wrong labels everywhere [Archive] - SUBSIM Radio Room Forums

Badileus

12-26-18, 11:25 AM

Hi,

ok this may be an old (stock) bug and for most people certainly an absolute minor problem. I tried to ignore it but it still annoys me a lot: You all know perhaps the little black plates on gauges and machines, they are all over the place from bow to stern and all labeled wrong with terms of the TDC like "Schußwinkel", "Schiffspeilung", "Gegnerlage" (gyro angle, target bearing, angle of bow) etc., some of them even upside down...

I have TWoS installed and there are interior mods with changed a bit in comparison to the stock version, all great work of course, but this bug remained. My question: Is there a (modding) specialist among you, who can tell me if it is possible (and how) to change these labels or at least remove them completely? Or if there is a reason why it can´t be changed?

I wouldt be a big relief for me, not to have to see these absurd plates anymore!

Thanks a lot!

gap

12-26-18, 12:53 PM

Hi Badileus,

if you want those labels fixed, maybe you can do a little inventory of them, specifying for each label: the Uboat compartment where it is found, the device it is placed on, its current (wrong) lettering and the correct term that we should use instead. For gauges not immediately visible, a screenshot might also be useful.

Hopefully, with this information, fixing the wrong labels shouldn't be too difficult :salute:

Fifi

12-26-18, 01:02 PM

Perso, i would like to see them removed .... because with my Nvidia card, those labels are often flickering when not too close of them :yep:

Badileus

12-30-18, 02:09 PM

Here now some screenshots, where i have marked the wrong labels with a red cross. I made suggestions for the correct labeling, if possible. The terms for that i have taken from pictures and videos of the U-995 here in germany, as far as i couldt recognise them (from the web, i had no time to visit it myself lately).
Perhaps you can tell me if it is possible to change, delete or just blacken the labels individually. And if that wouldt be compatible with TWoS.

Here are the pictures, 2 from the e-machine-room, the rest are located in the command room (Zentrale):
(I just see in the "posting rules", that i "may not post attachments". What does that mean? For now, i just insert the links...)

https://www.dropbox.com/s/thfnzg0fl4ll4i7/emachine%20left.jpg?dl=0

https://www.dropbox.com/s/faudgzjb7b87c9b/emachine%20right.jpg?dl=0

https://www.dropbox.com/s/sbatuaqxugx7h90/Zentrale1.jpg?dl=0

https://www.dropbox.com/s/yqd9xkag0bi01c6/Zentrale2.jpg?dl=0

https://www.dropbox.com/s/jxfe972mqmmp2xj/Zentrale3.jpg?dl=0

https://www.dropbox.com/s/4agm0yzzh65qilh/Zentrale4.jpg?dl=0

https://www.dropbox.com/s/7rurkht8aknf8ar/Zentrale5.jpg?dl=0

https://www.dropbox.com/s/thfnzg0fl4ll4i7/emachine%20left.jpg?dl=0
https://www.dropbox.com/s/faudgzjb7b87c9b/emachine%20right.jpg?dl=0
https://www.dropbox.com/s/sbatuaqxugx7h90/Zentrale1.jpg?dl=0https://www.dropbox.com/s/thfnzg0fl4ll4i7/emachine%20left.jpg?dl=0
https://www.dropbox.com/s/yqd9xkag0bi01c6/Zentrale2.jpg?dl=0
https://www.dropbox.com/s/jxfe972mqmmp2xj/Zentrale3.jpg?dl=0
https://www.dropbox.com/s/4agm0yzzh65qilh/Zentrale4.jpg?dl=0
https://www.dropbox.com/s/7rurkht8aknf8ar/Zentrale5.jpg?dl=0

gap

12-31-18, 10:34 AM

Here now some screenshots, where i have marked the wrong labels with a red cross. I made suggestions for the correct labeling, if possible. The terms for that i have taken from pictures and videos of the U-995 here in germany, as far as i couldt recognise them (from the web, i had no time to visit it myself lately).
Perhaps you can tell me if it is possible to change, delete or just blacken the labels individually. And if that wouldt be compatible with TWoS.

Well done Badileus. I had no time to check them all, but most if not all the labels found in the rooms that you have pointed out, have their textures in CR9C_2.dds. Granted that the same labels are not used multiple times in different places, one could simply change the lettering of each label directly on that texture. Otherwise, changing the UV mapping of wrong labels (so that they use another texture), or removing the redundant ones, shouldn't be too complicated.

Compatibility with TWoS shouldn't be an issue either. In one of the next days I could deal with that, but you should send me the following files from your SH5/TWoS install:

data\Textures\TNormal\tex\CR9C_2.dds
data\Submarine\Common\Rooms\Room_CR.GR2
data\Submarine\NSS_Uboat7a\NSS_Uboat7a.TRA.GR2
data\Submarine\NSS_Uboat7c\NSS_Uboat7c.TRA.GR2

:salute:

Badileus

12-31-18, 04:38 PM

Thank you for your time! I will send you the files. If I understand it right, the dds-file is the (only?) source for the plates-textures, and in the GR2-files they are placed at different locations in the room (CR = Control Room?).

But it seems to me that these plates were originally intended for the TDC in the tower (next to the attack periscope), where they are used correctly now. I think the devs used the same plates then for the whole boat, to save work and thinking, nobody will notice it (at least not english-speaking people...).

So if the plates in the dds-file as they are now are changed, will this not affect the TDC plates in the tower also? Or is it possible to add more labeled plate-textures in the dds-file, to have a greater "pool" of labels to choose from?

gap

01-01-19, 07:18 AM

Thank you for your time! I will send you the files.

Files received :up:

If I understand it right, the dds-file is the (only?) source for the plates-textures

After a first inspection, it seems so.

...and in the GR2-files they are placed at different locations in the room (CR = Control Room?).

But it seems to me that these plates were originally intended for the TDC in the tower (next to the attack periscope), where they are used correctly now. I think the devs used the same plates then for the whole boat, to save work and thinking, nobody will notice it (at least not english-speaking people...).

This is my suspect too. It should be noted that there are some discrepancies between the stock CR9C_2.dds file and the copy included in TWoS:

stock:
https://i.imgur.com/XI1H6hs.png

TWoS:
https://i.imgur.com/jDpQ8ZN.png

Unfortunately I don't speak German, but it is possible that who edited that file (probably SteelViking), in fixing the labels for the TDC/conning tower, messed them up for other devices/compartments.

So if the plates in the dds-file as they are now are changed, will this not affect the TDC plates in the tower also?

If we simply edit the texture, they probably would.

Or is it possible to add more labeled plate-textures in the dds-file, to have a greater "pool" of labels to choose from?

This is exactly my idea. The model editor that we have now (TDW's GR2 Editor / Viewer) is not 100% functional, and depending on the file to be edited some of its features might not work, but in theory it should be possible making the labels to use another portion of the same texture, or even tu use a different texture. :yep:

Fifi

01-01-19, 11:50 AM

Hi Gap,

Is it possible to change their texture so they will not flicker with Nvidia cards? :06:

gap

01-01-19, 06:28 PM

Hi Gap,

Is it possible to change their texture so they will not flicker with Nvidia cards? :06:

I am currently running the game on a laptop with an NVidia card; in my SH5 install I have several visual glitches and flickerings, but I didn't notice any flickering labels.

That said, the problem you are experiencing might depend on the combination of several factors, such as GFX card, driver version, graphic settings AND some surfaces being too close to each other. In theory we could move those labels slightly away from the devices they are attached to, but doing that for all of them would be a little PITA. :O:

Are all the labels equally affected by the flickering?

Fifi

01-02-19, 03:32 AM

gap

01-02-19, 09:33 AM

Yes they are all equally affected.

I recently changed my PC with a new graphic card wich is Nvidia GTX 1050 TI (my old one was ZOTAC 580) and i have exact same visual glitches as before.

Of course i can live with them as i did for years now...
I have a flickering on the hydrophone round button left low side (not always - this button doesn’t have any fonction btw)
In the radio room beside the gramophone, there is a square panel that flicker too (not always)
All the labels mentioned in this thread are flickering in the command room (always)
When I choose a side emblem, looking with external camera it flickers often (a lot less with my new card)
And last glitche, looking up the sky I have strange triangular artefacts flashing very often.
With my old card, I had sometimes smoke bubbles glitches on the sea when close to other boats, but didn’t see it so far with new card…

Thanks to Nvidia for those additional visual effects! :haha:

Ps: I have latest drivers (Nvidia 417.35)

I have a GTX 850M, not exactly the top of the line and much older / lesser performing than your card. I used to have many of the visual glitches that you have mentioned, including the weird triangular artifacts that you have described (for me they appeared between sky and land IIRC); lately most of them have disappeared though I cannot say if it was a new driver or a change in graphic settings that (accidentally) solved or subdued them. The one glitches I still have, is terrain textures flickering in free camera view, when seen from a certain height, especially when the weather is cloudy and the borders of textures with an opacity layer applied (trees, some flags, etc.) becoming visible at times. If you want, I can send you a screenshot of my Nvidia Control Panel graphic settings, in case they can help you tracking down the flickering labels problem :salute:

CaptJulius

01-02-19, 01:19 PM

Hi Gap,

Is it possible to change their texture so they will not flicker with Nvidia cards? :06:

I often experience flickering on ships

gap

01-02-19, 07:16 PM

I often experience flickering on ships

True, that's something I always had, even when I was playing the game on a PC with an ATI card. I think this glitch is not in stock game, but it was introduced with some camera settings included in NewUI's (part of TWoS) :hmm2:

gap

01-04-19, 07:13 PM

Fifi

01-05-19, 03:04 AM

I often experience flickering on ships

Yep, i forgot this too... but with my new card it seems calm down a bit.
At least it’s not always as before.

Badileus

01-05-19, 01:36 PM

@ Badileus:

before I start messing with textures and labels, can you make sure that some of the original labels replaced in TWoS by other labels (see my post #7), aren't more appropriate for CR/EER devices?

Unfortunately almost none of all these labels (in file CR9C2.dds; original and TWoS) are usable in any other place than the TDC, for which they are apparently created. If it is any help, here is a picture of the TDC with the corresponding german terms (I couldt not make out the meaning of every gauge though).

https://imgur.com/OAAb7EP

So, for example, every time i am in the EER and look at the gauges left and right, i see them all lableled with "Streuwinkel" (=spread angle), two with "Entfernung" (=range), and this of course is silly and i can´t get used to it. To make things not too complicated, for the EER perhaps it wouldt be enough to change these to plates with the term "Spannungsregler" (voltage regulator) and "Schaltautomat" (switching automat). Much more sense.

I found, that the file CR8C2.dds contains exactly these plates of the EER. If they are not needed elsewhere, they can be simply changed then, right? So, "Streuwinkel" -> "Spannungsregler" and "Entfernung" -> "Schaltautomat". There are two brighter plates labeled "Leistung". They shouldt be labeled with "Amp-Meter" and "Volt-Meter". But how to put them to the corresponding gauges (the 2 different scales: for Ampere and Volt)?

By the way, i noticed that some of the plates (CR9C2.dds, TWoS-Version) are nowhere correctly used, as far as i can see. Perhaps i missed something. These are:

"Frequenzbereich"
"Frequenzabgleich"
"Entfernungsskala"
"Abfragen/Einstellen"
"Null Stellen"

and "Schiffspeilung" is there twice . Perhaps they can be changed and used elsewhere.

I noticed, that there are some other (bigger) plates on some devices, such as "Heizungs- und Teleskopbeleuchtung" in the CR. Don´t know if this one is correctly placed and where the source is. Is it perhaps possible to change the graphics of some devices and "paint" labeled plates on them, so that they are fixed and individual?

Badileus

01-09-19, 04:24 PM

I tried to change the black plates in the E-Engineroom (in the file CR8C_2.dds), and it seems to work! If i get no further problems, at least i am satisfied with the EER now (not tried changing the "Leistung"-plates yet). But better than nothing...

Can anyone perhaps tell me the optimal editing method for dds-files in SH5? I used Photoshop Elements 10 with a dds-plugin, but I am not sure if i have loaded and saved the file correctly. Here an image of my loading- and saving-dialogs.

https://imgur.com/a/FZftgru

Thanks!

gap

01-10-19, 01:56 PM

Hi Badileus and sorry for my late replies. Please find them below :)

I found, that the file CR8C2.dds contains exactly these plates of the EER. If they are not needed elsewhere, they can be simply changed then, right? So, "Streuwinkel" -> "Spannungsregler" and "Entfernung" -> "Schaltautomat". There are two brighter plates labeled "Leistung". They shouldt be labeled with "Amp-Meter" and "Volt-Meter". But how to put them to the corresponding gauges (the 2 different scales: for Ampere and Volt)?

CR8C2.dds is not among the stock files, and I doubt that it is actually used in TWoS. It was probably created by the author of the interior mod included in TWoS, in hope that one day someone could import it in game: at that time there was no GR2 Editor at all.

Now we can do that, at least in theory :yep:

Can you send me that texture too?

By the way, i noticed that some of the plates (CR9C2.dds, TWoS-Version) are nowhere correctly used, as far as i can see. Perhaps i missed something. These are:

"Frequenzbereich"
"Frequenzabgleich"
"Entfernungsskala"
"Abfragen/Einstellen"
"Null Stellen"

and "Schiffspeilung" is there twice . Perhaps they can be changed and used elsewhere.

Sure they can :up:

I noticed, that there are some other (bigger) plates on some devices, such as "Heizungs- und Teleskopbeleuchtung" in the CR. Don´t know if this one is correctly placed and where the source is. Is it perhaps possible to change the graphics of some devices and "paint" labeled plates on them, so that they are fixed and individual?

Not sure what you mean here. Could you please illustrate your question with a screenshot?

I tried to change the black plates in the E-Engineroom (in the file CR8C_2.dds), and it seems to work! If i get no further problems, at least i am satisfied with the EER now (not tried changing the "Leistung"-plates yet). But better than nothing...

Well done!

Can anyone perhaps tell me the optimal editing method for dds-files in SH5? I used Photoshop Elements 10 with a dds-plugin, but I am not sure if i have loaded and saved the file correctly. Here an image of my loading- and saving-dialogs.

You should check the 'Generate MIP maps' radio button and save as DXT5 (interpolated alpha). My suggestion is to redo your changes on a clean copy of the file, because with your current save settings, the alpha channel (used as specular mask) was lost.

Badileus

01-11-19, 07:12 AM

Hi gap,

thanks for your reply. Here is the other dds-file:

https://www.dropbox.com/s/pxyzpos1as29bog/CR8C_2.dds?dl=0

With the "other plates" i mean these (for example), they seem to be individual plates:

https://imgur.com/a/spXpLxn

I followed your advice and saved the dds as you said, but when saving i got the message "image width and height must be multiple of four". Indeed the dds-files have all the width of 2047. I boldly changed it to 2048, but then in the game i get this:

https://imgur.com/a/zQfKPpd

So the area the game takes for the plates from the file is now double the width as before. I used a clean copy of the file. Are you sure with choosing "Generating MIP-Maps" and not "Using existing MIP-Maps"? I am not an expert in this, certainly you know what i did wrong...

gap

01-11-19, 11:23 AM

thanks for your reply. Here is the other dds-file:

https://www.dropbox.com/s/pxyzpos1as29bog/CR8C_2.dds?dl=0

I got the file, thank you too :up:

With the "other plates" i mean these (for example), they seem to be individual plates:

https://imgur.com/a/spXpLxn

In which room?

I followed your advice and saved the dds as you said, but when saving i got the message "image width and height must be multiple of four". Indeed the dds-files have all the width of 2047. I boldly changed it to 2048, but then in the game i get this:

https://imgur.com/a/zQfKPpd

So the area the game takes for the plates from the file is now double the width as before. I used a clean copy of the file. Are you sure with choosing "Generating MIP-Maps" and not "Using existing MIP-Maps"? I am not an expert in this, certainly you know what i did wrong...

Stock CR9C2.dds is 512 x 512. The textures you sent me double this resolution to 1024 x 1024. Where is this 2047-pixel width coming from? :hmmm:

You can resize game textures, but you need to keep the same width/height ratio as in stock textures (or redo the UV mapping of the objects using those textures). Moreover, if you want to save the resized textures as signed DDS images, both width and height must be multiple of four. This is because the DDS compression uses groups of 4x4 pixel as compression unit.
Mipmaps are a series of pre-rendered copies of the main texture with progressively lower resolutions. They are useful in 3D imaging because they relieve the GPU from having to resample the textures in real time, when (during gameplay) the said texture is seen from a distance. If a texture is edited, it is a good rule to recalculate its MIP levels before saving, otherwise what you see at close and far distance won't match each other :03:

Badileus

01-11-19, 01:18 PM

This device is in the CR, to the left of the depth gauges and diving plane control.

When i open a dds-file with my photoshop plugin (choosing "default size" and "load MIP-Maps"), i get this:

https://imgur.com/a/VAuGO58

I thought it is normal, so that the textures for the different distances can be changed. And how many bpp shouldt it have? Here it has 8 bpp, but when i open it with IrfanView it tells me 24 or 32 bpp. I am a bit confused...

gap

01-11-19, 01:41 PM

This device is in the CR, to the left of the depth gauges and diving plane control.

Okay, found them. Their labels are in Uboat7_CT.dds :up:

When i open a dds-file with my photoshop plugin (choosing "default size" and "load MIP-Maps"), i get this:

https://imgur.com/a/VAuGO58

I thought it is normal, so that the textures for the different distances can be changed. And how many bpp shouldt it have? Here it has 8 bpp, but when i open it with IrfanView it tells me 24 or 32 bpp. I am a bit confused...

Okay. Before a dds file is loaded, you should be prompted with a loading option menu. You should uncheck the option 'load MIP maps', and when you save, choose to (re)generate them. In this way, whatever change you have done to the texture, its MIP maps will be always updated with your changes :03:

Badileus

01-12-19, 07:59 AM

Thanks gap, I think I got the meaning of MIP-Maps now. It works now. Perhaps I try to play around a bit with TDW´s GR2-Editor, is there a good tutorial for beginners? But maybe this is too advanced for me...

gap

01-12-19, 02:08 PM

Thanks gap, I think I got the meaning of MIP-Maps now. It works now.

:up:

Perhaps I try to play around a bit with TDW´s GR2-Editor, is there a good tutorial for beginners?

I am afraid not. You can read its thread, start messing with it, and ask here in case you need help :)

But maybe this is too advanced for me...

Not that advanced, but you need to be familiar with 3D modelling and texturing in general and with the relevant terminology. Moreover, GR2 Editor is an unfinished tool: dpending on the GR2 file you want to edit, some ot its function might not work, work in a different way than supposed or even corrupt the file.

A bit annoying but nothing impossible though, and again, you can always ask for help. :salute:

Badileus

01-13-19, 07:41 AM

gap

01-13-19, 06:07 PM

I still have a little problem with my modified plates: They all work fine save one in the CR (from file CR9C_2.dds), image below. Ingame it looks ok from the right, but viewed from the left you can see the old label, mixed with the new one. These views are from the same distance! And it doesn´t change if i look from further away.

https://imgur.com/a/wMQMbig

I noticed, when i open this file with IrfanView (ver. 4.30), the changed labels look mixed up. Does this mean anything?

What you probably see is the specular map which is stored in texture's alpha channel. Did you update it when you edited those labels?

What does the 24 bpp at the bottom mean? I thought I saved the file with 8 bpp.

https://imgur.com/a/E5NzUD9

8 bpp is the uncompressed colour depth for each channel. Multiply this number by three (the number of channels composing an RGB image) and you get 24 bpp, i.e. "true color". This is not considering the extra 8 bpp ("shades of grey") alpha channel that the DXT5 compression format also supports.

By the way, there is another file with obviously unused plates (CR9C_8.dds), this time with mostly not TDC-terms, which couldt be useful for several devices. Even one with "Spannungsregler" (the term i used myself for the EER-plates) i found there, although spelled wrong. Don´t know if this file is a stock one or from some other interior mod. Here it is:

https://www.dropbox.com/s/1a0tt8keobm9b4j/CR9C_8.dds?dl=0

No, this texture is not among stock files. I hope it can be imported (in theory yes, in practice who knows?). Do all the needed changes to CR9C_2.dds first, an then tell me if new textures are required :03: