 12 knots. Roughly 1/3 of a ship's speed, but it is dependent upon the rpm, power, etc in the sim file. But, in this case, I think it's the electric motor sound on a surface vessel, instead of the diesel sound. I'm doing some noodling right now, and might have the test finished in a bit - if I don't fall asleep before hand... lol

Edit: Fourth try now, and I'm still getting the same high-pitched electric engines, trying to push the boat along at 9 knots on the surface, and no diesel sound... the names all look good, the links all look good, the SH.sdl looks good, the actual diesel sound sounds like a diesel... I am overlooking something... sigh. It's too late for my mind to be attempting to function for this... lol :salute:


Ugh. This U boat makes no sound on hydrophone. Just torpedoed one, no explosions, just disappeared, no credit for sinking.

[KaleunMarco]

Ugh. This U boat makes no sound on hydrophone. Just torpedoed one, no explosions, just disappeared, no credit for sinking.

that sounds like the Phantom Ship Syndrome....like when you sink a merchie and it respawns and you sink it again and get no credit.

how did the Uboat spawn...i mean under what circumstances did it spawn?

[Bubblehead1980]

that sounds like the Phantom Ship Syndrome....like when you sink a merchie and it respawns and you sink it again and get no credit.

how did the Uboat spawn...i mean under what circumstances did it spawn?



Spawned as part of a ULTRA regarding U boat's rendezvousing, so they were placed in the campaign mission(patrol objective) file. I arrived, two u boats. Fired at both, three torpedoes hit one of them, no boom as expected. Just sat there a minute, then disappeared. No credit for sinking. The other got underway and torpedoes just missed him, although he seemed damaged as was very close to the other. Turned toward me like was going to fire torpedoes , so I went deep

When I came back to periscope depth few hours later, nothing, when surfaced SJ had one pip in exact position where had sunk the U boat. Quite annoying.


This is the AI Type 9 U boat imported from FOTRS. How do we fix this?

[Jeff-Groves]

This is the AI Type 9 U boat imported from FOTRS. How do we fix this?

Maybe start over? That Unit was built by hex editing so any number of things could be wrong with it.

[propbeanie]

The problem with the AI Type IX-D2, is that most other AI subs were created by copying the Type IX-D2, so most likely, ALL the other AI subs in SH4 are borked in this regard. They are set to Type=17 in FotRSU, a surface warship, but thus far, no matter what I have done with the dsd and dat file, it refuses to use any sound other than the electric motors, in spite of the fact that the file is not mentioned or linked directly to in either file... My guess is that there is still something "human-playable" on the boat that is causing the issue... either that or I am missing something simple - which would not surprise me, or s7rikeback either... lol - I am testing all of the AI subs that are in the FotRSU mod, and if we find one with a proper engine sound and sonar lighting, we'll let you know Bubblehead1980! :salute:

[Jeff-Groves]

For 1 thing the sim needs changed from unit Submarine to unit Ship.

That will whack the e-motors.

[Bubblehead1980]

The problem with the AI Type IX-D2, is that most other AI subs were created by copying the Type IX-D2, so most likely, ALL the other AI subs in SH4 are borked in this regard. They are set to Type=17 in FotRSU, a surface warship, but thus far, no matter what I have done with the dsd and dat file, it refuses to use any sound other than the electric motors, in spite of the fact that the file is not mentioned or linked directly to in either file... My guess is that there is still something "human-playable" on the boat that is causing the issue... either that or I am missing something simple - which would not surprise me, or s7rikeback either... lol - I am testing all of the AI subs that are in the FotRSU mod, and if we find one with a proper engine sound and sonar lighting, we'll let you know Bubblehead1980! :salute:



:Kaleun_Salute: Thanks for looking into it:Kaleun_Salute: Sound is a problem of course, should be able to hear it. Whether it keeps the electric motor motor, well would be nice to hear surfaced sub make proper sounds of course but biggest problem is them not blowing up properly/not giving credit for kill lol.

[propbeanie]

For 1 thing the sim needs changed from unit Submarine to unit Ship.

That will whack the e-motors.
That's just it Jeff - it is a "Ship"... lol

https://i.imgur.com/LC0enu4.jpg


:Kaleun_Salute: Thanks for looking into it:Kaleun_Salute: Sound is a problem of course, should be able to hear it. Whether it keeps the electric motor motor, well would be nice to hear surfaced sub make proper sounds of course but biggest problem is them not blowing up properly/not giving credit for kill lol.
Now, the not blowing up and other assorted sundry issues would not be an issue from FotRSU, as witnessed by the video above. I would not know where to begin to look for issues there, but I suspect torpedoes. Could be also, that you punctured the hull with a "dud", and Bernard saw it on the interior side, and tried to push it back out with a hammer... Internal, low-level detonation, and poof, she was gone... ?? lol - I am currently going through the list, top to bottom of the AI subs, and checking for sonar tracking, sound and detonate-ability of the test subjects...

[Jeff-Groves]

I was looking at the 9 in the submarine folder.
:doh:

[Bubblehead1980]

That's just it Jeff - it is a "Ship"... lol

https://i.imgur.com/LC0enu4.jpg



Now, the not blowing up and other assorted sundry issues would not be an issue from FotRSU, as witnessed by the video above. I would not know where to begin to look for issues there, but I suspect torpedoes. Could be also, that you punctured the hull with a "dud", and Bernard saw it on the interior side, and tried to push it back out with a hammer... Internal, low-level detonation, and poof, she was gone... ?? lol - I am currently going through the list, top to bottom of the AI subs, and checking for sonar tracking, sound and detonate-ability of the test subjects...



haha. No, not duds. After current patrol is over will look into it some more. Every other AI sub blows up fine. Could need its HP or armor lowered beyond the standard of the others

Also possible given its Jan 1943 torpedoes ran deep and these were magnetic detonations (external cam was off so not sure) , which would not set off the explosions that a impact into the side does , in many instances. Definitely disappeared, sunk from the three torpedo hits.

The second U Boat that was along side him, it got underway but was damaged from the explosions as was in such close proximity, I fired stern tubes at it but they missed because U Boat disappeared....whether it sunk from damage or reached its last way point and "submerged" aka deleted, not sure. I recall in the mission I made it so if it got underway it would "dive" soon after.

Ah, the work is never done lol.

[propbeanie]

The problem with the AI Type IX-D2...
... either that or I am missing something simple...
It was... Open the dat file, use it to open the dsd file. For the "Label" node in the dsd, you need to properly associate that with the root node of the dat... I don't know what your mod has the IDs at, but select the "12" node in the IX-D2 dat file, and copy the "ID" in the top-middle ( 0x6a3daf232e68e8a3 in FotRSU), and paste that into the "Label" node's "Parent ID" slot. It should then work...

Now, who would-a thunk that would influence things? But like so much else in the computer world... the computer stuff is VERY specific... off by one little iota, and you may as well have missed by a mile... lol

[propbeanie]

The vid (sorry for the size - I'm on a machine that does not have video editing software)

https://youtu.be/K5M9bZCTcUw

Notice that it reverts to its former self after using too much TC throughout... lol

[Jeff-Groves]

:salute:

[Bubblehead1980]

It was... Open the dat file, use it to open the dsd file. For the "Label" node in the dsd, you need to properly associate that with the root node of the dat... I don't know what your mod has the IDs at, but select the "12" node in the IX-D2 dat file, and copy the "ID" in the top-middle ( 0x6a3daf232e68e8a3 in FotRSU), and paste that into the "Label" node's "Parent ID" slot. It should then work...

Now, who would-a thunk that would influence things? But like so much else in the computer world... the computer stuff is VERY specific... off by one little iota, and you may as well have missed by a mile... lol


Thanks prop, will try it out after end of this patrol.:Kaleun_Salute:

[propbeanie]

Thus far, in further testing, I have not found any further engine sound issues, nor sonar tracking trouble, but... it is more than a pinch difficult to sink some of them still... If you attempt to sink a US S-Boat, I emptied the whole bunker on one, then surfaced and did the deck gun for a good while, with over a 95% hit rate at close range, and while the after deck was underwater, the conning tower and bow were not. It also looks like the DMG image might be a pinch off in the bow. Makes me wonder how I was sunk by a circular runner a while back while in an S-Boat...

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NPJTaOJbfso

old video

[Bubblehead1980]

Thus far, in further testing, I have not found any further engine sound issues, nor sonar tracking trouble, but... it is more than a pinch difficult to sink some of them still... If you attempt to sink a US S-Boat, I emptied the whole bunker on one, then surfaced and did the deck gun for a good while, with over a 95% hit rate at close range, and while the after deck was underwater, the conning tower and bow were not. It also looks like the DMG image might be a pinch off in the bow. Makes me wonder how I was sunk by a circular runner a while back while in an S-Boat...

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NPJTaOJbfso

old video



Ouch.

Now, I have to say and I know its a stock legacy issue, its drives me nuts how subs can still function after a torpedo hit lol,. By all accounts of survivors, circle run impact results in immediate flooding and lost of control.


Going off travelers flooding work, I modded the flooding and what not when revamping the damage model in TMO so when take a torpedo hit, even if hull damage does no shoot to 100, you will flood fast and sink, blowing ballast might get to surface but you would sink again before water could be pumped. Problem as you likely no is if make sub vulnerable enough for own torpedoes to have desired effect, does not hold up well as it should to depth charges etc. so I had to choose to have them perform properly under attack from enemy and hope player would stay on honor system if struck by own torpedo.

I had the subs sinking from the surface when had too much flooding as traveler did in his mod, but never could get things balanced properly in TMO. I shelved that aspect of the mod for later in order to move forward.
I know you are aware but man, UBI was really phoning it when comes to many aspects of SH 4, ridiculous lol.

[Bubblehead1980]

It was... Open the dat file, use it to open the dsd file. For the "Label" node in the dsd, you need to properly associate that with the root node of the dat... I don't know what your mod has the IDs at, but select the "12" node in the IX-D2 dat file, and copy the "ID" in the top-middle ( 0x6a3daf232e68e8a3 in FotRSU), and paste that into the "Label" node's "Parent ID" slot. It should then work...

Now, who would-a thunk that would influence things? But like so much else in the computer world... the computer stuff is VERY specific... off by one little iota, and you may as well have missed by a mile... lol


I am a slightly confused....what is the name of the node (since they are numbered differently) . In TMO UBoat9d2.dat Node 12 is " a particle generator for @secondary bubble.

Nodes 106-111 deal with aud engines prop noises:hmmm:

[Jeff-Groves]

Yours will be Node 6

6: Node - AI_Uboat9d2

[propbeanie]

Yours will be Node 6

6: Node - AI_Uboat9d2
Yes. But that is also not the FotRSU AI_UBoat.

The first version you did is this:

https://i.imgur.com/2cGzop9.jpg

https://i.imgur.com/wVZzYkh.jpg

http://i.imgur.com/L69b5X0.jpg

Save the dsd file to a new mod, and see what it does after that. You might have to do like I did with the FotRSU version, and link the SoundSource nodes to the proper nodes in the dat file, so that it does make appropriate sounds. Probably about half the sounds in FotRSU were not linked. Well, they were linked, just not to the U-Boat dat file... lol

My guess is that you probably have similar issues with the zon file at least, and maybe the sim and val also. The zon file is where the collision spheres are, and if those are not linked properly, a torpedo is not detected as colliding, hence no explosion.

[Jeff-Groves]

"select the "12" node in the IX-D2 dat file"

I was talking about the AI uboat in the Sea folder.
That seemed to be the main subject to start.
And now your off on the Other Subs.
:doh:

Get one fixed before you chase others! Jumping around from Unit to Unit is to confuse the possible issues!
You have any idea how many people I've fired because they can't keep thier minds on a project and jump willy nilly?

[propbeanie]

Fixed the FotRSU AI UBoat on the 8th, as above, and have found a seemingly similar issue in the Sen Toku, which is one of kelto01's boats. The former Stock version is not used. The Sen Toku though does show on sonar, in spite of the electric motor sound, instead of a diesel, while the Ko Hyoteki has a diesel sound that shows on sonar, so I am going to try to swap one's funtionality for the other. The Triton and Zwaardvisch both have the same issue as the UBoat did. All others are fine, though several are rather difficult to sink, and the Ko Hyoteki needs some zon file functionality moved down a pinch closer to the water and hull, since we have fire mid-air and in front of its bow after it takes a hit. In the process of going through the repairs list...

Bubble's AI UBoat I looked at is in his v1 of TMO_BH is in the submarine folder, listed as Type=200, so he has a modified TMO version there. It has the same problem. I have not tried the funtionality of his v2, since I do not have the mod loaded yet, and therefore my images of his boat are from v1 of his mod. There is no UBoat in the Sea folder of v1.

[Bubblehead1980]

So I made the changes in TMO AI _Uboat 9d2 and got a CTD when encountered a UBoat. This sim..ugh!

[Bubblehead1980]

Fixed the FotRSU AI UBoat on the 8th, as above, and have found a seemingly similar issue in the Sen Toku, which is one of kelto01's boats. The former Stock version is not used. The Sen Toku though does show on sonar, in spite of the electric motor sound, instead of a diesel, while the Ko Hyoteki has a diesel sound that shows on sonar, so I am going to try to swap one's funtionality for the other. The Triton and Zwaardvisch both have the same issue as the UBoat did. All others are fine, though several are rather difficult to sink, and the Ko Hyoteki needs some zon file functionality moved down a pinch closer to the water and hull, since we have fire mid-air and in front of its bow after it takes a hit. In the process of going through the repairs list...

Bubble's AI UBoat I looked at is in his v1 of TMO_BH is in the submarine folder, listed as Type=200, so he has a modified TMO version there. It has the same problem. I have not tried the funtionality of his v2, since I do not have the mod loaded yet, and therefore my images of his boat are from v1 of his mod. There is no UBoat in the Sea folder of v1.


The AI U boat I am talking about is not a Type 200 in V2.0, its a Type 17 i. Make sure are looking at AI_Uboat9d2 as well. In V1.0 this U boat caused CTD, s7trike fixed this issue. ID conflicts if I recall


Edit: Now when tried to do this again steps, S3D CTD

[propbeanie]

I just looked at your new version Bubbles, and the Label was properly linked, but the ShipSound is not. That needs to be linked to the main node of the sub, just like the Label node, as "6 : Node AI_Uboat9d2". Be sure you copy the correct link, and paste it into the correct "ID Parent" slot. I'll make a little time later this evening and look through the rest of it.

[Bubblehead1980]

I just looked at your new version Bubbles, and the Label was properly linked, but the ShipSound is not. That needs to be linked to the main node of the sub, just like the Label node, as "6 : Node AI_Uboat9d2". Be sure you copy the correct link, and paste it into the correct "ID Parent" slot. I'll make a little time later this evening and look through the rest of it.


Still getting CTD's:o

[propbeanie]

Like Jeff mentioned above, your AI_UBoat had the dsd label set to Submarine, and it has to be "Ship" for the Sea folder. Plus the ShipSound was not properly linked. Check your Discord for a download link, and see if that does it. :salute: