View Full Version : [WIP] Lighthouses mod
Kendras
07-18-17, 04:25 AM
If you want to test yourself new coordinates, here is a little tool :
http://www.mediafire.com/file/54akqo17jatwysv/g_-_mast_ref.7z
The land unit is a red mast (stored in environmental folder)
The terrain object is a blue mast
:up:
I have amended the reflection propertie's parameters, and also removed the DX2/3 compression checks on all nodes in LLH_LaPlate.dat and Lighthouse_Parts.dat. In my view the reflection now looks stronger bringing the light house into the sea rather than on it?
regards,
MLF
Kendras
07-18-17, 06:04 AM
I have amended the reflection propertie's parameters, and also removed the DX2/3 compression checks on all nodes in LLH_LaPlate.dat and Lighthouse_Parts.dat. In my view the reflection now looks stronger bringing the light house into the sea rather than on it?
regards,
MLF
Nice. :up:
Could you also add some reflections nodes for the sub parts ?
Nice. :up:
Could you also add some reflections nodes for the sub parts ?
Thanks.
I added the reflections to all nodes in the lighthouse_Parts.dat - when I zoom in on the reflection they are there, but fainter, possibly because they are further away from the sea which is possibly more realistic than having the reflections all the same strength. I'll see if I can improve on them but need to go out now for a couple of hours.
regards,
MLF
Kendras
07-18-17, 07:42 AM
Thanks.
I added the reflections to all nodes in the lighthouse_Parts.dat - when I zoom in on the reflection they are there, but fainter, possibly because they are further away from the sea which is possibly more realistic than having the reflections all the same strength. I'll see if I can improve on them but need to go out now for a couple of hours.
regards,
MLF
Perfect ! :yeah:
:rotfl2:
Problem solved !
:yeah:
So, I've finished to test all possibilities, and here are my conclusions :
- In locations.cfg, coordinates D (in degrees) must have no more than 6 decimal digits.
- In .mis file, coordinates M (in meters) mustn't have any decimal digits. Even if the converted number in degrees (D) has exactly 6 decimal digits.
As D should be equal to M/120000, the minimal move for a land unit is 3 meters (0.000025 or 25.10^-6 degrees), in other words M must be a multiple of 3.
But there is more !
When you convert the coordinate M (in meters) to D (in degrees), you must apply this formula :
for longitude : D = M/120000 - 6.10^-6
for latitude: D = M/120000 + 6.10^-6
http://i.imgur.com/5jfoPEV.png
http://i.imgur.com/kNKYR98.png
:Kaleun_Applaud:
I did a little research last night and I believe the model I converted is the Aniva Rock Lighthouse:-
Good finding, it must be that! :up:
Pity that its geographical position puts it out of U-boat reach :D
You are using controller 10/-1 as am I, with a child node of 6/0 WaterReflection property yet the one I use has this added parameter.....very strange.
Obviously ther are two different types of parameter chunks for the WaterReflection controller. I wonder if the one with the additional MaxVisDistance parameter, has any impact on the quality of reflections though I don't think so...
None of my textures have the DX2/3 compression checked - I seem to recall a post somewhere where this was stated as causing a problem?????
I am pretty sure that that flag being checked was the main cause of reflections looking so faint :yep:
I have amended the reflection propertie's parameters, and also removed the DX2/3 compression checks on all nodes in LLH_LaPlate.dat and Lighthouse_Parts.dat. In my view the reflection now looks stronger bringing the light house into the sea rather than on it?
Amazing :up:
Maybe reflections now are even a bit too strong lol, what do you guys think? :D
Nice. :up:
Could you also add some reflections nodes for the sub parts ?
I added the reflections to all nodes in the lighthouse_Parts.dat
Am I missing something? I thought I had already added those nodes to all the library subparts :hmm2:
when I zoom in on the reflection they are there, but fainter, possibly because they are further away from the sea which is possibly more realistic than having the reflections all the same strength.
That sounds reasonable :yep:
I can upload the 2 dat files to mediafire if you want to use them, or inspect them?
Regards,
MLF
I can upload the 2 dat files to mediafire if you want to use them, or inspect them?
Regards,
MLF
Sure please: I plan to upload a major update today, and I would like it to feature your tweaks too :up:
:)
Here's the link:-
https://www.mediafire.com/?2i07drl516bqapx
The rar file contains the 2 dat files I modified - it is not JSGME ready.
Regards,
MLF
:)
Here's the link:-
https://www.mediafire.com/?2i07drl516bqapx
Thank you very much :up:
Please check back at your earliest convenience for my update. It should be ready in no more than a couple of hours from now :salute:
P.S: I finally see why the library models had no reflections: their WaterReflection controller must be placed directly under the model node; no dedicated reflection model is used :up:
:Kaleun_Thumbs_Up:
One thing - I couldn't identify the node for the flashing light, so there isn't a reflection of the light in the water when the light flashes. Which node and file has the flashing light?
regards,
MLF
:Kaleun_Thumbs_Up:
One thing - I couldn't identify the node for the flashing light, so there isn't a reflection of the light in the water when the light flashes. Which node and file has the flashing light?
Lighthouse_FX.dat. I have already added a WaterReflection controller to the version I am going to release today. :up:
I am also wondering whether to add a RayTracedHalo controller to the platform (with its 'Halo' property set to 'False') so to provent the halo for glowing under the platform. Maybe you can quickly test this option while I am adding a sound source to the lighthouse with a lapping waves SFX? :03:
Kendras
07-18-17, 11:37 AM
What is the RayTracedHalo controller useful for ?
I am also wondering whether to add a RayTracedHalo controller to the platform (with its 'Halo' property set to 'False') so to provent the halo for glowing under the platform. Maybe you can quickly test this option while I am adding a sound source to the lighthouse with a lapping waves SFX? :03:
I added the controller to node 12 LaPlate_Platform in the lighthouse_Parts.dat - didn't see any noticble difference but I think possibly I am misunderstanding the term "platform" again. I cannot see the light through the structure of the lighthouse before or after so presumably it's what shows in my screenshot below (the white area under the platform) that you want rid of? The screen shot was taken after I added the controller as above. Should I be adding it somewhere else - I've never used this controller so.......:doh:
regards,
MLF
Lapping waves? Hope I never get that close:Kaleun_Sick:
Fog Horn?:O:
Regards,
MLF
Kendras
07-18-17, 12:10 PM
About the icon, here how it looks with your .tga resized at 20 % :
http://i.imgur.com/AEIdR93.png
and in game (the other icon on the right is La Vieille lighthouse (with correct coordinates), and the small bar on the left is my submarine) :
http://i.imgur.com/ONgk36W.png
:-?
New version ready for download:
http://www.mediafire.com/file/lh8517qdzzolbod/gap%2C_Kendras_%26_MLF_-_Tourelle_de_La_Plate_v7.7z
The list of changes is quite long today:
I have split the tower base from the main lighthouse model: it is part of the rock now. This seemed more logical to me, since both rock and base lay at least partly underwater and they both need a StaticObject controller for collision detection and wave interaction.
Folllowing Kendras' suggestion, the two sub-models composing the rock object (the unpainted concrete base and the rock itself) are now stored in the same library file as the lantern, the platform, etc, and and they are linked to Rock_LaPlate.dat through placement nodes (likewise stock harbors). I thought that storing those models in a library file is more rational, as we might use them for other lighthouses.
Following the example provided by stock files, I have moved the StaticObject controller of Rock_LaPlate.dat to a dummy node which is also parent to the two placement nodes I mentioned above. This should fix the problem of collision with other units not being detected. Moreover, waves should "crash" against the base now, and spawn foam in the process.
Also attached to the rock/base 'location', there is a SoundSource and AmbientVolume controller. Provided that I didn't make any mistake, you should hear a wave lapping sound when close to the lighthouse.
Following MLF's suggestion, I have scaled down LaPlate's icon by an 8 factor, and the relative text by a 4 factor. I have created two versions of the tga. The 'default' version has texture size also scaled down to 128x128 pixels. Should this version look weird (i.e. icon having equal size as before, text double the size as before, both with heavily jagged edges) or crash the game (hopefully not), please replace the tga in the Terrain/Locations folder with the one provided in the 'spare icon' folder. The spare texture is stock sized (1,024 square pixels), and only the visible icon and text were resized.
Since it did seem to do nothing, I have removed the Caustics controller from the lighthouse unit. I couldn't find any example in stock/GWX files of a land unit/terrain object using such a controller, and I doubt we will ever get it to work on our lighthouse.
I have added a WaterReflection controller to the light/halo effect. It should cast reflection now.
Submodel reflections should work now (thanks to MLF): I had placed their WaterReflection controller under reflect_* nodes with reflections model attached; this obviously works for units' reflections, but not for the reflection of equipments. Now I have correctly placed the reflection controllers of loghthouse 'equipments' under the same nodes as their visible models, and I have deleted the redundant reflect_* nodes with the attached reflection models.
I have deleted the materials I had set for reflections from the main lighthouse file and from the lighthouse parts library file. These materials had their DX2/3 compression flag set to true. Now all the reflections use the same material as the visible models, with no in-memory texture compression. Higher memory usage but much better results. Thanks again to MLF for confirming my suspect!
I have deleted the messy reflection model used for the main lighthouse unit. The reflect_LLH_LaPlate node was linked to the main model instead, and reflections are calculated based on it now. This tweak should make reflections to look better without increasing RAM memory usage, though it might require more work by the GPU, due to the higher complexity of the model used for reflections.
All the MinVisDim and MaxVisDim reflection properties used by the lighthouse, by the library items and by the light effect, were set to 0.1 and 0.5 respectively. These settings were taken from the reflections of similar stock objects. Should you guys think that the settings proposed by MLF give better results than the ones above, feel free to tweaks those parameters and to inform me about your changes: I will update the files on my HD accordingly, and you wont have to redo the changes again and again after each update :03:
Well, I think that's all from my part. I am looking forward to your feedback and I am ready to work on any still unfixed, or possibly newly introduced, bug. I thank you for your big efforts into the development of our first full-fledged lighthouse, and I hope you are enjoying the process as much as I do. As you know I am a SH5 guy lent to SHIII, but I am getting to love it as much as the other games of the series :salute:
I added the controller to node 12 LaPlate_Platform in the lighthouse_Parts.dat - didn't see any noticble difference but I think possibly I am misunderstanding the term "platform" again.
The yellow three-legged turret with stairs on a side, the big gas bottle under it, and lantern and topmark on top :03:
I cannot see the light through the structure of the lighthouse before or after so presumably it's what shows in my screenshot below (the white area under the platform) that you want rid of?
Exactly: the whitish halo covering the back half of pltform's bottom side. That's just a detail, but I am a perfectionist: I we can fix this glitch, why not? If we can't, well, we will live with it :D
The screen shot was taken after I added the controller as above. Should I be adding it somewhere else - I've never used this controller so.......:doh:
What is the RayTracedHalo controller useful for ?
I don't know much abot this controller: I was looking at Kendras' light effect, and I noticed that the controller had two states: one for glowing light (True) and one for obstacle (False). I was curious and I made a quick search (https://www.google.it/search?q=RayTracedHalo&oq=RayTracedHalo&aqs=chrome..69i57.166599j0j4&sourceid=chrome&ie=UTF-8#q=RayTracedHalo+site:subsim.com). The sparse information I got from it, induced me to think that we could use the controller to iron out the glitch described above, but unfortunately I don't know much more of what you can read from the link above. Maybe Anvart, Jeff Grooves or some other old timer might... cast some light on the topic :O:
Lapping waves? Hope I never get that close:Kaleun_Sick:
:rotfl2:
Fog Horn?:O:
Sure, this is an idea I had before. Where there must be fog horns, there will fog horns. That's not the case of the Petite Vieille though :03:
Talking about your idea, a while ago I looked for a way to link the playing of a certain sound to a particular weather state. Unfortunately I couldn't find any clue. Ideas?
About the icon, here how it looks with your .tga resized at 20 % :
and in game (the other icon on the right is La Vieille lighthouse (with correct coordinates), and the small bar on the left is my submarine) :
:-?
I see what you mean Kendras: they still look super big, but they already look awfully jagged. I think I might have a solution for that, but before I can say more I need you to test both icons included in my new release, and to report back with the results and with your impressions :yep:
Hi Gap,
Have just had a quick test. CTD when the GPU picked up the first light flash I'm afraid. Took out the RayTracedHalo controller from Lighthouse_FX.dat and all now OK. What does this controller do (apart from CTD)?
Light tower offset from rock (see screenshot). What Lat and Long did you use in Locations.cfg and the corresponding co-ordinates in the .mis file? Sorry - I've not had time to look at Kendras' findings yet.
I don't like the lack of hard reflections - personal taste or possibly environment mod in use? Here is a real life example of another tower on a perfect day.
.https://s-media-cache-ak0.pinimg.com/736x/29/7c/2f/297c2f9d68ad512cfccfb96ff01dec30--bretagne-france-lighthouses.jpg (http://madetente.fr/wp-content/uploads/2015/12/la-tourelle-de-la-plate-le-phare-de-tevennec.jpg)
The chart icon is better, prefer the "spare" one I think. I'll try and search for an example of an old imperial unit (Feet and fathoms with the Lateral system of buoyage) admiralty chart showing light symbols - I'm sure they were more discrete.
Sorry if a bit negative. Presumably when this one is perfect all the others will be easy:)l:Kaleun_Thumbs_Up:
regards,
MLF
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Kendras
07-18-17, 03:17 PM
Have just had a quick test. CTD when the GPU picked up the first light flash I'm afraid. Took out the RayTracedHalo controller from Lighthouse_FX.dat and all now OK.
Same here.
Light tower offset from rock (see screenshot). What Lat and Long did you use in Locations.cfg and the corresponding co-ordinates in the .mis file? Sorry - I've not had time to look at Kendras' findings yet.
For exact coordinates, I have updated the first post of this thread (see green text). :03:
I don't like the lack of hard reflections - personal taste or possibly environment mod in use? Here is a real life example of another tower on a perfect day.
Reflections are broken in my game, due to my graphics card, so I can't comment. But I agree with MLF, hard reflections are nice.
The chart icon is better, prefer the "spare" one I think.
Icon is better, text is readable, but I think the icon should be smaller (if possible), and text should be very near the icon.
How it looks :
http://i.imgur.com/2fvf9wM.png
Presumably when this one is perfect all the others will be easy
Exactly. Mmhh no, let's say ... probably ! :haha:
Kendras
07-18-17, 03:27 PM
BTW : Rock is still not collisionable ...
Kendras
07-18-17, 03:33 PM
Next lighthouse (after La Vieille) :
http://www.dirm.nord-atlantique-manche-ouest.developpement-durable.gouv.fr/IMG/pdf/plan1_cle22618b-1.pdf
... Near Brest, a harbour which is becoming more realist !
:D
For exact coordinates, I have updated the first post of this thread (see green text). :03:
:Kaleun_Thumbs_Up: All OK with those co-ordinates:)
I'll put my reflections on later - time to eat!!!!!!!
regards,
MLF
Have just had a quick test. CTD when the GPU picked up the first light flash I'm afraid. Took out the RayTracedHalo controller from Lighthouse_FX.dat and all now OK. What does this controller do (apart from CTD)?
I din't add that controller, Kendras did when he created the light effect. I think does what the name says: it adds to the game an halo which is base on actual light rays, not just flat particle set as emissive. Kendras might know on it more than I do. Didn't you see any difference after removing it?
What changed compared to Kendra's version of the FX, is my addition of a WaterReflection controller, so now we know that the two controllers are not reciprocally compatible :03:
Light tower offset from rock (see screenshot). What Lat and Long did you use in Locations.cfg and the corresponding co-ordinates in the .mis file? Sorry - I've not had time to look at Kendras' findings yet.
I don't know Kendra's settings. Let's wait for feedback from him. Is vertical alignment more or less good?
I don't like the lack of hard reflections - personal taste or possibly environment mod in use? Here is a real life example of another tower on a perfect day.
Me neither, but I think that depends on environmenatl settings. I don't see any parameter that might affect reflection 'scattering' in the WaterReflection controller :hmm2:
The chart icon is better, prefer the "spare" one I think.
Is the 'spare' one as jagged and big as the one whose screeenshot was posted by Kendras in his last post? Is the text still readable? I think I know how to scale those icons up and down without loosing resolution. Let me know if you think I should further reduce icon's size :)
I'll try and search for an example of an old imperial unit (Feet and fathoms with the Lateral system of buoyage) admiralty chart showing light symbols - I'm sure they were more discrete.
That would be nice. You should look for the symbol for "tower beacon": that's what the Tourelle de la Plate is. :up:
The current symbol is the one used internationally on modern charts. I took it from this document:
https://msi.nga.mil/MSISiteContent/StaticFiles/NAV_PUBS/Chart1/Sec_Q.pdf
Sorry if a bit negative. Presumably when this one is perfect all the others will be easy:)l:Kaleun_Thumbs_Up:
Sure, positive criticism is always welcome. When you get time, let me know if collision detection works now, if there is foam around the base, and if the wave lapping sound works as supposed.
P.S: I think you wanted to attached an image at the bottom of your last post, but the link was corrupted :03:
Have just had a quick test. CTD when the GPU picked up the first light flash I'm afraid. Took out the RayTracedHalo controller from Lighthouse_FX.dat and all now OK. What does this controller do (apart from CTD)?
Same here.
Did removing either the new WaterReflection controller or the RayTracedHalo controller solve the issue for you?
Icon is better, text is readable, but I think the icon should be smaller (if possible), and text should be very near the icon.
How it looks :
http://i.imgur.com/2fvf9wM.png
Let's say half the current size and two times the current resolution? would that be okay? :03:
P.S: was the screenshot above taken with the 'standard' tga or with the 'spare' one?
BTW : Rock is still not collisionable ...
:o :wah:
Next lighthouse (after La Vieille) :
http://www.dirm.nord-atlantique-manche-ouest.developpement-durable.gouv.fr/IMG/pdf/plan1_cle22618b-1.pdf
... Near Brest, a harbour which is becoming more realist !
:D
:up:
I'll put my reflections on later - time to eat!!!!!!!
Was your last screenshot taken with the latest alpha of the lighthouse? If so, after all it seems that the faint look of the reflection was caused by Min and MaxVis parameters rather than texture compression :yep:
Kendras
07-18-17, 04:16 PM
Let's say half the current size and two times the current resolution? would that be okay?
Yes. Let's try this ! :yep:
P.S: was the screenshot above taken with the 'standard' tga or with the 'spare' one?
From 'standard' tga.
Will continue tests tomorrow, I'm tired now.
Good job, our project is progressing nicely ! :yep:
From 'standard' tga.
Try the other one then and tell me what do you think. I think you will be surprised :03:
Will continue tests tomorrow, I'm tired now.
Good job, our project is progressing nicely ! :yep:
:salute:
Kendras
07-19-17, 01:05 AM
Is the 'spare' one as jagged and big as the one whose screeenshot was posted by Kendras in his last post?
Yes, exactly the same size. Conclusion : size of icons is 'absolute'.
When you get time, let me know if collision detection works now, if there is foam around the base, and if the wave lapping sound works as supposed.
No collision, no foam, no sound.
I will try to add sound.
Kendras
07-19-17, 01:44 AM
New sound added to the land unit, perfect in game. :yep:
Sound from this video :
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yFlHYoxstgo
Hi,
I'm afraid I did not have time last night to do any more testing etc. For the next couple of days I will not be available for anything, and thereafter, for a couple of weeks I will only have access if/when WiFi is available - possibly won't be able to test much though. Sorry about the short notice. But I will watch the thread and respond when I can if needed.
Regards,
MLF
Kendras
07-19-17, 06:17 AM
Hi,
I'm afraid I did not have time last night to do any more testing etc. For the next couple of days I will not be available for anything, and thereafter, for a couple of weeks I will only have access if/when WiFi is available - possibly won't be able to test much though. Sorry about the short notice. But I will watch the thread and respond when I can if needed.
Regards,
MLF
No problem. :up:
About the light's icon, reducing its size by 50 % is still acceptable :
http://i.imgur.com/Ekqq21v.png
What do you think ?
Yes, exactly the same size. Conclusion : size of icons is 'absolute'.
mmm... it can't be that. Have you really tested the tga file that I have put in the 'spare icon' folder? :hmm2:
What I have understood is that the game scales the tga overlay, no matter what is its pixel resolution, to fit the same space on map. That means that if a standard sized (1024 x 1024) texture is scaled down, let's say to 256 x 256 pixels, the result in game won't be an icon four times smaller than the unscaled version, but one having the same size than the original, but four times lesser smooth. This is exactly what is happening with the tga file I have placed in the Locations folder of the last alpha, and with the one you yoursels have scaled to 20% of the original size, both of which you have tested yestarday.
The correct way to make the icon smaller, is scaling not the whole tga file, but only the visible pixels within it. In other words, If we want the tower symbol to be four times smaller and as smooth as the original, we should select the area within the tga file with non-trasparent pixels, and scale it down to 25%, repeating the process for both RGB and alpha channel. This is exactly the approach I followed for creating the tga file in the 'spare icon' folder, and that's why it is important that you make sure you have tested it.
There is more: due to the size reduction, some icons and/or the text, might require their resolution to be increased in order to still look good. How to do it? If, folllowing the previous examples, we want the same icon to be four times smaller and four times smoother, we don't have to scale the tower symbol within the original tga file: all we need to do, is adding black/transparent pixels to it, so to modify its size from 1024 square pixels to
4096 x 4096. One might fear that by doing that the file size would increase exponentially but that's not really the case: with the compression method used for saving those files, black/transparent pixels get compressed, so the final file size will be bigger, but not so much bigger. :03:
No collision, no foam
Yesterday night I have been looking into the issue. Everything is apparently in order, but I will keep inspecting the files this afternnon.
no sound.
I will try to add sound.
New sound added to the land unit, perfect in game. :yep:
Sound from this video :
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yFlHYoxstgo
Yep, I had listened the same sound when I was looking for sound loops which might apply to our model, but I discardes it, because it is the sound of crashing waves, not realistic during fair weather. At the end I opted for the wave lapping sound already featured in SHIII with GWX (but I believe it is in stock game too): it would be audible during calm days, and it would be covered by the ambience sound of heavy waves when the weather is stormy. What do you think? :hmm2:
Whatever is your decision, can you please send me your tweaked and/or added files when you are satisfied with them, so I can keep working on up-to-date files? :)
I'm afraid I did not have time last night to do any more testing etc. For the next couple of days I will not be available for anything, and thereafter, for a couple of weeks I will only have access if/when WiFi is available - possibly won't be able to test much though. Sorry about the short notice. But I will watch the thread and respond when I can if needed.
No problem MLF. Your help and suggestions are always appreciated, but take your time on them. Whatever you got planned for the next two weeks, I wish you to have a nice time! :salute:
Kendras
07-19-17, 07:16 AM
mmm... it can't be that. Have you really tested the tga file that I have put in the 'spare icon' folder?
Yes Sir.
What I have understood is that the game scales the tga overlay, no matter what is its pixel resolution, to fit the same space on map.
Definitely not.
This is exactly what is happening with the tga file I have placed in the Locations folder of the last alpha, and with the one you yoursels have scaled to 20% of the original size, both of which you have tested yestarday.
No, in fact I didn't test your original tga, because I knew that it was far too big. Here is the definitive evidence, the pictures speaks for itself (in game icon with your original tga) :O: :
http://i.imgur.com/dDGL2LY.png
Yesterday night I have been looking into the issue. Everything is apparently in order, but I will keep inspecting the files this afternnon.
Don't loose your precious time on that problem, i will see/test that myself. Keep going forward with 3D modelling, you're very good ! :yep:
Yep, I had listened the same sound when I was looking for sound loops which might apply to our model, but I discardes it, because it is the sound of crashing waves, not realistic during fair weather. At the end I opted for the wave lapping sound already featured in SHIII with GWX (but I believe it is in stock game too): it would be audible during calm days, and it would be covered by the ambience sound of heavy waves when the weather is stormy. What do you think? :hmm2:
Mmh, I don't know. Maybe it's not the appropriate sound for this beacon, but sure it will be for bigger islands. On the video, the sea state is not stormy. :03:
Whatever is your decision, can you please send me your tweaked and/or added files when you are satisfied with them, so I can keep working on up-to-date files? :)
Yes, of course. I will send you v.8 during the afternoon.
No problem MLF. Your help and suggestions are always appreciated, but take your time on them. Whatever you got planned for the next two weeks, I wish you to have a nice time! :salute:
Thank you :salute:
Regards,
MLF
Yes Sir.
Definitely not.
No, in fact I didn't test your original tga, because I knew that it was far too big. Here is the definitive evidence, the pictures speaks for itself (in game icon with your original tga) :O:
Okay, that's an evidence :03:
Since we are at it...
No problem. :up:
About the light's icon, reducing its size by 50 % is still acceptable :
http://i.imgur.com/Ekqq21v.png
What do you think ?
50% relative to the tga version featured in the package I posted yesterday, and with text of unchanged size?
What about moving the text on the left size of the icon, so not to overlap the overaly used for the La Vielle lighthouse?
Don't loose your precious time on that problem, i will see/test that myself. Keep going forward with 3D modelling, you're very good ! :yep:
Thanks. Today, I will post an update with a few tweaks, I think I am up to something. Should I fail again, I will leave the issue to you :up:
Mmh, I don't know. Maybe it's not the appropriate sound for this beacon, but sure it will be for bigger islands. On the video, the sea state is not stormy. :03:
But still it is wavy: I can see waves breaking against a large rocky coast. Believe me, that's not the kind of sound one would expect for gentle waves lapping against an isolated and streamlined obstacle in the middle of the sea. For the model we are currently working on, but also for biggers rocky shoals as the one of La Vieille, I see 'Submarine waves lap.wav' (in SHIII's Sound folder) more appropriate.
BTW, this same sound is used as SFX of both Maunsell forts featured in GWX :)
Yes, of course. I will send you v.8 during the afternoon.
...or v.9, depending who will be faster :03: :D
Kendras
07-19-17, 09:53 AM
50% relative to the tga version featured in the package I posted yesterday, and with text of unchanged size?
Exactly.
What about moving the text on the left size of the icon, so not to overlap the overaly used for the La Vielle lighthouse?
Yes, sure. And it's very easy to do. You just have to enlarge the tga, without changing the size of the icon.
I see 'Submarine waves lap.wav' (in SHIII's Sound folder) more appropriate.
BTW, this same sound is used as SFX of both Maunsell forts featured in GWX :)
I will try that.
Exactly.
:up:
Yes, sure. And it's very easy to do. You just have to enlarge the tga, without changing the size of the icon.
No problem. I have the texture in psd format and in original quality. I will do the changes :up:
I will try that.
Maybe try both sounds in game; from your tests, you can decide which one sounds more natural under different sea conditions :)
So Kendras, my new update is ready:
https://www.mediafire.com/?159pcbzq3aqv3yj
Change log:
I have added/removed from our files empty, unknown, start, end, index, eof chunks to reflect similar stock files. I don't think those chunks make a big difference, but you never know...
Following the example provided by SHIII antisub nets, I have made the rock and base models in the library file child to two newly added col_* nodes with collision meshes linked to them. The placement nodes of the dummy rock, in the Terrain/Locations folder now point to these col_* nodes, rather than pointing directly to the visible models.
Shouldn't that work, I will make one last attempt at fixing the collison of those mpdels, and I will set them as I would in SH5. If also this last attempt will fail, I swear I will leave the struggle to you, and I won't deal again with that controller in my life :O:
While digging into AntiSubNet.dat in SHIII's Library folder, I have noticed it got a Caustics controller, so I decided to restore back the controller in our files, but this time it is linked to the base model in the library file, not to the main lighthouse model.
I have set all the WaterReflections controller per MLF settings. This should improve their look. If you or MLF want to further improve them, making them more "zigzagged", please go for it!
I deleted the WaterReflection controller from the light effect as it made the game to CTD, but I have also made a copy of the file with the WaterReflection controller but without the RayTracedController one. This file was placed in a 'light reflection' subfolder of the main mod folder. Can you please test it, and tell us which version gives the best results.
Lastly, I have edited the lighthouse icon as per our discussion of this afternoon. I hope you like it.
That's all I think. Sound settings are unchanged of course, I am waiting for your updates :salute:
Kendras
07-19-17, 03:39 PM
So Kendras, my new update is ready
I am waiting for your updates :salute:
Sorry, I got very lazy this afternoon. :yawn:
After testing sounds and collision solutions, I switched to the rockets mod, going on writting the readme, and searching for pics to illustrate it.
Back to our subject :
We need to add a new line into Sh3.sdl, even if the sound already exists. It must start with 'Land.' instead of 'Submarine.'. I don't like this sound very much, but it's still better than the ambient sound of buoys.
Change log:
I have added/removed from our files empty, unknown, start, end, index, eof chunks to reflect similar stock files. I don't think those chunks make a big difference, but you never know...
Following the example provided by SHIII antisub nets, I have made the rock and base models in the library file child to two newly added col_* nodes with collision meshes linked to them. The placement nodes of the dummy rock, in the Terrain/Locations folder now point to these col_* nodes, rather than pointing directly to the visible models.
Shouldn't that work, I will make one last attempt at fixing the collison of those mpdels, and I will set them as I would in SH5. If also this last attempt will fail, I swear I will leave the struggle to you, and I won't deal again with that controller in my life :O:
While digging into AntiSubNet.dat in SHIII's Library folder, I have noticed it got a Caustics controller, so I decided to restore back the controller in our files, but this time it is linked to the base model in the library file, not to the main lighthouse model.
:rotfl2: It seems that it's working. I hit something, but what ? :hmmm:
http://i.imgur.com/X4Tqzgu.png
I have set all the WaterReflections controller per MLF settings. This should improve their look. If you or MLF want to further improve them, making them more "zigzagged", please go for it!
I deleted the WaterReflection controller from the light effect as it made the game to CTD, but I have also made a copy of the file with the WaterReflection controller but without the RayTracedController one. This file was placed in a 'light reflection' subfolder of the main mod folder. Can you please test it, and tell us which version gives the best results.
I can't check that. My laptop's graphics card doesn't render reflections correctly.
Lastly, I have edited the lighthouse icon as per our discussion of this afternoon. I hope you like it.
Yeah, perfect :
http://i.imgur.com/ZrGW5bi.png
Sorry, I got very lazy this afternoon. :yawn:
After testing sounds and collision solutions, I switched to the rockets mod, going on writting the readme, and searching for pics to illustrate it.
No problem. BTW: did you ever manage making rockets to disappear from the racks once they are fired? :D
We need to add a new line into Sh3.sdl, even if the sound already exists. It must start with 'Land.' instead of 'Submarine.'.
You are right, I didn't think about it! For maximum compatibility, I didn't want to add a new entry to Sh3.sdl, because many mods alter it, but since there's no other way... :up:
I don't like this sound very much, but it's still better than the ambient sound of buoys.
I can help you looking for a better sound... or do you still prefer the crashing wave sound? :doh:
:rotfl2: It seems that it's working. I hit something, but what ? :hmmm:
http://i.imgur.com/X4Tqzgu.png
:o no model? :wah::haha:
Hopefully I made an obvious mistake. The concrete base is set as the rock, and it is still rendered. BTW: did you try hitting it too?
I can't check that. My laptop's graphics card doesn't render reflections correctly.
Okay, maybe when we have everything more or less ready, we can pre-release the package as a single mission, so people can test it and report back with their impressions/suggestions.
BTW: what is exactly the advantage of adding the RayTracedHalo to the light particle effect?
Yeah, perfect :
http://i.imgur.com/ZrGW5bi.png
:up:
:rotfl2: It seems that it's working. I hit something, but what ? :hmmm:
http://i.imgur.com/X4Tqzgu.png
:o no model? :wah::haha:
Hopefully I made an obvious mistake. The concrete base is set as the rock, and it is still rendered. BTW: did you try hitting it too?
Okay, I have found why the rock didn't show up: I had inadvertently unchecked the 'Visible' flag of the node LaPlate_Rock :D
Can you confirm that everything else is working? Tell me yes please! :O:
Kendras
07-19-17, 05:02 PM
Can you confirm that everything else is working? Tell me yes please! :O:
:haha: Will check that !
Kendras
07-19-17, 05:07 PM
No problem. BTW: did you ever manage making rockets to disappear from the racks once they are fired?
Unfortunately not. Damage inputs are always destroying the aircraft instead of the rocket ... :damn: So I gave up ...
I can help you looking for a better sound... or do you still prefer the crashing wave sound?
Another sound would be great.
BTW: what is exactly the advantage of adding the RayTracedHalo to the light particle effect?
I have no idea.
:haha: Will check that !
http://et-38d7.kxcdn.com/emojione-3.0/1f91e.png
Unfortunately not. Damage inputs are always destroying the aircraft instead of the rocket ... :damn: So I gave up ...
One day I will put myself on that, maybe I will be luckier than you :D
Another sound would be great.
Okay, before I start overwhelming you with tens of sound loops you don't like, what don't you like exactly about the stock sound that I pointed you to, and I would you expect it to be instead? :)
I have no idea.
Okay, let's wait for MLF to come back and test the effect with reflection but without halo :salute:
Kendras
07-19-17, 05:54 PM
Ok. So the rock and the base are now solid (collision). The strange thing is that if I delete the 3D models circled in red, it's still working. What is special with the new 3D models (the 2 others) ?
http://i.imgur.com/abS6HOl.png
Else, the Caustics controller works on the base, the effect is visible underwater.
Ok. So the rock and the base are now solid (collision).
At last! :rock: :sunny:
What about foam? In SH5 the game automatically spawns foam on the water surface, around objects with a StaticObject controller on them. Does it work the same for SHIII, or we will have to add the effect through val file (provided that this is possible)?
The strange thing is that if I delete the 3D models circled in red, it's still working. What is special with the new 3D models (the 2 others) ?
http://i.imgur.com/abS6HOl.png
That's not strange :yep:
In each tree, the first model is the one used for collision detection and it is invisible in game. The second model is the one you view in game; deleting it, or making it invisible, doesn't prevent the game from still detecting collisions when another object hits the collision model :03:
Else, the Caustics controller works on the base, the effect is visible underwater.
Nice, I didn't hope it would have worked so easily. :up:
Does it look nice, or it will need its parameters tweaked?
Should we add it to the tower (main unit) too? :)
Kendras
07-19-17, 06:20 PM
What about foam? In SH5 the game automatically spawns foam on the water surface, around objects with a StaticObject controller on them. Does it work the same for SHIII, or we will have to add the effect through val file (provided that this is possible)?
Not automatic in SH3. I don't think it's possible to add this effect to a static object, but who knows ?
That's not strange :yep:
In each tree, the first model is the one used for collision detection and it is invisible in game. The second model is the one you view in game; deleting it, or making it invisible, doesn't prevent the game from still detecting collisions when another object hits the collision model :03:
The strange thing is : why doesn't it work if you use only the red circled 3D models instead of the 2 others ?
Nice, I didn't hope it would have worked so easily. :up:
Does it look nice, or it will need its parameters tweaked?
I don't know, as this effect is also broken on my laptop. The model is only 'flashing', and that means that the effect is working.
Should we add it to the tower (main unit) too? :)
You mean to the rock ?
Kendras
07-19-17, 06:27 PM
Here is version 9 : http://www.mediafire.com/file/ajhtsddzy4j4k8v/gap%2C_Kendras_%26_MLF_-_Tourelle_de_La_Plate_v9.7z
Change log :
- deleted the Rock_LaPlate.dsd file from the Locations folder
- removed the aud_node in Rock_LaPlate.dat
- corrected the visibility of the 3D model in Lighthouse_Parts.dat
- added LLH_LaPlate.dsd
- added the Sh3.sdl file
- added the mission file with lighthouses (replaced by searchlights)
- added the Locations.cfg file (from WAC 4.1 + lighthouses)
Not automatic in SH3.
Pity
I don't think it's possible to add this effect to a static object, but who knows ?
I doubt it too, but if you are on it we can try. This effect would make our lighthouses so much more nice and realistic! :D
The strange thing is : why doesn't it work if you use only the red circled 3D models instead of the 2 others ?
I don't know. In Sh5, collision models are the rule both for units with SH3ZonesCtrl/CollisonableObject controllers and for terrain objects using the StaticObject controller in place of the usual spheres and boxes. Digging in SHIII files, I have noticed that most objects with a StaticObject controller attached don't have collision models, so I thought the game didn't need them. That was obviously not the case for our model, don't ask me why. Luckily this afternoon I opened AntiSubNet.dat, and I got from it the clue I was missing. When I saw it had a col_ node I had an illumitation, as this prefix reminded me of analogous bones found in SH5 and connected with collision detection.
I don't know, as this effect is also broken on my laptop. The model is only 'flashing', and that means that the effect is working.
Okay, let's wait for someone with a better hardware and artistic skills to pop up and help us with the tedious but rewarding task of finetuning those effects :03:
If no one volunteers and we become too impatient for waiting MLF to get back to us, I might decide to once again istall the game on my computer :D
You mean to the rock ?
Do you think caustics would be needed on the rock? Who would see them? IMO they would be a waste of computer resources, and not very realsitic anyway. In theory the effect should be visible above water more than below water (which is not the case apparently, we will discover why). I was wondering wether to add the effect to the main lighthouse structure (LLH_LaPlate.dat), but again, that would probably be too high on the sea surface for realistically receiving caustics (in real life)... Do you agree? :hmm2:
[B]Here is version 9 :
Cool! :yeah:
I have just one remark:
- deleted the Rock_LaPlate.dsd file from the Locations folder
- removed the aud_node in Rock_LaPlate.dat
[...]
- added LLH_LaPlate.dsd
If the lighthouse (not this one in particular but I hope that, once finished, we can use its files as template for quickly importing in game similar models), is removed from game or destroyed, after your changes the sound source would be destroyed too, whereas the rock/base would stay in game, though without SFX. Is there no way to tie them back to the 'terrain object portion' of our model? I have seen that most if not all the harbors in SHIII have dsd files and SoundSource controllers connected with them, and I hoped we could do the same with our model :hmm2:
Found this page with some interesting sound loops:
https://www.soundsnap.com/tags/lapping
The one that I think more fit for our needs is the one called 'Rocky lakeshore, small waves lapping - quick and bubbly'
The following SFX are nice too, but they come with some squeaky/chirpy sound (as cricket's calls) which are a bit out of place for our model:
https://freesound.org/people/Benboncan/sounds/82058/
Tomorrow I will look for other sounds, in the meanwhile let me know about the ones above :salute:
Kendras
07-19-17, 07:57 PM
If the lighthouse (not this one in particular but I hope that, once finished, we can use its files as template for quickly importing in game similar models), is removed from game or destroyed, after your changes the sound source would be destroyed too, whereas the rock/base would stay in game, though without SFX. Is there no way to tie them back to the 'terrain object portion' of our model? I have seen that most if not all the harbors in SHIII have dsd files and SoundSource controllers connected with them, and I hoped we could do the same with our model :hmm2:
I agree. The sound was not working with the terrain object. But now you remind me that harbours have also sound attached, I had a look into a harbour's .dsd file, and I saw that the sound attached is 'Ambient.Harbour'. So I guess that it will work with your terrain object after I changed 'Land' to 'Ambient'. :)
I agree. The sound was not working with the terrain object. But now you remind me that harbours have also sound attached, I had a look into a harbour's .dsd file, and I saw that the sound attached is 'Ambient.Harbour'. So I guess that it will work with your terrain object after I changed 'Land' to 'Ambient'. :)
Yep, I was looking exactly at that. 'Ambient' and 'Animations' are the sound prefixes most commonly associated with harbours :03:
P.S: what about linking seagulls to the model? It would be cool seeing them flying over our lighthouses :D
Kendras
07-19-17, 08:05 PM
Found this page with some interesting sound loops:
https://www.soundsnap.com/tags/lapping
The one that I think more fit for our needs is the one called 'Rocky lakeshore, small waves lapping - quick and bubbly'
Cool sounds ! This one sounds pretty good : "Lake, water lapping against rocky shore - calm ebb and flow".
What about linking seagulls to the model? It would be cool seeing them flying over our lighthouses :D
Good idea, but I think this is hardcoded ...
Cool sounds ! This one sounds pretty good : "Lake, water lapping against rocky shore - calm ebb and flow".
Not bad, but can't you hear the sizzling background noise, as of small pebbles dragged by the waves? That has nothing to do with our model, I still prefer 'Rocky lakeshore, small waves lapping - quick and bubbly' which is very similar to the one you like BTW, except for that noise :03:
Good idea, but I think this is hardcoded ...
Probably yes. We can try, the seagull will probably show up, but there will be only one, and it will probably be static in the air :hmmm:
Kendras
07-19-17, 08:41 PM
Sound is working with the terrain object ! :)
Not bad, but can't you hear the sizzling background noise, as of small pebbles dragged by the waves? That has nothing to do with our model, I still prefer 'Rocky lakeshore, small waves lapping - quick and bubbly' which is very similar to the one you like BTW, except for that noise.
Believe me, it can't be noticed in game.
So, here is version 10 ! :woot:
http://www.mediafire.com/file/mx69u5mkew2xobo/gap%2C_Kendras_%26_MLF_-_Tourelle_de_La_Plate_v10.7z
Change log :
- deleted LLH_LaPlate.dsd
- restored the aud_node in Rock_LaPlate.dat
- restored and modified Rock_LaPlate.dsd
- added lap_rock.wav
- modified Sh3.sdl
Sound is working with the terrain object ! :)
:up:
Believe me, it can't be noticed in game.
I give up on that lol :doh: :D
So, here is version 10 ! :woot:
:yeah:
Time to see if we can give additional texture maps to our model now! :03:
Kendras
07-20-17, 07:36 AM
Not bad, but can't you hear the sizzling background noise, as of small pebbles dragged by the waves? That has nothing to do with our model, I still prefer 'Rocky lakeshore, small waves lapping - quick and bubbly' which is very similar to the one you like BTW, except for that noise
I also saved the sound you're looking for. Let's use it for the rocky islands, and keep the one I chose for smooth obstacles (La Plate, U-Boot bunkers ... :D). It will also allow the island sound to be hear from a geater distance, by setting specific values (min and max distances) in Sh3.sdl !
I also saved the sound you're looking for. Let's use it for the rocky islands, and keep the one I chose for smooth obstacles (La Plate, U-Boot bunkers ... :D).
Imo it is quite the reverse: I see the one you chose more suitable for rocky islands as La Vieille, and my one better suited for small obstacles as La Plate :D
P.S: how do you save those sounds? I have recorded them using WavePad, but I have noticed a decay in sound quality :hmmm:
Kendras
07-20-17, 07:55 AM
Imo it is quite the reverse: I see the one you chose more suitable for rocky islands as La Vieille, and my one better suited for small obstacles as La Plate :D
:haha: That's not very easy to say ! I think your sound is more natural and is good for rock or beach. Mine is more rude and better suitted for human devices. But that's just a personal feeling. ;)
P.S: how do you save those sounds? I have recorded them using WavePad, but I have noticed a decay in sound quality :hmmm:
With Audacity, and also a decay in sound qualit, but not (or very hardly) noticable in Sh3, with the other ambient sounds (sea, seagulls, wind, u-boat).
:haha: That's not very easy to say ! I think your sound is more natural and is good for rock or beach. Mine is more rude and better suitted for human devices. But that's just a personal feeling. ;)
My sound being more quiet, soft and uniform, I think it is best suited for a small and smooth obstacle raising abruptly from the 17-m-deep sea bottom, such as the concrete base of La Plate. On the contrary I see your sound more adequate for moderate waves lapping in shallower waters against an irregular rocky coastline. Anyway those are just details, and switching sound files is easy enough that we can post-pone our decision to a second moment :03:
With Audacity, and also a decay in sound qualit, but not (or very hardly) noticable in Sh3, with the other ambient sounds (sea, seagulls, wind, u-boat).
I wonder if there is a way to record stereo mix audio without such a loss of quality :hmmm:
Kendras
07-20-17, 08:23 AM
Just a detail : could you remove the residual green mud from the texture, it's visible on the ladders.
http://i.imgur.com/aCDsw0u.png
Just a detail : could you remove the residual green mud from the texture, it's visible on the ladders.
So far I thought you loved Phaeophyceae (https://fr.wikipedia.org/wiki/Phaeophyceae), but I start suspecting that you actually hate Chlorophyta (https://fr.wikipedia.org/wiki/Algue_verte). By any chance, did you happen to slip on one of them as a kid? :D
Out of jokes: both green and brown algae are common on bedrocks and other hard substrates of the lower intertidal (https://fr.wikipedia.org/wiki/Estran) zone and of the infralittoral (https://fr.wikipedia.org/wiki/%C3%89tage_infralittoral) zone. Some times those seaweeds form mixed communities, some other times one species belonging to either group prevails on others. In any case, unlike their name, brown algae are rarely fully brown, as they rely on chlorophyll -which is a green pigment- for their nutrition. A good example of that is Dictyota dichotoma (https://fr.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dictyota_dichotoma), a brown alga common in the Mediterranean and in the North Atlantic, but I could bring many more examples.
I am sorry to sound like a professor (I hope I didn't), but besides being a sea lover, I am also a biologist... :O: :salute:
That said, I am ready to remove the remaining green spots if you explain your point :up:
So, the more I read about SHIII and texture maps, the more I get convinced that the game can't manage more than two textures per material at a time. Detracting from that the one texture channel used by the diffuse map and ignoring the ambient occlusion map, which was blended to the diffuse texture, we are left with just one channel which we can use either for the specular or for the normal map. Which one should we use? :hmmm:
Personally I would opt for the specular map, but I wish to listen to your opinion before anything. Should you need a description of how each texture map works, please read the document below:
http://wiki.splashdamage.com/index.php/Basic_Texture_Overview
Kendras
07-20-17, 11:06 AM
That said, I am ready to remove the remaining green spots if you explain your point :up:
It's quite simple : it's not logical to have fresh algae on the ladders. There may rather be some rusty metal. And on all pictures I saw of La Plate, there is only brownish mud on the base. Last point : the green mud is very visible and pixelised on the ladders, and looking very ugly, looking more like radioactive mud. :lol:
So, the more I read about SHIII and texture maps, the more I get convinced that the game can't manage more than two textures per material at a time. Detracting from that the one texture channel used by the diffuse map and ignoring the ambient occlusion map, which was blended to the diffuse texture, we are left with just one channel which we can use either for the specular or for the normal map. Which one should we use? :hmmm:
Personally I would opt for the specular map, but I wish to listen to your opinion before anything. Should you need a description of how each texture map works, please read the document below:
http://wiki.splashdamage.com/index.php/Basic_Texture_Overview
Yeah, not easy. First, are normal maps working in SH3 ? Specular maps are more important IMO, because you can choose 2 parameters : the shininess and its saturation. But is it working in SH3 ? Why can you choose also the specular strenght of a diffuse map ?
About glow maps, is this the type used by the buildings' and ships' windows with light at night ?
Kendras
07-20-17, 11:33 AM
By the way, since I gave real coordinates to lighthouses, here are the ones with a new depth :
pierres noires -52
petit minou -17.51
tevennec -18
It's quite simple : it's not logical to have fresh algae on the ladders.
Not logical you say? :hmmm:
These pictures must have been photoshopped then :O:
http://texture-maps.com/sites/default/files/bernac/vzeeW_72_MF.JPG
http://l7.alamy.com/zooms/fd6c648a7d254468b6154595f04411e6/margate-seaside-harbour-ladder-hn66wh.jpg
http://l7.alamy.com/zooms/efd5a54118c241e2980b795586b48c63/an-old-rusty-metal-ladder-in-tenbys-harbor-wales-uk-j4awyp.jpg
There may rather be some rusty metal.
There is. I have applied semi-transparent overlays to that texture and arranged ladder's UV projections so that top rungs are incrementally more rusty and lesser weedy than lower ones. There was a lot of work involved :yep:
The effect is partly lost now due to the heavy hue/saturation adjustment layer I applied after your complaints, but it is clearly visible in the original version of the texture.
http://i.imgur.com/VJq0JvR.jpg
And on all pictures I saw of La Plate, there is only brownish mud on the base.
What you call "mud" is actually algae, and I don't object on its brownish tone, but like it or not, there is a also a green component to it which makes it more "greenish-brownish" than simply "brownish" :03:
http://static.panoramio.com/photos/original/4451898.jpg
http://i1.wp.com/audierne.info/audierne-info/wp-content/uploads/2015/03/plate_pgay_540.jpg?resize=540%2C800
There's even a picture where the base looks almost emerald green (look closely under the water line), but that's mostly due to the interaction of the blue sea colour with the greenish colour of the seaweeds:
http://www.dirm.nord-atlantique-manche-ouest.developpement-durable.gouv.fr/local/cache-vignettes/L225xH300/Tourelle_La_Plate_vignette_internet_cle283658-1-3714e.jpg
Last point : the green mud is very visible and pixelised on the ladders, and looking very ugly, looking more like radioactive mud. :lol:
I agree on that. That's due to the blurred borders of the adjustment layer I applied following your suggestion: due to it, the most external pixels are hardly affected by the layer and they contrast with the rest. If we agree on the other points, I will see what I can do with it :up:
Yeah, not easy. First, are normal maps working in SH3 ?
I think so. If memory serves me well, crew models and a few more models use normal maps to create extra "detail"
Specular maps are more important IMO, because you can choose 2 parameters : the shininess and its saturation.
Usually specular maps are stored in the alpha channel so no saturation: only shininess. :yep:
But is it working in SH3 ?
It should. There is a controller for it. Anyway, soon we will know more about it, when I will send you my next update :03:
Why can you choose also the specular strenght of a diffuse map ?
Specular strength, similar to Glossiness, is not a diffuse map parameter but a material parameter. I think Specular strength has no effect if no specular map is enabled for any given materia. Not sure about Glossiness, but probably it doesn't require a specular map. I will let you to play with those parameters once I enable that map. Tweaking them before I send you the next alpha version would be a waste of time, as the specular map can change drastically the look of the materials we have set so far. :yep:
About glow maps, is this the type used by the buildings' and ships' windows with light at night ?
Yep, sure. It is enabled through the CityLights controller IIRC. It might come in handy for illuminating the windows of some lighthouses pertaining to neutral countries. :salute:
By the way, since I gave real coordinates to lighthouses, here are the ones with a new depth :
pierres noires -52
petit minou -17.51
tevennec -18
Very useful, thanks :up:
...but...
is the sea around the Pierre Noires lighthouse really that deep? :o
I have checked on Google Earth, and in reality near that lighthouse the seabed should lay under 10-12 meters of water. Either you entered the wrong coordinates or, as it is more likely, devs got the sea profile totally wrong there and we will have to fix it: I can not create a 80-m-high island lol :doh:
Kendras
07-20-17, 06:13 PM
Very useful, thanks :up:
...but...
is the sea around the Pierre Noires lighthouse really that deep? :o
I have checked on Google Earth, and in reality near that lighthouse the seabed should lay under 10-12 meters of water. Either you entered the wrong coordinates or, as it is more likely, devs got the sea profile totally wrong there and we will have to fix it: I can not create a 80-m-high island lol :doh:
I let you compare between the SH3 map, and the real depth map :
http://i.imgur.com/mFyLFn5.png
http://i.imgur.com/2yajPpJ.png
I let you compare between the SH3 map, and the real depth map :
Well done maps :up:
Reflect map setting is finished. Hopefully it will work. I am now working on lighthouse damage. I am setting some new damage zones. Is that okay? :)
Kendras
07-20-17, 07:40 PM
Well done maps :up:
Reflect map setting is finished. Hopefully it will work. I am now working on lighthouse damage. I am setting some new damage zones. Is that okay? :)
Mmh, why not ? Especially the gas tank for the light which could explode ... :)
Mmh, why not ? Especially the gas tank for the light which could explode ... :)
:haha:
You read in my mind :arrgh!:
Could you help me setting the new zones I set?
[ReinforcedTower]
Multiplier=1.000000
Flotability=0.000000
HitPoints=1
Armor Level=1
Critic Flotation=0.300000
Critical=No
FloodingTime=59.999996
CargoType=None
[ConcreteTower]
Multiplier=1.000000
Flotability=0.000000
HitPoints=1
Armor Level=1
Critic Flotation=0.300000
Critical=No
FloodingTime=59.999996
CargoType=None
[StoneTower]
Multiplier=1.000000
Flotability=0.000000
HitPoints=1
Armor Level=1
Critic Flotation=0.300000
Critical=No
FloodingTime=59.999996
CargoType=None
[BrickTower]
Multiplier=1.000000
Flotability=0.000000
HitPoints=1
Armor Level=1
Critic Flotation=0.300000
Critical=No
FloodingTime=59.999996
CargoType=None
[MetalTower]
Multiplier=1.000000
Flotability=0.000000
HitPoints=1
Effect1=Effect1=#Fire_small, 70
Effect2=#Fire_big, 100
Armor Level=1
Critic Flotation=0.300000
Critical=No
FloodingTime=59.999996
CargoType=None
[SkeletalTower]
Multiplier=1.000000
Flotability=0.000000
HitPoints=1
Effect1=Effect1=#Fire_small, 70
Effect2=#Fire_big, 100
Armor Level=1
Critic Flotation=0.300000
Critical=No
FloodingTime=59.999996
CargoType=None
[GasCylinder]
Multiplier=3.000000
Flotability=0.000000
HitPoints=5
Destructible=Yes
Effect1=#Small_splinter_explosion_no_halo, 100
Effect2=#Fire_big, 100
Armor Level=1
Critic Flotation=0.300000
Critical=No
FloodingTime=59.999996
CargoType=None
[LanternRoom]
Multiplier=1.000000
Flotability=0.000000
HitPoints=1
Destructible=Yes
Effect1=Effect1=#Fire_small, 70
Effect2=#Fire_big, 100
Armor Level=1
Critic Flotation=0.300000
Critical=No
FloodingTime=59.999996
CargoType=None
[LanternBig]
Multiplier=1.000000
Flotability=0.000000
HitPoints=1
Destructible=Yes
Effect1=#Small_splinter_explosion_no_halo, 100
Armor Level=1
Critic Flotation=0.300000
Critical=No
FloodingTime=59.999996
CargoType=None
[LanternSmall]
Multiplier=1.000000
Flotability=0.000000
HitPoints=5
Destructible=Yes
Armor Level=1
Critic Flotation=0.300000
Critical=No
FloodingTime=59.999996
CargoType=None
'Tower' zones should be used with main lighthouse buildings, the remaining zones are for their 'equipments'. Towers are ordered in what I think should be a decreasing order of Armor Level/Hit Points, but I leave it on you. Among them, imo only metal and skeletal towers should have fire effects , due to them being likely painted with flammable enamel paints. LanterSmall should be used with small lanterns, like the one of the La Plate lighthouse; I think a well aimed 20mm round should be capable of disabling it. LanternBig is meant for Fresnel lenses. Disabling them should take something bigger, or several 20mm rounds. I have set GasCylinder's Hit Points and Armor level to 5 and 1 respectively (that's the only zone I really worked on, all the other zones have more or less the same basic settings). A single 20 mm round hitting it should be able to destroy it. Explosion and fire effects are triggered at 100% damage, as I thought that gas explosion is an "all or nothing" phenomenon. feel free of adding other zone type you might think of. That's all I think :salute:
Kendras
07-21-17, 03:33 AM
Could you help me setting the new zones I set?
'Tower' zones should be used with main lighthouse buildings, the remaining zones are for their 'equipments'. Towers are ordered in what I think should be a decreasing order of Armor Level/Hit Points, but I leave it on you. Among them, imo only metal and skeletal towers should have fire effects , due to them being likely painted with flammable enamel paints. LanterSmall should be used with small lanterns, like the one of the La Plate lighthouse; I think a well aimed 20mm round should be capable of disabling it. LanternBig is meant for Fresnel lenses. Disabling them should take something bigger, or several 20mm rounds. I have set GasCylinder's Hit Points and Armor level to 5 and 1 respectively (that's the only zone I really worked on, all the other zones have more or less the same basic settings). A single 20 mm round hitting it should be able to destroy it. Explosion and fire effects are triggered at 100% damage, as I thought that gas explosion is an "all or nothing" phenomenon. feel free of adding other zone type you might think of. That's all I think :salute:
No problem. Some gunfire exercice for my SH5 converted Nelson ! :shucks: :03:
Kendras
07-21-17, 07:25 AM
Shells are passing through the tower without hitting ... :wah:
All your 3D models are ghosts. :doh:
Shells are passing through the tower without hitting ... :wah:
All your 3D models are ghosts. :doh:
No panic, I am currently working at some good damage decals :D
Have you finished with damage zones setting?
All the stock land units I have seen have a .zon file with a SH3ZonesCtrl controller and a damage box attached to it. I have already set up those items for our lighthouse unit and for the platform, lantern and topmark library equipments.
That is a very simplified configuration though, and I doubts it can really enable ammo damage to be taken by any unit.
Looking into Jeff's Maunsell forts, I have noticed he added a CollisonableObject controller to their zon files, as I would have thought logical also for other land units. I will add that controller to our model too.
I will also add collision spheres. They are probably not needed for ammo damage, but they will make our model 'solid' to the camera and to other objects that might collide with it (especially planes: ships will collide with the base instead, which is already collisionable thanks to the StaticObject controller).
Add to those controllers a sim file with cmdr_AI* and unit_* controllers. Again, I am not really sure that those controllers are required for damage detection, possibly not; probably not the two of them. In any case, they might be needed for enemy units to 'see' and attack our lighthouses. If that was true, we could omit the said controllers for the lighthouses that we don't want to be attacked, while still being able to damage/destroy them with our guns :arrgh!:
Stay tuned for an update by me before dark :salute:
Kendras
07-21-17, 11:35 AM
Have you finished with damage zones setting?
Yes, that was easy. I have added the new zones to Zones.cfg (and chose values for each parameters, but couldn't test in game), created the .zon files for the land unit and library objects, also added the .sim file for the land unit because the unit couldn't be detected by Nelson.
That is a very simplified configuration though, and I doubts it can really enable ammo damage to be taken by any unit.
Looking into Jeff's Maunsell forts, I have noticed he added a CollisonableObject controller to their zon files, as I would have thought logical also for other land units. I will add that controller to our model too.
Let's see. :hmmm:
I will also add collision spheres. They are probably not needed for ammo damage, but they will make our model 'solid' to the camera and to other objects that might collide with it (especially planes: ships will collide with the base instead, which is already collisionable thanks to the StaticObject controller).
The problem if you link collision spheres directly to the main model, is that when destroyed, the object will be thrown into the air, like an airplane's wing. This can't be realistic for a massive building. So, maybe if we link the collision spheres to a child node ?
Add to those controllers a sim file with cmdr_AI* and unit_* controllers. Again, I am not really sure that those controllers are required for damage detection, possibly not; probably not the two of them. In any case, they might be needed for enemy units to 'see' and attack our lighthouses. If that was true, we could omit the said controllers for the lighthouses that we don't want to be attacked, while still being able to damage/destroy them with our guns
Yes, exactly. :up:
Yes, that was easy. I have added the new zones to Zones.cfg (and chose values for each parameters, but couldn't test in game)
Can you please copy/paste you settings here, so that my files will be up-to-date with your changes, when I upload them? :)
created the .zon files for the land unit and library objects
Did you match damage boxes' and 3D models' shape and position? Did you specify the correct zone number for each damage box you added?
also added the .sim file for the land unit because the unit couldn't be detected by Nelson.
:up:
Let's see. :hmmm:
CollisonableObject missing is my first candidate as a reason for damage not working during your tests
The problem if you link collision spheres directly to the main model, is that when destroyed, the object will be thrown into the air, like an airplane's wing. This can't be realistic for a massive building. So, maybe if we link the collision spheres to a child node ?
Okay, we will test without collision spheres first. This will actually make my update to come faster, as spheres were the last feature I wanted to add before the next alpha, but why do you think the lighthouse will be thrown in the air, if we add them? :hmm2:
The update will be ready in about 30 minutes: just the time to wait for your zone settings, to revise the files for errors, to pack the up in a zip file, and to write the change log :salute:
La voilà:
https://www.mediafire.com/?coftg94397kwhns
Change Log:
Adjusted Caustic controller's parameters according to the settings of stock ships. The effect should look better now (the initial FPS setting was extremely low), and it should be visible (also) above water. Let me know if those improvement are noticeable on your system.
Adjusted Y Translation values of placement nodes in Rock_LaPlate.dat for a sea depth of 17 meters, as inferred from La Plate's position height in Kendras' mis file. This should make the rock to lay perfectly on the sea bed, and improve the vertical alignment of tower and concrete base.
Added a SpecularMask action controller to all the 'concrete' and 'metal' materials in LLH_LaPlate.dat and Lighthouse_Parts.dat, and restored the alpha channels of LH_LaPlate.tga and Rock_LaPlate.tga. There should finally be specular reflections on the model, changing with light conditions and material settings. If everything hopefully works it is about time to mess with material properties. Some tweaking of textures' alpha channels migh be required too :03:
Corrected some small mistakes of the platform 3D model in the library file, and adjusted accordingly the AO map overlapped to the diffuse texture.
Added GWX's version of Zones.cfg file to the mod with some new damage zones to be used for lighthouse damage. Damage settings still under development.
Added a LLH_LaPlate.zon and a Lighthouse.zon file with SH3ZonesCtrl controllers and damage boxes for the lighthouse and its subparts. Those boxes have been assigned the newly added damage zones as their type. Other settings still under development.
Added a CollisionableObject controller to LLH_LaPlate.zon. Its settings are still under development. I hope that the three additions above will be sufficient to make damage detection to work for our model.
Added a LLH_LaPlate.sim file with cmdr AICostalDefense and unit_CostalDefense controllers, so to make other units to 'see' and react to our lighthouse.
Added a LLH_LaPlate.val file with VisualDamage controllers. I am currently working on new and more appropriate concrete damage decals to be set in the controller. After implementing the new textures, the adjustment of other parameters in the controller might be required.
That should be all for this update. I am waiting for your feedback Kendras, and I hope that someone else will join our testing/modding team while we wait for MLF to report back on duty :D
gap off for now :salute:
.
If no one volunteers and we become too impatient for waiting MLF to get back to us, I might decide to once again istall the game on my computer :D
I am waiting for your feedback Kendras, and I hope that someone else will join our testing/modding team while we wait for MLF to report back on duty :D
Hello - you 2 have been making good progress :Kaleun_Salute: I've just checked on my iPad
I should be in a position to test the latest version tomorrow with a bit of luck, but I can't say when. Anything specific you would like tested?
I can't believe you are doing all this without an installation - remarkable :Kaleun_Applaud:
Regards,
MLF
Hello - you 2 have been making good progress :Kaleun_Salute: I've just checked on my iPad
Thank you MLF, we missed you :O:
I should be in a position to test the latest version tomorrow with a bit of luck, but I can't say when.
No hurry :up:
Anything specific you would like tested?
Yes, Kendras is dealing with damage modelling now, but due to his poor gfx card he cannot be sure about visual stuff. You should keep an eye on:
- Water reflections: I have applied the Min and MaxVisDis settings you had suggested, and I would like to know if reflections look okay now.
- Caustics: I have added caustics to the lighrhouse base and during one of his tests Kendras reported seeing them, but only underwater. I have adjusted controller's parameters, and I would like to know if caustics look okay now.
- Specular reflections on the model: as you probably have read already, in the latest version I have added relfection controllers to most materials used on the model and on its subparts. How do they look in game?
- One last thing: tle latest versions of the mod have restored light effect in its original configuration, i.e. halo FX on, but eithout water reflections. Thatis due to the two controller crashing the game when working together, as you and Kendras have reported. In v. 8 I have included a copy of the FX file without halo but with water reflections. Could you tell us:
a. if witha that file enbaled in place of the standard one, water reflections work
b. what is more desiderable/better looking among halo lights, or lights casting light on water? :)
I can't believe you are doing all this without an installation - remarkable :Kaleun_Applaud:
I am long used to that. I rarely run SHIV and 5, even if I have them installed on my system and working. I have a copy of SHIII + GWX on the hard disk of an old laptop that I use now as an external data storage disc. I cannot play the game from it obviously, but I can look into its files. I can figure out many things from them, but I couldn't have progressed to that point without your and Kendra's precious work :salute:
Kendras
07-21-17, 05:52 PM
Good news :
- the beacon can take damage now
- it's destroyable as expected
Bad news :
- when the lantern or the platform is destroyed, the halo is still lightning over the beacon
- the specular maps don't work, the beacon is quite black :
http://i.imgur.com/Fmvqnfz.png
http://i.imgur.com/v32SFE7.png
Question :
- how can you determine so precise values for damage zones ?
Notes :
If the platform is destroyed, the lantern and top mark are still visible, so :
- I have moved the Y02 as child node of the platform
- Y03 transformed into a child placement node of the platform
Good news :
- the beacon can take damage now
- it's destroyable as expected
:yeah:
What happend when it is destroyed? It simply disappears from game or what else?
- when the lantern or the platform is destroyed, the halo is still lightning over the beacon
That's odd. I expected the lantern not to disappear from game when its platform is destroyed: that happens becasue lplatform and lantern have no relationship (I might have a better fix than the one you have devised, I will post a patch for that shortly), but the light effect is tied to the lantern through placement node, so detsroying the lantern should definitely destroy the FX attached to it :hmmm:
- the specular maps don't work, the beacon is quite black
Okay, I am sure there is a fix for that too. Let's wait for MLF's report first.
- how can you determine so precise values for damage zones ?
s3d damage editor. You access it from a button with 3d cubes on it, near the texture rendering buttons in model preview interface- :03:
- I have moved the Y02 as child node of the platform
- Y03 transformed into a child placement node of the platform
Do you mean you set Y02 as a child node of Y01, or as child of the platform equipment in library file? As I said before, I might have a better soluce. If spossible, I would like those nodes to be indipendent and fully configurable...
@ Kendras
Please, enabled this patch on top of alpha v 11 without your node changes, and tell me if now lantern and topmark are destroyed when the platform is destroyed:
https://www.mediafire.com/?szcdtoxxs1401qc
Should the light still shine when the group of equipments is destroyed, try removing the RayTraceHalo controller from the light FX. I am under the feeling that this controller causes more problems than else :hmmm:
Kendras
07-21-17, 06:33 PM
s3d damage editor. You access it from a button with 3d cubes on it, near the texture rendering buttons in model preview interface-
I knew that. I mean how you give so precise values, with 6 decimal digits ? :doh:
Do you mean you set Y02 as a child node of Y01, or as child of the platform equipment in library file?
as child of the platform equipment in library file.
More answers tomorrow, I need to sleep, and night gives advices. :O:
I knew that. I mean how you give so precise values, with 6 decimal digits ? :doh:
Vertex coordinates in Wings3D :03:
as child of the platform equipment in library file.
Okay, if that works, it could be a good solution also for the topmark, but let's test the patch I have posted a few minute ago first
More answers tomorrow, I need to sleep, and night gives advices. :O:
:up: :salute:
Tonight is too hot and there are too many mosquitos in the room, can't sleep :doh:
Anyway, while at bed I was considering the reflect map corruption problem. The next information I need from you is wether rock's texture is similarly corrupted or not. Moreover, there is a set of tests you could do for us:
resize LH_LaPlate.tga to 512x512 pixels saving it as a 32 bits/pixel tga, no compression;
if that doesn't fix the problem,
embed the resized LH_LaPlate.tga to the first material in LLH_LaPlate.dat;
if that doesn't make any difference,
rename the labels of the two materials in LH_LaPlate.tga to whatever you want, LaPlate_Concrete1 and LaPlate_Metal1 for example;
if that doesn't work either,
tomorrow we will think about something else! :03:
gap off :zzz: :salute:
Hi gap,Kendras.
Here are my findings:-
.
- Water reflections: I have applied the Min and MaxVisDis settings you had suggested, and I would like to know if reflections look okay now.
The reflections look good, apart from the light (halo) missing - that doesn't look right IMO. See screenshot 1
- Caustics: I have added caustics to the lighrhouse base and during one of his tests Kendras reported seeing them, but only underwater. I have adjusted controller's parameters, and I would like to know if caustics look okay now.
I believe caustics are the reflection of light from 1 surface to another. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Caustic_(optics)
I would therefore expect to see light being reflected from the sea on to the lighthouse which I don't I'm afraid. However the light/shade does change when the sun moves around the tower. (See screenshot 2 and 3)
- Specular reflections on the model: as you probably have read already, in the latest version I have added relfection controllers to most materials used on the model and on its subparts. How do they look in game?
As Kendras reports, the model was black with speckles. I deleted the alpha channel and the light was rendered correctly but possibly specular reflections isn't working?
- One last thing: tle latest versions of the mod have restored light effect in its original configuration, i.e. halo FX on, but eithout water reflections. Thatis due to the two controller crashing the game when working together, as you and Kendras have reported. In v. 8 I have included a copy of the FX file without halo but with water reflections. Could you tell us:
a. if witha that file enbaled in place of the standard one, water reflections work
b. what is more desiderable/better looking among halo lights, or lights casting light on water?
I believe the reflection of the light on the water is more desirable as you have to be very close to the light to see the line under the platform which is still there. (See screenshot 4)
I also noticed a gap (not you) appearing between the tower and the base/rock as the sea level rises and falls – IMO not critical as underwater (See screenshots 5&6)
Chart Icon is much much better. (Screenshot 7):up:
Rock and tower both collisionable (Screenshots 8 & 9):Kaleun_Thumbs_Up:
As reported by Kendras, after shooting away the light – halo and top mark still exist. (Screenshot 10)
Hope this helps :)
Out for most of day, so won't be able to test.
Regards,
MLF
Kendras
07-22-17, 05:39 AM
What happend when it is destroyed? It simply disappears from game or what else?
The tower falls down, and then disappears.
http://i.imgur.com/VECQwrj.png
The next information I need from you is wether rock's texture is similarly corrupted or not.
Yes, similarly corrupted.
Moreover, there is a set of tests you could do for us:
resize LH_LaPlate.tga to 512x512 pixels saving it as a 32 bits/pixel tga, no compression;
if that doesn't fix the problem,
embed the resized LH_LaPlate.tga to the first material in LLH_LaPlate.dat;
if that doesn't make any difference,
rename the labels of the two materials in LH_LaPlate.tga to whatever you want, LaPlate_Concrete1 and LaPlate_Metal1 for example;
Nothing is working. I did exactly as you asked, and here is the result at the end :
http://i.imgur.com/50mFVkl.png
the_frog
07-22-17, 07:17 AM
Kendras, gap,
in case you two want to have an addtional opinion about the texture issue, send me the *.dat file plus the texture (original site prefered)
The reflections look good, apart from the light (halo) missing - that doesn't look right IMO. See screenshot 1
Okay, I hope in the next days you will get the time to test my tweaks of the light FX without halo but with water reflection controller. See one of my answers below for more details on that.
I believe caustics are the reflection of light from 1 surface to another. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Caustic_(optics)
Yes, you are right. More specifically, caustics are sun rays refracted by the wavy sea surface and reflected on other surfaces. This is how this optical effect looks in reality:
https://ak2.picdn.net/shutterstock/videos/555832/thumb/1.jpg
and this is how SH5 mimics it:
http://www.jlynson.com/images/SH5/sh5_detailed_caustics_v01_after.jpg
I know caustics are also featured in SHIII, but I don't know how well implemented they are.
I would therefore expect to see light being reflected from the sea on to the lighthouse which I don't I'm afraid. However the light/shade does change when the sun moves around the tower. (See screenshot 2 and 3)
Yes, I don't see any caustics in your screenshot :hmmm:
As Kendras reports, the model was black with speckles. I deleted the alpha channel and the light was rendered correctly but possibly specular reflections isn't working?
No, specular reflections are coming from the alpha channel. No alpha channel, no specularity :)
I believe the reflection of the light on the water is more desirable as you have to be very close to the light to see the line under the platform which is still there. (See screenshot 4)
I think there's a misunderstanding here: to the best of my knowledge the main purpose of the RayTracedHalo controller, is making light sources to cast light on surrounding objects. When Kendras worked on the light effect (now stored in the Lighthouse_FX file), he added one to the light node, and this is where the light halo on platform's underside is coming from, I think. The controller has two states: "True" and "False"; when used in its main role, the controller must be set to "True", but I have read on the forum that the same controller could be used on some objects for making them to block the light from a nearby light source, so to prevent the light from affecting its back faces. As far as I understood, this is done by adding a second RayTracedHalo controller to the desired object, and by setting its flag to "False". This is exactly what I did with the platform, as i thought it could cure the glitch shown in your screenshot. When you tested my files, you reported that nothing had changes and I removed the controller (the one set to "False" from the platform, not the one one attached to the light effect, which is set to "True" and which has always been there from day one.
I then tried to add water reflections to the ligh effect, and attached a WaterReflectionController to it. When you tested this new version, you told me that the game crashed just after the first light flash and that you fixed the problem by removing the RayTracedHalo controller. That must have been the one stored in Lighthouse_FX, as the other one (the I had previously attached to the platform) had already been removed. Now my question is:
after you removed that controller, were light reflections working? was the lack of light halo acceptable?
I hope I made myself clear this time :)
I also noticed a gap (not you) appearing between the tower and the base/rock as the sea level rises and falls – IMO not critical as underwater (See screenshots 5&6)
That's a bit puzzling too. :hmmm:
You said a gap "between the tower and the base/rock". Base/rock and tower are two separate objects, that's right. Their junction lies at the top of the concrete base (bottom of the yellow/black tower), and it is well above the sea level. Your screenshot and your wording clearly show that the glich happens underwater, near the water line, and that it only affects the concrete base, which is a solid mesh. Did you ever notice a similar glitch while testing other versions of the mod? Might the Caustics controller (attached to the base) have anything to do with it? :hmm2:
Chart Icon is much much better. (Screenshot 7):up:
:up:
Rock and tower both collisionable (Screenshots 8 & 9):Kaleun_Thumbs_Up:
:up:
As reported by Kendras, after shooting away the light – halo and top mark still exist. (Screenshot 10)
That was expected. I wish someone had tested v11 with patch 1 (http://www.subsim.com/radioroom/showpost.php?p=2501980&postcount=334) enabled on top of it :03:
Hope this helps :)
Out for most of day, so won't be able to test.
Sure it did! Thank you for your feedback and enjoy the week-end :salute:
The tower falls down, and then disappears.
Coool :yeah:
I have one of the damage decals ready, and another one is in the works. When we finish with more important features/fixes, I can create a destroyed tower model to be linked to the main model through ObjectRemains controller (or, if it doesn't work, I can split the main model in two halves), and we can work on some 'concrete debris falling in the water' effect. What do you think? :D
P.S: can you please copy/paste your zone settings here?
I might decide to reinstall the game and to do some tests myself :)
Nothing is working. I did exactly as you asked, and here is the result at the end
Okay, no problem: we will fix it. I would give up on that if I wasn't sure that a good specular mask could greatly improve the look of that model :up:
Kendras, gap,
in case you two want to have an addtional opinion about the texture issue, send me the *.dat file plus the texture (original site prefered)
Sure we want... if only you could join our dev team, this mod would probably be finished in a matter of days! :Kaleun_Salivating:
This is the latest public alpha with reflection map enabled but corrupted:
http://www.subsim.com/radioroom/showpost.php?p=2501939&postcount=329
Should you want to carry out some ballistic tests as well, I suggest you to enable this patch on top of the main mod:
http://www.subsim.com/radioroom/showpost.php?p=2501980&postcount=334
:salute:
Nothing is working. I did exactly as you asked, and here is the result at the end :
http://i.imgur.com/50mFVkl.png
Okay, no problem: we will fix it. I would give up on that if I wasn't sure that a good specular mask could greatly improve the look of that model :up:
Kendras, gap,
in case you two want to have an addtional opinion about the texture issue, send me the *.dat file plus the texture (original site prefered)
I think I know what is going on guys: alpha blending was not enabled, that made the reflection data passed on to the graphic engine, either totally black or ototally white. My bad for not thinking of it before :doh: :yep:
@ Kendras
Please scrap all the tweaks I suggested yesterday and check the 'Disable z-buffer wtite + enable alpha blend' checkbox for all the materials with SpeculaMask action controller attached :salute:
P.S: if you want to make the reflection effect more or less evident, you can play with the 'Specular strength' material property. In stock files, I have seen settings as high as 140; usually materials with no reflection map enabled, have much lower setting, similar to the ones that our 'concrete' and 'metal' materials are set to.
Kendras
07-22-17, 03:29 PM
When we finish with more important features/fixes, I can create a destroyed tower model to be linked to the main model through ObjectRemains controller (or, if it doesn't work, I can split the main model in two halves), and we can work on some 'concrete debris falling in the water' effect. What do you think?
IMO, it's not a good idea to use the ObjectRemains controller, not enough realistic to have a new model poped up from no where. The idea to create several destroyable parts is much better, like ships breaking in two parts. There, you could create several small parts that could have collisionable spheres in order they fly in the air when they are hit by shells. No need to create a new effect !
P.S: can you please copy/paste your zone settings here?
Here are my first values, but they can be a bit lowered if needed.
[ReinforcedTower]
Multiplier=1.000000
Flotability=0.000000
HitPoints=1000
Destructible=Yes
Armor Level=100
Critic Flotation=0.300000
Critical=No
FloodingTime=59.999996
CargoType=None
[ConcreteTower]
Multiplier=1.000000
Flotability=0.000000
HitPoints=1000
Destructible=Yes
Armor Level=90
Critic Flotation=0.300000
Critical=No
FloodingTime=59.999996
CargoType=None
[StoneTower]
Multiplier=1.000000
Flotability=0.000000
HitPoints=700
Destructible=Yes
Armor Level=60
Critic Flotation=0.300000
Critical=No
FloodingTime=59.999996
CargoType=None
[BrickTower]
Multiplier=1.000000
Flotability=0.000000
HitPoints=600
Destructible=Yes
Armor Level=50
Critic Flotation=0.300000
Critical=No
FloodingTime=59.999996
CargoType=None
[MetalTower]
Multiplier=1.000000
Flotability=0.000000
HitPoints=400
Destructible=Yes
Armor Level=40
Critic Flotation=0.300000
Critical=No
Effect1=Effect1=#Fire_small, 70
Effect2=#Fire_big, 100
FloodingTime=59.999996
CargoType=None
[SkeletalTower]
Multiplier=1.000000
Flotability=0.000000
Destructible=Yes
HitPoints=200
Armor Level=40
Critic Flotation=0.300000
Critical=No
Effect1=Effect1=#Fire_small, 70
Effect2=#Fire_big, 100
FloodingTime=59.999996
CargoType=None
[GasCylinder]
Multiplier=3.000000
Flotability=0.000000
HitPoints=50
Destructible=Yes
Armor Level=5
Critic Flotation=0.300000
Critical=No
Effect1=#Small_splinter_explosion_no_halo, 100
Effect2=#Fire_big, 100
FloodingTime=59.999996
CargoType=Fuel
[LanternRoom]
Multiplier=1.000000
Flotability=0.000000
HitPoints=150
Destructible=Yes
Armor Level=20
Critic Flotation=0.300000
Critical=No
Effect1=Effect1=#Fire_small, 70
Effect2=#Fire_big, 100
FloodingTime=59.999996
CargoType=None
[LanternBig]
Multiplier=1.000000
Flotability=0.000000
HitPoints=50
Destructible=Yes
Armor Level=5
Critic Flotation=0.300000
Critical=No
Effect1=#Small_splinter_explosion_no_halo, 100
FloodingTime=59.999996
CargoType=None
[LanternSmall]
Multiplier=1.000000
Flotability=0.000000
HitPoints=10
Destructible=Yes
Armor Level=1
Critic Flotation=0.300000
Critical=No
FloodingTime=59.999996
CargoType=None
Please scrap all the tweaks I suggested yesterday and check the 'Disable z-buffer wtite + enable alpha blend' checkbox for all the materials with SpeculaMask action controller attached
Still black.
Please, enabled this patch on top of alpha v 11 without your node changes, and tell me if now lantern and topmark are destroyed when the platform is destroyed
No, halo and top mark are still there after the platform is destroyed.
IMO, it's not a good idea to use the ObjectRemains controller, not enough realistic to have a new model poped up from no where.
Well, when I talked about that controler I was thinking mostly about a burned out and warped version of the tourelle, after the gas explosion :D
The idea to create several destroyable parts is much better, like ships breaking in two parts. There, you could create several small parts that could have collisionable spheres in order they fly in the air when they are hit by shells. No need to create a new effect !
Well, there is not much in that tower that can be break apart if not the tower itself, but I can break it in two detachable parts, and I can make ledge to break apart as well :03:
Here are my first values, but they can be a bit lowered if needed.
Thanks :up:
Still black.
Le's see it The_Frog can give us some clue on that :03:
No, halo and top mark are still there after the platform is destroyed.
Okay, no big problem here: your solution of moving Y02 and Y03 into the platform model is good enough :up:
Hi Kendras,
when you get time, if you select any 3d model chunk in s3d, there is an uncaptioned parameter to the right of the "Model info" section, about under the Import/Export buttons, whose exact meaning is beyond my understanding.
In most SHIII files I have seen so far (and for all the 3d objects linked to a material with SpecularMask action controller and with an alpha channel in their texture), the said parameter is set to 4, but in our files it is set to 6.
I start wondering if this is not the culprit for the corrupted reflections on our model. I know the chance of this being true is low, but as someone else said: "when you have eliminated the impossible, whatever remains, however improbable, must be the truth". Maybe worth a try? :hmm2:
Kendras
07-23-17, 09:33 AM
Hi Kendras,
when you get time, if you select any 3d model chunk in s3d, there is an uncaptioned parameter to the right of the "Model info" section, about under the Import/Export buttons, whose exact meaning is beyond my understanding.
In most SHIII files I have seen so far (and for all the 3d objects linked to a material with SpecularMask action controller and with an alpha channel in their texture), the said parameter is set to 4, but in our files it is set to 6.
I start wondering if this is not the culprit for the corrupted reflections on our model. I know the chance of this being true is low, but as someone else said: "when you have eliminated the impossible, whatever remains, however improbable, must be the truth". Maybe worth a try? :hmm2:
Hi Gap,
No. It doesn't solve our problem. :hmph:
I think the only solution to apply a specular effect is the value to choose (specular strenght), even if it gives only a uniform effect.
Hi Gap,
No. It doesn't solve our problem. :hmph:
I think the only solution to apply a specular effect is the value to choose (specular strenght), even if it gives only a uniform effect.
The way specular reflections are set in our files is nothing experimental; if you look at stock ships, you will see that their materials have the SpecularMask controller and textures with an alpha channel. I don't get why those settings work for them, but not for our unit. Can the problem be in the texture we are using?
I ask you to do one last test to narrow down the problem: export the hull texture (NBB_BismarkNewest.tga) from NBB_Bismark, rename it LH_LaPlate.tga, and drop it in the tex folder of our mod, therefore replacing the original texture, but not before you embedded it (the original version of LH_LaPlate.tga) to a copy of NBB_Bismark.dat which you will have added to our mod. Add then the Bismark to our testing mission and run it.
If our texture/alpha channel is "wrong", at this point the Bismark will have an almost antirely black hull, and our lighthouse will have messed up texture but with correct looking specular reflections. Vice versa, if the problem resides elsewhere, the Bismark will have messy -but not black- textures, and our lighthouse will still look black. :hmm2:
I ask you to do one last test to narrow down the problem...
To ease your task, I have created a patch that you can enable on top of the last alpha to test what I am suggesting:
https://www.mediafire.com/?5u88cqe4j1v484v
All you have to do is adding the Bismark to our testing mission, and run it after enabling the patch.
On a partly unrelated note, something I have noticed about stock sea units, is that they have two UV coordinates/Map channel sets. That's common in SHIV & 5 units, the second UV set being used for amblient occlusion mapping. So far, I thought that the apparently redundant Map channels in SHIII were the leftover of an abandoned feature, as their UV unwrapping is quite messy, but I start wondering if -messy as it is- it isn't required for additonal map channels (normal or specular maps) to be rendered on the model. If that was true, the implementation of only two Map channels would explain why, at best, we can only have one additional map (besides the diffuse texture) for any given model :hmmm:
Kendras
07-23-17, 03:54 PM
To ease your task, I have created a patch that you can enable on top of the last alpha to test what I am suggesting:
https://www.mediafire.com/?5u88cqe4j1v484v
All you have to do is adding the Bismark to our testing mission, and run it after enabling the patch.
My game stays blocked on the start screen of the mission ...
:k_confused: :wah:
More tests tomorrow.
:Kaleun_Sleep:
My game stays blocked on the start screen of the mission ...
:k_confused: :wah:
The test patch 1 contains only two files. I suppose it will be easy understanding which one makes the game to freeze. I suspect NBB_Bismark.dat: the version of it I have tweaked might come from GWX and might not be compatible with your game installation. The one change I made to it, is replacing the embedded hull texture with the one of our lighthouse. :03:
More tests tomorrow.
:Kaleun_Sleep:
No problem. Tomorrow, if you get time, also run a test with testing patch #2:
https://www.mediafire.com/?w7b55ob5ros1g52
This patch adds additional map channels to the tourelle and to all its parts. Maybe it is not the ultimate fix to the specular mask problem but, if my suspects are right, it should definitely make some difference in game.
If you can't see any, we will remove the alpha channels from our textures, and we will keep their implemetation (if still possible) as last task before release :salute:
Kendras
07-24-17, 07:00 AM
Results of tests with patch 1 :
- the .tga file embedded in the bismark.dat must be resized at 512x512, original size makes the mission impossible to load.
- still a problem of black pixels on the tower model
- pics :
bismark :
http://i.imgur.com/aM5MGFg.png
tower :
http://i.imgur.com/mrhXRke.png
Kendras
07-24-17, 07:05 AM
Result of test with patch 2 :
nothing new, tower is still black (and yes, i have corrected added the new files, there was no data folder)
Results of tests with patch 1 :
- the .tga file embedded in the bismark.dat must be resized at 512x512, original size makes the mission impossible to load.
Maybe there is a limit to the size an embedded texture can have. Anyway I think for final release it wil better resizing our textures and/or compressing them :03:
- still a problem of black pixels on the tower model
Okay, at least now we know that the critical element is not our texture per se :up:
Result of test with patch 2 :
nothing new, tower is still black (and yes, i have corrected added the new files, there was no data folder)
Sorry, my bad for the wrong file structure :doh:
Honestly I was expecting a different answer by you. After reading some other posts on the forum, I think that adding the new map channels to our meshes puts us in the right direction, but obviously there is something else we do wrong.
Unfortunately, as much as I looked into other modders' units and objects, I couldn't find in their files any working example of what I want to do with our lighthouses. From what I have read, I am pretty sure that Hans Witteman made an extensive use of the same concept for specular reflections of his U-BOOT_HAHD project but, pity for us, this brilliant mod was abandoned long ago and Hans is no longer an active member.
All in all, I still have some ideas on what might be causing our reflections not to work and I feel like we are just one step away from the solution. Nonetheless I also think it is about time to take a short rest from texture map issues and to focus on other and more important aspects. IMO, so far our small team has made an excellent job; let not our recent failures spoil our morale :up:
That said, I hope to release tomorrow a new alpha version with some fixes/improvements and a few new features. I ìf we keep up this pace, I don't see us too far away from the beta fase :salute:
Kendras
07-24-17, 02:37 PM
After reading some other posts on the forum, I think that adding the new map channels to our meshes puts us in the right direction, but obviously there is something else we do wrong.
Yes, yes, something else. Maybe the_frog can say more to us.
... and I feel like we are just one step away from the solution.
It's my opinion too.
IMO, so far our small team has made an excellent job; let not our recent failures spoil our morale :up:
:yep:
Yes, yes, something else. Maybe the_frog can say more to us.:
Yes, hopefully he will pop up one of the next days and he will give us an insight on the secrets of SHIII's texture mapping, but of course the know-how of all the other SHIII hard-core modders and 3d modellers is most welcomed too :D :salute:
Kendras
07-25-17, 07:04 AM
Just an idea : perhaps the 3D model has to be textured twice : one with a diffuse map, and one with the specular map. In S3D, you create 2 materials, one without specular map controller and big opaque tga, and the other with specular map controller and the 512x512 transparent tga. :03:
Just an idea : perhaps the 3D model has to be textured twice : one with a diffuse map, and one with the specular map. In S3D, you create 2 materials, one without specular map controller and big opaque tga, and the other with specular map controller and the 512x512 transparent tga. :03:
If you look at SHIII's Bismarck, her main model has three materials linked to it: The first material, named 'normal' is used on the hull, and it has a texture with alpha channel embedded and a SpecularMask controller attached. The second material, named 'complete', is mapped on the decks and it has no alpha channel nor SpecularMask controller; the third material, named '2sided', is used on ladders, railings, etc, it uses the same texture as the 'normal' material and likewise it, it has a SpecularMask controller attached but, as the name says, it has the 'Two sided' flag enabled. So, in total, we have two 'specular' materials linked to the same object, and both have the specular map in the alpha channel of their diffuse texture. Other stock units that I have had a glance into, are not dissimilar from the Bismarck.
What you are suggesting, would probably require the usage of the Texture Map chunk in place of (or together with?) the Specualar Mask controller. This chunk, allows additional texture maps to be linked to the diffuse map. Three texture types can be selected: Ambient Occlusion, Specular, and Normal/Bump. In stock game it seems underused, and it is only employed for the mapping of AO maps or normal maps on a few objects. I couldn't find any example of it being used for specular mapping (neither in stock nor in modded files), but we can try :hmm2:
Our first lighthouse is not finished yet, but I am making plans for the next one. :D
It seems that with the Phare de la Vieille we will have a foghorn in game. To be precise, three blasts separated by a 1 minut interval:
http://enezsun.chez-alice.fr/Phares/Vielle.htm
BTW, I am trying to locate the diaphone on pictures available from the web, (so that I can model something similar and place it correctly within the lighthouse model) but I cannot find it. Maybe, in recent times, it has been replaced with some electrical device :hmmm:
I let you compare between the SH3 map, and the real depth map :
http://i.imgur.com/mFyLFn5.png
http://i.imgur.com/2yajPpJ.png
Should we edit the SHIII terrain so to add the Pointe du Raz and Chausée de Sein in game?
https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/8/8d/Chausseedesein.png
From your screenshot of the ME map, I don't see them simulated in game. Both La Vieille and La Plate lay on the offshore extension of the Pointe du Raz with a sea depth ranging from ca. -10 to -14 m between the two lighthouses (measured in Gooogle Earth). In game, the depth of both locations is -17 which is reasonably close, but maybe we can do better, and recreate the submerged ridges as closely as possible with the limited resolution of SHIII's depth map :O:
Kendras
07-25-17, 02:01 PM
Should we edit the SHIII terrain so to add the Pointe du Raz and Chausée de Sein in game?
https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/8/8d/Chausseedesein.png
From your screenshot of the ME map, I don't see them simulated in game. Both La Vieille and La Plate lay on the offshore extension of the Pointe du Raz with a sea depth ranging from ca. -10 to -14 m between the two lighthouses (measured in Gooogle Earth). In game, the depth of both locations is -17 which is reasonably close, but maybe we can do better, and recreate the submerged ridges as closely as possible with the limited resolution of SHIII's depth map
I would like to correct all the sea depth of the area which is on the map I've posted. :O:
How can you modifiy the sea depth / terrain altitude with terrain editor ? I've never used it. Do you have to just change the color ? Is it a grey scale ?
the_frog
07-25-17, 03:06 PM
Hello folks,
so far, I only had a very brief look into the files and couldn't do any testing.
Some first impressions:
1. rather complex file structure
2. placement of textures in the Texture folder
3. textures, attached controllers, model setup, channels -- all fine
The way I would set up the files and the contents:
0. Use smaller textures; they are not very detailed so maps of 512 x 512 or 1024 x 1024 are sufficient, especially the submerged rock does not need a HR map
1. No texture in the Texture folder !!! All placed in the *.dat files
2. All material not changing over time removed from the _parts.files in the Library folder
3. Model of rock placed in the respective Location file, including texture.
4. Model of the platform and concrete base added into the Lighthouse files in the Land folder, including the respective texture
5. Either lantern and topmark remain the library file; then, a small cropped texture representing black and yellow metal can be placed into that file. Or place them also into the Land folder file. The lantern was likley not removed during wartime but just switched off. Therefore, it can stay; only the halo needs to "switched off".
More probably later the week (if I find some free time ...).
Anvar1061
07-25-17, 03:15 PM
https://youtu.be/gFFyhdGeQ1A
I would like to correct all the sea depth of the area which is on the map I've posted. :O:
This is the right time to do it, before we start placing lighthouses around the Atlantic coast of France :up:
How can you modifiy the sea depth / terrain altitude with terrain editor ? I've never used it. Do you have to just change the color ? Is it a grey scale ?
Exactly, 256 shades of grey, each shade being a different height. Indeed, we need to know how many meters below the sea level each shade corresponds to. We don't have this information, all I can say righ away is that sea areas are marked with values from 0 to 47, and land areas go from 48 to 255 (0 being the deepest trench and 0 the highest peak) but...
Knowing that the globe is divided in 180 x 360 = 64,800 elevation squares having a resolution of 126 sq. pixels each, and that the three most external pixels on each side of each square are 'redundant' (i.e. they are overlapped with the outer border of the neighbouring squares), it is a matter of simple math deducing that each pixel on those squares is equal to 1 deg / (126 - 3 x 2) = 1/120 deg = 0.5 min = 30 sec = 1 km in the SHIII world. With those equations in mind, we can easily locate any set of SHIII-world coordinates on the height map.
Knowing how deep is that point in game, we can build our own chart with grey values on a column and depths in meters on the other column. I can imagine that there is a linear correlation between grey values and height values, so we don't have to repeat the process 256 times: two or three well space measures, maybe four to stay on the safe side, will be enough to plot a line which will tell us what is the right grey value for the (approximate) depth we want :yep:
Let's do an example with La Plate's position. Our lighthouse lies between 48 and 49 deg of latitude N, and 4 and 5 deg of longitude W. When we select a set of coordinates in SHIII extractor and we load a grid, SH3 TE will show a matrix of 3x3 squares, the central square having as top left coordinates the coordinates we have selected, so we should look for 49°N and 5°W if we want the square which actually encompasses La Plate's location to be loaded at the center of the 3x3 matrix:
http://i.imgur.com/NmHXY9j.jpg
The square higlighted in red is the one we are actually interested in, and the double green lines show the overlappings with surrounding squares.
When we export our square, again, it will be saved on file together with its neighbours in a raw file whose pixel resolution is 366 pixels (=120 pixels per square x 3 squares + 3 overlapping pixels per side x 2 sides). This is how it looks in PS, after converting it into a greyscale indexed image:
http://i.imgur.com/DBYvhNg.jpg
Note that I have added guidelines to it: the central area marked by the guidelines measures exactly 120 x 120 pixels, and it corresponds to the 1 deg x 1 deg quadrant that La Plate lies in.
Let's look for the exact position of our lighthouse now: we know that the bottom guideline marks 48 deg of latitude north. In SH metric units, that's 48 deg x 120,000 m/deg = 5,760,000 m. La Plate's position, from the mis file, is 5,764,737: a bit to the north of the line; 5,764,737 - 5,760,000 = 4,737: that's the metric distance between the top guidline on the elevation map and the lighthouse. Before, we had concluded that 1 pixel on that map was equal to 1,000 m, so if we want the distance from the bottom guideline in pixels we calculate 4,737 m / 1,000 m/pixel = 5 pixels. The calculation is similar for the longitude: the right guidline marks 5 deg of longitude west, -600,000 m in metric units. The lighthouse is placed at -571,143 m. -571,143 - (-600,000) = 28,857; 28,857 / 1,000 = 29 pixels from the right guidline. This is the pixel we were looking for, on the haight map:
http://i.imgur.com/dNOWdM6.jpg
For better readability I have zoomed in the map so only the zone comprised between the guidelines is visible (48-49°N, 5-4°W), and I have marked 'our' pixel with a selection mark. Its greyscale value is 46 by the way so, unless I made some gross mistake, we know now that a value of 46 on that indexed map, corresponds to an in-game depth of -17 m, and we also know that, if we want, we can do it shallower by one 'step', if we change that value from 46 to 47. Beyond that value, I think the area would still be submerged (the coastline map takes the priority for deciding what is sea and what land), but the area would probably be marked on the in-game navigation map as a brown pixel, as if it was land :03:
Kendras
07-26-17, 04:12 AM
Exactly, 256 shades of grey, each shade being a different height. Indeed, we need to know how many meters below the sea level each shade corresponds to. We don't have this information, all I can say righ away is that sea areas are marked with values from 0 to 47, and land areas go from 48 to 255 (0 being the deepest trench and 0 the highest peak)
...
Knowing how deep is that point in game, we can build our own chart with grey values on a column and depths in meters on the other column. I can imagine that there is a linear correlation between grey values and height values, so we don't have to repeat the process 256 times: two or three well space measures, maybe four to stay on the safe side, will be enough to plot a line which will tell us what is the right grey value for the (approximate) depth we want
Precisely, the scale is not linear. A few months ago, I determined for almost all submerged pixels the exact depth, by changing colors of the scale (red-yellow-blue ... in order to distinguish between each depth) and putting land units on each depth in Mission Editor to know the exact depth.
Here is the scale :
http://i.imgur.com/Ot2E0or.png
Knowing that the globe is divided in 180 x 360 = 64,800 elevation squares having a resolution of 126 sq. pixels each, and that the three most external pixels on each side of each square are 'redundant'
Now, here is my idea : instead of searching the exact depth of each pixel (14400 for each square !) in Google Earth, let's take the map with red to blue scale I've posted, and convert into grey scale with the SH3 own scale, then apply to the SH3 map.
After that, I think we have to correct also the 3 pixels borders of the 9 squares around.
Hello folks,
so far, I only had a very brief look into the files and couldn't do any testing.
Hi The_Frog, thank you :salute:
Some first impressions:
1. rather complex file structure
A while ago, Kendras asked me for some generic lighthouses that we can place around the globe while we wait for more accurate models to get available. My idea is creating models of real lighthouses and day beacons that can be stripped down to their basic elements. Those elements should be easy to combine in order to create the said generic lighthouses, and the file structure I have adopted is functional to this 'modular' concept :)
2. placement of textures in the Texture folder
I think I will move textures that are specific to a lighthouse unit, into the folder of that unit. All the remaining textures should remain in the tex folder, as I plan to re-use them on other models.
3. textures, attached controllers, model setup, channels -- all fine
Still, there's something wrong in our files, otherwise specular masks would work. I hope that apllying some of your suggestions below can solve the problem...
The way I would set up the files and the contents:
0. Use smaller textures; they are not very detailed so maps of 512 x 512 or 1024 x 1024 are sufficient, especially the submerged rock does not need a HR map
You are right; we are still at the alpha stage, but soon all the textures used by the model will be resized/compressed, especially the ones of the rock model. When it comes to textures and non-vectorial 2D art, my philosophy is: the bigger the source files, the better they will look once they are resized to their final size :up:
1. No texture in the Texture folder !!! All placed in the *.dat files
If you mean in the same folder as the dat file, that's what I want to do. If you mean embedded in the dat files, I am a bit against embedded textures, essentially for two reasons:
a. they are not configurable; once you link a material to a 3d model and that material has a texture embedded, that model will have the same texture forever.
b. if you want to use the same texture on several dat files, you need to re-embed it as many times as the dat files that use it, with a total waste of disc stoting space and RAM.
2. All material not changing over time removed from the _parts.files in the Library folder
I don't get you here :hmm2:
3. Model of rock placed in the respective Location file, including texture.
The rock model might be re-used in other locations, that's why I decided to store it in the library file. If you look into stock locations, they are mostly composed of dummy nodes and placement nodes pointing to models in the harbor_kit.dat library file :yep:
4. Model of the platform and concrete base added into the Lighthouse files in the Land folder, including the respective texture
This is an option I had taken into consideration, but ad the end I decided to make it part of the rock terrain object, mostly for two reasons:
a. I don't want it to be destroyable
b. Ease of making terrain objects collisionable using the StaticObject controller
5. Either lantern and topmark remain the library file; then, a small cropped texture representing black and yellow metal can be placed into that file...
I don't get you. What would be the use of the cropped texture you are talking about?
...Or place them also into the Land folder file. The lantern was likley not removed during wartime but just switched off. Therefore, it can stay; only the halo needs to "switched off".
It is not only about the lantern or topmark being removed during wartime. As I mentioned before, we might proxy-clone the La Plate tower and use it in another position as a different type of sea mark. Depending on the type of mark we want to reproduce, we might need to replace or remove at all one or more library parts, including lantern and topmark.
More probably later the week (if I find some free time ...).
I am looking forward to listening to any other suggestion or remark you might come from you :up:
https://youtu.be/gFFyhdGeQ1A
Amazing video Anvar1061, thank you for sharing, and by the way...
https://3dwarehouse.sketchup.com/model/f1579cdbc0134d445819490a4071c9f2/Phare-du-Fastnet-Rock :03:
Precisely, the scale is not linear. A few months ago, I determined for almost all submerged pixels the exact depth, by changing colors of the scale (red-yellow-blue ... in order to distinguish between each depth) and putting land units on each depth in Mission Editor to know the exact depth.
Here is the scale :
http://i.imgur.com/Ot2E0or.png
Oh, amazing :yeah:
Tha's exactly the scale we need, with the Terrain.act palette applied to it. You can replace each shade of blue on it with a grey value going from 0 to 47 :yep:
Out of curiosity: do the first two values both correspond to -17 m?
Now, here is my idea : instead of searching the exact depth of each pixel (14400 for each square !) in Google Earth, let's take the map with red to blue scale I've posted, and convert into grey scale with the SH3 own scale, then apply to the SH3 map.
Sure, we can't do this work pixel by pixel :O:
We are going to face some problems though:
1- what is the scale/projection of your depth map? If we want to do a decent work, that map should be stretched to fit the SHIII world
2- sure we can convert that colour map into a grey-scale image, but then grey values wouldn't have any relation with depths.
It would be better starting from a greyscale haight map. I have read on the web that, though a bit complicated, extracting height data from Google Earth is all but impossible. :yep:
After that, I think we have to correct also the 3 pixels borders of the 9 squares around.
That's going to be a real PITA :doh:
Kendras
07-26-17, 06:16 AM
Oh, amazing :yeah:
Tha's exactly the scale we need, with the Terrain.act palette applied to it. You can replace each shade of blue on it with a grey value going from 0 to 47
:sunny:
Out of curiosity: do the first two values both correspond to -17 m?
I think so, but first value should not be used, as it can take blue or brown color, depending on the map scale... :doh:
2- sure we can convert that colour map into a grey-scale image, but then grey values wouldn't have any relation with depths.
Except if we "rescale" the SH3 map picture in order to be linear. :yep:
It would be better starting from a greyscale haight map. I have read on the web that, though a bit complicated, extracting height data from Google Earth is all but impossible.
That would be amazing ! :yep:
Kendras
07-26-17, 06:42 AM
Just a note : I realized that the map from Schnell Boot v2 is even better than the map from War Ace Campaign v4.1. So, we should use the one coming with SBM 2.
I think so, but first value should not be used, as it can take blue or brown color, depending on the map scale... :doh:
Maybe that's a feature. Let's take a mental note of it, just in case we will need something like that in future :03:
Except if we "rescale" the SH3 map picture in order to be linear. :yep:
Believe me, that's not going to happen. The SH world is the way it is and, once you know the rules, everything is in its right place. Look for any known location on my spreadsheet if you don't believe it.
Sure, distances are not right, and land masses are stretched out, but there is no way we can squeeze a spherical world into a cylindrical one. The one thing we would achieve, is moving around islands, ports, straits, landmarks and other geographical features in unpredictable ways :yep:
That would be amazing ! :yep:
Let's put us on that. Provided that we manage getting our hands on good quality grayscale heightmaps, we couldn't use them as they are. Reason is that shades of gray shown on them are a linear fucntion of RW heights, whereas in SHIII the relation is not linear. I have plotted data from your chart on an Excel graph and left the program to interpolate a likely tendency line. This is the result:
http://i.imgur.com/VEaTLbS.jpg
Before we could use any heightmap, we should adjust its tonal range to reflect the graph above...
Kendras
07-26-17, 08:06 AM
Provided that we manage getting our hands on good quality grayscale heightmaps, we couldn't use them as they are. Reason is that shades of gray shown on them are a linear fucntion of RW heights, whereas in SHIII the relation is not linear.
Yes.
Believe me, that's not going to happen. The SH world is the way it is and, once you know the rules, everything is in its right place. Look for any known location on my spreadsheet if you don't believe it.
Sure, distances are not right, and land masses are stretched out, but there is no way we can squeeze a spherical world into a cylindrical one. The one thing we would achieve, is moving around islands, ports, straits, landmarks and other geographical features in unpredictable ways :yep:
You didn't understand me. :O: I mean the picture of the SH3 scale, in photoshop or paint.net : for each meter of depth, and thanks to the scale i've posted, we add the correct grey used by SH3 (Terrain Editor). Then, we get a real depth map (heightmap for example), we create the depth color scale used by it, and put this scale just above the grey SH3 scale. And then, for each SH3 depth intervall (one unique grey color), we select all the colors from the real depth map scale, and convert them into the correct grey. Easy ! :p2: But maybe i'm not clear enough... :doh:
You didn't understand me. :O: I mean the picture of the SH3 scale, in photoshop or paint.net : for each meter of depth, and thanks to the scale i've posted, we add the correct grey used by SH3 (Terrain Editor). Then, we get a real depth map (heightmap for example), we create the depth color scale used by it, and put this scale just above the grey SH3 scale. And then, for each SH3 depth intervall (one unique grey color), we select all the colors from the real depth map scale, and convert them into the correct grey. Easy ! :p2: But maybe i'm not clear enough... :doh:
I think I got you now :up:
That would be easier if we had access to a bathymetric chart with several bands of different colours, each colour representing a range of heights, like the one below:
https://apps2.eere.energy.gov/wind/windexchange/images/windmaps/us_windmap_80meters.jpg
Okay, this is for wind speeds but you get the idea :03:
Even easier if we had a graph showing bathymetric curves:
https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/a/ad/Bathymetry.jpg
Working on colour gradients, as the ones in the graph we have currently available, makes things much more complicated :hmmm:
Anvar1061
07-26-17, 02:42 PM
Just a note : I realized that the map from Schnell Boot v2 is even better than the map from War Ace Campaign v4.1. So, we should use the one coming with SBM 2.
What card are you talking about? Show the path to the file and how it can be opened.
Kendras
07-26-17, 03:21 PM
What card are you talking about? Show the path to the file and how it can be opened.
So here in WAC 4.1 :
http://i.imgur.com/lkBRlDE.png
And here in SBM 2 :
http://i.imgur.com/MHw3yyu.png
the_frog
07-26-17, 03:32 PM
Hello gap,
before making things too complex -- what I was suggesting:
-- consider a less complex file structure (this may cause SH3 loosing track of all texture file paths ... that sometimes causes funny texture effects ....
-- this happens often preferentially with textures in the Texture folders ... that's why in GWX most textures were placed into the respective *.dat files or into the subfolders of the Air and Sea folder. Also, loading of large external texutures takes longer (and may cause fancy effects) than of embedded textures
Kendras
07-26-17, 03:38 PM
Hello gap,
before making things too complex -- what I was suggesting:
-- consider a less complex file structure (this may cause SH3 loosing track of all texture file paths ... that sometimes causes funny texture effects ....
-- this happens often preferentially with textures in the Texture folders ... that's why in GWX most textures were placed into the respective *.dat files or into the subfolders of the Air and Sea folder. Also, loading of large external texutures takes longer (and may cause fancy effects) than of embedded textures
Thank you very much, the_frog ! :)
Just a note : I realized that the map from Schnell Boot v2 is even better than the map from War Ace Campaign v4.1. So, we should use the one coming with SBM 2.
So here in WAC 4.1 :
http://i.imgur.com/lkBRlDE.png
And here in SBM 2 :
http://i.imgur.com/MHw3yyu.png
Why not, but let's be careful with the decision on which map we use: I wouldn't like to break any feature of the major SHIII supermods :)
Hello gap,
before making things too complex -- what I was suggesting:
-- consider a less complex file structure (this may cause SH3 loosing track of all texture file paths ... that sometimes causes funny texture effects ....
-- this happens often preferentially with textures in the Texture folders ... that's why in GWX most textures were placed into the respective *.dat files or into the subfolders of the Air and Sea folder. Also, loading of large external texutures takes longer (and may cause fancy effects) than of embedded textures
IIRC, I think we already tried to resize those textures and to embed them into the dat files (Kendras please correct me if I am wrong), but we will try again :up:
This is my first attempt at modding the SHIII terrain. It should add the Île de Sein to the game:
https://www.mediafire.com/?vq414s3rvs09i4l
It is based on GWX Gold terrain, but the files it modifies are probably identical in stock game and in other mega mods. Enable it with SH3 repacker and let me know if it works :salute:
Kendras
07-26-17, 05:47 PM
This is my first attempt at modding the SHIII terrain. It should add the Île de Sein to the game:
https://www.mediafire.com/?vq414s3rvs09i4l
It is based on GWX Gold terrain, but the files it modifies are probably identical in stock game and in other mega mods. Enable it with SH3 repacker and let me know if it works :salute:
Excellent news !
I don't have GWX on my PC. Could you send me the original terrain files from GWX please ? BTW, has GWX modified the terrain ?
Excellent news !
I don't have GWX on my PC. Could you send me the original terrain files from GWX please ? BTW, has GWX modified the terrain ?
Only the Kiel Canal I think, and a few selected areas maybe. Checking that on the manual and packing the relative files :up:
EDIT
This is the full list of terrain modification from GWX Gold manual (http://www.silenthunter.cz/tgw/Manual_V3.0_Final.pdf):
Helgoland
Scapa Flow
The Kiel Canal
The Suez Canal
The Panama Canal
The uploading of pertinent files is in progress :salute:
Kendras
07-26-17, 06:05 PM
I've tried to repack with the stock game terrain :
http://i.imgur.com/27GY9w8.png
, and here is what I get :
http://i.imgur.com/zuwt282.png
http://i.imgur.com/zINnkqV.png
I've tried to repack with the stock game terrain :
http://i.imgur.com/27GY9w8.png
, and here is what I get :
http://i.imgur.com/zuwt282.png
http://i.imgur.com/zINnkqV.png
Weird, I think I have followed all the instructions. Let me check again :hmmm:
What's the difference between 'Repack 3x3 grid' and 'Rebuild Terrain'? Should I apply any of those commands on the edited files before sharing them? :doh:
Silly me, I had forgot to the 'repack' the 3x3 grid I had edited. :doh:
This is the new download link:
https://www.mediafire.com/?vq414s3rvs09i4l
The folder you should select when rebuilding the terrain is named 'Repacked_W005N049'.
...and this is the full GWX terrain package (Warning: large download!):
https://www.mediafire.com/?yvwyx6py17uy7gx
Sorry for the inconvenience, and I hope you will enjoy this time :D
Kendras
07-26-17, 07:17 PM
I understand nothing. :doh:
I really need to sleep.
Good night.
:Kaleun_Sleep:
Kendras
07-27-17, 03:17 AM
Silly me, I had forgot to the 'repack' the 3x3 grid I had edited. :doh:
This is the new download link:
https://www.mediafire.com/?vq414s3rvs09i4l
The folder you should select when rebuilding the terrain is named 'Repacked_W005N049'.
So, I have "repacked" the stock terrain with both versions you sent to me. Name must be "W005N049_3x3", else the software doesn't find the file. I can open Mission Editor, but in each case, there is no new island ...
I understand nothing. :doh:
I really need to sleep.
Good night.
:Kaleun_Sleep:
What didn't you understand? :D
In my last post of yesterday there are two download links. The first one is named 'Île de Sein.7z' and it contains two folders. One of the folders is named 'W005N049_3x3'; it contains the same 3 x 3 map grid files in raw format that you had unsuccessfully tried to repack the first time, and it is there just as a back-up. The other folder is named 'Repacked_W005N049', and it contains the same maps, but in compressed format ready to be imported in game:
you should place SH3Repacker.exe in the folder above (Repacked_W005N049) and double click on the executable in order to install my changes.
Once you run the program and you click on the 'Repack' button, you are prompted to choose the path to TerrainData.BFI in your installation of SHIII.
After your confirmation, the 'Repack' button will show the text "Working", and the progress bar will start to fill. If everything works well, when the bar is full you will get a confirmation message, and you will notice that the repacker will have created back up copies of your original TerrainData.BFD and TerrainData.BFI. At this point you are ready to run the game and check my changes :03:
The last package I have linked yesterday night, contains the complete and unedited GWX terrain files you had asked for :salute:
Hello gap,
before making things too complex -- what I was suggesting:
-- consider a less complex file structure (this may cause SH3 loosing track of all texture file paths ... that sometimes causes funny texture effects ....
-- this happens often preferentially with textures in the Texture folders ... that's why in GWX most textures were placed into the respective *.dat files or into the subfolders of the Air and Sea folder. Also, loading of large external texutures takes longer (and may cause fancy effects) than of embedded textures
This is an extremely simplified testing version of La Plate (only the tower) with resized textures embedded into the dat file:
https://www.mediafire.com/?mx5mmkcj84ygasc
Let me know if the specular mask is still black :salute:
Kendras
07-27-17, 07:51 AM
What didn't you understand? :D
I don't understand why it's not working. What am I supposed to see ? Can you show me the island you created ?
Kendras
07-27-17, 07:54 AM
This is an extremely simplified testing version of La Plate (only the tower) with resized textures embedded into the dat file:
https://www.mediafire.com/?mx5mmkcj84ygasc
Let me know if the specular mask is still black :salute:
and yes, still black ... :hmmm:
I don't understand why it's not working. What am I supposed to see ? Can you show me the island you created ?
In SH3 Terrain Extractor, after repacking the SHIII terrain with my changes, this is what I see:
http://i.imgur.com/TUy6PZr.jpg
If you have followed my instructions to the letter, you should at least see the island in Mission Editor.
In game, it is possible that I made the island too low (used the '48' grey value as height, i.e. the first value used for land). Who knows, the island might be semi-submerged... :D
and yes, still black ... :hmmm:
Okay, this should exclude file complexity, big texture size and non-embedded textures as a cause for the black reflection map. I will make one last attempt with the SpecularMaks controller currently implemented, by reducing the number of materials from two to one. If that doesn't work either, I will switch to the other method: TextureMap chunck embedded to the texture and set to 'specular', and specular map stored in a separate tga file, as you have suggested.
On as side note: guess WHAAAT? I have discovered that I can run the game from my installation on the external hard drive! :har:
Everything seems to work fine. I can even load and play other single missions, but when I run our test mission, the game CTD's :doh:
Kendras
07-27-17, 09:52 AM
In SH3 Terrain Extractor, after repacking the SHIII terrain with my changes, this is what I see:
If you have followed my instructions to the letter, you should at least see the island in Mission Editor.
In ME, i don't see any island. The repack process is not working. I will try now with the GWX terrain.
Everything seems to work fine. I can even load and play other single missions, but when I run our test mission, the game CTD's :doh:
The beacon is german in the mission. So you have to add the german folder of the land unit in the roster folder. :salute:
Kendras
07-27-17, 10:16 AM
As expected, no new island even with GWX terrain ...
Using SH3Repacker.exe leads to no solution ....
So the software is broken, or I don't have the good method (readme not enough clear) ....
:k_confused:
In ME, i don't see any island. The repack process is not working. I will try now with the GWX terrain.
As expected, no new island even with GWX terrain ...
Using SH3Repacker.exe leads to no solution ....
So the software is broken, or I don't have the good method (readme not enough clear) ....
:k_confused:
It is obvious that your terrain files weren't updated with my tweaks
Since the repacking program worked for me, it should for you too :up:
Again:
open the package Île de Sein.7z and unzip the folder named Repacked_W005N049 anywhere on your HD;
put a copy of SH3Repacker.exe in the same Repacked_W005N049 folder. The folder structure should look like this:
http://i.imgur.com/3HtBjmN.jpg
Run the program and click on the 'Repack' button;
You will be prompted to choose the location of Terraindata.BFI on your hard disk. Do it and confirm!
http://i.imgur.com/7c9SXz1.jpg
The correct path should be: Ubisoft\SilentHunterIII\data\Terrain\Data, but if you have istalled your game into the Programs (x86) folder, the repacking might not work. If that is the case you better create a copy of TerrainData.BFD and TerrainData.BFI on your desktop or anywhere you prefer, and point the repacker to that location
After that, the repacking process should start, and the progress bar fill. TerrainData.BFD and TerrainData.BFI will be updated (make it sure through the 'last modified' file property once the repacking is finished), and backup copies of the original files will be created in the same folder. That's it :yep:
The beacon is german in the mission. So you have to add the german folder of the land unit in the roster folder. :salute:
:up:
Kendras
07-27-17, 01:45 PM
With your new folder (Repacked_W005N049), the error message now is a bit different :
http://i.imgur.com/gMWm88k.png
http://i.imgur.com/ztwyINo.png
Maybe it comes from the fact that you modified height values in the 'forbidden' border of the square ?
With your new folder (Repacked_W005N049), the error message now is a bit different :
http://i.imgur.com/gMWm88k.png
http://i.imgur.com/ztwyINo.png
Maybe it comes from the fact that you modified height values in the 'forbidden' border of the square ?
No, I didn't get any error message while repacking my terrain tweaks, anyway I think there is a something wrong with them: every time I enable them and I run the test mission, the game crashes. I will investigate later on what might cause that.
If you want to test yourself here are my repacked terrain files: (replace the files in your Terrain/Data folder with them):
https://www.mediafire.com/?35jkhbf2244ljvv
BTW of mission....
The beacon is german in the mission. So you have to add the german folder of the land unit in the roster folder. :salute:
The lighthouse was set as French, but there was an unit type mismatch: in my files La Plate is set as environmental (type 408), but in your tests mission had it as artillery (type 403). I matched the unit types and removed missing locations from Terrain.cfg and now the mission works.
Is there any special reason for you to change lighthouses' unit type? Should I switch to that type in my copy of the mod?
Kendras
07-27-17, 02:32 PM
I think there is a something wrong in my terrain tweaks: every time I enable them and I run the test mission, the game crashes. I will check later what's wrong with it
Maybe it comes from the fact that you modified height values in the 'forbidden' border of the square ?
there was an unit type mismatch: in my files La Plate is set as environmental (type 408), but in your tests mission had it as artillery (type 403). I matched the unit types and removed missing locations from Terrain.cfg and now the mission works.
Is there any special reason for you to change lighthouses' unit type? Should I switch to that type in my copy of the mod?
Oh yes, sorry, I forgot about that. :D
I set it as artillery type, because the unit was not attacked by Nelson during my test mission to see if the unit could be destroyed. But it didn't solve the problem. So I added the .sim file, and it solved it. Then, I forgot to write the original value of 408 for the unit's type. Sorry about that. :(
Maybe it comes from the fact that you modified height values in the 'forbidden' border of the square ?
That's a bit strange actually. The island I have added is close to the bottom border of the square it belongs to, that's true, but when a square is extracted, what we get is not simply the 1-deg/120-km/120-pixel wide height map of that square + 3 pixels on each side from the height maps of the surrounding squares, as I had initially understood. What we get is instead a 366 sq. pixel map, containing height data of nine squares (the central square being the one we are interested in) + (again) 3 pixels on each side from the second nearest squares. For that reason, the Ile se Sein is not actually close to any border, at least not in the raw file I have edited :hmmm:
Oh yes, sorry, I forgot about that. :D
I set it as artillery type, because the unit was not attacked by Nelson during my test mission to see if the unit could be destroyed. But it didn't solve the problem. So I added the .sim file, and it solved it. Then, I forgot to write the original value of 408 for the unit's type. Sorry about that. :(
No problem, I would have done the same, and probably you are right in thinking that a normal unit wouldn't attack an 'environmental' unit, even if that was in the roster of an enemy country :up:
Kendras
07-27-17, 05:22 PM
I can see your island in Terrain Extractor, but ME crashes. Could you send me the tga of the nine squares with the new island please ?
I can see your island in Terrain Extractor, but ME crashes. Could you send me the tga of the nine squares with the new island please ?
Okay, don't ask me why, but after repacking my raw maps and rebuilding the SHIII terrain, everything finally works fine :yeah:
I will upload the new files in a matter of minutes for you to test :salute:
Okay, don't ask me why, but after repacking my raw maps and rebuilding the SHIII terrain, everything finally works fine :yeah:
I will upload the new files in a matter of minutes for you to test :salute:
Here is the new package. Please follow strictly my instructions at post #394 (http://www.subsim.com/radioroom/showpost.php?p=2503048&postcount=394) to rebuild your terrain with my changes
https://www.mediafire.com/?vq414s3rvs09i4l
The island now shows up both on the navigation map and in the 3D world. I wish I could post some screenies, but Ctrl F11 didn't work for me (probably because my unusual installation of the game). There are some flickerings around the island borders, especially when it is seen from the top. Maybe increasing a bit its height asl would help. :hmm2:
Let me know your impressions :salute:
Kendras
07-28-17, 04:02 AM
Here is the new package. Please follow strictly my instructions at post #394 (http://www.subsim.com/radioroom/showpost.php?p=2503048&postcount=394) to rebuild your terrain with my changes
https://www.mediafire.com/?vq414s3rvs09i4l
The island now shows up both on the navigation map and in the 3D world.
Working for me too ! :yeah:
There are some flickerings around the island borders, especially when it is seen from the top. Maybe increasing a bit its height asl would help.
Yes, 'flickerings' are normal, and due to the movement of the sea waves. But I agree we could increase the height of the island on some precise parts, to look more than a sandbank, even if the island is very flat.
http://www.mairie-iledesein.com/images/ile_de_sein_avion_1024.png
Let me know your impressions :salute:
Well, I think the shape can be improved. Here is my work about drawing the island for SH3, layer are separated, but you can place them on top of each other in photoshop or paint.net :
your proposition :
http://i.imgur.com/F9ZNo4n.png
the island (from http://map.openseamap.org/) with a little horizontal expansion to align both lighthouses on those from SH3 (placed with real coordinates) :
http://i.imgur.com/PUqbRyZ.png
And my proposition :
http://i.imgur.com/8LtxMKX.png
Kendras
07-28-17, 04:28 AM
Other proposition based on the photo i've posted :
- light + dark brown shape is the same shape as my previous proposition (dark brown = increased altitude)
- light yellow now represents "sandbank"
http://i.imgur.com/zb5aGLy.png
Anvar1061
07-28-17, 05:49 AM
So here in WAC 4.1 :
http://i.imgur.com/lkBRlDE.png
And here in SBM 2 :
http://i.imgur.com/MHw3yyu.png
Does this mean that I should try SB World mod?
Working for me too ! :yeah:
:Kaleun_Thumbs_Up:
Yes, 'flickerings' are normal, and due to the movement of the sea waves. But I agree we could increase the height of the island on some precise parts, to look more than a sandbank, even if the island is very flat.
Nice picture!
Unfortunately, scaled to its correct size the island only covers two pixels of the SHIII height map lol. If you want, we can increase its general height by one or two levels of grey, but I am afraid we lack the resolution needed to raise or lower spefic areas of it :yep:
Well, I think the shape can be improved...
I guess that Sein's outline may vary considerably from low to high tide due to the low profile of the island. The current shape was painted over openseamap's aerial photo overlay.
Here is a satellite view available on Google Maps that comes close to the one I used as template:
https://www.google.it/maps/vt/data=XUQu_NJlh2jQh5ueIAJmgMqzQpGq8RgG1mHILnPCwe6jO zBofsL2jn05iU7iDVdxQSEbFtEyw2odLkXt_AJOhRUa9f-9MrdbeplimCSSTk2I7fkLa4ca7hZrEqf38u4t_v_RBVXeuHm-_lGf9V9Oql1WlZvsMSPQi9bhXFAvJXvNRI1jwVKtZiu0VxNoFo PgeVD8
And here is my drawing in original size:
http://i.imgur.com/y2M4D7c.png
After drawing the island, I scaled it down by matching openseamap's coordinate grids on the template picture, with their equivalent position on SHIII's land mask. Everything was calculated/drawn to the nearest tenth of minute, that's why the lighthouses are perfectly aligned with their real positions on the island. Sure, the island looks squeezed vertically, but that's because of the well known SH world's distorsion.
We can add/remove a pixel here and there but, as far as the game is concerned, my proposition is essentially correct and your ones distorted. :03:
Below a comparison of the island masks we have proposed so far: the current layout (top left), a new proposal by me (top right), your first drawing (bottom left), and your modified proposal with "sand banks":
http://i.imgur.com/CrHqaKh.jpg
Kendras
07-28-17, 07:03 AM
Unfortunately, scaled to its correct size the island only covers two pixels of the SHIII height map lol. If you want, we can increase its general height by one or two levels of grey, but I am afraid we lack the resolution needed to raise or lower spefic areas of it.
Oh my bad, I forgot that the height map has a much lower resolution than the land/sea mask. :wah:
By the way, this is strange : look at the Helgoland island, and you will see that the height map is relatively precise :
http://i.imgur.com/AqwbN73.png
I guess that Sein's outline may vary considerably from low to high tide due to the low profile of the island.
Yes, sure. On your satellite view, you took into account submerged parts to draw your island. :03:
After drawing the island, I scaled it down by matching openseamap's coordinate grids on the template picture, with their equivalent position on SHIII's land mask. Everything was calculated/drawn to the nearest tenth of minute, that's why the lighthouses are perfectly aligned with their real positions on the island. Sure, the island looks squeezed vertically, but that's because of the well known SH world's distorsion.
We can add/remove a pixel here and there but, as far as the game is concerned, my proposition is essentially correct and your ones distorted.
Mine can't be distord. If I'm correct, the vertical scale in SH3 is correct, whereas the horizontal one is not, depending of latitude (it's worse when you come close to the poles). So, I took the real map and resized it in order to fit the SH3 scale, keeping the right proportions. Now, we only have to adjust the horizontal side, and I did it by aligning the lighthouses of the map with the lighthouses on the SH3 map (which have exact coordinates, to the nearest tenth of second :D).
Moreover, I think my last proposition is more looking natural as your last proposition.
Oh my bad, I forgot that the height map has a much lower resolution than the land/sea mask. :wah:
Exactly five times smaller :yep:
By the way, this is strange : look at the Helgoland island, and you will see that the height map is relatively precise :
Once we find an agreement on the land mask of Sein (hopefully :haha:), we will see if we can improve its heightmap too :)
Yes, sure. On your satellite view, you took into account submerged parts to draw your island. :03:
You are right, I probably took into account the very shallow waters around the island, but if I were to follow only the emerged profile, due to the low resolution of the terrain mask and to the impossibility of using smooth edges, the island in game would be smaller than it is in reality.
A visual example of that follows.
The aerial view I used as template:
http://i.imgur.com/pTYBBeG.jpg
The same picture, with two island layouts overlayed on top of it: the drawing that my previos proposals were based on (in white), and a new layout I have just drawn by strictly taking into account only the coastline (in yellow):
http://i.imgur.com/cduOkM6.jpg
As above, but in SHIII (equirectangular) proportions. Note that after the resizing, the coordinate grid is square:
http://i.imgur.com/fS3HJdV.jpg
The new (yellow) layout in SHIII proportions and scaled exactly to the size of the SHIII land/sea mask (by matching coordinate grids):
http://i.imgur.com/EK0FcYd.jpg
For comparison, here's the improved layout I had proposed in my last post:
http://i.imgur.com/v9W8FQt.jpg
Which one looks better? :03:
I am not even sure that on the new version the Sein lighthouses would find their place. Not because of inaccuracies made by me, but because of the extremely low resolution and of the lack of eges smoothing, which 'erodes' the borders of the island.
Mine can't be distord [...]
Not only it can... it is :D
You said you based the proportions of your island drawing drawing on the following picture below that you have (not enough) expanded horizontally, don't you?
http://i.imgur.com/PUqbRyZ.png
Well, for the island to be in scale with the coordinate system used in game, the grid on the map you use as template should be square, not rectangular. If you follow the correct method (I invite you to give it a try!), the result wont be too dissimilar from what I already got :yep:
Moreover, I think my last proposition is more looking natural as your last proposition.
That's another proof of what I am saying: if it looks 'natural', it can't be right... Not in this crazy game :haha:
Changing of topic... when you finish drawing that island in a proper way, what do you think about tweaking a bit the light flash effect, so that it resambles more the light of a carbide lamp (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Carbide_lamp)?
Here's a video:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UqXnBXmPQ3U
Imo, the outer border of the light should be red-violet towards its outer border, not blue as it is now. What do you think? :hmm2:
EDIT: found a decent picture
http://www.harrisproductsgroup.com/~/media/Images/Articles/Brazing/air-vs-oxy.jpg
The flame looks bluer near the center of combustion, and it becomes red-violet as it moves away from the center. After all, the current effect color might be compatible with the blue seen in the picture above :hmm2:
Kendras
07-28-17, 11:11 AM
The same picture, with two island layouts overlayed on top of it: the drawing that my previos proposals were based on (in white), and a new layout I have just drawn by strictly taking into account only the coastline (in yellow):
http://i.imgur.com/cduOkM6.jpg
As above, but in SHIII (equirectangular) proportions. Note that after the resizing, the coordinate grid is square:
http://i.imgur.com/fS3HJdV.jpg
:yeah:
Which one looks better?
This one :D (something between your two versions) :
http://i.imgur.com/STbVDww.png
You said you based the proportions of your island drawing drawing on the following picture below that you have (not enough) expanded horizontally, don't you?
Well, for the island to be in scale with the coordinate system used in game, the grid on the map you use as template should be square, not rectangular. If you follow the correct method (I invite you to give it a try!), the result wont be too dissimilar from what I already got.
OK. :up:
Changing of topic... when you finish drawing that island in a proper way, what do you think about tweaking a bit the light flash effect, so that it resambles more the light of a carbide lamp (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Carbide_lamp)?
Imo, the outer border of the light should be red-violet towards its outer border, not blue as it is now. What do you think? :hmm2:
Nice effect. But my halo is white, not blue. I guess this is the blue sky that you see, because the halo is a bit transparent.
This one :D (something between your two versions) :
http://i.imgur.com/STbVDww.png
I like it, but I had to change a bit the port area, otherwise the local lighthouse would have been in the water... unless we want to create a simple port model for the island, of course :03:
http://i.imgur.com/DXviwUN.jpg
In the meanwhile I had been working on something similar, but smaller:
http://i.imgur.com/XVFnp4b.jpg
I like more your version, but I thought I would share that layout too, in case you want to take inspiration from it for some last minute changes (before I create the new mask/elevation files) :up:
Nice effect. But my halo is white, not blue. I guess this is the blue sky that you see, because the halo is a bit transparent.
Could you give it reddish hue, but very faint, so to obtain some shades of violet where the flare colour melts with the sky colour? Just for trying how it looks:O:
P.S: I have removed the RayTracedHalo controller from the light effect (seemingly without any loss of quality), and replaced it with the WaterReflection controller. Light reflections on the water look so cool :sunny:
Kendras
07-28-17, 01:49 PM
... unless we want to create a simple port model for the island, of course
Are you ready to create a simple 3D model of the Sein island, instead of adding squares to the terrain and having something which looks like nothing ? :D
Are you ready to create a simple 3D model of the Sein island, instead of adding squares to the terrain and having something which looks like nothing ? :D
Come on Kendras... If people can enjoy sinking ships with this level of detail...
http://i.imgur.com/mCZzNsl.png
...why should you mind sailing around an island like this?
http://i.imgur.com/F9ZNo4n.png
:rotfl2:
Kendras
07-28-17, 04:43 PM
Come on Kendras... If people can enjoy sinking ships with this level of detail...
http://i.imgur.com/mCZzNsl.png
...why should you mind sailing around an island like this?
http://i.imgur.com/F9ZNo4n.png
:rotfl2:
I guess that means 'no' ?
:k_rofl:
In this case, why building so nice lighthouses, with such an ugly island ? :hmmm:
I guess that means 'no' ?
:k_rofl:
In this case, why building so nice lighthouses, with such an ugly island ? :hmmm:
Come on Kendras, I like well done stuff too, but let's be realistic: who will notice if the shape of a small and totally flat island which we will hardly spot through the binoculars, is not so exciting? Put some houses around it, a couple of jetties, a dock, two or three fishing trawlers anchored along the dock, two well modelled lighthouses and little more, and Sein will look as good or as bad as the rest of SHIII.
If on the contrary we decide to model it as a 3D mesh, what will come next? The Orkneys? What about the Norwegian Fjords? And why not Helgoland, the Azores, or the Canary Islands? And I don't want to imagine what will happen when it will be the time of the Greek Islands :doh: :O:
I don't want to sound too categoric: if need be, I am okay to quickly model some rocks which are not even the size of a single pixel on the SHIII terrain map, but anything bigger than that should be made of the same matter as the rest of SHIII's land IMHO :)
Kendras
07-28-17, 06:10 PM
And why not Helgoland?
Yes, why not ? :O:
http://www.subsim.com/radioroom/showthread.php?p=2490379#post2490379
but anything bigger than that should be made of the same matter as the rest of SHIII's land IMHO
These new small islands 3D models have the same role as the new lighthouses : improve the aspect of the world with more realistic objects. But ... as this thread is not dedicated to the reworking of islands, let's give up. :salute:
You will come again to this one day ! :()1:
Kendras
07-28-17, 06:14 PM
Now, as we are working on the terrain, we have to find a solution to extract height maps from google earth, in order to correct the sea depth ... :hmmm:
About new halo effect, don't you have a more explicit picture ? Is it the kind of halo when can see from lighthouses ?
Yes, why not ? :O:
http://www.subsim.com/radioroom/showthread.php?p=2490379#post2490379
:k_rofl:
You are a natural born poker player obviously: I make my bet and rather than calling it or folding, you make an higher bid :03:
These new small islands 3D models have the same role as the new lighthouses : improve the aspect of the world with more realistic objects. But ... as this thread is not dedicated to the reworking of islands, let's give up. :salute:
You will come again to this one day ! :()1:
Let's do a deal: poor as it might look, we paint that island on the terrain map. You decide the layout you like the most, and we both make our best to make it look as nice as possible by placing already existing models or some purposedly made docks and jetties on top and around it. Something simple but nice. At the end, if you still are not satisfied, and when we are at good point with the mod, I will see what I can do in Wings, but believe me, making it to look good and natural according to your standars, is something that has the potential of driving me insane. I know that already :D :haha:
Kendras
07-28-17, 07:33 PM
You decide the layout you like the most
I think the less ugly version is yours + one square :
http://i.imgur.com/4IVu4wQ.png
and we both make our best to make it look as nice as possible by placing already existing models or some purposedly made docks and jetties on top and around it. Something simple but nice.
I'm not interested to add a harbour. But why not a little village.
but believe me, making it to look good and natural according to your standars, is something that has the potential of driving me insane. I know that already :D :haha:
:hmmm: You're talking about that ? : http://www.subsim.com/radioroom/showthread.php?p=2463298#post2463298
Kendras
07-29-17, 05:55 AM
You know, I think the best way to add better looking halos (with different colors, etc.) is too create new halos for Materials.dat
Kendras
07-29-17, 06:28 AM
I've found interesting maps :
http://www.bretagne-environnement.org/gipbeimage/download/photofullnoright/11807/227792/file/2005-Ifremer_Bathym%C3%A9trieDesEauxMaritimesBretonnes. png
http://hmf.enseeiht.fr/travaux/bei/beiere/sites/default/files/users/cdidier/bathym%C3%A9trie2.png
https://norois.revues.org/docannexe/image/3662/img-1.jpg
I think the less ugly version is yours + one square :
I thought you were sponsoring the below version, but that's okay :up:
http://i.imgur.com/STbVDww.png
I'm not interested to add a harbour. But why not a little village.
Not really an harbor, but a sheltered natural inlet with a few structures. See the picture below:
http://i.imgur.com/aw2O7RF.jpg
Red: quays/seawalls
Blue: jetties
Yellow: Men-Brial lighthouse
Black: warehouses
:hmmm: You're talking about that ? : http://www.subsim.com/radioroom/showthread.php?p=2463298#post2463298
That's an example :D
You know, I think the best way to add better looking halos (with different colors, etc.) is too create new halos for Materials.dat
Can you please look into it? Isn't there a 'Color' section among the properties of the ParticleGenerator controller?
As I said yesterday, I have managed making the light effect on our lighthouse to have water reflections (RayTracedHalo controller replaced with WaterReflection controller), but I have noticed a weird glitch: when seen from a distance, the smooth borders of the light particle become partly opaque, and I see a semi-transparent square with the light flash painted on it, where I should se a totally smooth transition from full light to the sky color. I will investigate if this error is caused by my changes but I doubt that. It might also be my NVidia gfx card, or some graphic setting, but I was also wondering if the FastParticleGenerator wouldn't be more appropriate for our quick flashing light :hmmm:
I've found interesting maps :
Very nice (!) but we need to clean them up and to resize them to the same scale and lat/long proportions as SHIII :yep:
On a side note: you cannot imagine how much progress I made with our current model, and guess what? Don't ask me how, the specular mask doensn't cause any longer black textures, though it still seems to do nothing. More on that later :salute:
Kendras
07-29-17, 12:16 PM
Nice pics here : http://www.skreo-dz.com/article-le-raz-de-sein-phares-la-vieille-la-plate-le-chat-tevennec-an-amouig-ar-men-ile-de-sein-art-87814106.html
Nice pics here : http://www.skreo-dz.com/article-le-raz-de-sein-phares-la-vieille-la-plate-le-chat-tevennec-an-amouig-ar-men-ile-de-sein-art-87814106.html
I agree!
We can model the rocks between the Pointe du Raz and La Vielle in game... as 3D models this time :03:
Lighthouses are there for signaling dangers and showing the safest ways. There is no point in having them in place, if there is no danger to be avoided :D
Changing of topic: while I wait for your answers to my other remarks, here is an update relative to the light effect problem I described before:
I have noticed a weird glitch: when seen from a distance, the smooth borders of the light particle become partly opaque, and I see a semi-transparent square with the light flash painted on it, where I should se a totally smooth transition from full light to the sky color. I will investigate if this error is caused by my changes but I doubt that
Unfortunately, after some tests, I must say that I was wrong: the problem is caused by the missing RaYTracedHalo controller.
I am sure I have seen other lighthouse flare effects in SH5m SHIV and SHIII, which don't use that controller. Could we modify those particle effects for use with our lighthouse? Can you please look into the issue while I give the last touch ups to our model? The light reflections on water are too a cool feature for simply give it up and you are the king of SHIII special effects, I know you will invent something :D
Kendras
07-29-17, 01:30 PM
Changing of topic... when you finish drawing that island in a proper way, what do you think about tweaking a bit the light flash effect, so that it resambles more the light of a carbide lamp (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Carbide_lamp)?
Here's a video:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UqXnBXmPQ3U
Imo, the outer border of the light should be red-violet towards its outer border, not blue as it is now. What do you think? :hmm2:
EDIT: found a decent picture
http://www.harrisproductsgroup.com/~/media/Images/Articles/Brazing/air-vs-oxy.jpg
The flame looks bluer near the center of combustion, and it becomes red-violet as it moves away from the center. After all, the current effect color might be compatible with the blue seen in the picture above :hmm2:
What do you think about that ?
http://i.imgur.com/wsMNHf5.png
http://i.imgur.com/uDPPiFk.png
Unfortunately, after some tests, I must say that I was wrong: the problem is caused by the missing RaYTracedHalo controller.
I am sure I have seen other lighthouse flare effects in SH5m SHIV and SHIII, which don't use that controller. Could we modify those particle effects for use with our lighthouse? Can you please look into the issue while I give the last touch ups to our model? The light reflections on water are too a cool feature for simply give it up and you are the king of SHIII special effects, I know you will invent something :D
Yes, I think there is a way to avoid this problem. In S3D, you can see that the halo tga has a black background which is read into transparency (I don't know how). What if we change this black background with tranparent background ?
http://i.imgur.com/3qmlEBE.png
What do you think about that ?
:sign_yeah:
Very nice!
Yes, I think there is a way to avoid this problem. In S3D, you can see that the halo tga has a black background which is read into transparency (I don't know how). What if we change this black background with tranparent background ?
http://i.imgur.com/3qmlEBE.png
I will look into that :up:
Kendras
07-29-17, 05:27 PM
The halo during the night :
http://i.imgur.com/yaAjnE4.png
http://i.imgur.com/XkgKUkW.png
By the way, I don't have the problem you mentioned, although I deleted the RaYTracedHalo controller. What are the weather conditions under which you see a semi-transparent square ?
The halo during the night :
So nice! :yeah:
By the way, I don't have the problem you mentioned, although I deleted the RaYTracedHalo controller. What are the weather conditions under which you see a semi-transparent square ?
Ypu must move the camera a few hundred meters away from the effect for the light flare to become a luminous square.
I use the test mission you sent me. I have edited many parameters of it, but date, hour of the day and cloud cover are unchanged.
I suspect my gfx card being part of the problem: NVidia cards and SH lights even never got along nicely, The weird thing is that the glitch is only apparent when I delete that controller :hmmm:
Good news, our specular mask finally works :up:
Kendras
07-30-17, 09:02 AM
Good news, our specular mask finally works :up:
Excellent news ! How did you manage to solve this issue ? :hmm2: And is this modifying the aspect in game ?
BTW, here is the new halo effect, so you can try it directly in your game !
D/L link :
I have modified it a bit compared to the last picture :
Kendras
07-30-17, 09:31 AM
Gap, could you send me the grey scale used by Terrain Editor ? I intend to convert the maps I've found into maps with SH3 bathymetric colors. :D
Excellent news ! How did you manage to solve this issue ? :hmm2
Not sure what was the problem.
I replaced the materials previously used, with other materials copied from units which had the specular mask enabled and working. Even in their new location, those new materials worked as supposed. I then edited their properties, names, flags, texture linking etc, one by one, for making them to resemble the buggy materials. By doing so, I hoped that at some point I would have discovered the 'bad' setting which caused the corruption but, at the end of the story, I found myself with materials apparently identical to the old ones, except for the fact that they still worked and the originals didn't :doh::haha:
I suspect that the materials initially used were corrupted in a way that s3d couldn't detect (I am not sure, but I might have copied them from a file which had been "manually" tweaked with an hex editor), or perhaps those materials had nothing wrong, but there is some 'hidden' material flag which is a 0 by default and must be set to 1 for the material to accept specular reflections. The old materials might have had this flag disabled, and the new ones enabled. The good thing about S3ditor is that it is able to create exact copies of chunks/addresses even when it doesn't fully understands/handles them :up:
And is this modifying the aspect in game ?
Sure it does!
I wish I could take some screenies: I am currently tweaking/balancing material attributes; for making things more obvious, I have replaced diffuse texture's RGB channel with solid medium grey, and I can clearly see how the underlying specular mask affects the texture depending on luminosity level and sun angle. :up:
BTW, here is the new halo effect, so you can try it directly in your game !
D/L link :
I have modified it a bit compared to the last picture :
:up:
I would gladly test it, and incorporate it in the upcoming new version of the mod, but can see no link :doh:
Gap, could you send me the grey scale used by Terrain Editor ? I intend to convert the maps I've found into maps with SH3 bathymetric colors. :D
You don't need the grey scale: you have it already :D
That's exactly the chart you had posted a few days ago, but with tones of grey replacing shades of blue, and grey values used for water going from 0 to 47. From it, I get that a grey value of 46 (R=46, G=46, B=46) is equal to -17 m, a value of 45 is equal to -18 m, and so on. :yep:
The 'shallowest' grey tone is 47, but its corresponding depth is not provided in your chart. I have included that value in my Ile de Sein terrain modification (for waters surrounding the island to the South IIRC), but I couldn't notice the side effect you told me. Did you? Maybe I should add a bigger spot of grey-47 on SHIII's elevation map for you to measure what is its corresponding depth in game, as -17 is a bit too deep for simulating the very shallow waters we want to put in game :hmm2:
Kendras
07-30-17, 12:11 PM
I would gladly test it, and incorporate it in the upcoming new version of the mod, but can see no link :doh:
For two reasons :
- I decided to improve a bit the "animation" of the light
- I've had a new idea for our mod, and I immediately started to work on it. It's now working fine. More on this coming soon ... :D
Else, I've just reworked a bit the color of the halo, to have something more pink than violet.
Kendras
07-30-17, 12:39 PM
So, why not to add a "searchlight effect" to the main lighthouses ?
With a turning light beam (i've added a rotation controller for that) ?
http://i.imgur.com/hT4aVXZ.png
You can even change the color :
http://i.imgur.com/0JklQ3c.png
Maybe, we can use this feature to add different colors for the light, depending on the angle ? :D However, more tests are needed to see if that's possible.
The side effect is that the beam on the sea surface can only appear if the lighthouse has detected an ennemy unit ...
- I decided to improve a bit the "animation" of the light
Okay but be careful with those particles: remember that they are FPS killers.
On a side note: have you had a look into the FastParticleGenerators? It has more or less the same parameters as the more common ParticleGenerator (i.e. porting an effect from a generator to the other should be quite easy) but I think it is lesser GPU-intensive and more optimized for quickly evolving particles :hmm2:
- I've had a new idea for our mod, and I immediately started to work on it. It's now working fine. More on this coming soon ... :D
Eagerly looking forward to your idea!
:Kaleun_Salivating:
Else, I've just reworked a bit the color of the halo, to have something more pink than violet.
Pink is not exactly my favorite color, but let's see it and keep a copy of the violet version, just in case :up:
On a partly unrelated note: as I already told you, I would really like our rocks/shoals/islets to have foam around them from the waves crashing on them. Have you started digging into this topic? Do you think there is a way to link a particle effect to the water surface? :D
So, why not to add a "searchlight effect" to the main lighthouses ?
With a turning light beam (i've added a rotation controller for that) ?
...
Maybe, we can use this feature to add different colors for the light, depending on the angle ? :D However, more tests are needed to see if that's possible.
Brilliant! Maybe this effect is not very useful for the lighthouse we are currently working on, but it definitely could be a valid approach for lighthouses with directional and multicolored lights, as La Vielle :up:
The side effect is that the beam on the sea surface can only appear if the lighthouse has detected an ennemy unit ...
I hope we can find a workaround to this :hmmm:
Kendras
07-30-17, 01:02 PM
Okay but be careful with those particles: remember that they are FPS killers.
On a side note: have you had a look into the FastParticleGenerators? It has more or less the same parameters as the more common ParticleGenerator (i.e. porting an effect from a generator to the other should be quite easy) but I think it is lesser GPU-intensive and more optimized for quickly evolving particles
Don't worry, parameters are still as simple as possible, and I don't think that a fastparticlegenerator is needed (and even possible ?).
Eagerly looking forward to your idea!
Already posted just above ! :03: I'm currently making more tests about that idea.
Pink is not exactly my favorite color, but let's see it and keep a copy of the violet version, just in case :up:
It's not really "pink". I let you test the new effect (color and animation) :
http://www.mediafire.com/file/g2i2f364ys92uby/Lighthouse_FX.dat
On a partly unrelated note: as I already told you, I would really like our rocks/shoals/islets to have foam around them from the waves crashing on them. Have you started digging into this topic? Do you think there is a way to link a particle effect to the water surface? :D
Yes, that would be so cool. I have to see what can be done here. :hmmm:
Don't worry, parameters are still as simple as possible
Okay, but remember what happens with your buoys mod, when many light buoys are in the area :hmmm:
and I don't think that a fastparticlegenerator is needed (and even possible ?).
Why not possible? It is in the list of the SHIII controllers. Not used much in SHIII, but in SH5 it is, and it is normally used for quick effects, like our flashing lights.
Not saying that we have to use it, but let's make a mental note about it, in case we need it in future :)
Already posted just above ! :03: I'm currently making more tests about that idea.
good! :up:
It's not really "pink". I let you test the new effect (color and animation) :
http://www.mediafire.com/file/g2i2f364ys92uby/Lighthouse_FX.dat
Okay, I am going to test it :up:
Yes, that would be so cool. I have to see what can be done here. :hmmm:
Yes please!
It is just a small detail, but one that might raise the realism level by a factor 2 :D
Kendras
07-30-17, 02:07 PM
Okay, but remember what happens with your buoys mod, when many light buoys are in the area :hmmm:
All was fine. A problem only occured if there was a lot of buoys AND a light node for each halo.
All was fine. A problem only occured if there was a lot of buoys AND a light node for each halo.
Okay, light nodes are another nasty thing :up:
I have to go now. Tomorrow I will test your reworked light effect and hopefully I will upload the next version of our lighthouse with some new features and many fine-tunings, optimizations and fixes
Have a nice evening :salute:
Kendras
07-30-17, 02:51 PM
Brilliant! Maybe this effect is not very useful for the lighthouse we are currently working on
It will be for the Creac'h "landing" lighthouse (as we say in french), which has one of the most powerful light in the world. :03:
Kendras
07-31-17, 03:27 AM
What do you think ? :D
http://i.imgur.com/qEJDevM.png
I just would like the beams to be larger on the extremities, to not looking like laser beams. :lol: The problem is that the texture is no more applied correctly on them, there are some holes in the light beams. Could you help me ? I will send you the testing tower by PM.
The idea is this :
http://i.imgur.com/qhA6LH2.png
itadriver
07-31-17, 05:07 AM
Great !!!! :)
What do you think ? :D
:up:
I just would like the beams to be larger on the extremities, to not looking like laser beams.
I agree: smaller at their origin and wider at the extremities, and much more transparent :yep:
The problem is that the texture is no more applied correctly on them, there are some holes in the light beams. Could you help me ? I will send you the testing tower by PM.
Sure, send the files :up:
On a side note: I have tested your improved flashing light effect and it works as a charm. Even the ghost sqare around the light flash texture has disappeared :yeah:
I have another suggestion. In theory, light intensity should decrease with the distance following the inverse-square law (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Inverse-square_law), but currently our effect is as bright when seen in close-up view as it is when seen from far away.
Would it be possible making it to gradually fade away until it completely disappears at a distance of about 8 nm (14.8 km) from its source? :hmmm:
EDIT: something else I would do, is making the flash considerably smaller: it looks a bit too big for such a modest light. If we kept the currents size, how big should be in comparison Créac'h's flare? :o
I wish I could take some screenies:
Hi Gap
I had a problem with that as well. Look in the Silent Hunter III root folder. If you have a file d3d9.dll rename it (don't delete). This will take you away from a wide screen view, but allow screenshots by using 'Alt'+ 'PrtSc' and the pasting into a prog like Paintshop to generate the .jpg file. Worked for me, but if d3d9.dll doesn't exist then not a solution.
I'm following this thread with amazement at the way you guys are progressing:Kaleun_Thumbs_Up:. Good stuff.
Regards,
MLF
I had a problem with that as well. Look in the Silent Hunter III root folder. If you have a file d3d9.dll rename it (don't delete). This will take you away from a wide screen view, but allow screenshots by using 'Alt'+ 'PrtSc' and the pasting into a prog like Paintshop to generate the .jpg file. Worked for me, but if d3d9.dll doesn't exist then not a solution.
Hi MLF, unfortunately there is not such a file in the root folder of my SHIII installation, but thank you anyway
I'm following this thread with amazement at the way you guys are progressing:Kaleun_Thumbs_Up:. Good stuff.
It has been a while since the last alpha version that you have tested, but compared to that, the upcoming version will have:
working specular reflections on all the model surfaces, changing with general luminosity and with light angle;
better caustics effect and shadowing both on the lighthouse base and on the underneath rock (but only underwater);
improved material attributes for all the materials used by the model;
improved light flare effect, which will cast reflections on the sea surface;
fully collisionable/damageable model;
damage decals expecially made for the model;
tower top, eaves and configurable items detachable from the model when they incur a certain level of damage;
hopefully (if Kendras manages doing the magic :O:), foam from crashing waves on the sea surface, around the base of the lighthouse;
maybe (if I manage doing the magic :D), different wave lapping/crashing sounds triggered by wave height, in place of the one lapping sound currently featured, that plays without interruption no matter what sea conditions are.
Stay tuned for this new version :salute:
On a side note: I have tested your improved flashing light effect and it works as a charm. Even the ghost sqare around the light flash texture has disappeared :yeah:
I have discovered what caused halo texture borders to become visible: during my arrangement of the effect node, I had inadvertently moved the fog controller on top of the particle generator; apparently the latter must be on top :doh:
It has been a while since the last alpha version that you have tested, but compared to that, the upcoming version will have:
working specular reflections on all the model surfaces, changing with general luminosity and with light angle;
better caustics effect and shadowing both on the lighthouse base and on the underneath rock (but only underwater);
improved material attributes for all the materials used by the model;
improved light flare effect, which will cast reflections on the sea surface;
fully collisionable/damageable model;
damage decals expecially made for the model;
tower top, eaves and configurable items detachable from the model when they incur a certain level of damage;
hopefully (if Kendras manages doing the magic :O:), foam from crashing waves on the sea surface, around the base of the lighthouse;
maybe (if I manage doing the magic :D), different wave lapping/crashing sounds triggered by wave height, in place of the one lapping sound currently featured, that plays without interruption no matter what sea conditions are.
Stay tuned for this new version :salute:
:o wow!!!!!:Kaleun_Salute: brilliant!
This is ground breaking work that must be of great value to all modders of SH3
:Kaleun_Thumbs_Up:
Regards, MLF
:o wow!!!!!:Kaleun_Salute: brilliant!
This is ground breaking work that must be of great value to all modders of SH3
:Kaleun_Thumbs_Up:
Regards, MLF
Well, "groundbreaking" is definitely too much. Most of the notions that this mod in its current state is based on, are scattered here and there in the forum and/or borrowed from later games of the SH series. Anyway I believe that the work we are doing is at least original, and I hope that other modders can take ispiration from it for making the best of their own talent and creativity :up:
Kendras
07-31-17, 05:36 PM
Sure, send the files :up:
Already sent. :salute:
I have another suggestion. In theory, light intensity should decrease with the distance following the inverse-square law (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Inverse-square_law), but currently our effect is as bright when seen in close-up view as it is when seen from far away.
Would it be possible making it to gradually fade away until it completely disappears at a distance of about 8 nm (14.8 km) from its source?
No, I think it's not possible.
something else I would do, is making the flash considerably smaller: it looks a bit too big for such a modest light.
Yes, I used a big size to control the correct visual aspect of the effect. Now, it's easy to reduce its size. Another thing about the light : it's noted "VQ", which means very quick if i'm correct. But at the moment, the light is rather quick than very quick. So, I think I will make the light flashes shorter, but with same period of course.
Hi MLF, unfortunately there is not such a file in the root folder of my SHIII installation, but thank you anyway
In order to take screenshots, don't use full screen option. Take screenshot with your normal shortcut to print the screen, and paste it in a picture software (paint).
It has been a while since the last alpha version that you have tested, but compared to that, the upcoming version will have:
working specular reflections on all the model surfaces, changing with general luminosity and with light angle;
better caustics effect and shadowing both on the lighthouse base and on the underneath rock (but only underwater);
improved material attributes for all the materials used by the model;
improved light flare effect, which will cast reflections on the sea surface;
fully collisionable/damageable model;
damage decals expecially made for the model;
tower top, eaves and configurable items detachable from the model when they incur a certain level of damage;
hopefully (if Kendras manages doing the magic :O:), foam from crashing waves on the sea surface, around the base of the lighthouse;
maybe (if I manage doing the magic :D), different wave lapping/crashing sounds triggered by wave height, in place of the one lapping sound currently featured, that plays without interruption no matter what sea conditions are.
Stay tuned for this new version :salute:
Good news ! :)
Already sent. :salute:
Where? My PM box on subsim or my private e-mail? :hmm2:
No, I think it's not possible.
That's a shame. I think I saw LOD/distance settings among the parameters of some type of particle generator, but it was probably the, more sophisticated, SH5 version of them.
If we don't find any better solution, what about doing the effect a bit more subdued? As it is now, in full day, that litlle lantern is more shiny than the sun itself :sunny: :O:
Yes, I used a big size to control the correct visual aspect of the effect. Now, it's easy to reduce its size.
Okay, I would halve the current size for a start, and see how it looks...
Another thing about the light : it's noted "VQ", which means very quick if i'm correct. But at the moment, the light is rather quick than very quick. So, I think I will make the light flashes shorter, but with same period of course.
Well, if we must follow the VQ flashing pattern schematized in the picture (http://www.sailingissues.com/light/cardinal-buoys.png) I had posted a few weeks ago, the sequence should be:
(short dark interval + light flash) x 9 = 6s (light and darkness of more or less equal duration = ca. 0.33s each)
long dark interval = 4s
I think you got this sequence about right, but if you think you can further improve it, why not? :03:
In order to take screenshots, don't use full screen option. Take screenshot with your normal shortcut to print the screen, and paste it in a picture software (paint).
I will try, but how do I switch to windowed mode?
Good news ! :)
:up:
Kendras
07-31-17, 06:50 PM
Where? My PM box on subsim or my private e-mail?
Your PM box on Subsim is always full, isn't it ?
If we don't find any better solution, what about doing the effect a bit more subdued? As it is now, in full day, that litlle lantern is more shiny than the sun itself.
I prefer a too much bright light during day, than not enough bright during night.
I will try, but how do I switch to windowed mode?
In graphic options.
Your PM box on Subsim is always full, isn't it ?
I have erased a few old messages :03:
I prefer a too much bright light during day, than not enough bright during night.
Right, but maybe we can find a balance: as it is now, the light is very bright at night and way too bright during the day :hmmm:
Remember whe are not (yet) simulating Créac'h's light :03:
In graphic options.
:up:
What do you think about this cracking line?
http://i.imgur.com/Po52qy0.png
Does it look natural enough? (cracked surface's texture is provisional, I will extract the final texture from this picture (http://texturelib.com/Textures/concrete/damaged/concrete_damaged_0003_01_preview.jpg), and I will add 3D torn/warped iron bars to it).
Should I add another crack line near the base of the tower?
Kendras
08-01-17, 02:42 AM
What do you think about this cracking line?
http://i.imgur.com/Po52qy0.png
Does it look natural enough? (cracked surface's texture is provisional, I will extract the final texture from this picture (http://texturelib.com/Textures/concrete/damaged/concrete_damaged_0003_01_preview.jpg), and I will add 3D torn/warped iron bars to it).
Should I add another crack line near the base of the tower?
Gap, yes it's nice, but let's not loose time on modelling destroyed models. I really would like that we go forward with new lighthouses. There is also the sea bed depth to rework. The only important thing is that the light can be destroyed. I am thinking this : in order that the AI considers the beacon destroyed when the light is destroyed, the main tower should be transfered in the terrain locations folder. The platform would be the real land unit, and once destroyed, the AI doesn't attack the tower anymore. We can do this, since I've discovered the perfect relation between coordinates in meters and in degrees.
Gap, yes it's nice, but let's not loose time on modelling destroyed models. I really would like that we go forward with new lighthouses. There is also the sea bed depth to rework. The only important thing is that the light can be destroyed. I am thinking this : in order that the AI considers the beacon destroyed when the light is destroyed, the main tower should be transfered in the terrain locations folder. The platform would be the real land unit, and once destroyed, the AI doesn't attack the tower anymore. We can do this, since I've discovered the perfect relation between coordinates in meters and in degrees.
Well, to be honest Kendras, in my plans AI units shouldn't attack at all our lighthouses, except for the ones located near strategic ports. Can you imagine the RAF continuosly patrolling the Gulf of Biscay in search of French lighthouses to ravage, instead of attacking German u-boats and naval traffic lol? A total waste of ammo, and probably an unbalancing factor in game.
Besides that, unlike SH5, SHIII doesn't remove destroyed units from the rosters they belong to, so we would often see our beacons destroyed under our eyes, only to see them unharmed as if nothing had happened during the next patrol.
That said, I have decided to make our lighthouses destroyable and to visually display damage occurred partly for fun (in case we want to use them as unconventional targets for our gunnery drills) and partly for realism, in the rare evenience that they are caught in the cross-fire of a battle involving air, surface and submarine units, in which case it would be nice if they accidentally took some collateral damage.
I am sure that you will agree with me that the above reasons are not enough for wasting our limited time on simlulating a complex damage model. I only started yesterday night to split our model in a few destroyable parts, and the simple modifications I had in mind are pretty much done. If you see that I delay the beta release for more than 1, max 2 days from now, it will mean that experiments with my sound-triggred-by-waves idea are taking longer than expected. :up:
In the meanwhile I hope that your realism tweaks on the light effect will be ready and that you will have made some progress with our wave foam idea. Time spent on those items will be well spent, as they well be used on many models :03: :salute:
Kendras
08-02-17, 07:31 AM
Hi,
I've discovered a very nice webpage which gives positions and infos about French lighthouses : http://www.pharesdefrance.fr/index.php/cartes-des-phares
During all the morning, I've searched for the most important (size or position) ones, with real coordinates converted to SH3. Here is the result :
http://i.imgur.com/TxV0oe4.png
I've also added Bishop Rock. :up:
Kendras
08-02-17, 09:29 AM
What do you think about this cracking line?
...
Does it look natural enough? (cracked surface's texture is provisional, I will extract the final texture from this picture (http://texturelib.com/Textures/concrete/damaged/concrete_damaged_0003_01_preview.jpg), and I will add 3D torn/warped iron bars to it).
Should I add another crack line near the base of the tower?
If you really want to make the beacon destroyable, so I think one crackline is enough, but I would place it higher :
http://i.imgur.com/NAwUKys.png
The red part is the land unit, and the grey part is the terrain object. Thus, when the unit is destroyed, it collapses, and it remains only the terrain object which is no more attacked. :)
I've discovered a very nice webpage which gives positions and infos about French lighthouses : http://www.pharesdefrance.fr/index.php/cartes-des-phares
During all the morning, I've searched for the most important (size or position) ones, with real coordinates converted to SH3. Here is the result :
http://i.imgur.com/TxV0oe4.png
I've also added Bishop Rock. :up:
Nice website and good work :up:
I had started doing something similar in Google Earth, with lighthouse names and positions shown on map and clickable icons linked to individual pages with pictures, informations and relevant links for each lighthouse.
I had planned to add all the French lighthouses; it is not finished yet, but if you want I can send the file your way :)
If you really want to make the beacon destroyable, so I think one crackline is enough, but I would place it higher
I like your layout, but it is a bit too late now. I have already finished modelling the damaged tower according to the picture I had posted the day before yesterday; I am ready applying to it any slight modification you might suggest, but I am afraid that completely redoing it would be too much work. Nothing is lost though: I will use your drawing for any similar full-concrete lighthouse we might need in game in the near future. :up:
http://i.imgur.com/a2dweZw.png
The red part is the land unit, and the grey part is the terrain object. Thus, when the unit is destroyed, it collapses, and it remains only the terrain object which is no more attacked. :)
I think I get your point: making enemy AI units to attack the lighthouse, but without raging against it, when the beacon is damaged beyond repair. Isn't it?
The approach you are suggesting is valid, but I have painted some nice damage decals and I would like them to show up on the whole lighthouse model, when it is hit by a shell or by a bomb. Just a little cosmetic feature, but, if possible, I wouldn't like giving it up.
The way I have currently set the lighthouse, the base plus the lower portion of the tower are the main model, and the tower top is stored in a separate model, linked to a child node of the main unit node. The two parts have separate damage boxes. If the top tower is destroyed, it will be removed from the game together with the equipments (platform, lantern, etc) linked to it. On this evenience, the space left at the top of the lower tower portion will be filled, by means of the ObjectRemains controller, with the concrete debris + iron bars model shown in the picture above. If need be, the debris mesh can be made part of the main model, but I think it would be a waste of memory, as normally we wouldn't see it.
If we wanted the AI to stop attacking our lighthouse as soon, or shortly after, the top model is destroyed, we should link tower top's damage box to a zone whose hit points are ca. equal to the hit points of the whole unit (as set in its .zon file/CollisionableObject controller). The problem is that if the unit is destroyed, it is possible that also the main model will be removed. If that was true, it would render the splitting of the unit in two parts totally pointless, as with the settings I am suggesting they both would be removed at once. The model of a destroyed unit having to be removed from game, is not so obvious though: when the hp's of a ship are totally depleted, her lifeless wreck stays in game for a while until it sinks down, and in the meanwhile enemies stop attacking it.
Maybe we should use a different zone for the main unit, similar to the one assigned to the top, but with 'Destructible' parameter set to 'No'.
What do you think? Should we try? :hmmm:
Kendras
08-02-17, 01:50 PM
I had started doing something similar in Google Earth, with lighthouse names and positions shown on map and clickable icons linked to individual pages with pictures, informations and relevant links for each lighthouse. I had planned to add all the French lighthouses; it is not finished yet, but if you want I can send the file your way.
Yes, I'm curious to see what lighthouses you want to add.
By the way, I have created an Excel file to store and calculate coordinates. Here it is :
http://www.mediafire.com/file/sjb4as87c3ea3e4/Lighthouses_coordinates.xlsx
I like your layout, but it is a bit too late now. I have already finished modelling the damaged tower according to the picture I had posted the day before yesterday; I am ready applying to it any slight modification you might suggest
I would delete the 2 small black portions of concrete remaining on top (after the explosion of the gaz tank, they would have been thrown in the air). And I would add another row of metalic bars.
I think I get your point: making enemy AI units to attack the lighthouse, but without raging against it, when the beacon is damaged beyond repair. Isn't it?
Yes. Once the light device is destroyed, the AI doesn't fire anymore on the beacon.
If we wanted the AI to stop attacking our lighthouse as soon, or shortly after, the top model is destroyed, we should link tower top's damage box to a zone whose hit points are ca. equal to the hit points of the whole unit (as set in its .zon file/CollisionableObject controller).
:hmmm:
Maybe we should use a different zone for the main unit, similar to the one assigned to the top, but with 'Destructible' parameter set to 'No'.
Yes, sure.
The problem is that if the unit is destroyed, it is possible that also the main model will be removed.
What do you think? Should we try?
Let's try, and see what happens. http://yoursmiles.org/psmile/science/p0306.gif
Yes, I'm curious to see what lighthouses you want to add.
Um... I have made no selection: so far I have marked on map all the lighthouses that I am aware of from Saint-Jean-de-Luz in Aquitaine to Lorient. I thought we better have an overall view of all the lighthouses available before we decide which one to model in game :D
Here is the file:
https://www.mediafire.com/file/97wsww1j4r1a84k/Lighthouses%20of%20France.kmz
If you have Google Earth installed, just double click on the kmz file to add it to the list of GE's custom locations. The lighthouses are found in a folder called "Lighthouses of France" and they are grouped by department. Click on any item in the list, to zoom the map on it. Click on the icons on map to open a window with information, pictures and links. If you want the coordinates of any lighthouse, right click on its name in the list or on its icon on map, and select 'Properties'.
By the way, I have created an Excel file to store and calculate coordinates. Here it is
Useful, thanks :up:
Since we are at it: do you want me to update the coordinate calculator spreadsheet with your adjusted formulas?
I would delete the 2 small black portions of concrete remaining on top (after the explosion of the gaz tank, they would have been thrown in the air).
Okay I will remove them, no problem, but I am afraid that the explosion of that gas cylinder wont be enough to demolish the top of the solid reinforced concrete tower by itself. The explosion will probably blast away some railings and part of the eaves though :03: :D
And I would add another row of metalic bars.
Okay, will do that too, but... I am loosing my sight on those tiny bars lol :doh:
Yes. Once the light device is destroyed, the AI doesn't fire anymore on the beacon.
:up:
If we wanted the AI to stop attacking our lighthouse as soon, or shortly after, the top model is destroyed, we should link tower top's damage box to a zone whose hit points are ca. equal to the hit points of the whole unit (as set in its .zon file/CollisionableObject controller).
:hmmm:
That's logical: the main unit inherits damage suffered by any of its parts linked to a damage box. If hit points of the top tower model are as high as the overall hit points of the unit, or even higher, there is an high chance that the unit will be destroyed as soon as, or before, the tower-top is blasted away. :yep:
Let's try, and see what happens. http://yoursmiles.org/psmile/science/p0306.gif
:up:
Parkera
08-02-17, 10:33 PM
Wow a ton of work and efforts thus far! Been reading thru all the posts and LOVING the concept and ideas. Keep it up guys it will all be worth is in the end :up:
Kendras
08-03-17, 03:45 AM
Um... I have made no selection: so far I have marked on map all the lighthouses that I am aware of from Saint-Jean-de-Luz in Aquitaine to Lorient. I thought we better have an overall view of all the lighthouses available before we decide which one to model in game :D
Here is the file:
https://www.mediafire.com/file/97wsww1j4r1a84k/Lighthouses%20of%20France.kmz
I've just downloaded Google Earth. Well, this tool gives a lot of infos ! :)
Great work ! This will be particularly uesful to place harbours' lights. :yep: How did you find all these small lighthouses ? :o Could you do the same job for the lights of Brittany ? A last note : some of the LH were built after WWII (in particular on L'Ile d'Yeu), and we should not place them in SH3 world.
Since we are at it: do you want me to update the coordinate calculator spreadsheet with your adjusted formulas?
You mean your excel file ? I already did it, even if I don't use it very much.
Okay I will remove them, no problem, but I am afraid that the explosion of that gas cylinder wont be enough to demolish the top of the solid reinforced concrete tower by itself.
That's why I wanted the top part to be smaller. :O:
Wow a ton of work and efforts thus far! Been reading thru all the posts and LOVING the concept and ideas. Keep it up guys it will all be worth is in the end :up:
:salute:
Wow a ton of work and efforts thus far! Been reading thru all the posts and LOVING the concept and ideas. Keep it up guys it will all be worth is in the end :up:
:smug: :salute:
I've just downloaded Google Earth. Well, this tool gives a lot of infos ! :)
:yep:
Great work ! This will be particularly uesful to place harbours' lights. :yep: How did you find all these small lighthouses ? :o
My main source is The Lighthouse Directory (https://www.unc.edu/~rowlett/lighthouse/) that you already know.
Talking about French lighthouses, my second best source is Les Phares de France (http://phares-de-france.pagesperso-orange.fr/) which provides detailed information, historical background and drawings for most lighthouses, included the ones no longer in place.
Wikipedia articles on single lighthouses often provide good quality pictures and rough world coordinates. The quality of the articles themselves varies, but sometimes you can get from there information not found elsewhere.
openseamap.org, that you also know, is a great tool for locating small and/or little known lighthouses and beacons, whose exact position is not clear from other sources.
Could you do the same job for the lights of Brittany ?
Sure, that was the initial plan :up:
A last note : some of the LH were built after WWII (in particular on L'Ile d'Yeu), and we should not place them in SH3 world.
I made every effort to only include the lighthouses and beacons that are known to have been in place during WWII. I might have done some mistakes though. Moreover, in case of doubt on the building or demolition dates of certain lighthouses, I often decided to list them anyway, postponig to a second moment the decision whether to include them or not in our mod.
Talking more specifically about the Phare de la Petite-Foule or Grand Phare de l'île d'Yeu, if that's what you meant in your example, the current lighthouse was built in 1950, but before and during WWII there was another lighthouse in the same station, built in 1830 and destroyed by the nazists on 25 August 1944 :)
You mean your excel file ? I already did it, even if I don't use it very much.
Okay, I will give it low priority then but I think I will update in anyway and make it available in case anyone else might need it. Great discovery on the constant terrain / unit coordinate offset btw :up:
That's why I wanted the top part to be smaller. :O:
I got you now, but don't worry, the effect will be even nicer after separating eaves and railings from the current tower-top model, and making them destroyable :03:
Btw: if you have no other remarks, I think the damaged tower model is ready:
http://i.imgur.com/ivis31T.png
While working on those broken/bent rebar rods, I have discovered an important exception to the second law of thermodinamics: no matter if, given an ordered system, its entropy naturally tends to increase over time; simulating its effects requires a lot of work anyway lol :doh: :D
Kendras
08-03-17, 10:57 AM
Okay, I will give it low priority then but I think I will update in anyway and make it available in case anyone else might need it.
One can also calculate coordinates for SH3 with my excel file, which contains the correct formula. :03:
Great discovery on the constant terrain / unit coordinate offset btw
That was a little challenge. :)
Btw: if you have no other remarks, I think the damaged tower model is ready
Cool. Nice job. Time to test in game ! :yep:
One can also calculate coordinates for SH3 with my excel file, which contains the correct formula. :03:
Did you update graph inputs with your offsets?
Besides doing that, I also wanted to add a checkbox to spreadhsheet's interface letting users to choose whether they want to match output unit/location coordinates or not. Reason is that, when the two coordinate systems used in SHIIII have to be matched, the level of precision relative to the input coordinates is lower (only 3m) compared to the one of unmatched coordinates (0.12 cm and 1 m respectively for locations and units).
Once those features are added and the spreadsheet polished, we could release it under our names for other modders to mess with it. What do you think? :03:
That was a little challenge. :)
I could see from your and MLF's screenies there was a constant small offset, but how you calculated it is still a mistery to me :D
Cool. Nice job. Time to test in game ! :yep:
I don't think today I will have much time for modding, but I hope to release the first beta version tomorrow.
BTW: did you get time to make the last small finetunings to the light FX and to work on the sea foam FX? It would be nice if they could be added to the upcoming version.
One last idea I had, is creating some simple material-specific falling debris effects (concrete, stone, bricks, metal, etc) which can be triggered when the corresponding damage zones (the ones we have added to zones.cfg for this mod), will suffer a given amount of damage. Just a few simple 3D particles, not to burden too much our GPU's. There is no hurry on that, but I wish those effects to be ready before we release our next lighthouse. We could dig in RacerBoy's/TheDarkWraith's FX mods for SHIII, IV and 5, to see how he achieved this particular effect. With that done, I don't really see what other feature we could add to our interactive lighthouses. That would likely be the state-of-art, as far as SHIII limits are concerned. What do you think? :D
Kendras
08-03-17, 12:09 PM
Once those features are added and the spreadsheet polished, we could release it under our names for other modders to mess with it. What do you think?
OK.
BTW: did you get time to make the last small finetunings to the light FX and to work on the sea foam FX? It would be nice if they could be added to the upcoming version.
Yes, I tried to add a foam effect, but I failed until now (tried to add water falls after waves crashed on the rock). I don't even know if that's possible. What kind of effect would you like to have ?
One last idea I had, is creating some simple material-specific falling debris effects (concrete, stone, bricks, metal, etc) which can be triggered when the corresponding damage zones (the ones we have added to zones.cfg for this mod), will suffer a given amount of damage. Just a few simple 3D particles, not to burden too much our GPU's. There is no hurry on that, but I wish those effects to be ready before we release our next lighthouse. We could dig in RacerBoy's/TheDarkWraith's FX mods for SHIII, IV and 5, to see how he achieved this particular effect. With that done, I don't really see what other feature we could add to our interactive lighthouses. That would likely be the state-of-art, as far as SHIII limits are concerned. What do you think? :D
No problem, very easy for me. Give me the debris 3D models (which should be non specific to La Plate beacon, so we can use the effect for all lighthouses), and I create the effect for you, with a cloud of grey smoke. :)
Kendras
08-04-17, 04:16 AM
In fact, I don't think that spawning debris flying in the air is a good idea. When destroyed, the top part will only collapse, and create a cloud of smoke.
Yes, I tried to add a foam effect, but I failed until now (tried to add water falls after waves crashed on the rock). I don't even know if that's possible. What kind of effect would you like to have ?
Just foam: little white bubbles on the sea surface, similar to the material that ship wakes are composed of
http://i194.photobucket.com/albums/z58/tonschk/SH5Img2011-06-05_230547.jpg
The screenshot above was taken in SH5. You can see the effect along the dock: the game generates it automatically where the sea surface interacts with the terrain or with any object linked to a StaticObject controller. Do you think we can achieve that for our lighthouses?
Water splashes, where waves hit walls and rocks, would be a nice addition too, but I don't ask for that much. Foam would be more than enough :D
No problem, very easy for me. Give me the debris 3D models (which should be non specific to La Plate beacon, so we can use the effect for all lighthouses)
Of course. Imo we need two effects, one with smaller and fewer debris particles for intermediate damage, and one with bigger debris for 100% damage. Those two effects should use different debris models and sounds, depending on the zone it is used for
ReinforcedTower/ConcreteTower: fragments of concrete falling down
StoneTower: squared stones and irregular stone pieces falling down
BrickTower: bricks, brick fragments and small portions of wall falling down
MetalTower: metal plates and pieces of metal frame falling down
SkeletalTower: pieces of metal frame falling down
...and I create the effect for you, with a cloud of grey smoke.
More a cloud of dust than real smoke, as most of the materials that lighthouses are built with are not flammable anyway :03:
:) And we have to add a specific sound too !
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WNgnsuW3Zis
Nice idea, those sound are okay, but we need to crop only the falling debris sound (no need for explosion sounds, as those are already in game)
In fact, I don't think that spawning debris flying in the air is a good idea. When destroyed, the top part will only collapse, and create a cloud of smoke.
Why not? physical debris collapsing and splashing in the water would be so cool :D
Kendras
08-04-17, 09:55 AM
Just foam: little white bubbles on the sea surface, similar to the material that ship wakes are composed of
Water splashes, where waves hit walls and rocks, would be a nice addition too, but I don't ask for that much. Foam would be more than enough
OK. I will try to do that ! :yep:
More a cloud of dust than real smoke, as most of the materials that lighthouses are built with are not flammable anyway
Yes, that's what I mean.
Nice idea, those sound are okay, but we need to crop only the falling debris sound (no need for explosion sounds, as those are already in game)
Of course.
Why not? physical debris collapsing and splashing in the water would be so cool :D
If so, the debris must be detachable parts of the main model.
Kendras
08-04-17, 10:53 AM
OK. I will try to do that ! :yep:
Well, it seems impossible to add a shipwake to an immobile unit. :hmph:
If so, the debris must be detachable parts of the main model.
Not only. I give you two examples:
when we hit the main tower, far from any detachable part, there will be a damage decal rendered on it. A fake hole. In RL there would debris detaching and falling down from the hole; in SHIII there wouldn't be any, unless we create the debris artificially as part of the damage effect.
When we destroy the tower top, in real life it would collapse, partly breaking in many pieces; in SHIII it will collapse in one piece, and it will take a damage effect to simulate the debris detaching from it and also collapsing in the water.
Did I make myself clear now? :)
Kendras
08-04-17, 11:41 AM
Not only. I give you two examples:
when we hit the main tower, far from any detachable part, there will be a damage decal rendered on it. A fake hole. In RL there would debris detaching and falling down from the hole; in SHIII there wouldn't be any, unless we create the debris artificially as part of the damage effect.
When we destroy the tower top, in real life it would collapse, partly breaking in many pieces; in SHIII it will collapse in one piece, and it will take a damage effect to simulate the debris detaching from it and also collapsing in the water.
Did I make myself clear now? :)
Yes, but the damage effect will never simulate the falling debris as well as detachable parts thrown in the air (not necessarily far) after a direct hit. Moreover, when the fake debris will fall into water, there won't be any splash effect, whereas with detachable parts. And also it's not possible to control the direction of the debris which won't move in the same direction as the ennemy's fire.
All this will make debris effect very unrealistic.
Well, it seems impossible to add a shipwake to an immobile unit. :hmph:
Well, that sounds logical: static objects have no wakes :O:
Out of jokes, have you looked in ShipWake speed propeties? Maybe changing the ShipSpeed property of the second or third array item from 0.05/1 to 0, and removing the other two items?
I that doesn't work I wonder if, by using the same texture used as the wake effect and by taking inspiration from ShipWake controller's settings, you could create a ParticleGenerator FX which resembles it.
If nothing works, don't worry and scrap the idea, at least for the moment being: we still have a lot of work to do for this mod :up:
Kendras
08-04-17, 11:56 AM
Well, that sounds logical: static objects have no wakes :O:
Yeah ... but this is the shipwake controller which spawns a foam effect floating on the waves.
Out of jokes, have you looked in ShipWake speed propeties? Maybe changing the ShipSpeed property of the second or third array item from 0.05/1 to 0, and removing the other two items?
Yes, sure. I've tried on a sea unit. First by removing the two items with speed different from 0 + changing the parameters of the remaining node to have same as those from nodes with speed different from 0, and then by setting all 3 nodes speed to 0.
I wonder if, by using the same texture used as the wake effect and by taking inspiration from ShipWake controller's settings, you could create a ParticleGenerator FX which resembles it.
Well, unfortunately both controllers have completly different parameters.
Yes, but the damage effect will never simulate the falling debris as well as detachable parts thrown in the air (not necessarily far) after a direct hit.Moreover, when the fake debris will fall into water, there won't be any splash effect, whereas with detachable parts. And also it's not possible to control the direction of the debris which won't move in the same direction as the ennemy's fire.
All this will make debris effect very unrealistic.
Debris particles shouldn't follow the same direction as the impacting projectile but they should radiate (not necessarily far) from the impact area in random directions
Obtaining a realistic effect should be a matter of playing with initial/overlife X, Y and Z speeds and with particle mass parameters. decrease X/Z speeds and mass and particles shouldn't move too far away from the impact area before they start falling down; decrease the Y speed and/or increase the mass, and particles shouldn't jump too high in the air before they invert their vertical speed and they start falling down.
As for water splashes, I am pretty sure that debris featured in the SH5 version of FX-Updates have them, and they cause damage to nearby vessels too if they hit them lol. I think they have a StaticObject controller attached, but I will have a look into them to see how this particular effect was obtained :up:
Yeah ... but this is the shipwake controller which spawns a foam effect floating on the waves.
Yes, sure. I've tried on a sea unit. First by removing the two items with speed different from 0 + changing the parameters of the remaining node to have same as those from nodes with speed different from 0, and then by setting all 3 nodes speed to 0.
Well, unfortunately both controllers have completly different parameters.
Okay, pity for our models, but I think we will live with it :up:
Kendras
08-04-17, 05:10 PM
Do you like this ?
http://i.imgur.com/FSRL6eU.png
Do you like this ?
http://i.imgur.com/FSRL6eU.png
I like your stubborness. :D
Yes, I like it. Maybe a bit more transparent :up:
Are splashes affected by wave height BTW?
So, here is the new version:
https://www.mediafire.com/file/u8aaiamuh6gru4g/Tourelle%20de%20La%20Plate%20v12.7z
Sorry, lately I had not much time for modding so I couldn't finish the model splitting/damage tweaking that I had planned for this version, but I am at good point with it. Another missing feature is sounds triggered by waves. As for the rest, the list of changed features is like the one I had posted at post #444 (http://www.subsim.com/radioroom/showpost.php?p=2503956&postcount=444) with some small additions that you will notice probably.
During the next two weeks I won't be at home. I will take my laptop with me but I am not sure I will get enough free time for modding. In any case I will check the forum regularly and I will give you my feed-back on any update you might post.
As I said before, very little work is left before I can share the damage models. The tower top, part of the eaves and part of the railings are separate from the tower now. Here's a couple of examples:
http://i.imgur.com/C4ulVwg.png
http://i.imgur.com/BJ0mfpL.png
As you can see, meshes odels are more or less ready. I might decide some put some rebars around the top edge of the tower to replace the missing eaves, I need to work on the textures (that's quick), I have to prepare the meshes for importing them in s3d (model flipping, edge splittting, neet to put vertices at the right height, etc.), and I need to setup the game files (adding damage boxes and pother controllers to the new parts, creating and tweaking new zones, etc.). With a bit of luck, I will be able to finish the work before I am back home :salute:
Kendras
08-04-17, 06:53 PM
Are splashes affected by wave height BTW?
Yes, of course ! They will appear only with big waves. :)
Another missing feature is sounds triggered by waves.
Stop searching, I think I have the solution ! :D
During the next two weeks I won't be at home.
Ok, thank you to inform me.
As I said before, very little work is left before I can share the damage models. The tower top, part of the eaves and part of the railings are separate from the tower now. Here's a couple of examples:
So, you finally decided to add some detachable parts ? Don't forget to add a collision sphere, in addition to the damage box.
So, here is the new version:
https://www.mediafire.com/file/u8aaiamuh6gru4g/Tourelle%20de%20La%20Plate%20v12.7z
I will test it next week, I won't have much time during the week-end. :salute:
Yes, of course ! They will appear only with big waves. :)
:yeah:
If we can have water splashes only on high waves, why not simple foam during on the sea surface when waves are medium-low :hmm2: :D
Stop searching, I think I have the solution ! :D
Sound triggered by particle effect? :03: :up:
So, you finally decided to add some detachable parts ?
Sure, I think I had told you they were in my todo list, but they don't replace the debris effect: I can't add so many of them and I still think we need smaller debris triggered by damage. Install this mod (http://www.subsim.com/radioroom/downloads.php?do=file&id=455) and you will probably understand what I mean :03:
[QUOTE=Kendras;2504780]
Don't forget to add a collision sphere, in addition to the damage box.
Not sure, but I think we dont need it: I added the StaticObject controller to the lighthouse unit, and now all its parts and equipments are as hard as stones :up:
I will test it next week, I won't have much time during the week-end. :salute:
No problem, take your time on it :up:
Anvar1061
08-06-17, 07:59 AM
http://s4.uploads.ru/i/VGzUn.jpg
Kendras
08-07-17, 08:35 AM
Hello,
I need the int_halo.tga texture with a transparent background instead of black. Could you create it for me please, gap ? It's located in Materials.dat, at the end of the list.
PS : @ Anvar1061 : your post is empty.
Anvar1061
08-07-17, 11:55 AM
PS : @ Anvar1061 : your post is empty.
http://www.subsim.com/radioroom/images/smilies/Kaleun_Confused.gif
But in this way?
Kendras
08-07-17, 01:38 PM
:k_confused:
But in this way?
OK now ! :up:
I need the int_halo.tga texture with a transparent background instead of black. Could you create it for me please, gap ? It's located in Materials.dat, at the end of the list.
Hi Kendras, unlike gif and png, the tga format doesn't allow transparecy to be applied straight to the RGB channel. Transparency information can be stored in the alpha channel though. If that is what you meant, please download the following texture:
https://www.mediafire.com/file/7u9ppp7hpuabg4h/int_halo.tga
For your information, that's what I did:
- took the SH5 version of the texture which is identical to the one used in SHIII, but bigger (256x256 instead of 128x128 pixels);
- added an alpha channel to it;
- copied the RGB channel in the alpha channel;
- made the RGB channel solid white;
- saved as a RLE-compressed 32-bit tga.
If need be, you can resize the texture to its original size, restore the original RGB texture (copying it from the alpha channel) or save as uncopressed tga. Let me know if it helps :salute:
@ Anvar1061
Any remark? :)
Anvar1061
08-08-17, 07:49 AM
What is any remerak?
http://www.subsim.com/radioroom/images/smilies/Kaleun_Confused.gif
What is any remerak?
http://www.subsim.com/radioroom/images/smilies/Kaleun_Confused.gif
Oh sorry, I meant "any remark?", my bad for the mistyping :88)
Anvar1061
08-08-17, 08:48 AM
I get CTD at 85% of the load of a single mission with all the fixes of the required my GWX Rus files. In NYGM this lighthouse only works in 1940!
Thank you for your reports Anvar, they are of great help :)
As far as I know, before you joined our little team, our lighthouse had only been tested over SHIII + GWX Gold (me), and WAC (Kendras). MLF has also been helping us with alpha-testing, but I ignore his mod loadout.
More extensive tests to ensure compatibility with the most common megamods will be carried out during the beta-testing stage. :up:
I get CTD at 85% of the load of a single mission with all the fixes of the required my GWX Rus files.
This CTD might be caused by the lighthouse having been set as type 407 (Naval Base) starting from alpha v12. I am not sure yet that this is the best unit type we can use for our lighthouses; we might switch to another unit type in one of the next versions, but if we kept it, it would enable our lighthouses having their names printed on the navigation map, similar to ports.
Getting back to the crash you have repoted, your Russian-localized version of GWX might not like the map label currently set for our lighthouse. Please open Lighthouses.mis with a text editor, and try replacing the orange text in the following line with any cyrillic text migh be fit:
Name= La Plate VQ(9)10s19m8M
Let me know if that solves the problem
In NYGM this lighthouse only works in 1940!
To be honest, all my tests have been carried out using the date chosen by Kendras for his testing mission (March 1, 1940). The date-triggered CTD you are reporting might be caused by some lighthouse equipments -which, on turn, have other configurable equipments linked to them- being removed from the model starting from June 25, 1940.
If that was true, the CTD migh not be megamod-related, and it might happen when the game tries placing an equipment on top of another equipment which is no longer in place. If that was the case, a possible fix could be "switching off" "child equipments" as well as their "parent equipments".
I will investigate on the issue and I will keep you informed on my findings :salute:
Kendras
08-08-17, 10:24 AM
Thank you for your reports Anvar, they are of great help :)
Yes, thank you Anvar. :up:
As far as I know, before you joined our little team, our lighthouse had only been tested over SHIII + GWX Gold (me), and WAC (Kendras). MLF has also been helping us with alpha-testing, but I ignore his mod loadout.
Correction : I'm testing with vanilla game, but modded with WAC 4.1 terrain and WAC 4.1 locations.
This CTD might be caused by the lighthouse having been set as type 407 (Naval Base) starting from alpha v12. I am not sure yet that this is the best unit type we can use for our lighthouses; we might switch to another unit type in one of the next versions, but if we kept it, it would enable our lighthouses having their names printed on the navigation map, similar to ports.
I think it's a very good idea, and it does not cause any problem.
The CTD is probably due to the Locations.cfg file in Terrain folder. You have to install manually the new locations in your own Locations.cfg file (ignore the Brest_U_Bunker new entry) from line ; LIGHTHOUSES, and correct the numbers in each [Location ---] .
To be honest, all my tests have been carried out using the date chosen by Kendras for his testing mission (March 1, 1940). The date-triggered CTD you are reporting might be caused by some lighthouse equipments -which, on turn, have other configurable equipments linked to them- being removed from the model starting from June 25, 1940.
If that was true, the CTD migh not be megamod-related, and it might happen when the game tries placing an equipment on top of another equipment which is no longer in place. If that was the case, a possible fix could be "switching off" "child equipments" as well as their "parent equipments".
I've tried to launch the mission in 1945, and no CTD occured.
Kendras
08-08-17, 10:39 AM
Results from my testings on V12 :
- textures are shown correctly, but I don't see any difference with and without specular map controller.
- else, all is working fine ! :up:
Here are the modifications I've made :
LLH_LaPlate folder :
- added (with correct name "LLH_LaPlate_shp.tga") the icon shown on the navigation map (else there is an error message, see picture)
- LLH_LaPlate.dat : modified values of specular strenght for textures (in order that metal looks more bright), added the placement nodes for foam particles.
Library folder :
- Lighthouse_FX.dat : modified the light halo (smaller, and shorter light signals, same frequency 10 seconds)
- particles.dat : added 2 nodes for foam particles (splash effect) with sound, controlled by the height of the waves
- particles.dsd : added 2 nodes for the sound of the splash effect
- Materials.dat : new texture for water splash effect
Sound folder :
- added a new sound (which could be improved) : wave_crash.wav
- added a new line in Sh3.sdl for this new sound.
Roster folder :
- added the German folder
- corrected name (from "La Plate" to " La Plate VQ(9)10s19m8M") on the line "DisplayName=" in .cfg files.
Terrain folder :
- added the locations for all the most important lighthouses of the French Atlantic coast.
- 2 icons : Lighthouse.tga for medium lighthouses (height around 30 meters), and Tall_Lighthouse.tga for high lighthouses (around 60 meters).
D/L link : http://www.mediafire.com/file/vely5jd3ea50bo7/Tourelle_de_La_Plate_v12_-_Patch_1.7z
Note 1 : This is a "patch", so it contains only the corrected files.
Note 2 : the foam effect and its sound might be buggy sometimes. It may come from the particles time settings, or from my old computer with very low graphics specs, so I let you test by yourself. The wind speed must be 15 m/s.
:salute:
@ Kendras
Have you seen my post #485 (http://www.subsim.com/radioroom/showpost.php?p=2505350&postcount=485)?
Correction : I'm testing with vanilla game, but modded with WAC 4.1 terrain and WAC 4.1 locations.
:up:
I think it's a very good idea, and it does not cause any problem.
lighthouse text labels are much more smooth now, yet I can see some unwanted effects too: they are visible at lower zoom levels, meaning that the map will look a bit messy when there will be many lighthouses around the coasts, and no matter how hard I tried finding an paragraph end marker which works for those labels, I couldn't find any: Lighthouse names and their shortened characteristics must be on the same line.
A question: do enemy units still attack our lighthouse set as naval bases?
The CTD is probably due to the Locations.cfg file in Terrain folder. You have to install manually the new locations in your own Locations.cfg file (ignore the Brest_U_Bunker new entry) from line ; LIGHTHOUSES, and correct the numbers in each [Location ---] .
I don't think so. I am testing over GWX, and the Locations.cfg file included in the last beta (which I took from you, with some basic modifications), doesn't cause any crash. I must be something text-related :hmmm:
I've tried to launch the mission in 1945, and no CTD occured.
Tested with v12?
Kendras
08-08-17, 10:49 AM
Have you seen my post #485 (http://www.subsim.com/radioroom/showpost.php?p=2505350&postcount=485)?
Oh yes, sorry. So, this was exactly what I was searching for, but it didn't help to sort out the idea I was following. Thank you anyway. :up: These .tga with colored background are something very strange to me. The same thing happens with trees' textures. And in game the background is transparent... :hmmm:
Tested with v12?
Yes.
Results from my testings on V12 :
- textures are shown correctly, but I don't see any difference with and without specular map controller.
The effect can be subtle: make main texture's RGB channel solid gray to see what a difference the specular mask makes. Contrast/luminosity/gamma of the alpha channel might require to be tweaked separately for each material, and material's "Specular strength" attribute raised a bit for the effect to become more obvious :yep:
- else, all is working fine ! :up:
:up:
Here are the modifications I've made...
Good :yeah:
Testing your patch right away :salute:
Oh yes, sorry. So, this was exactly what I was searching for, but it didn't help to sort out the idea I was following. Thank you anyway. :up:
My pleasure :salute:
These .tga with colored background are something very strange to me. The same thing happens with trees' textures. And in game the background is transparent... :hmmm:
Tree materials are hardcoded; it is possible that they have been coded so that their texture's background color is transparent in game. Other textures require (semi-)transparent areas to be painted as grey/black in their alpha channel, and the "enable alpha blend" flag of their material to be enabled. Texture particles seem to be the exception to that rule, as their transparency mask is often painted on the RGB channel rather than on the alpha channel :hmm2:
@ Kendras
I have tested your patch. Good job! :Kaleun_Applaud:
In the next few days I will try to review all your changes and see if there's anything that can be improved.
My first remarks/suggestions below.
LLH_LaPlate folder :
- LLH_LaPlate.dat : modified values of specular strenght for textures (in order that metal looks more bright)
As far as I can see, you have basically decreased concrete material's specular strength. The resulting effect is coherent with what one would expect for such a material, but the low value also causes specular reflections from texture's alpha channel to be hardly noticeable. Couldn't we reset concrete's attribute to the value I had set in v12, and correspondingly increase metal's specular strength instead, thus simulating the specularity/glossiness of wet surfaces?
Library folder :
- Lighthouse_FX.dat : modified the light halo (smaller, and shorter light signals, same frequency 10 seconds)
The halo is finally of the right size. The quicker flashing light, makes it harder to count flashes for each period, but that's okay.
I had to restore the 3D model previously linked to the light effect though, in order to make it to light up surrounding objects (most notably lantern's glass). Was there a special reason for you to remove it?
Roster folder :
- added the German folder
What's the use of having La Plate in the German roster, since we have already added it to the French roster?
Kendras
08-09-17, 04:36 AM
As far as I can see, you have basically decreased concrete material's specular strength. The resulting effect is coherent with what one would expect for such a material, but the low value also causes specular reflections from texture's alpha channel to be hardly noticeable. Couldn't we reset concrete's attribute to the value I had set in v12, and correspondingly increase metal's specular strength instead, thus simulating the specularity/glossiness of wet surfaces?
Yes, ok, let's do that.
The halo is finally of the right size. The quicker flashing light, makes it harder to count flashes for each period, but that's okay.
I had to restore the 3D model previously linked to the light effect though, in order to make it to light up surrounding objects (most notably lantern's glass). Was there a special reason for you to remove it?
Do you see any difference in game ? Not me :o
What's the use of having La Plate in the German roster, since we have already added it to the French roster?
When France is occupied, France becomes a neutral country. But Germans can use all strategic devices they want, including lighthouses. So, we can consider them as German, and British airplanes will attack them.
(Note : About the foam effect, I'm not sure that it's working smoothly. Sometimes, I notice an unexpected flickering effect. Could you check that attentively ?)
Yes, ok, let's do that.
:up:
Main factors to play with are:
Specular color (i.e. reflection brightness; black or a shade of gray close to the one used as Diffuse color=no reflections; white=bright reflections);
Specular strenght (i.e. reflection intensity; 0 = no reflections, 255=very strong reflections)
Glossiness (i.e. reflection sharpness; 0=completely blurred reflections, 255=very sharp reflections).
Both materials stored in the main unit and in the library file should be edited in a similar way (in both files, first 'empty' material=concrete, second empty material=metal).
Do you have time to mess with those settings? :D
Do you see any difference in game ? Not me :o
I do. Look at lantern's glass: when the light flare particle node has a 3d mesh attached, the glass becomes bright when the light is on. If the 3d model is removed, the glass stays unlit.
When France is occupied, France becomes a neutral country. But Germans can use all strategic devices they want, including lighthouses. So, we can consider them as German, and British airplanes will attack them.
Wouldn't be easier setting France as an Axis country during its occupation? Indeed, that would be in contrast with the official stance of Vichy France, but it would better reflect its actual relations with the other WWII contenders and, imho, gamewise it would be more appropriate :hmm2:
(Note : About the foam effect, I'm not sure that it's working smoothly. Sometimes, I notice an unexpected flickering effect. Could you check that attentively ?)
Yep, I noticed that. I am trying to track down the problem. It might be related with max number of particles / particle creation rate.
Talking about the same effect, I have some more remarks:
I have moved the new particle generators and the related material to the Lighthouse_FX library file. For compatibility issues, I think it is better messing as little as possible with stock files which are altered by many mods.
The main effect has two particle generators, one of them with an object particle item, the other with a bitmap particle item and the sound effect attached to it. Can you explain what each particle generator/particle is mean for? Couldn't you use just one particle generator with two array items (one for the object particle, and one for the bitmap particle?). Sorry for the many questions, but I am trying to learn :D
In the Material dat, under the water spray texture, there was a fastparticle generator (which I moved in the Lighthouse_FX file together with the material/texture) having as parent the main node of the lighthouse unit. As far as I can judge, this configuration is a bit unusual. I have tried to remove the controller and/or to set the Parent Id field to 0, and the effect becomes buggy. Can you explain why you set the material/particle this way? Is there no way to link the FastParticleGenerator directly to the splash effect (as an object particle maybe), rather than linking it to the model through parent Id settings? I ask so because, if keep it like this, we will need as many copies of the controller as the lighthouses/rocks that we want to have splashes on them. :hmmm:
It is me, or water splashes spawn on the wrong side relative to wave direction? After rotating splash effect's node by 180deg, splashes seem to be triggered on the correct side of the lighthouse. I am not sure though: it could be an optical illusion.
Splashes spawn a bit too far from the concrete base. I have displaced effect's placement nodes in the lighthouse file so to form the vertices of a regular octagon having a circumradius of 5 m (moving them closer didn't work, as most of the times splash particles were triggered at once on all sides), and I have displaced particle generator's node by 1.5 m along its z axis, in the direction of the lighthouse center. Now splashes spawn directly against the walls of the lighthouse, rather than looking like water columns
with a loose connection with the model.
The texture used for the effect was quite poor. I have replaced it with a custom texture based on another texture I had created long ago for FX Update by TheDarkWraith (for SH5). Better resolution, a hint of blue in the RGB channel, and an actual water splash with a cloud of small water drops painted on the alpha channel. I think you will like it :03:
Even after bringing all the changes mentioned above, the effect still looks a bit monotonus. I think we should add some degree of randomness to its particles, and to make them affected by wind. The result we should aim for, is every splash being unique in appearance and, unlike now, not to look as the same texture reiterated n times.
For the same reason as above, I think we should switch the two particles/particle generators that the effect is composed of, to use two different textures. That's why I asked what each of them is meant to represent :)
(Note : About the foam effect, I'm not sure that it's working smoothly. Sometimes, I notice an unexpected flickering effect. Could you check that attentively ?)
Yep, I noticed that. I am trying to track down the problem. It might be related with max number of particles / particle creation rate.
I didn't do the math yet, but the quote below might apply to your stuttering/resetting particle effect:
To address patchy bubbles - you don't need anywhere near as high as 5,000 particles for this effect, a few hundred should be just fine. To get a steady release, make sure that @Helix Bubbles.FastParticleGenerator.BitmapParticles.n.Cr eation.Rate multiplied by .Life is less than MaxParticles. For example if you tell it to have a max of 100 particles, but to release 50 every second for five seconds, then after two seconds it's going to run out of particles, until the first ones start to die. So you'll have a patchy of three seconds where there are no particles.
Kendras
08-09-17, 12:04 PM
Yep, I noticed that. I am trying to track down the problem. It might be related with max number of particles / particle creation rate.
I didn't do the math yet, but the quote below might apply to your stuttering/resetting particle effect:
To address patchy bubbles - you don't need anywhere near as high as 5,000 particles for this effect, a few hundred should be just fine. To get a steady release, make sure that @Helix Bubbles.FastParticleGenerator.BitmapParticles.n.Cr eation.Rate multiplied by .Life is less than MaxParticles. For example if you tell it to have a max of 100 particles, but to release 50 every second for five seconds, then after two seconds it's going to run out of particles, until the first ones start to die. So you'll have a patchy of three seconds where there are no particles.
Yes, I know this. In the foam_particles generator, MaxParticles=40, life for each particle is 2s, and rate of creation is 10/s, so there is a maximum of 20 particles ...
I have moved the new particle generators and the related material to the Lighthouse_FX library file. For compatibility issues, I think it is better messing as little as possible with stock files which are altered by many mods.
Yes ok, if it's still working.
The main effect has two particle generators, one of them with an object particle item, the other with a bitmap particle item and the sound effect attached to it. Can you explain what each particle generator/particle is mean for? Couldn't you use just one particle generator with two array items (one for the object particle, and one for the bitmap particle?). Sorry for the many questions, but I am trying to learn :D
The one with a bitmap particle item attached creates the visual effect. The other one creates one "object" which has a sound attached. Long time ago, I tried to create a particles generator with both bitmap and object items, and it didn't work properly, IIRC.
In the Material dat, under the water spray texture, there was a fastparticle generator (which I moved in the Lighthouse_FX file together with the material/texture) having as parent the main node of the lighthouse unit. As far as I can judge, this configuration is a bit unusual. I have tried to remove the controller and/or to set the Parent Id field to 0, and the effect becomes buggy. Can you explain why you set the material/particle this way? Is there no way to link the FastParticleGenerator directly to the splash effect (as an object particle maybe), rather than linking it to the model through parent Id settings? I ask so because, if keep it like this, we will need as many copies of the controller as the lighthouses/rocks that we want to have splashes on them.
Really, no details can escape from you ! :haha: This node was part of an attempt to create a unique generator throwing several particles generators all around the beacon, but it didn't work. You can ignore/delete it. Same remark for both nodes called "$mat_int_halo_2".
It is me, or water splashes spawn on the wrong side relative to wave direction? After rotating splash effect's node by 180deg, splashes seem to be triggered on the correct side of the lighthouse. I am not sure though: it could be an optical illusion.
Yes, the direction of the foam is in the other direction of the wave, because (in my mind) the water crashes on the beacon, splashes in the air and returns in the other direction with foam.
Splashes spawn a bit too far from the concrete base. I have displaced effect's placement nodes in the lighthouse file so to form the vertices of a regular octagon having a circumradius of 5 m (moving them closer didn't work, as most of the times splash particles were triggered at once on all sides), and I have displaced particle generator's node by 1.5 m along its z axis, in the direction of the lighthouse center. Now splashes spawn directly against the walls of the lighthouse, rather than looking like water columns with a loose connection with the model.
Why not.
The texture used for the effect was quite poor. I have replaced it with a custom texture based on another texture I had created long ago for FX Update by TheDarkWraith (for SH5). Better resolution, a hint of blue in the RGB channel, and an actual water splash with a cloud of small water drops painted on the alpha channel. I think you will like it :03:
Do you have a screenshot ? :D
Even after bringing all the changes mentioned above, the effect still looks a bit monotonus. I think we should add some degree of randomness to its particles, and to make them affected by wind. The result we should aim for, is every splash being unique in appearance and, unlike now, not to look as the same texture reiterated n times.
I fear it won't be possible.
For the same reason as above, I think we should switch the two particles/particle generators that the effect is composed of, to use two different textures. That's why I asked what each of them is meant to represent :)
In the generator with the bitmap item attached, you can add as many items (with different materials linked, and different settings) as you want.
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