Snorkel deployment

[Randomizer]

I quite enjoy SH3 in the late was, trying to survive and achieve something resembling a score in mid to late 1944 using a VIIC. This is difficult in GWX3 but more difficult in NYGM, which may come as no surprise.

One issue is that in GWX3 it takes less than 2-minutes to raise the snort and start the diesels. However in NYGM it takes typically takes more than 3-minutes just to raise/lower the mast. Particularly when surprised by aircraft, this can be deadly since I suspect that the retracting snorkel mast is more vulnerable to damage.

There is some film footage on the Internet of VIIs and IXs extending and retracting their masts and from these snippets of data it would seem that GWX3 is closer than NYGM for extension/retraction times but the sample size is small.

I checked the snorkel entries for the boats in their respective NSS_UboatXXXX.cfg files and they appear identical so I cannot determine where the extension/retraction parameters live.

Does anybody know how to edit the appropriate file to reduce the time in NYGM. Thanks in advance.

-C

[Randomizer]

Over 180-views and no help. Disappointed but not really surprised.

-C

[propbeanie]

Have you looked at the Data / Library / Sensor.dat & sim files?

[Randomizer]

Have you looked at the Data / Library / Sensor.dat & sim files?
Thanks for the response, in a million years I would not have looked in the sensor.sim file for snorkel parameters. There are nine entries there for the snorkel extension and changing the values in all of them from 180 to 15 produces no changes in the extension time in the game. The extension values in GWX3 are 10 but why changes made to the NYGM file produce no results is unknown to me. There does not appear to be any snorkel entries in the sensors.dat file so no joy there.

I'm missing something...

-C

[propbeanie]

Have you looked in the H.sie options?

Those file names are for Stock. NYGM might use something different. The dat file is the 3D model, with nodes that are "linked" to the parameters in the sim file by the "Parent ID" listing at the top of a particular node's page. So if you open Sensors.sim with S3D, and look at the "12: Obj_snorkel" node, you'll see near the top of the page it's "ID: 0x9bbc018fa140ee32" and its "Parent ID: 0xac5f9baa2a26e0ce", which you'll not find the Parent ID in the sim file - at least, you shouldn't... But copy that Parent ID, open the Sensors.dat file, use "Edit", "Find", and paste that hex number Parent ID into the "Find what" box, press "Find next", and you should have "Node:170 - NSS_Uboattype7_SNK" highlighted (in Stock). Click on the "Model Preview" link, click the screen, zoom-in, and press the video camera icon just about the view window, and there's the snorkel and cover for the Type 7 centered in the window...

Download something like Notepad++, and use its "Search in files" function, and "target" *.sim files in the SH3 Data folder, including sub-folders. Use the submarine's eqp file to find the LinkName and use that for the search term. You can find all kinds of interesting stuff like that... Things like a snorkel or a gun are usually (not always) in the Library folder. :salute:

[Randomizer]

Cannot find snorkel extension/retraction times as an option in H.sie's option selector or hsie.ini file.

I have been working in NYGM with S3D and it's beginning to look like the effort required will not be worth the results particularly since my WAC, LSH, CCoM and GWX3 (and presumably Stock) installations all use the 10-second extension/retraction time.

Too bad that the NYGM team did so much work preparing the theatre for the 1944-45 Inshore Campaign and then made it nearly impossible to use because of the snorkel extension issue. While 10-seconds is quite probably too short, 180 seconds seems almost certainly too long based on the available visual evidence.

Anyway, thank you for the help, will probably continue to tinker with the issue since I already have Notepad++ although am still not comfortable using it. That said have copied your post into Notepad as an editing guide.

-C

[propbeanie]

Oh no! You've been bitten! You are in for what remains of your lifetime, doing tweaking of cfg and ini files in Silent Hunter... :arrgh!: You'll be needing 7zip and an upload account within the year! :salute:

[Hebe Vollmaus]

Thanks for the response, in a million years I would not have looked in the sensor.sim file for snorkel parameters.

You may learn how to search for things in youre SH3-installation.
Sometimes i use "SearchMyFiles" to find things, but especialy for SH3 i cannot really recommend it, since it can produce some of 'false positives'. Anyway, a search for "snorkel,time" in SH3/data for "multiple values" can find 10 files. And only 1 file when restrict the search to SH3/data/Library.

There are nine entries there for the snorkel extension and changing the values in all of them from 180 to 15 produces no changes in the extension time in the game. The extension values in GWX3 are 10 but why changes made to the NYGM file produce no results is unknown to me. There does not appear to be any snorkel entries in the sensors.dat file so no joy there.

I'm missing something...No. In NYGM 2017 i can only find 3 entries for Snorkel in Sensors.sim.
And change the entries from 180 to 30 works (i only tested 7b) as it should.

Greetings.

[Randomizer]

No. In NYGM 2017 i can only find 3 entries for Snorkel in Sensors.sim.
And change the entries from 180 to 30 works (i only tested 7b) as it should.
The FuMB37 mod adds lines 34,36,38,40,42 and 44 to the sensors.sim file. and editing all entries does not affect the extension time with the mod activated. Will disable the mod and check back.

-C

[Randomizer]

Anyway, a search for "snorkel,time" in SH3/data for "multiple values" can find 10 files. And only 1 file when restrict the search to SH3/data/Library.

This search turned up a whack of *.ogg files for the sound effects and nothing useful. Cannot find any relevant entries for snorkel times in the sensor.dat file.

Disabled the FuMB37 mod and edited the three snorkel entries in the sensor.sim to 30-seconds. No luck, the snorkel still takes 3-minutes to extend.

Rolled back the mods to NYGM3_6F and edited the sensors.sim file in that update 30-seconds. Reactivated the mods in use.

NYGM Mod list in use, other than the snorkel issue no problems noted so far after 5-complete 1940-41 patrols.

NYGM Tonnage War V2.5 – Stand Alone Version
NYGM3_New
NYGM3_6F* (Note)
NYGM 2017A
Supplement to V16B1 (JSGME)
Stiebler4C_Addon_for_V16B1
IABLShipsforNYGM_New
Anvart_Stiebler_TurmsR01R02
Kiel_Locks_NYGM
Single Merchant Contact Mod
depth charge noise - Rev A - NYGM
Harbor Traffic Add-In
NYGM Tonnage War Minefield Mod
1500 meter bearing overlay
3rd Flotilla Mod
Enhanced Nav Map Plotting Tools
Functional Draggable Chrono for NYGM

(Note) None of the Mods below here change the sensor.sim file.

No biggie, I just won't use NYGM for late war careers.

-C

[ThePrody]

i started a campaign in both NYGM and GWX with a type VII and a type IX in 1944 and the snorkel lower/raise time is 12-15 secs in NYGM and 25-30 secs in GWX, i dont understand how you get those big values .

[Randomizer]

i started a campaign in both NYGM and GWX with a type VII and a type IX in 1944 and the snorkel lower/raise time is 12-15 secs in NYGM and 25-30 secs in GWX, i dont understand how you get those big values .
With the stopwatches provided in the game...

-C

[Hebe Vollmaus]

The FuMB37 mod adds lines 34,36,38,40,42 and 44 to the sensors.sim file. and editing all entries does not affect the extension time with the mod activated. Will disable the mod and check back.


The same with FuMB37-mod, change 180 to 30 in Sensors.sim works. Test with 7b and 9b. No problem.

Greetings.

[Randomizer]

The same with FuMB37-mod, change 180 to 30 in Sensors.sim works. Test with 7b and 9b. No problem.

Just to repeat, I have done exactly this but for some reason, it is NOT WORKING in my NYGM installation. Am trying to figure out WHY and am getting nowhere. And there's the issue that almost none of the Type VIIB and Type IXB were equipped with snorkels AND used them on operations. Try with VIIC or IXC and let me know how you make out.

-C

[propbeanie]

One thing to remember is that some edits in the game do not take until the start of the next patrol. Others do not take effect until the next Career is started. Since you are trying to change the sub, it's probably the career...

[Randomizer]

One thing to remember is that some edits in the game do not take until the start of the next patrol. Others do not take effect until the next Career is started. Since you are trying to change the sub, it's probably the career...
Nope, new careers all. Have not tried a XXI in NYGM though but I get the 180 second extension in all of the VII's and IX's in spite of using SH3 Editor on the sensors.sim file and cannot find another file that defines the extension time.

The loading times using NYGM are short enough that testing new careers does not consume too much time.

Others are having different results, fair ball but I have posted my NYGM mod-soup and nobody has posted where I may be in error or provided info on related files that may need editing.

It would be ungracious not to acknowledge input received so far, so thanks.

-C

[Hebe Vollmaus]

Just to repeat, I have done exactly this but for some reason, it is NOT WORKING in my NYGM installation. Am trying to figure out WHY and am getting nowhere. And there's the issue that almost none of the Type VIIB and Type IXB were equipped with snorkels AND used them on operations. Try with VIIC or IXC and let me know how you make out.

Answering your request is easy, but will not change anything. Funny, isnt it?
Start new Campaign, Year 44, 1st Flottille, Brest. I get 7c.
Start new Campaign, Year 44, 2nd Flottille, Lorient. I get 9c.
With my modified FuMB37 Sensors.sim from 180 to 30 both boats will drive out my Snorkel in 30 seconds.

So i know, this info alone will not help you much. Let me assemble some facts together. Your changeings does not work. My changings work. You have not provided your Operating-System. You have not provided youre Install-drawer. To me it looks like you have an install in something like a 'windows protected storage folder' or a 'copy protected' download install. This can be "Windows/Programs" or "ProgramsX86" ore something like that. In this drawers installed programs and games will work. But Windows (or the Download-Tool) may prevent any modifications which is very bad for Mods. This is known, and tips about that will pop up here (mostly) on a week-basis.
Changing the Snorkel-Loadout-Time in NYGM is Sensors.sim for Types 7 and 9. Type 21 has its own *sim in Submarine-folder, but is not related here, since it always has 10 seconds.
Another often discussed procedure to find bad things is deactivate all Mods, and activate one at a time to test.

Normal i do not use NYGM, i have my own install, which is a mixture of many Mods out there that fit my needs but based on GWX 1.3/2.0 and heavy modified.
For things like this here i use only the core NYGM files without any 'Add-On'-mods which is exactly as youre Mod-Soup breaked after "NYGM 2017A". It looks like this:

Generic Mod Enabler - v2.6.0.157
[E:\SilentHunterIII\MODS]

SH3_14b_4FPS_4GB
xNYGM_36F_2017A_myMerge
xNYGM_mySH3TooL_Korrekt
xNYGM_mySH3TooL_Korrekt_Campaign
Missions_myTEST-Missions_SH3
xNYGM_FuMB37
xNYGM_FuMB37_Snorkel30
ag_FileManager-Ini-Comment-Crash


Let me say one last word to youre *ogg-file-findings.
For me this looks like you have a very bad installation, or you have not used SearchMyFiles. This is a standalone Freeware-Tool.
With this Tool i find (on the above JSGME-Modlist) on my SH3-install these 10 files:
Zones.cfg
messages_en.txt
Basic.cfg
Commands_de.cfg
Commands_en.cfg
Sensors.sim
en_help.txt
en_menu.txt
NSS_Uboat21.sim
NSS_Uboat23.sim


And restricted search to Library:
Sensors.sim


Hope this helps.
Greetings.

[Randomizer]

Hope this helps.
Greetings.
It doesn't but thanks anyway. I'm done.

-C

[Randomizer]

I had created a copy of the original file and then renamed the original Sensors.sim file to Z_ORG_Sensors.sim and left it in the Library folder. The problem was that the program was not loading the edited Sensors.sim file but was continuing to load the now renamed, stock file.

For one who does not write code and has no formal training in programming or computer language this seems completely counter-intuitive but I did multiple tests to confirm that this is exactly why snorkel extension time remained 180-seconds after editing the Sensors.sim file extension values. One hypothesis is that the program loads top down by file extension rather than by file name and the stock Z_ORG_Sensors.sim file loaded after the edited Sensors.sim file and over-wrote the edited values but I do not intend to explore this further.

The solution was simply to move the stock, renamed file to a different folder and the extension time becomes the desired 30-seconds as the game reads the correct file. Changing the file extension for the original from Sensors.sim to Sensors.xxx rather than renaming it also works.

So NYGM snorkel extension time is now the desired 30-seconds and I can begin a late war Inshore Campaign patrol. If somebody can explain why renaming the file had no effect I would welcome some enlightenment. It seems odd that the program would not read the edited Sensors.sim and instead default to the renamed original file but that's what happens.

Lesson learned = save original files in a new location and away from the folder where they had previously lived.

Thanks again to Propbeanie for pointing me to the Sensors.sim file as a starting point.

-C

[propbeanie]

The game seems to load all files in all folders, which is another reason why making a mod for your edits is preferable. The behavior you noticed, with the game loading a custom-named file is something that can be used to advantage. It would be better to rename the file extension, such that you would have "sensors.sim.bak" or something similar, but I don't trust the game to do that correctly either... :O: btw, you are welcome, and I thank you for thanking me... :roll: :salute:

[John Pancoast]

This search turned up a whack of *.ogg files for the sound effects and nothing useful. Cannot find any relevant entries for snorkel times in the sensor.dat file.

Disabled the FuMB37 mod and edited the three snorkel entries in the sensor.sim to 30-seconds. No luck, the snorkel still takes 3-minutes to extend.

Rolled back the mods to NYGM3_6F and edited the sensors.sim file in that update 30-seconds. Reactivated the mods in use.

NYGM Mod list in use, other than the snorkel issue no problems noted so far after 5-complete 1940-41 patrols.

NYGM Tonnage War V2.5 – Stand Alone Version
NYGM3_New
NYGM3_6F* (Note)
NYGM 2017A
Supplement to V16B1 (JSGME)
Stiebler4C_Addon_for_V16B1
IABLShipsforNYGM_New
Anvart_Stiebler_TurmsR01R02
Kiel_Locks_NYGM
Single Merchant Contact Mod
depth charge noise - Rev A - NYGM
Harbor Traffic Add-In
NYGM Tonnage War Minefield Mod
1500 meter bearing overlay
3rd Flotilla Mod
Enhanced Nav Map Plotting Tools
Functional Draggable Chrono for NYGM

(Note) None of the Mods below here change the sensor.sim file.

No biggie, I just won't use NYGM for late war careers.

-C




Just in case the op ever returns to this thread;


The Anvart_Stiebler_TurmsR01R02 isn't needed with NYGM; already part of NYGM.


Maybe that's part of the problem you're having.

[Randomizer]

Thanks but in post #19 I made it clear that the issue was solved.

-C

[John Pancoast]

Thanks but in post #19 I made it clear that the issue was solved.

-C




Oops. Now you know why I failed detective school.....

[Randomizer]

No problem. I too will miss some blinding glimpses of the obvious but wright it off to age and too many brain cells sacrificed to too many beer over the years.

Actually I needed the Anvart-et-al turms mod to get the FuMB-30 radar antenna to work on the late-war Type VIIC in NYGM. No idea why.

-C