Stolen work and modding etiquette

[CapnScurvy]

I've been a modder here with SubSim for quite a while. Something that came up the other day was the realization that some newer mods are using older work without proper crediting. All of my mods state that anyone can use my work as long as they give credit where credit is due. When this simple request goes unnoticed or ignored, it causes me to wonder if the voluntary guidelines, set out within this forum, is either read or understood.

The Guidelines for us all are HERE (http://www.subsim.com/radioroom/showthread.php?t=155786).

I'm bringing this up because I ran across this (http://www.subsim.com/radioroom/downloads.php?do=file&id=1542) 2010 mod found in our "Downloads" section called "Medals Fix IV for v1.5 - TMO". This fellow Latency states:

The original idea was taken from fullmetaledges who put out vII and somehow was incorporated in TMO supermod. Here is the fix to your incorrect attempt and I want to give credit where credit is due EVEN THOUGH I revamped this completely from scratch.

What a lie!!

The original work was done by me in 2008, revised in 2009 using this thread (http://www.subsim.com/radioroom/showthread.php?t=142241&highlight=U.S.+Medals+Fix). Ducimus and I added my fix to TMO because it not only adds the authentic medals to the game, but the hierarchy of the medal group was corrected which prevented the correct medal to be awarded for the players achievements. The work is still in TMO 2.5....this mod isn't needed...it corrects nothing!!

Latency also states:

There were a couple other attempts from modders which I had also looked at and those were just plain crap. Sorry, but the image quality wasn't that good and what's with the SH3 medals? I am convinced by the way the config files were constructed, that those were a quick hack and were clueless needless to say.

His BS is beyond belief, and one of the reasons I'm calling him on it. Enough is enough!

I compared his in-mod images to mine....their individually exact reproductions of the same images I made years ago!?! Compare for yourself using any image editor.

The "statute of limitations" may have passed regarding this mod and its theft. But, for those of us who invest hours into our pay-free work, only to see it used by egotistic A-holes without even as much as a nod of credit....it's too much to ignore.

[Rockin Robbins]

I think that's a Neal question. I don't think he would have a problem removing a mod from Subsim which is just a copy of another mod without crediting the original author.

[Webster]

it seems you have a clear case here of stolen mod work.

I will bring it to the attention of the admins

I cannot speak on their behalf as to what they might do

[CapnScurvy]

That's fine Webster, I've said my piece. Let the chips fall where they may. :up:

[Jimbuna]

it seems you have a clear case here of stolen mod work.

I will bring it to the attention of the admins

I cannot speak on their behalf as to what they might do

Mod deleted but be advised Neal may later decide to reinstate it if he feels that is the correct course of action.

[Rockin Robbins]

That's more than fair. First time that I'm aware of that our modding code has been put to use. It's great to see it fairly applied.

Fellow modders: what we do wouldn't be possible without the pioneering work of those who came before, many of whom are not around the site any more. Please do the extra effort to find those responsible for the work you use or modify and just give them credit in your readme.

Even if it's not explicit, give them credit anyway. Example: I was testing FOTRSU with the external camera to see DD depth charge behavior and spotted a ship tossing depth charges off to the side. Although he's not mentioned in the original FOTRS documentation, I know, from my experience six years ago, that the man who invented those was Lurker_hlb3 and he will get a mention in the FOTRSU readme, even though I can't trace exactly where that ship got its side throwers.

If you use a supermod as basis for your mod, like TMO, look in TMO's credits and give all those modders credit in your readme too. Not only does it bring the modders of the past to notice by current players, but the history itself is interesting and important.

Finally, are mistakes going to be made? Of course. When someone shows to a reasonable standard of proof that they are responsible for part of your mod, take five minutes, ammend your readme and post in the thread for your mod that the addition has been made, thanking the contributing modder.

It isn't difficult. And don't do it because Neal and company have guns pointed at you requiring it, do it because it's the right and respectful thing to do. And I find it actually fun. It's geneology for mods!:up:

[CapnScurvy]

Mod deleted but be advised Neal may later decide to reinstate it if he feels that is the correct course of action.

That's Ok to me.

Sometimes its a fine line drawn between what modification a person may make, when its done to already modded work. A small change, or even a large robust one should still give credit to the original author(s). Many times its a combined effort by several others that brought the idea to you to add your own "spin". Even if it was nothing more than inspiration for an idea. Those of us that have opened the hood on the game have all gleaned information, insite, how to, from past members. Giving credit is the least one should do. Asking permission should be the first.

[THEBERBSTER]

I think its called 'good manners'.
Peter