Things I definitely DON'T want in Wolfpack

[THE_MASK]

External views .

[Lost At Sea]

Why not?
I enjoy a good screen-shot now and then !

External views should be an option in the lobby/game settings. Once the mission is launched, the option is not available anymore.

Cheers,
Lost

[abaileyatd]

:Kaleun_Applaud::Kaleun_Applaud::Kaleun_Applaud:

Thank you sober! I totally agree. I think people keep forgetting this isn't SH6... this game intends to immerse you -inside- a submarine. Let Wolfpack be Wolfpack! I could go on, but all I'm gonna say is yes yes yes. I think there is still a great misunderstanding with many people on the goals and ambitions of this particular subsim...

[ceh]

Idea: Enable external views in training/tutorial only, need for screenshots settled.

[ChrisPhoenix]

As OP said, please no external views. Absolutely killing the immersion.

However maybe an option to record and review missions after they are finished. And in review mode maybe you have the option to switch to every camera-perspective including external view and other subs and crew.
Then people can take their precious screenshots and even evaluate their tactics.

That however seems like a lot of work, now that i'm writing it down and may be too much to ask for a two man dev. team.

[Lost At Sea]

I don't understand the hate you guys are expressing for external views !!!!
What do you care about what others do with their view settings :O:

Your missions may block external views for all players joining your lobby (own sub and other subs), but the other lobby set up by that bloke from Johannesburg, South Africa, may have them turned on if he wishes.
How does it kill your precious immersion if you stick to your own words and never ever join his lobby...? :O::06: I'm curious.

Most sims I can think of do have external views as an option. I see no difference with Wolfpack.
As long as settings are clearly indicated in a lobby, it is fine.
Their choice, and your choice to jump in or bug off to your own lobby.

Cheers,
Lost

[abaileyatd]

It's just a direction the sim doesn't need to move in in my opinion. The goal of Wolfpack is to re-create as best as possible the feeling of being inside the submarine, operating it in a somewhat realistic fashion in cooperation with other people. Honestly even the single player bots erodes away at this, however I understand why they've implemented it and in fact welcome this addition... But I do worry that people's demand for this to just be Silent Hunter 6 will dilute the pure aspects that make Wolfpack so great and unique. Remember this is a small independent dev team, with a lot of absolutely necessary things on their plate as it is. Everything they add to the development takes time away from something else. Wolfpack has a specific focus and it should be respected because no other game has ever tackled it in this way, and it doesn't look likely that many more are on the horizon at this time. Just my opinion!

For my single player kicks I still play SH5 TWOS, which is a woefully underrated experience to this day in my opinion... There you can have all the amazing external views you could possibly want, with much more fleshed out external eye candy.

[ceh]

I don't understand the hate you guys are expressing for external views !!!!

I'd venture a guess and say: because it's a 'cheat'.

External views offer a perspective you otherwise wouldn't have, being in a submarine. You can compare it to 3rd person view in shooters.

[Lost At Sea]

Oh well, I do agree External Views are not a priority, probably far down on my wish list. The roadmap is already packed with future goodies.

But why would you dictate how others should play the sim? Posh elitism, nothing else.

Cheers,
Lost

[ceh]

I'm sure that guys (probably safe to assume girls are scarce if not non-existent in our community) that have been around know the deal.

Using a 'cheat', as I described above, makes the game easier to play. This leads to people choosing the easier way to play. This, in turn leads to player base segmentation. Segmentation is bad, since there are two groups of players that are, in a way, incompatible.

So, a posh elitist looks for a lobby to play in, but all he can see are lobbies in easy mode. Been there, done that. Sucks.

Granted, in our case (not requiring 50 people for a game) is not that much of threat, but on the other hand, there aren't thousands of us either.

All in all, it's a slippery slope.

[Elphaba]

I'm sure that guys (probably safe to assume girls are scarce if not non-existent in our community)

Oh really.... yawn.

[blackswan40]

Ho Mighty Neptune forgive them for they know not what they do!!!

ceh have you booked your free eye test at specsavers also we havn't been keeping our hears to the ground of late have we.

Guess who's been modding Wolfpack?

Mod list

Dud Torpedo's
Premature Detonations
Circle Running Torpedos

Flooding the Ballast Tanks When you fire a Torpedo the bow of your Uboat rises so you have to open and close forward balast tank to compansate the torpedo or torpedos fired everytime you fire one same on stern tube on a Type VII
Type II Modeled with only six Torpedos
25 minuets between Torpedo reloads on type II's and VII's

Adds a lot more Depth to Wolfpack no pun intended

Elphaba is to Wolfpack what Mr R.J.Mitchell was to the Spitfire!!!

[derstosstrupp]

Ho Mighty Neptune forgive them for they know not what they do!!!

ceh have you booked your free eye test at specsavers also we havn't been keeping our hears to the ground of late have we.

Guess who's been modding Wolfpack?

Mod list

Dud Torpedo's
Premature Detonations
Circle Running Torpedos

Flooding the Ballast Tanks When you fire a Torpedo the bow of your Uboat rises so you have to open and close forward balast tank to compansate the torpedo or torpedos fired everytime you fire one same on stern tube on a Type VII
Type II Modeled with only six Torpedos
25 minuets between Torpedo reloads on type II's and VII's

Adds a lot more Depth to Wolfpack no pun intended

Elphaba is to Wolfpack what Mr R.J.Mitchell was to the Spitfire!!!

THIS

Come join us at Wolfpack BdU!

[ceh]

Oh really.... yawn.

My apologies, I stand happily corrected :)


Ho Mighty Neptune forgive them for they know not what they do!!!

ceh have you booked your free eye test at specsavers also we havn't been keeping our hears to the ground of late have we.

Guess who's been modding Wolfpack?
[...]
Elphaba is to Wolfpack what Mr R.J.Mitchell was to the Spitfire!!!

Oh -expletive-. :) Not only we do have a lady, but a modder to boot.

Eye exam to be scheduled ASAP, in the meantime I'm heading to the corner to be embarrassed. :oops:

Seriously now - I didn't mean to be rude or anything, it was just an assumption based on probability I guess.

[Skybird]

The taste of some must not be command to others. Leave screenshots yes or no to server administrators setting up the session. And what single players do, must not be a concern to anyone else except - individual single players making their choice themselves.

[JuanLiquid]

I'd like external view only in a previously recorded gameplay (like you can do in IL2 1946)

[abaileyatd]

I don't think there has ever been a more misunderstood subsim than Wolfpack... and I get it, everyone is hungry for more Silent Hunters... but I think the premise and uniqueness of this sim goes way over some people's heads sometimes. What ceh said about difficulty trending towards the lowest common denominator is totally true. This is not at it's heart a single player game, and so the whims of individual players must not -necessarily- be indulged at every turn or you risk ruining what makes Wolfpack so special in the first place. I mean holy moly can't people who want a single player game where you can cheat just play Silent Hunter? I don't get it.

[Lost At Sea]

I'd like external view only in a previously recorded gameplay (like you can do in IL2 1946)

That will fix my need for external views very nicely:), and should hopefully stop other folks who absolutely do not know me from calling me a cheat...:O:
But then some will argue that Prien never had the luxury to review at leisure his attack at Scapa Flow.
This whole affair may not be settled yet.

Cheers,
Lost

[VonHoffman]

Make it an option.

What the devs must be careful not to do is add features that detract from the SIMULATION development aspects that are actually needed.

Camera angles can be added before V1.0 release, when the rest of it is done.

As already said - there are plenty of other sub sims that cover any game requirements. GWX and SH3 is an awesome combo.

[Jonas Grumby]

External views .

I can't wait for external views. Going to be awesome.
You're not allowed to use it when it comes though. Sorry.

[Fidd]

There's no reason - given a considerable dev effort, (and I'm by no means suggesting this is worth such an effort) why external views could not be implemented in such a way as to not ruin the immersion for those who would rather not have their skipper's utilising it in effect a cheat-tool:

One way is to have a playback facility whereby at the end of a mission you can save and then replay a mission, but with external views. Post-mission viewing only would allow those who wish to see external views to co-exist with those who don't want it (with good reason) to exist during the mission..

Another means would be to show, slightly after the event, but within game, significant events, such as done in SH3 iirc.

I am not advocating either - there are plenty of other more pressing priorities for my tuppence-worth - playable escorts - (shameless plug!) but often, with a little thought two apparently utterly conflicting preferences can be worked to be acceptable to both parties, provided that what really bugs people in either camp is defined well.

In this case, those that don't want external views, probably only don't want them as they don't want the experience of having to rely on sound interpretation or "existing" in claustrophobic conditions to be lessened by external views or someone with access to them explaining to the skipper where exactly the escort is that's DC'ing them. By the same token, those that want external views, probably only wish to see, after the fact, what happens from the external POV.

So once those two specific issues are more tightly defined and teased out, they are no longer necessarily mutually-exclusive.

[Sailor Steve]

I don't think there has ever been a more misunderstood subsim than Wolfpack... but I think the premise and uniqueness of this sim goes way over some people's heads sometimes... This is not at it's heart a single player game, and so the whims of individual players must not -necessarily- be indulged at every turn or you risk ruining what makes Wolfpack so special in the first place.
I don't play Wolfpack. I don't want to play Wolfpack. So why am I responding to this line of commentary? I remember years of players complaining that Silent Hunter (any of them) doesn't have a multiplayer component. Several members tried to get me involved, and I had to explain that - except for the possible case of combat flight sims - multiplayer just doesn't appeal to me.

All that said, I can understand why so many like it and pushed for a game like that. They pushed, and got what they wanted. And now that there is a multiplayer sub sim available, people are complaining that multiplayer isn't enough. They want single player elements too. I just don't get it.

[Fidd]

It's quite simple: Single player enables you to learn, practice, make mistakes and correct them without disappointing other players (especially in the captain role) because you make a rookie mistake and get spotted.

Multiplayer is an entirely different experience. With a good crew it's all about good teamwork, accuracy and efficiency in all roles, and much greater situational awareness requirements, especially of the captain. It's also a laugh, as you get to know your ship-mates, so it's a social experience as much as a technical or tactical one.

There's value in both, and indeed the game is much stronger for allowing players to do either as they please.. imho of course.