patSH3r - Reborn

[Fader_Berg]

patSH3r
_ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _



patSH3r changes the way Silent Hunter III works by bringing new functionality to the game. It uses a technique called code injection, which adds/replaces code in live memory while running the game. Thus it doesn't make modifications to any of the original game files. When the files belonging to this project are removed, the game is left as nothing ever happened.

I'm restarting this project from scratch... again. After getting a new interest in SH3. This time I'm going full assembly because it's easier to implement. And since no one ever joined in on the C-code, there is not much use of making things more accessible/complicated.


!!! patSH3r is no longer compatible with hsie-patched exe's !!!


FEATURES:
Read the manual for more information.


DOWNLOADS: Current revision: 48

Download patSH3r and the manual from https://fb.tuxxor.net/


CREDITS & Special Thanks:


makman94 for testing and advices
H.sie - for opening his source code which perhaps will be the source of many patches to come.



Known Bugs:
None

Have a nice day!

/Fader Berg

[areo16]

- patSH3r -



patSH3r changes the way Silent Hunter III works by bringing new functionallity to the game. It uses a technique called code injection, which adds/replaces code in live memory while running the game. Thus it doesn't make modifications to any of the original game files. When the files belonging to this project are removed, the game is left as nothing ever happened.

I'm restarting this project from scratch, since h.sie's project have died out. The first goal is to rewrite the h.sie patches (copy the behaviour, not the code) into this project, and later on extend them further and add new patches.

patSH3r-code is licensed under the GNU GPL3 license. Contributions are welcome.

FEATURES:

WO range estimation fix

Currently this fix mimics the h.sie range estimation fix (yet only WO). Accuracy is off by the following rules:- Range < 2000m: Steps: 100m
- Range 2000-4000m: Steps: 200m
- Range 4000-9000m: Steps: 500m
- Range 9000-12000m: Steps: 1000m
- Range > 12000m: Steps: 2000m

INSTALLATION:Unzip the downloaded file and copy the two files (patSH3r.act & patSH3r.cfg) to the directory where your SH3 installations resides. patSH3r will do its magic next time you start the game.

To remove it. Just remove patSH3r.act & patSH3r.cfg and there will be no magic no more.
DOWNLOADS:
latest-patSH3r.zip (http://www.voidptr.se/patsh3r/latest-patSH3r.zip)
latest-patSH3r-source.zip (http://www.voidptr.se/patsh3r/latest-patSH3r-source.zip)

Have a nice day!

/Fader Berg

I'm so glad someone here who has some time and knows about code injection has taken on this project. Your skills are valueable. Do you mind sharing your methods for reverse engineering? Do you use CheatEngine or just read the hex directly in OllyDbg or WinHex?

What do you write in? C#?

I do have some other information that may be of assistance to you. Let me know if you need it. It regards information about the EXE.

[Fader_Berg]

I'm so glad someone here who has some time and knows about code injection has taken on this project. Your skills are valueable. Do you mind sharing your methods for reverse engineering? Do you use CheatEngine or just read the hex directly in OllyDbg or WinHex?

What do you write in? C#?

I do have some other information that may be of assistance to you. Let me know if you need it. It regards information about the EXE.

I've not been using CheatEngine so far, but it will be required along the road. I'm currently using Ollydbg 1.10 and HT Editor (http://hte.sourceforge.net/).

I write in plain good old C and assembler.

You're more than welcome to contribute in one or another way. Code snippets or just general findings. All small contributions will sum up to the big whole.

[LGN1]

Hi Fader_Berg,

good news! There is still much room for improvements!

One question: Why don't you start from H.Sie's patched exe for injecting the new code? I guess this would save a lot of work and time because re-doing H.Sie's work will be A LOT of work without benefit for the community.

Regards, LGN1

[Fader_Berg]

Hi Fader_Berg,

good news! There is still much room for improvements!

One question: Why don't you start from H.Sie's patched exe for injecting the new code? I guess this would save a lot of work and time because re-doing H.Sie's work will be A LOT of work without benefit for the community.

Regards, LGN1

Going through h.sies patches is a good way to learn his findings and catch up with the program flow (where things are at). But ofcourse... If I find something that steals my attention for a bit, I won't hesitate.
There is a huge benefit for the community. First of all, I share my code to you all and everyone is welcome to join in at any time. Second; it's mainly written in C, which is far more simplier than assambly to cope with. I think we'll reach a larger developer base.

[La vache]

Good news

Will they also add "Added crew rotation" for new version?
This was no longer compatible with h.sie / stiebler.exe.

Regards, La vache

[Fader_Berg]

Good news

Will they also add "Added crew rotation" for new version?
This was no longer compatible with h.sie / stiebler.exe.

Regards, La vache

I'll look into it, but I don't know when.

[areo16]

Hi Fader_Berg,

good news! There is still much room for improvements!

One question: Why don't you start from H.Sie's patched exe for injecting the new code? I guess this would save a lot of work and time because re-doing H.Sie's work will be A LOT of work without benefit for the community.

Regards, LGN1

H.Sie's work isn't open source is it?

[Fader_Berg]

r16:


Code clean-up
Removed inaccurate_wo
Added wo_experience



Watch Officer Experience

Range estimation will suffer penalties if the WO don't have the Watchman qualification and/or is inexperienced.

[Fader_Berg]

r17:


Added wo_targeting



Watch officer targeting

Watch officer will give bearing and range to locked target (or pointed to with UZO). If no target is locked, the closest ship is reported.

[makman94]

The sun is rising again for the moding of sh3 :yeah:

did i get it right ? no patching the .exe is needed ? just dropping the files in sh3 folder ? this is...heaven mate :salute:

also, this new feature you added ,WO giving range estimations for the locked target (and not for the closer ship) is more that needed and usefull !!!
i still remember the damn destroyer getting into WO eyes as closer item when i was looking for the large cargo


thank you very very much for these stuff Fader_Berg :up:


question:
do you believe that is doable to alter the target's behaviour (routines) and make them 'smarter' ? you know , i am talking about if we can get rid of this silly zig-zagging (but staying on their current course) when the u-boat is detected or when they are attacked by torpedo

[Fader_Berg]

do you believe that is doable to alter the target's behaviour (routines) and make them 'smarter' ? you know , i am talking about if we can get rid of this silly zig-zagging (but staying on their current course) when the u-boat is detected or when they are attacked by torpedo

Everything is possible, but I'm not sure I can do it. It sounds hard to find where this code is running and I don't think I'll look for it in a long, long time. Maybe if I just happen to run into it.

[jaxa]

It's really very interesting, especially new WO behaviour depending on his experience :).
What would you like to include in this mod in near future?

[sublynx]

Range to the locked target!?! That's extremely useful :D Thanks a lot!

[Fader_Berg]

It's really very interesting, especially new WO behaviour depending on his experience :).
What would you like to include in this mod in near future?
I'm just playing around for now and getting to know my way. It depends much on what I run into.
Personally I miss a lot of things regarding the crew when I play. I want them to become a bigger part of the game. Make the experience more important than it is today. They should leave a bit of grief when they die or get transfered, 'cause you've worked so hard and long with them.

[iambecomelife]

Thanks for this contribution!

[Magic1111]

Copied from the patSH3r.cfg:


...
wo_targeting_msg "Range to visual contact at bearing %03.0f is %.0f meters."

Works this with german version (de_menu.txt) too? :hmmm:

[areo16]

I'm just playing around for now and getting to know my way. It depends much on what I run into.
Personally I miss a lot of things regarding the crew when I play. I want them to become a bigger part of the game. Make the experience more important than it is today. They should leave a bit of grief when they die or get transfered, 'cause you've worked so hard and long with them.

I sent you a PM regarding pointer locations.

[Fader_Berg]

Copied from the patSH3r.cfg:

Works this with german version (de_menu.txt) too? :hmmm:

No, patSH3r doesn't look in either en- or de_menu.txt. It uses the configuration value wo_targeting_msg in the cfg-file. So you've got to replace the message displayed in the patSH3r.cfg with your own.

[Fader_Berg]

Watch officer experience - Explained

The formula is based on three factors.not_watchman, wo_experience_no_wmPenalty factor when the WO doesn't have the Watchman qualification. Default is 0.15
experience, wo_experience_xpPenalty factor depending on whether the WO got less experience than this value. Default is 350.
range, wo_experience_rangePenalty factor (or bonus) if the target is beyond or closer this value in meters. Default is 3000
This is the formula with default values
Penalty = 0.05 if WO got Watchman, else 0.15
Penalty = Penalty * MAX(1, (350 / WOs XP))
Penalty = Penalty * (Range to target / 3000)
Penalty = Penalty / (a randomized number between 1-5)
Penalty = Penalty / 2
Penalty is randomized to be positive or negative 50/50

Estimated_range = Estimated_range + (Estimated_range * Penalty)
Estimated_bearing = Estimated_bearing + (4 * Penalty)

[Benti]

This sounds great. Thank you very much for doing this.

Best regards benti

[MLF]

Hi Fader-Berg,

I have followed the instructions, and placed the 2 files in the root directory of SH3. I have run a couple of missions, but cannot see the magic - I lock onto a target but no message from the WO. Am using Version 20. Are there any pre-requisites?

Regards,

MLF

[Fader_Berg]

Hi Fader-Berg,

I have followed the instructions, and placed the 2 files in the root directory of SH3. I have run a couple of missions, but cannot see the magic - I lock onto a target but no message from the WO. Am using Version 20. Are there any pre-requisites?

Regards,

MLF
On the main menu screen, the version of your game is written in the down right corner. What does it say?

[MLF]

V1.4 PatSH3r r20

[Fader_Berg]

V1.4 PatSH3r r20
Check that wo_targeting is set to on in the config file. If it is, are you really asking the WO to report the range?

[MLF]

Didn't realise I had to ask him - I expected a well trained WO to read my mind and report it directly I had locked on:oops: That'll be it then. Just tested and when I ask, it is reported - even changed message in cfg to make sure.

Thanks for your quick response and please keep up the good work:Kaleun_Salute:

Regards,

MLF

[makman94]

everything is working as intended;

it is so nice and usefull addition :Kaleun_Thumbs_Up:

can't wait for your news features :Kaleun_Periskop:

[areo16]

It's great that this is open source. It will speed up the progress exponentially.

[Anvar1061]

INSTALLATION:Unzip the downloaded file and copy the two files (patSH3r.act & patSH3r.cfg) to the directory where your SH3 installations resides. patSH3r will do its magic next time you start the game.
To remove it. Just remove patSH3r.act & patSH3r.cfg and there will be no magic no more.
patSH3r is compatible with all different v1.4 EXE-files including the v1.6B1 h.sie patched ones.
Fader Berg
SSS
I do not understand why we need this download if you are using only two files to the right.
http://www.subsim.com/radioroom/images/smilies/Kaleun_Confused.gif
http://s3.uploads.ru/t/bsOJk.jpg (http://uploads.ru/bsOJk.jpg)

[Fader_Berg]

SSS
I do not understand why we need this download if you are using only two files to the right.
:k_confused:
http://s3.uploads.ru/t/bsOJk.jpg (http://uploads.ru/bsOJk.jpg)

latest-patSH3r.zip is for people who just want to play the game. No more files are needed for that.
latest-patSH3r-source.zip is for people who want to see the code, and is interested in how it's done.

[Fader_Berg]

aero16 has given me a list of found memory locations made by Stiebler (with his permisson of course).

I officially want to thank you both for this contribution. This will speed things up.

[Anvar1061]

latest-patSH3r.zip is for people who just want to play the game. No more files are needed for that.
latest-patSH3r-source.zip is for people who want to see the code, and is interested in how it's done.
SSS
http://www.subsim.com/radioroom/images/smilies/Kaleun_Salute-1.gifhttp://www.subsim.com/radioroom/images/smilies/Kaleun_Salute-1.gifhttp://www.subsim.com/radioroom/images/smilies/Kaleun_Salute-1.gif

[Fader_Berg]

Hmmm... The hydro-guy loses all contacts when the periscope is used. That lovely bug made me threw a way a couple of hours for nothing.
Man... I've been playing this game so many hours, but never noticed it before. Not that I can remember anyways.

[makman94]

Hmmm... The hydro-guy loses all contacts when the periscope is used. That lovely bug made me threw a way a couple of hours for nothing.
Man... I've been playing this game so many hours, but never noticed it before. Not that I can remember anyways.

yes...another annoying bug !!

i am very excited with your thread and your achievements ! hope to have success to this new task too!
(see if you can import Rubini's hydrophone layers-plus Leitender's addition- in your code.would be nice to have all in one if possible:
http://www.subsim.com/radioroom/showthread.php?t=193199)

many thanks to Stiebler for his very valuable sharing :up:

all the best to you guys

[BigWalleye]

Excellent work, Fader_Berg! h.sie and Stiebler have provided some great enhancements with their executable file patches. Making WO accuracy experience- and qualification-dependent adds another consideration for the Kaleun. And run-time patching will be easier to install, especially for less tech-savvy gamers. I hope you will continue with this implementation approach. Reverse-engineering machine code is labor-intensive and requires great expertise. Thank you for all your effort.

One question: Is there a constraint on implementation of your patch? Before starting a career? Mid-career, but in-port only? Or can it be implemented at any mid-patrol save?

[Fader_Berg]

One question: Is there a constraint on implementation of your patch? Before starting a career? Mid-career, but in-port only? Or can it be implemented at any mid-patrol save?
Anytime, anywhere.

[rowi58]

Hi Fader_Berg,

first of all thanks for this great new aproach to chnge things in SH3. I#ve d/l your r21 today and i'm testing the WO messages - the German messages. Thre is a little typo mistake which won't give you correct range and bearing.

https://www.mediafire.com/convkey/8017/axou6o7ceuedaoy6g.jpg

As underlined in red there is a <LARGE O> istead of a <ZERO> which causes this problem. And by the wy it looks better if you type Sichtkontakt and Peilung - but this has no resultuts on the program.

Greetings
rowi58

[rowi58]

Hmmm... The hydro-guy loses all contacts when the periscope is used. That lovely bug made me threw a way a couple of hours for nothing.
Man... I've been playing this game so many hours, but never noticed it before. Not that I can remember anyways.

Hi Fader_Berg,

this is not a bug, this is normal. The sensor "Visual" is the dominat sensor. If a ship is in the range of this sensor, the hydrophone lines will disappeaer. And if you loose the visual contact - they come back. The same with the radar and rwr.

And that is very good becuase you can't identify a sighted ship within a labyrinth of black hydro-lines.

Greetings
rowi58

[Fader_Berg]

Hi Fader_Berg,

first of all thanks for this great new aproach to chnge things in SH3. I#ve d/l your r21 today and i'm testing the WO messages - the German messages. Thre is a little typo mistake which won't give you correct range and bearing.

<IMAGE>

As underlined in red there is a <LARGE O> istead of a <ZERO> which causes this problem. And by the wy it looks better if you type Sichtkontakt and Peilung - but this has no resultuts on the program.

Greetings
rowi58

Thanks. I'll fix that in next revision.

[Fader_Berg]

Hi Fader_Berg,

this is not a bug, this is normal. The sensor "Visual" is the dominat sensor. If a ship is in the range of this sensor, the hydrophone lines will disappeaer. And if you loose the visual contact - they come back. The same with the radar and rwr.

And that is very good becuase you can't identify a sighted ship within a labyrinth of black hydro-lines.

Greetings
rowi58
Why do I have to identify a sighted ship within a labyrinth of black hyrolines? I might want to keep track of a warship while plotting an merchant, though.

When it comes to this, I don't have full understanding of the game engine yet. But it sure looks like it would be possible to have them non exclusive with each other.

[Myxale]

A most welcome addition to SH3-
Awesome work. :rock:

Kudos

[sublynx]

Could the fact that ASDIC contact was lost after explosions be simulated by your mod?

(Sound of explosion -> ASDIC Range = 0 + some kind of timer for x seconds?)

[Fader_Berg]

Could the fact that ASDIC contact was lost after explosions be simulated by your mod?

(Sound of explosion -> ASDIC Range = 0 + some kind of timer for x seconds?)
Maybe... If I find where the logic for it is at.

[sublynx]

Maybe Darkwraith's Depth Charge Water Disturbances mod could be of help in figuring out what to look for:

http://www.subsim.com/radioroom/showthread.php?t=181513&page=11

[Fader_Berg]

r23:


Added repair_time_factor


Repair time factor

Lets you set the repair time to something little more realistic and challenging. Not compatible with V16b1. This setting is impossible to enable with a h.sie patched exe, so no worries.

[Magic1111]

r23:
Not compatible with V16b1. This setting is impossible to enable with a h.sie patched exe, so no worries.

What does it means exactly? :hmmm:

Must we now disable the "Realistic Repair Times" Option via Hsie Options Selector? Or what?

Best regards,
Magic

[Fader_Berg]

What does it means exactly? :hmmm:

Must we now disable the "Realistic Repair Times" Option via Hsie Options Selector? Or what?

Best regards,
Magic
No. patSH3rs repair time is always off if you run a hsie patched exe.

[padi]

Could you implement that a ship could use more than one sensor of each type at a time?
This would allow a higher realismn in the ASW part and the visual sensors...

[Fader_Berg]

Could you implement that a ship could use more than one sensor of each type at a time?
This would allow a higher realismn in the ASW part and the visual sensors...
I don't know. It looks like - the little I have seen - that it should be possible. UBI took this route however, so there might be something that makes itimpossible somewhere.

[Magic1111]

No. patSH3rs repair time is always off if you run a hsie patched exe.

Okay, understand!

Thx mate! :salute:

[padi]

I don't know. It looks like - the little I have seen - that it should be possible. UBI took this route however, so there might be something that makes itimpossible somewhere.


I have full confidence in yourself that you could make everything possible!

[Fader_Berg]

r24:


Added profile_name


Profile name

Lets you choose an profile name for your SH3-installation, (if you've got multiple). The game data will be stored under your personal SH3-directory, in a folder named as this profile name.

[sublynx]

r24:


Added profile_name


Profile name

Lets you choose an profile name for your SH3-installation, (if you've got multiple). The game data will be stored under your personal SH3-directory, in a folder named as this profile name.

That is marvelous:D MultiSh3 is not working for me so maybe this will help.

[makman94]

r24:


Added profile_name


Profile name

Lets you choose an profile name for your SH3-installation, (if you've got multiple). The game data will be stored under your personal SH3-directory, in a folder named as this profile name.

thank you :up:

[Fader_Berg]

r26:


Added hy_targeting
Added hy_targeting_msg


Hydrophone targeting

Hydro-guy will report on hydrophone targeted contact. Yes... though the periscope is up.

[Magic1111]

Many thx for new version!!! :yeah:

[Niedowidek]

Thank you, Fader Berg! I'm checking your progress every day. Well, twice a day. Hmm, I'll be back in five minutes... ;-)

[Fahnenbohn]

Thank you, Fader Berg! I'm checking your progress every day. Well, twice a day. Hmm, I'll be back in five minutes... ;-)

:rotfl2:

[Fader_Berg]

I'm glad you all like it.

[Tycho]

Please don't stop, these are so needed improvements. :yeah:

Hmmm... The hydro-guy loses all contacts when the periscope is used. That lovely bug made me threw a way a couple of hours for nothing.
Man... I've been playing this game so many hours, but never noticed it before. Not that I can remember anyways.
What I advise about this, is to deprive the obs periscope by its periscope sensor.
That way, when you need to look for something, but to keep active hydro contacts, use the obs periscope.
My playing style is such that for me is not a problem to deprive both periscopes by sensors.

About "Repair time factor", if I understood correctly. Why not to make it to work when V16B1 is used but its "Realistic Repair Times" is not active? I use V16B1, but "Realistic Repair Times" is unchecked because of NYGM.

[Fader_Berg]

About "Repair time factor", if I understood correctly. Why not to make it to work when V16B1 is used but its "Realistic Repair Times" is not active? I use V16B1, but "Realistic Repair Times" is unchecked because of NYGM.
That's a good point. I'll change the behavior to the next revision, so that you may enable the repair time factor if it's turned off in V16B1.
I don't know why V16B1s repair time is incompatible with NYGM. But I guess there is a slight risk that it will be incompatible with patSH3rs repair time factor too.

[Fader_Berg]

That's a good point. I'll change the behavior to the next revision, so that you may enable the repair time factor if it's turned off in V16B1.

Or not... Now I remember why I didn't do it.

H.sie has integrated his own - some sort of - game mechanics that has something to do with repairs (and other h.sie related stuff). These mechanics are in use regardless of whether the repair time fix is enabled or not.
So if we bypass them, some other h.sie thing will probably not work as expected.

[h.sie]

Did I? I don't remember. How auch ever :) , if you are interested in the assembler sources (which are full of interesting pointers), let me know. There is also the code for a new version V16D which I never released. You can use it all - proper credits provided, but I am too busy ATM to give any support. Comments are rare and in german. To be honest, I forgot most things in the meantime.

Good work, by the way. Could bring old SH3 to new dimensions...

[Fader_Berg]

Did I? I don't remember. How auch ever :) , if you are interested in the assembler sources (which are full of interesting pointers), let me know. There is also the code for a new version V16D which I never released. You can use it all - proper credits provided, but I am too busy ATM to give any support. Comments are rare and in german. To be honest, I forgot most things in the meantime.

Good work, by the way. Could bring old SH3 to new dimensions...

I would very much like to see that code of yours, and of course you'll be credited.

[sublynx]

yay ! This kind of work might give SH3 another 10 years of developing gameplay!

[keysersoze]

Excellent work Fader_Berg!

I'm following this thread closely.

[Fader_Berg]

r28:


Increased the random spread in WO range estimation error (from 1-3 to 1-5). It was a bit too chunky.

[areo16]

I would very much like to see that code of yours, and of course you'll be credited.

Yep, he should told me about it too.

Here's a link to the source:

http://www.mediafire.com/download/47exs1r35qj6nhf/Assembler+sources.7z

Have fun!!!

[LGN1]

r26:


Added hy_targeting
Added hy_targeting_msg


Hydrophone targeting

Hydro-guy will report on hydrophone targeted contact. Yes... though the periscope is up.

Hi Fader_Berg,

could you please provide some more information on this part?

I guess if I lock a target with the periscope and ask the hydrophone guy, he will report the rough distance to the locked target. But what does 'hydrophone targeted contact' mean?

Regards, LGN1

PS: Some further improvements which would be great are:


No 'We have been detected' and 'The enemy is pinging us' messages
Radar warnings without a direction line on the map. I don't think that, e.g., Metox could provide a bearing

[Fader_Berg]

Hi Fader_Berg,

could you please provide some more information on this part?

I guess if I lock a target with the periscope and ask the hydrophone guy, he will report the rough distance to the locked target. But what does 'hydrophone targeted contact' mean?

If you point the hydrophone to a ship and ask for a report. He will report about that particular ship. Not the closest one.

PS: Some further improvements which would be great are:


No 'We have been detected' and 'The enemy is pinging us' messages
Radar warnings without a direction line on the map. I don't think that, e.g., Metox could provide a bearing


I agree regarding the messages. I'll take a look on it later.
It looks like (according to wikipedia) that it could give some sence of bearing. Maybe make it less accurate?

[sublynx]

My guess is that the radar warnings did not give a direction as in U-boat KTBs they always give the bearing where the threat was if they knew it. Radar warning texts in the KTBs only mention the duration and the wavelength of the signal, visual sightings mention the bearing, height and speed.

Thanks for the ability to separate between different hydrophone signals! This will make underwater attack planning so easy that I might have to restrict myself from using certain procedures that are too gamey!

[Fader_Berg]

Thanks for the ability to separate between different hydrophone signals! This will make underwater attack planning so easy that I might have to restrict myself from using certain procedures that are too gamey!
He, he... I can't count the times I've spent a long time doing hydroplotting and suddenly a trawler shows up and f**ks it all up.
But you're right. It probably gets too easy sometimes. Haven't tried it out yet. Maybe I'll have to counter-patch it somehow.

[LGN1]

Thanks for the replies!

Concerning the bearing information:

I have tried very hard to obtain reliable information about that. However, this is quite difficult. If you look at the Biskaya Cross it's clear that you should be able to get a direction-dependent signal. However, was it ever used that way? I doubt it because it would be quite cumbersome with someone rotating the Biskaya Cross by hand and the operator down in the boat. In addition, I have never found any evidence of such procedures in any documents (like sublynx also points out).

Anyway, the current situation in SH3 is very unrealistic. You can use the RWR perfectly to shadow convoys, ships,... It's much better than the hydrophone!

I think the main problem is that SH3 does not model the different radar wave-lengths and which RWR could detect which wave-lengths. Even Metox in SH3 can detect 3cm radar :shifty: Thus, you can easily shadow all ships with Metox even if they have 10cm or 3cm radars.

To circumvent the problem I have changed my RWR to detect only signals from sources 50m above sea level --> no ship contacts. And for plane contacts the bearing information is not very useful.

But I would love to see any clear evidence that u-boats used (or did not use) RWR to detect/find/shadow ships. And information about which antenna provided bearing information and which didn't.

Regards, LGN1

[Fader_Berg]

But I would love to see any clear evidence that u-boats used (or did not use) RWR to detect/find/shadow ships. And information about which antenna provided bearing information and which didn't.

Regards, LGN1
I know very little about these things and I'll trust you as an enthusiast. If you haven't found anything so far, then maybe its because they never used it that way.
I haven't played much with radar either, so I don't really know how it affects the game play.
I'll put it on the wishlist, and we'll see if I manage to find anything while examining the code.

[sublynx]

Here's a line from the KTB of U-466 from June-August 1943:

Dived for detection on 134 cm wave, 2 second impulses, recurring. Skilled operator. [Used radar] sparingly.

http://www.uboatarchive.net/KTB466-3.htm

The allied started switching their radars off now and then while approaching the U-boat to lessen the possibility of getting detected by RWR. Maybe this could be randomized somehow in order to have the crewmen sometimes miss the approaching airplane/destroyer altogether?

[LGN1]

Hi,

my guess is that a RWR was never used to shadow/detect ships. Indications for this are: a) I have never seen any source mentioning such a use, b) bearing information would be very important for this and it seems that bearing information was never much of a concern in the development of RWR, and c) ship's radar was always ahead of airborne radar in terms of wave-lengths.

If my guess is true, my workaround with the RWR height simulates real-life performance quite well ---> there are more important issues to tackle :D

Regards, LGN1

[padi]

Another idea:
What's about sending and receiving messages in periscope depth if the Antenna was extended before?

[Hitman]

Fader :salute:

do you intend on keeping it as a complementary patch to H.Sie as it is now, or are you considering integrating it all into one?

I'm asking because from the user's point of view, having a single patch thing to deal with is much easier, and now that H-Sie's is open source maybe merguing it with your own one and operating always from the outside without any need of modifying the .exe would be good.

[Fahnenbohn]

Another idea:
What's about sending and receiving messages in periscope depth if the Antenna was extended before?

I see :



Сompletely forgot. This is my first model for the game.
Animated retractable antenna, but not functional. Alas, transmit messages from periscope depth impossible. It is hardcoded in the game. But you can raise and lower, stop ascent or descent anywhere at will. The movement of the antenna a little step. This is the best that can be obtained from the SMS mechanism. Just for historic justice and exterior.
http://s013.radikal.ru/i322/1510/ab/c068da7151d0.jpg (http://radikal.ru/big/708d8d6123104853948eee9d34c8422d)


from : http://www.subsim.com/radioroom/showpost.php?p=2354174&postcount=239

Here's a line from the KTB of U-466 from June-August 1943:

Dived for detection on 134 cm wave, 2 second impulses, recurring. Skilled operator. [Used radar] sparingly.

http://www.uboatarchive.net/KTB466-3.htm

The allied started switching their radars off now and then while approaching the U-boat to lessen the possibility of getting detected by RWR. Maybe this could be randomized somehow in order to have the crewmen sometimes miss the approaching airplane/destroyer altogether?

Yes, it's a good idea ! :yeah:

[Fader_Berg]

Fader :salute:

do you intend on keeping it as a complementary patch to H.Sie as it is now, or are you considering integrating it all into one?

I'm asking because from the user's point of view, having a single patch thing to deal with is much easier, and now that H-Sie's is open source maybe merguing it with your own one and operating always from the outside without any need of modifying the .exe would be good.
I'm looking in to it.

I know I'm gonna integrate some of them, but I'm not sure I'll go for all. Comments are few, often in german (Google translate sucks) and H.sie have forgotten much of it. He also don't have time to support the little he remembers.

But we'll see.

[Fader_Berg]

Another idea:
What's about sending and receiving messages in periscope depth if the Antenna was extended before?
That's a cool idea.

[Henri II]

Hi,

a quick question. I have your mod enabled on top of h.sie fixes and experienced something mildly strange.
I was hunting a ship in foggy weather, when it was sighted it was at a bearing of about 25° and a range of about 700 m. I didn't have it locked and asked the WO about range to nearest contact, his reply: "nearst contact at bearing 312, range 3400 m".

I repeated the question a few times and his estimates were allway different and never anywhere near correct. When the ship passed out of sight (it was neutral) I asked him again, his reply: "nearest contact at bearing 374, range 76326464 (not the exact number he said but something like this)".

Is this the fog messing with something? In retrospect I think it's possible that the officer did not have a watch qualification, but I'm not sure?

[Fader_Berg]

Hi,

a quick question. I have your mod enabled on top of h.sie fixes and experienced something mildly strange.
I was hunting a ship in foggy weather, when it was sighted it was at a bearing of about 25° and a range of about 700 m. I didn't have it locked and asked the WO about range to nearest contact, his reply: "nearst contact at bearing 312, range 3400 m".

I repeated the question a few times and his estimates were allway different and never anywhere near correct. When the ship passed out of sight (it was neutral) I asked him again, his reply: "nearest contact at bearing 374, range 76326464 (not the exact number he said but something like this)".

Is this the fog messing with something? In retrospect I think it's possible that the officer did not have a watch qualification, but I'm not sure?
Hmmm... Very odd.

The algorithm used for wo_experience can't come up with such huge differences. It just alters the SH3 range finding a bit.
My guess is that there is something wrong with the wo_targeting part of it. The memory area where the locked ship is supposed to be, is freed and are being used for something else. The estimates in such case, will seem to be totally random.
Why isn't the locked target cleared, since no ship is locked?

I'll have a look on it tonight.

Thanks for reporting.

Updates151029:I can't find the cause of this, or reproduce the problem with the information given. This doesn't mean that the bug doesn't exists.
Further reports regarding this problem are welcome.
160111:
Since this error has not been reported again. It will be removed from the bug list.

[LGN1]

That's a cool idea.

Hi,

I think this would be very nice even if it is not connected with any antenna position (for players without moving antenna).

Regards, LGN1

PS: I think it's already possible to receive messages at periscope depth, but not sending :hmmm:

[LGN1]

I'm looking in to it.

I know I'm gonna integrate some of them, but I'm not sure I'll go for all. Comments are few, often in german (Google translate sucks) and H.sie have forgotten much of it. He also don't have time to support the little he remembers.

But we'll see.

Hi again,

I guess features from version D would be of most benefit. H.Sie never released this version although it has some great additions (e.g., a dynamic response to the players' actions).

If you have specific questions about H.Sie's work, please feel free to ask me. I might be able to support a bit.

Regards, LGN1

[Fader_Berg]

r32:


Removed no_autoload since it worked so bad. Maybe later...
Added night_vision_factor

Night vision factor

Lets you set the reduced view range when its dark, to make spotting of ships act more realistic. This path is based on H.sies Night Vision Fix.

[Fahnenbohn]

r32:


Removed no_autoload since it worked so bad. Maybe later...
Added night_vision_factor

Night vision factor

Lets you set the reduced view range at night, to make spotting of ships act more realistic. This path is based on H.sies Night Vision Fix.

And when is it night ? When sunlight/ambiant light color is dark ? Or are there other parameters ?

[Fader_Berg]

And when is it night ? When sunlight/ambiant light color is dark ? Or are there other parameters ?
Dark. From when the sun sets in the horizon til its gets dark (or vice versa), there's a transision to what ever you set this value to.

[Fahnenbohn]

But in data/Cfg/Sim.cfg or Sim.cfg, there is already a parameter for visual detection called Light factor. So, what's new ? How was it working before ?

Another question : may the different improvments of your work be enabled one by one ?

[Fader_Berg]

But in data/Cfg/Sim.cfg or Sim.cfg, there is already a parameter for visual detection called Light factor. So, what's new ? How was it working before ?

Another question : may the different improvments of your work be enabled one by one ?
I don't know really. H.sie made the fix with input of some experienced modders, so I've never questioned it. I guessed that all other means had failed. Now I just needed it to have a nice game (spotting trawlers at 12k meters in pitch black is ridiculous).
Do you need a fix for reducing view range at dark nights, or does changes in sim.cfg work for you?

Yes. You can enable or disable each one of them. Except for the repair fix, which is not compatible with h.sies paches. It will be auto-disabled in such cases.

[makman94]

r32:


Removed no_autoload since it worked so bad. Maybe later...
Added night_vision_factor

Night vision factor

Lets you set the reduced view range when its dark, to make spotting of ships act more realistic. This path is based on H.sies Night Vision Fix.

Thank you Fader_Berg ! :yeah:

can you get the WatchOfficer automatically on bridge when boat is surfacing ?

[Fader_Berg]

Thank you Fader_Berg ! :yeah:

can you get the WatchOfficer automatically on bridge when boat is surfacing ?
That shouldn't be any problem. I'll look into it.

[sublynx]

Visibility reported in meters (randomized and approximate) would be cool. Now with different mods the visibility is really variable and hard to know from the weather report. Nighttime medium visibility could be perhaps 2 km in NYGM and perhaps double that in vanilla / GWX.

[Magic1111]

can you get the WatchOfficer automatically on bridge when boat is surfacing ?

Don´t understand, because this Option is in original h.sie Patch already included! :hmmm:

You can choose this Option on/off via h.sie OptionsSelector! :03:

[SquareSteelBar]

...I'm restarting this project from scratch, since h.sie's project have died out. The first goal is to rewrite the h.sie patches (copy the behaviour, not the code) into this project, and later on extend them further and add new patches....

:03:

[Fader_Berg]

I would like to get in touch with someone that's good with graphics - for a small upcoming patSH3r-feature. Not necessarily 3D-graphics in this particular case.

PM me.

[Niedowidek]

How is your work going, Fader? It's great work you're doing. I hope we'll see more features in your patch :)

[Fader_Berg]

How is your work going, Fader? It's great work you're doing. I hope we'll see more features in your patch :)
I'm having a short break from it right now - thank you, but I'll be back soon.

[a.g.]

I wonder if it would be possible to implement a feature to auto-dive to listen on hydrophone at regular periods when cruising around looking for things to attack. You'd enable it by pressing some key combination in navigation map, and then it'd basically repeat this until time compression drops below 64 for any reason:


wait X
periscope depth
wait Y
surface

[Fader_Berg]

I wonder if it would be possible to implement a feature to auto-dive to listen on hydrophone at regular periods when cruising around looking for things to attack. You'd enable it by pressing some key combination in navigation map, and then it'd basically repeat this until time compression drops below 64 for any reason:


wait X
periscope depth
wait Y
surface

Thanks for your suggestion. I guess it is possible. However, it doesn't change gameplay enough for me to see a point in having it. Pressing 'P' and 'S' is simple enough if you like doing your hunting that way.

[Fader_Berg]

I believe you got him wrong.

As I understand his post, he proposes to have just that AUTOMATED, i.e. let's say you have a long patrol where you increase time scale to example 128:

In that run that would be useful to have such a routine that would give you an "underwater-scan" regularly and if it finds something drops TC down to 1 so you can begin an attack run.

"wait x" could stand for a 3-hour-interval to have this routine executed.

Ok. I don't know. It still doesn't do much for gameplay. It's convenient - I can agree to that
but...
No. I will not implement it as far as I can see. Sorry.

[J0313]

Its already been done.

[sublynx]

Would it be possible to fix the helmsman not keeping course bug? Especially in stormy weather the helmsman lets the magnetic course drift making navigation without automatic course keeping from annoyingly inaccurate to impossible.

This makes this simulated real navigation method difficult:

http://www.subsim.com/radioroom//showthread.php?p=2361498#post2361498

It also makes convoy battles too cumbersome. I can estimate the right course with a maneuvering board or an attack disc, and would need no F5 Navigation Room at all if the drift wouldn't make course keeping without automatic waypoints too inaccurate.

U-boats didn't have waypoints. They had courses.

[Fader_Berg]

Would it be possible to fix the helmsman not keeping course bug? Especially in stormy weather the helmsman lets the magnetic course drift making navigation without automatic course keeping from annoyingly inaccurate to impossible.

This makes this simulated real navigation method difficult:

http://www.subsim.com/radioroom//showthread.php?p=2361498#post2361498

It also makes convoy battles too cumbersome. I can estimate the right course with a maneuvering board or an attack disc, and would need no F5 Navigation Room at all if the drift wouldn't make course keeping without automatic waypoints too inaccurate.

U-boats didn't have waypoints. They had courses.

Yes... That is indeed annoying. I'll put it on the TODO-list.

[sublynx]

That's marvelous to hear!

[makman94]

Would it be possible to fix the helmsman not keeping course bug? ...

yes...that is indeed very annoying !

very good point, Sublynx ! :up:

Lets hope Fader_Berg to manage locate it :yep:

[Fahnenbohn]

the helmsman not keeping course bug

Hello Sublynx. Could you explain me what you are talking about ? I don't understand.

[sublynx]

Hello Sublynx. Could you explain me what you are talking about ? I don't understand.

I have never navigated in real life nor can I really understand vector mathematics, so this is going to be awfully difficult for me to write, but maybe it'll help a bit on where to look for clearer info. Perhaps someone else will help as well.

Situation 1.
I want to go straight to East. I click the compass to change the course to 90 degrees True. The wind is 0 m/s. No problem. The U-boat sails accurately to East.

Situation 2.
I want to go straight to East. I click the compass to change the course to 90 degrees True. The wind is 15 m/s. Two factors push the U-boat badly off course:a. the wind pushes the boat away from the wanted vector (this is realistic and could be compensated by using real life navigation techniques, if not for the bug described in b.)
b. the AI lets the U-boat turn from the wanted course. First perhaps it's 91 degrees, then the compass indicates 92, then 93, etc. This is unrealistic, it means no-one is at the helm, someone has basically fallen asleep and the boat is drifting with no control at all. This makes the real life navigation technique of dead reckoning near impossible at times.
Here's a link to an explanation on dead reckoning and how wind direction and speed are compensated for in real life navigation:

http://msi.nga.mil/MSISiteContent/StaticFiles/NAV_PUBS/APN/Chapt-07.pdf

The ways the AI in SH3 deals with this are:
1. the usage of automatic waypoints (setting the course in Navigation map F5 view) keeps the desired and route despite wind conditions
2. the U-boat's position is always marked exactly right in the F5 view (U-boats didn't have a satellite positioning system, so they didn't always know their exact positions on the map)

The basically satellite-based system makes manual targeting too easy in SH3. For example the 3:15 method is really nice, fast and unhistorical to use with a known U-boat position, because you see all the time where your U-boat is and can just draw a couple of lines from a known point in space and time.

Hide the U-boat symbol from the map and target speed and course estimating, and intercept point estimating becomes wholly different. Instead of GPS navigating and waypoints the U-boats used techniques described for example in the Kriegsmarine Angriffscheibe Handbuch by Hitman and KLH:
http://www.subsim.com/radioroom/showpost.php?p=1772311&postcount=72

The American mariners used maneuvering board techniques, like the ones described in the 1941 US Navy Maneuvering Board Manual:
https://archive.org/details/maneuveringboard00unit

If the Helmsman bug is fixed, one can start using some real life navigating techniques both for travelling and more realistic navigation during long convoy approaches, battles and shadowings.

One way to get a grip on all of this is downloading Aaronblood's Electronic MoBo from the downloads section. IIRC it was done with the assistance of a real life Navy Officer.

[Fahnenbohn]

Thanks for the explanation, Sublynx.

[Fahnenbohn]

Hello Fader Berg, please have a look here : http://www.subsim.com/radioroom/showpost.php?p=2363039&postcount=4

Tell me what you are thinking about my idea.

[Fader_Berg]

Hello Fader Berg, please have a look here : http://www.subsim.com/radioroom/showpost.php?p=2363039&postcount=4

Tell me what you are thinking about my idea.
The algorithm is quite simple so I guess it's possible. But I don't have full insight in the SH3 weather mechanics (yet), so there is still a lot of work to get it done.
It isn't much of a game changer though, so I personally don't think it's worth the trouble.

[Niedowidek]

I hope that some more features are coming. Project is great and features already added are really making SH3 better. Dear Santa, I'm asking for more ;-)

[Fader_Berg]

This is the day we celebrate christmas in Sweden, so Merry Christmas to you all.

No christmas gifts on my part this year. :wah:
I'll try to find time to apply some more patches in 2016.

[MLF]

Merry Christmas Fader_Berg and thanks for all your work to date.

:Kaleun_Party:

Regards,

MLF

[Niedowidek]

Merry Christmas! :)
Lycka till! :)

[Fader_Berg]

r34:


Added wo_to_bridge


Watch officer to bridge

The watch officer - with best endurance - in either bow- or stern compartment, will be moved to bridge when surfacing.
This patch will override the hsie equivalent if both are enabled.

[Fader_Berg]

r36:


Added no_news_tc1
Stupid petty officer bugfix


No news TC1

Time compression will not fall down to 1 when recieving news.

Stupid petty officer - bugfix

For unknown reasons, UBISoft didn't want petty officers without the machinist qualification to be smart enough to move between the electric and diesel compartments by them self (when surfacing or submerging). They do now.

[Anvar1061]

r36:
SSS
Slowly, I am writing down.
https://img-fotki.yandex.ru/get/3009/257891320.72/0_19b5aa_7c4e3e2_orig.jpg
http://www.subsim.com/radioroom/images/smilies/Kaleun_Los.gif

[makman94]

r34:


Added wo_to_bridge


Watch officer to bridge

The watch officer - with best endurance - in either bow- or stern compartment, will be moved to bridge when surfacing.
This patch will override the hsie equivalent if both are enabled.

r36:


Added no_news_tc1
Stupid petty officer bugfix


No news TC1

Time compression will not fall down to 1 when recieving news.

Stupid petty officer - bugfix

For unknown reasons, UBISoft didn't want petty officers without the machinist qualification to be smart enough to move between the electric and diesel compartments by them self (when surfacing or submerging). They do now.

oh yea !!! :yeah:
Thank you very much for these addings Fader_Berg. it is getting more and more usefull and challenging :salute:

SSS
Slowly, I am writing down.
https://img-fotki.yandex.ru/get/3009/257891320.72/0_19b5aa_7c4e3e2_orig.jpg
:Kaleun_Los:

hehehe....very nice Anvar :up:

[Magic1111]

r36:


Added no_news_tc1
Stupid petty officer bugfix


No news TC1

Time compression will not fall down to 1 when recieving news.

Stupid petty officer - bugfix

For unknown reasons, UBISoft didn't want petty officers without the machinist qualification to be smart enough to move between the electric and diesel compartments by them self (when surfacing or submerging). They do now.

Where can I download the r36?

In the first post is written:

Current revision: 34

Thx in forward!

[SquareSteelBar]

...In the first post is written:

Current revision: 34...It's the 36

[Magic1111]

It's the 36

Hmm, okay!

But in the patSH3r.cfg File from the d/l Link on Post #1 I don´t find entries for the "Supid petty officer bugfix", therefore my question!

[Fader_Berg]

Where can I download the r36?

In the first post is written:

Current revision: 34

Thx in forward!
I forgot to update the nummer, sorry. I'll fix it.

The stupid petty officer is a permanent fix. You can't disable it. It may have been a bad decision?

[rowi58]

...
The stupid petty officer is a permanent fix. You can't disable it. It may have been a bad decision?

Hi Fader Berg,

i don't think that it is a bad decision. In CCoM all Petty Officer have a (special) qualification, fixed in the Crew_Config*.cfg files (data/cfg; 12 files). Not all (only in type II), in the types VII, IX and XXI 4 Petty Officer have no qualification so the player can ad one as he like it. But i think your fix don't hurt this CCoM solution.

Greetings
rowi58

[Magic1111]

I forgot to update the nummer, sorry. I'll fix it.

The stupid petty officer is a permanent fix. You can't disable it. It may have been a bad decision?

Thx FB for fixing it! :up:

And how rowi wrote, it is a good fix! :salute:

[Magic1111]

Sorry, another question in regarding the Night vision settings...:oops:

# --- Night vision factor -----------------------------------------------------
# Night vision factor sets the view range penalty for darkness at night.
# 1.0 = no penalty, 0.5 half view range, 0.66 = h.sie mode, 0.0 = off

What's the difference between 1.0 = no penalty and 0.0 = off?

Is no penalty and off not the same? :hmmm:

I play with Night vision factor disabled in h.sie patch, because I don´t like this.

What is now the best setting in your fix for me, 1.0 or 0.0?

Best regards,
Magic

[Fader_Berg]

Sorry, another question in regarding the Night vision settings...:oops:

# --- Night vision factor -----------------------------------------------------
# Night vision factor sets the view range penalty for darkness at night.
# 1.0 = no penalty, 0.5 half view range, 0.66 = h.sie mode, 0.0 = off

What's the difference between 1.0 = no penalty and 0.0 = off?

Is no penalty and off not the same? :hmmm:

I play with Night vision factor disabled in h.sie patch, because I don´t like this.

What is now the best setting in your fix for me, 1.0 or 0.0?

Best regards,
Magic
The result is the same. If you use 0.0, UBI-code is guaranteed to run. So I would go for 0.0 if I wanted original behaviour.

[Magic1111]

The result is the same. If you use 0.0, UBI-code is guaranteed to run. So I would go for 0.0 if I wanted original behaviour.

Thx FB, I set 0.0 in your Fix! :up:

:salute:

[ShadowStalker887]

Its a bit of a big ask, but I'm curious; have you found anything that might allow the game to handle more subs? So that we can have functioning VIIC/41's and VIIC/42's?

[Anvar1061]

Its a bit of a big ask, but I'm curious; have you found anything that might allow the game to handle more subs? So that we can have functioning VIIC/41's and VIIC/42's?

SH3 Commander

[Fader_Berg]

No. I've never thought of it. It's probably impossible bit I'll have a look on it later on.

[Niedowidek]

Hey,

It seems that I have some problem with revision 36.

When I surface, I get CTD.

When I change patch to revision 32, there is no crash on surfacing.

My modlist if it's relevant:
http://www.subsim.com/radioroom/showpost.php?p=2374121&postcount=47

[Hitman]

I shut down the normal crew fatigue and watches system long in favour of a different system suggested by Kaa long ago: My crew suffers progressive fatigue during the whole patrol, so that they are exhausted -but will never stop working completely- after one or three months at sea, depending on the Uboat type. I change that manually for each boat in SH3 Commander.

But looking at your fixes regarding the stupid petty officer and the watch officer, I wondered if you are planning to somehow make a more comprehensive automation of the crew system and implement auto-shift rotation and such.

It would be good to leave to the player only the task of clicking on the menu buttons that either call surface attack, torpedo attack or normal cruising, as a way of implementing calling/quitting battlestations. As in SH4, more or less.

[Fader_Berg]

Hey,

It seems that I have some problem with revision 36.

When I surface, I get CTD.

When I change patch to revision 32, there is no crash on surfacing.

My modlist if it's relevant:
http://www.subsim.com/radioroom/showpost.php?p=2374121&postcount=47
What if you disable wo_to_bridge?
Are you using the steam or another version of SH3?

[Fader_Berg]

I shut down the normal crew fatigue and watches system long in favour of a different system suggested by Kaa long ago: My crew suffers progressive fatigue during the whole patrol, so that they are exhausted -but will never stop working completely- after one or three months at sea, depending on the Uboat type. I change that manually for each boat in SH3 Commander.

But looking at your fixes regarding the stupid petty officer and the watch officer, I wondered if you are planning to somehow make a more comprehensive automation of the crew system and implement auto-shift rotation and such.

It would be good to leave to the player only the task of clicking on the menu buttons that either call surface attack, torpedo attack or normal cruising, as a way of implementing calling/quitting battlestations. As in SH4, more or less.

I made a crew rotation feature years ago. But it got so complicated and cumbersome to manage the rotation schedule in game - since there is no interface for it. I made it remember which two crew members that was last made swaping place with each other, and rotated them when one of them got tired.

If anyone can come up with an bright idea how to manage the crew rotation - other than the quite messed up solution I already tried, I'm in for it.

Is it possible to add a such feature to SH3 Commander, or isn't it developed anymore?

[Sailor Steve]

Is it possible to add a such feature to SH3 Commander, or isn't it developed anymore?
JScones hasn't even looked at Subsim in almost five years.

[GT182]

And his website is no longer operational.

[sublynx]

If anyone can come up with an bright idea how to manage the crew rotation - other than the quite messed up solution I already tried, I'm in for it.

Here's how I used to manage crew rotation in NYGM:

http://i.imgur.com/woDrXs1.jpg

Not really changing individual men, but assigning different areas of the crew compartment as

work area A - corresponding rest area A
work area B - corresponding rest area B
etc

I haven't been able to play in a long time, but IIRC the system worked perfectly during normal patrol times. Battles might have needed micromanaging.

I would expect that this would only work well when using NYGM's fatigue system.

[Tycho]

An interesting features, that I have with this patch. Without it, not seen such things.

My settings are:
wo_experience off
wo_experience_no_wm 0.0
wo_experience_xp 0
wo_experience_range 0

wo_targeting on
hy_targeting on

wo_targeting_msg "Range to visual contact at bearing %03.0f is %.0f meters."
hy_targeting_msg "%s %s! %s Bearing %03.0f! %s"

repair_time_factor 0.0

night_vision_factor 0.0

wo_to_bridge off

no_news_tc1 off
Now, when a ship goes behind another ship, your crew (visual sensor) lose sight of the rear ship. And when passed to the other side, the crew seen it again.
On the one hand it's cool, on the other, it leads to continuous "Ship spotted, sir!" message, when you shadow the convoy or in places with heavy traffic.
I even noticed, that the visual sensor lose sight of a small boats in the large waves. Again cool, but leads to too many of the "ship spotted" messages.
I don't have time to test these things in more conditions, different fog, night....

http://oi68.tinypic.com/33y3vgy.jpg

http://oi67.tinypic.com/2ma55d.jpg

[makman94]

A lot of discussions (not only these days) for a feature (crew rotation) that ,in my opinion, has less to zero interest.
i see people say that sh4's crew rotation is ok (or ,at least,better than sh3) and i am wondering whats the point for the player if something is happening (or not) in the background if he (the player) has nothing to do with it.

I have totally discard this feature (i guess you all know the ''No Fatigue'' mod) and i can't see what will be the difference (for the player) if the game is running a ,lets say perfect crew rotation system or the ''No Fatigue'' mod. In both cases , the player has not to bother himself with the crew 'actions'.

Am i missing something here ? may by ''good crew rotation'' system , people mean that player will have to make some specific actions himself?

[Niedowidek]

Even with perfect crew rotation crewmen get tired faster when moving on surface in bad weather. Several times I had a problem that one watch was too tired to keep going and the previous watch wasn't rested yet. Then I had to dive just to let people rest. And this means using your batteries and/or slowing you down which has impact on time of arrival to patrol zone, available battery charge etc.

Also if you have contact with enemy after long period of bad weather and your crew is more tired, i.e. less effective, it may seriously affect result of engagement.

I would like to preserve this uncertainty whether my crew will perform well or not so well (because of tiredness). Having perfect crew, with maximum abilities to hear contacts with hydrophone, reloading torpedoes all the time and such is not so fun for me. But manual crew rotation is not much fun either.

[Niedowidek]

Fader,

I have steam version modified by hsie/Stiebler patches.

I tried few times rev36 with wo_to_bridge

When off it didn't CTD (tried submerging and resurfacing 6-7 times)

When wo_to_bridge=on game sometimes CTD, sometimes not. Not sure now what's triggering the crash.

[Niedowidek]

As for crew rotation, maybe one could use crew qualifications to designate teams which rotate in given compartment. SH3Commander lets to award qualifications to seamen so one could mark every crew member this way.

Then we could have for example 4 crewmen marked as radiomen. Two of them would be assigned sonar and radio station at the beginning of the patrol. After 4/6/8 hours game automatically rotates them with two other crewmen with radiomen qualifications (the ones who were waiting in crew quarters).

Or maybe add a number to name of crewman to assign him to one of two watches - if it's possible to extract fragment of name and make use of it.

[padi]

i see people say that sh4's crew rotation is ok (or ,at least,better than sh3)


First: Everything is better than the SH3-System!
And the SH4-System is perfect!

[sublynx]

I like crew rotation, at least in theory. My reasoning is that an experienced crew should be able to work faster, even when tired. I also want my best trained watchmen on bridge at certain situations. Maybe they spot that plane a little bit earlier. Crew rotation should give me the option of planning ahead in terms if personnel management as well.

[makman94]

Even with perfect crew rotation crewmen get tired faster when moving on surface in bad weather. Several times I had a problem that one watch was too tired to keep going and the previous watch wasn't rested yet. Then I had to dive just to let people rest. And this means using your batteries and/or slowing you down which has impact on time of arrival to patrol zone, available battery charge etc.

Also if you have contact with enemy after long period of bad weather and your crew is more tired, i.e. less effective, it may seriously affect result of engagement.

I would like to preserve this uncertainty whether my crew will perform well or not so well (because of tiredness). Having perfect crew, with maximum abilities to hear contacts with hydrophone, reloading torpedoes all the time and such is not so fun for me. But manual crew rotation is not much fun either.

i see what you mean Niedowidek and i like it :up:

is there a mod you use and have this behaviour (i would like to try it) or it is your wish for such a mod ?

First: Everything is better than the SH3-System!
And the SH4-System is perfect!

i didn't say the opposite padi :yep:
i was asking something else

[Hitman]

I have totally discard this feature (i guess you all know the ''No Fatigue'' mod) and i can't see what will be the difference (for the player) if the game is running a ,lets say perfect crew rotation system or the ''No Fatigue'' mod. In both cases , the player has not to bother himself with the crew 'actions'.

Am i missing something here ? may by ''good crew rotation'' system , people mean that player will have to make some specific actions himself?

Crew fatigue is an element of the game like engine damage, you can't run flank speed all the time because you blow the engines, and you can't run around in battlestations or in conditions that destroy your crew's stamina for a long time. This all introduces an important strategy element, you will f.e. not go after a ship that you can only slowly reach at flank speed, and you will maybe not be able to engage, or be more cautious if your crew is stressed after a big pursuit or a storm, or by two long months of patrol.

More than a crew rotation I think that what is needed is a good fatigue system combined with a battlestations mode (That's where Patsh3er would enter the equation).

To sum up, my ideal model of fatigue would be as follows:

1) You always generate a minimum of fatigue that progresses till your crew is exhausted after some time in patrol (This reflects the general stress of living in the uboat and being out at sea for some time).
2) There is a minimum of efficiency, i.e. an exhausted crew will anyway always be able to do their duties, but they will slow down considerably when totally.
3) At battlestations (quick icons for surface/submerged/aircraft attack) and during storms when surfaced there is a bigger and quicker increase in fatigue. The difference is that your crew can recover from this increased fatigue to the point where it should be according to the fatigue generated by the general patrol duration. They will slowly recover once the battlestations situation is finished and they can resume the normal watches (After one cycle of watches everyone has slept some hours and is recovered from the extra fatigue).

An example (Arbitrary numbers, the % are just examples)

-You are already a month at sea, and your crew's efficiency has dropped to 75% under the normal watch rotation (No battle engagements or specially long storms)
-You find a convoy, call battlestations and engage during 72 intense hours. The stress makes your crew lose efficiency to a 50%, which is the minimum.
-You disengage or lose the convoy, and resume normal navigation and crew shifts --> In 8 hours more the combat stress has dissapeared and the crew is now at 72% efficiency (It still has lost a 3% for the additional days at sea)
-After two months at sea, your crew's efficiency has dropped to 50%. It won't go any lower, but you should head back home. If you engage a ship or convoy during your return trip your crew ill not lose any more efficiency, but since they engage at a 50%, you have less chances of surviving.

I hope the example can be understood well :)

[Leitender]

Hi all,

I´ve been using the crew management intensively for a long time, because it adds another point to the commander for which he had to pay attention. 2 settings I prefere: First I use the GWX/8hour fatigue model delivered with SH3 Commander, which leads to similar "problems" Niedowidek describes above. The second point is to switch on "crew efficiency" for every crew sensor in the "sensors.cfg" file. With this function enabled, imho a tired watch will spot a target later then a relaxed one, a hydrophone contact will be reported later and so on. This forces me to exchange the watch continously.

Btw, typically the bridge watch had a 4 hour turn, the machine watch a 6 hour turn and the radio operators rotated every 4 hour during day and every 6 hour during night. I exchange the crew according to this schedule, one by one if necessary, what takes a long time of course and sometimes gets boring in a certain way, but because I always plot my course , mark sundown, sunrise and depth, log the wheather and check the technical systems, i therefore get a good feeling about my current sea-worthyness and the overall circumstances.

Next: Although I see the point of that general "fatigue" after a long patrol, NYGM doesn´t simulate the recurrent watch by watch fatigue. Because imho the latter has the more important influence on the commander´s decisions, I prefere the GWX model. I´m not sure if a crew that e.g. operated successfully during a several week patrol should be able to do its duty for only "75%" or "50%", only because they are on a long trip. Generally that seems to me a little bit overestimated.

Maybe that fatigue isn´t a question of physival but of mental exhaust, what could be simulated by that odd "motivation" factor instead? Does this motivation factor has an influence on the game at all? I´ve never noticed that.

Finally, thanks to Fader_Berg for his additional options. Especially the exchange of non-machine petty officers between the engine rooms is a really fine improvement!

[makman94]

ok , i understand your points guys.
Whatever 'crew system' that doesn't demand from the user to manually moving around the crew members is fine for me.

There are other areas of the game that will make (if improved) the gameplay way more challenging and interesting than a good 'crew rotation'.Spending time for creating complex 'crew rotations' seems,to me, a waste of time at this moment

just my two cents

[LGN1]

Hi all,

..., but because I always plot my course , mark sundown, sunrise and depth, log the wheather and check the technical systems, i therefore get a good feeling about my current sea-worthyness and the overall circumstances.

...

Maybe that fatigue isn´t a question of physival but of mental exhaust, what could be simulated by that odd "motivation" factor instead? Does this motivation factor has an influence on the game at all? I´ve never noticed that.



Hi Leitender,

just for curiosity: how do you plot your course, mark sundown, depth,...? And what technical systems do you check? It sounds very interesting!

Concerning the motivation factor: See this old post for an explanation what it does:

http://www.subsim.com/radioroom/showpost.php?p=1509533&postcount=26

Regards, LGN1

[Leitender]

Hi LGN1,

that´s quite simple: I use the given tools of the F5 map. After having drawn the course, I retrace the track by using the ruler for a persistent plot. At sundown / sunrise, I draw a horizontal line with appropriate length to the given time (e.g. when sunrise is at 06.15 i draw a horizontal line with 6.1km length) at the current position. So, when reading the map, I can predict the next sunrise and I can measure the distance having moved between two sunrises (a kind of daily "etmal"). The measuring time is when the redlight turns on or off.

Every few hours I also use the Atlas echolot to measure the depth (at least near the coast). I mark the depth in the map by using the "compass" and draw a circle with a radius appropriate to the depth. With this markings, I can see whether there´s a significant descent or an increase of depth without trusting the colour of the map too much.

Another thing is, if I use the same way for retour, I already know the dephts quite exactly.

Concerning the technical checks: I use my own improved and optimized gauges with switched-on control lights (so called Bordinstrumente_Patch) with which I can precisely read the correct values of the most important instruments. E.g., at the beginning of each patrol, I make a new speed table with knots and rpms for every machine status, thus I can immediatly see on the instruments if something is getting wrong. I also pay attention on the control lamps, because at 100% realism settings, I cannot look outside the boat and control if both screws are turning or not and if recharching the batteries is the reason for slower movement. Same with the compressed air and oxygen (really vital especially if you use h.sie´s resp. Stiebler´s oxygen mod).

What I also sometimes do is to check the diesel consumption by measuring distance and time and I compare the results with the report of my helmsman to predict my remaining operational area and to keep in mind the needs of getting back to my base. Btw, the the sea state has a huge influence on diesel consumption.

There are lots of helpful information giving by the game to use it in an operational or tactical way, although it sounds not that exiting. But surely the kaleuns then did that too.

Sorry for getting off topic

Best regards

[utops]

Hi,

Im new to this patch and what i saw so far it working for most part,but:
no_news_tc1 on

Do not.
Im running GWX with Conus wide screen mod and Fire damage by DarkWraith.
Any tips how to resolve this will be painted gold. :P

BTW. Thx for keeping Sh3 expierence alive.

[Fader_Berg]

Hi,

Im new to this patch and what i saw so far it working for most part,but:
no_news_tc1 on
Do not.
Im running GWX with Conus wide screen mod and Fire damage by DarkWraith.
Any tips how to resolve this will be painted gold. :P

BTW. Thx for keeping Sh3 expierence alive.
Hmmm... Are you sure it's news you're talking about and not BDU messages?

[utops]

To be honest i can't tell the difference. They all are labeled as from BDu :hmmm:

[utops]

One more thing:
Was mangled by destroyer cannon,because IIA has periscope depth of 9 meters,so antena dipol is visible and that is the reason of my sub being shot at. Decided to rest on the bottom to stop flooding etc. Depth was 17 meters and after 10 minutes resting on seabed CE goes crazy with reports about sub being damaged and destroyer was not dc at that time or any time. Ths is the bug?I'll try to recreate this by simply resting on seabed in undamaged sub i report back with this.
Btw. Whats up with blank CE messages?
Edit again:

Uh there is no way to recover from flooding it says 0:00 past 1 h but still my sub is sinking and go hard against seabed and above aws trawler killing my carrer. This is feature or bug? ( and no i am not beaing sarcastic.)

[Fader_Berg]

One more thing:
Was mangled by destroyer cannon,because IIA has periscope depth of 9 meters,so antena dipol is visible and that is the reason of my sub being shot at. Decided to rest on the bottom to stop flooding etc. Depth was 17 meters and after 10 minutes resting on seabed CE goes crazy with reports about sub being damaged and destroyer was not dc at that time or any time. Ths is the bug?I'll try to recreate this by simply resting on seabed in undamaged sub i report back with this.
Btw. Whats up with blank CE messages?
Edit again:

Uh there is no way to recover from flooding it says 0:00 past 1 h but still my sub is sinking and go hard against seabed and above aws trawler killing my carrer. This is feature or bug? ( and no i am not beaing sarcastic.)
Maybe your hull integrity got so compromised that it couldn't stand 17 meters. That's all I can think of. patSH3r has no routines to make damage to the sub... yet.
Blank CE messages? Are you using a mod which need some extra messages somewhere. patSH3r probably has nothing to do with it.
All patSH3r does with the repair routine, is to alter the repair time factor (if you're using it in the config - and not using a hsie patched exe). It's a legit value that exist in UBI-code and is also used by the realistic repair time setting. Altering it should not change the behavior of the game in the sense of how the repair-code works. What's your repair time factor at in the patSH3r.cfg-file?

[utops]

repair_time_factor 25.0 ; >= 1.0, 0.0 = off
Sorry my english is a mess for now and i have hard time to direct you on real problem. So maybe i try again:

Got struck by cannon near radio compartment so flooding is understandable, i assigned damage control team to fix that and they do it quite fast,because i have mechanic class in team,but flooding indicator in box always show 0:00 to flood recovery and my sub slowly sinking ,i don't have any control over it except i need to press blow balast from time to time and this often equals end of carrer by popping like a cork near angry AWS Patrol. This is not a problem while on deep waters,but in II class sub i often operate on shallow waters so brushing on seabed quickly drains hull integrety and causing compartment damages.

[utops]

Ok,flooding recovery is not working as i like to, maybe in your idea is working correctly idk.I just damage my sub to cause flooding,after flooding was stoped,pumping water out of compartments take ages,so it's often end with death. There is any option to tune it?

[Michal788]

I use Winhq on my Mac for playing SH3.
And the h.sie patch didnt work for me.:down:
Even with the orginal sh3.exe.
Everytime if i patch the file sh3.exe the game is crashing or didnt start.

But this solution is working and i am happy.
I can finally play sh3 with the bug fixes.

Thanks Fader.

[Fader_Berg]

Ok,flooding recovery is not working as i like to, maybe in your idea is working correctly idk.I just damage my sub to cause flooding,after flooding was stoped,pumping water out of compartments take ages,so it's often end with death. There is any option to tune it?
Maybe it has to do with the repair time factor. Try to shut it off (or at least make it smaller than 25). If it has to do with this, it's an unwanted side effect and I'll have to take a look on it.

[Fader_Berg]

I use Winhq on my Mac for playing SH3.
And the h.sie patch didnt work for me.:down:
Even with the orginal sh3.exe.
Everytime if i patch the file sh3.exe the game is crashing or didnt start.

But this solution is working and i am happy.
I can finally play sh3 with the bug fixes.

Thanks Fader.

Nice. I've tried SH3 on linux a couple of times with wine, but there was too many graphical glitches. Is it working nice on mac?

[makman94]

hello Fader_Berg ,

i hope to get more (and even...more) from your super patch ! Do you have-plan any new goodies ?

all the best :up:

[Fader_Berg]

hello Fader_Berg ,

i hope to get more (and even...more) from your super patch ! Do you have-plan any new goodies ?

all the best :up:

Hi Makman94...

I have plans and wishes from community members I want to integrate. But the process has stagnated a bit. Too much World of Tanks, Space Engineers and last but not least, the forced upon me - earn to make a living thing... work. My interest in SH3 comes and goes, so the work will probably continue in the future. I'll let you all know.

/Fader Berg

[Aquelarrefox]

hi, is this compatible with steibler? i saw was compatible wiyh hsie.
I will test it.

I have an idea for a simple but realistic fix, you can't fire nor change pistol (until mid 42) with out 4 sailor or a minimum level of performance( I prefer last). Please considered it for future.

About fatigue,I love it and I'm good with gwx/and charging a little the basic file to change the fatigue proportion in different compartment. I think patch would be the most simple possible, referred to this, I would be pleasure if the patch could drop down performance by a value related to time (counting variable ) , with out floor, so you should left convoy if they are to stressed like in reality.

I have a question related with morale, game uses it? Because employ that concept would be beautiful. Always I have consisted it should increment with destroyed units, a little with send contract, drop down by time (very slow) and that value multiplied by hull integrity, and then multiplied in performance of compartment.

Other things interesting would be, maximum of days in sea by starvation, no water nor food (days counter implement, expanded by docking in supply ship or milk cow, for real navigation replace course plotter by a command to put a Mark in that position with clear sky (more complex could be done to generate random displacement), Another good one is that officer say land spoted, but it can recall continue spoting., and the most important, hydrophone in swipping and radar may say how many contracts are spoted after a complete turning. They are only ideas I hope some one could implement one day.

thanks. We live works like this.

tested no crash, and wo is great really

[drakkhen20]

got any new info or an udate on this ? should I patch to Hsie work and then use your patch\ mod or does it matter ?

[Aquelarrefox]

it worked for me with h.sie patch and steibler b (with fido fix no radar fix).
Just copy in folder and it fix on-the fly as readme say.

[Fader_Berg]

Hi.

patSH3r is fully compatible with the h.sie patches. Those parts of of patSH3r which isn't, will be auto-disabled with no possibility to override.
Check the readme or #1 (http://www.subsim.com/radioroom/showpost.php?p=2350290&postcount=1) for more details.

Regards

Fader Berg

[P_Funk]

If anyone can come up with an bright idea how to manage the crew rotation - other than the quite messed up solution I already tried, I'm in for it.

Can you read the status and position of crew members and export it to an external program?

[Fader_Berg]

Can you read the status and position of crew members and export it to an external program?
It's possible but not convenient to do in realtime.

[P_Funk]

I was thinking maybe you could just have some minimalist external gui that lets you basically import the status of the crew from the game including compartments they're in and then it could just have presets you press to change crew making it so that you'd still have to pause the game or bring it to 1x at rotation time but that you could avoid the need to keep changing people around one by one.

Another question. Is there anything that can be done about the way the game resets the lunar cycle to what it was at the start of your patrol everytime you load a save? Maybe some way to directly inject into the game the current date on the lunar calendar or something?

[Fader_Berg]

I was thinking maybe you could just have some minimalist external gui that lets you basically import the status of the crew from the game including compartments they're in and then it could just have presets you press to change crew making it so that you'd still have to pause the game or bring it to 1x at rotation time but that you could avoid the need to keep changing people around one by one.

Hmmm... It sounds interesting but I don't know...
I would like something like Hitman suggested a while back. Maybe the only way is to go through an external program. But in that case, it suddenly doesn't seems worth it. It gets too messy. Maybe if it could be incorporated in SH3 Commander, so that there is one app to rule 'em all. But that's not likely to be happening.
It would be nice to see the crew rotate in full watch sections, i.e. in the german UBoats there was a "Port" and a "Starbord" watch, which rotated every 4 hours (I think it was 4, NYGM readme has accurate information about this). Even if the player wants to drag a crewmember around for exceptional situations (Attacks), could you make the crew rotate in those 2 watches :up:

Sublynx also provided an interesting solution (#142 (http://www.subsim.com/radioroom/showpost.php?p=2376143&postcount=142)). I had some logically and programming concerns about it, but I can't recall what it was. Maybe we could work out something based on his thought.

Another question. Is there anything that can be done about the way the game resets the lunar cycle to what it was at the start of your patrol everytime you load a save? Maybe some way to directly inject into the game the current date on the lunar calendar or something?

I've never thought about it. Is it wrong as it is?
I guess it's possible.

[P_Funk]

I've never thought about it. Is it wrong as it is?
I guess it's possible.

The problem is that when you load a saved game the lunar cycle seems to reset to the day the patrol launched so if you play three days of sim time in every session then you basically end up reliving the same 3 days of the lunar calendar. So if you launch with a full moon you will spend a month at sea mostly with full moons.

As far as I know if you never save the game and run a single patrol all the way through the moon otherwise behaves properly.

[P_Funk]

Another question I have is does the night vision fix influence enemy detection as well or is it just for your own crew?

EDIT. Nvm, read hsie's manual to figure it out myself.

[ferg]

Decided to rest on the bottom to stop flooding etc. Depth was 17 meters and after 10 minutes resting on seabed CE goes crazy with reports about sub being damaged and destroyer was not dc at that time or any time.

This is stock behaviour, I believe. I've encountered in GWX long before discovering patSH3r. I'm sure I passed a mod the other day that changes this behaviour so you can rest on the sea floor and repair as you were trying to do.

Btw. Whats up with blank CE messages?

That's either SH3 Commander or some mod that you and I both use. Do you use GWX? I think that's where the behaviour is coming from on mine. It's hiding the part where the CE informs you of the damage to your hull integrity since in reality you'd have no way of assessing it.

So when you see a blank CE message, you can assume he's trying to tell you your hull is taking damage.

[ferg]

The second point is to switch on "crew efficiency" for every crew sensor in the "sensors.cfg" file. With this function enabled, imho a tired watch will spot a target later then a relaxed one, a hydrophone contact will be reported later and so on. This forces me to exchange the watch continously.

Wait. Crew sensors aren't influenced by efficiency? So what is the point of "Bridge" efficiency then?

[Gammel]

cheers!

May i ask for a feature?
OK Thanks!
So how about subs AA Crew firing on ships when ordered tds?
The surface ships already do this IIRC when engaging the players or other vessels.
SO great seeing someone is working on this hardcode stuff again.
:subsim:

[Aquelarrefox]

Watch officer to bridge is giving me crash dive or submerge at 128 or upper speed

[Fader_Berg]

Hi all.


I'm glad to announce a new release of patSH3r today. r48 is a complete rewrite of the code and patches.

This revision doesn't come with a lot of new features. Quite contrary. Some features have been removed 'cause they sucked in one way or another. But this release is far more robust than any of the previous ones. It also uses techniques in SH3 that wasn't known for me two years ago.

It's X-mas though... so I've got one new feature for you. True bearings. The watch officer and sonar guy may give true bearings to targets.

Read the manual for more information.

Also... patSH3r isn't compatible with hsie-patched exe's anymore. It takes too much time to write two versions of everything. patSH3r will refuse to initialize if you're running a hsie-patched exe.

Many thanks to Makman94 for advises and testing.

Download @ https://fb.tuxxor.net/

Merry Christmas

[Anvar1061]

http://www.subsim.com/radioroom/images/smilies/Kaleun_Thumbs_Up-1.gif
http://www.subsim.com/radioroom/images/smilies/Kaleun_Cheers-1.gifhttp://www.subsim.com/radioroom/images/smilies/Kaleun_Cheers-1.gifhttp://www.subsim.com/radioroom/images/smilies/Kaleun_Cheers-1.gif
https://pp.userapi.com/c845122/v845122959/15b74a/_iz_H5lttdM.jpg

[PATSH3R]
AlertWatchOfficer=Yes
NightVisionFactor=0.45
RepairTimeFactor=25.0
SmarterPettyOfficers=Yes
TargetReporting=Yes
TargetReportingWO=4620
TrueBearings=Yes

I regret that patSH3r is no longer compatible with hsie-patched exe.

[makman94]

Hi all.


I'm glad to announce a new release of patSH3r today. r48 is a complete rewrite of the code and patches.

This revision doesn't come with a lot of new features. Quite contrary. Some features have been removed 'cause they sucked in one way or another. But this release is far more robust than any of the previous ones. It also uses techniques in SH3 that wasn't known for me two years ago.

It's X-mas though... so I've got one new feature for you. True bearings. The watch officer and sonar guy may give true bearings to targets.

Read the manual for more information.

Also... patSH3r isn't compatible with hsie-patched exe's anymore. It takes too much time to write two versions of everything. patSH3r will refuse to initialize if you're running a hsie-patched exe.

Many thanks to Makman94 for advises and testing.

Download @ https://fb.tuxxor.net/

Merry Christmas

Merry Christmas to you too Fader_Berg :Kaleun_Salute:
Thank you for sharing your last work , superb as always :Kaleun_Applaud:

[hauangua]

Beautiful work Fader Berg
:salute:

[Fader_Berg]

r57 is the new release of patSH3r.


New with this release is PatSH3r BDU. If this option is enabled, your patrol reports will be sent to the patSH3r BDU and your sub will be mapped in the patSH3r - War Room (https://fb.tuxxor.net/pbdu.html).


Download @ https://fb.tuxxor.net

[Niume]

r57 is the new release of patSH3r.


New with this release is PatSH3r BDU. If this option is enabled, your patrol reports will be sent to the patSH3r BDU and your sub will be mapped in the patSH3r - War Room (https://fb.tuxxor.net/pbdu.html).


Download @ https://fb.tuxxor.net
Very cool with the war room.:Kaleun_Cheers:

[hauangua]

Hi Fader Berg
But old options.. For example "WO range estimation fix" are deleted?

[Fader_Berg]

Hi Fader Berg
But old options.. For example "WO range estimation fix" are deleted?
Yes. I didn't like that solution. It was horrible to play with. It made playing SH3 boring. I've been thinking about incorporate a little more clean and simple one, like hsies instead.

[hauangua]

Yes. I didn't like that solution. It was horrible to play with. It made playing SH3 boring. I've been thinking about incorporate a little more clean and simple one, like hsies instead.

Thanks for you answer Fader Berg
This new patch is really beautiful!!!
And war room very good idea!!
:salute:

[hauangua]

Maybe i wrong or my poor English is guilty,
Fader Berg can you post your 4616, 4620, 4912 and 4922 en_menu.txt?
this mine:
Where wrong?

4616=Nearest visual contact, bearing %03.0f° (%03.0f°), range %.0f
4620=Range to ship at %03.0f is %.0f meters
4912=Nearest sound contact, bearing %03.0f° (%03.0f°), range %.0f”
4922=Nearest warship sound contact, bearing %03.0f° (%03.0f°), range %.0f”

i do not read true bearing just my WO repeat relative bearing ,by periscope/Uzo bearing ...example 127° (127°)
i know this MY wrong but not understerand where

[Fader_Berg]

Maybe i wrong or my poor English is guilty,
Fader Berg can you post your 4616, 4620, 4912 and 4922 en_menu.txt?
this mine:
Where wrong?

4616=Nearest visual contact, bearing %03.0f° (%03.0f°), range %.0f
4620=Range to ship at %03.0f is %.0f meters
4912=Nearest sound contact, bearing %03.0f° (%03.0f°), range %.0f”
4922=Nearest warship sound contact, bearing %03.0f° (%03.0f°), range %.0f”

i do not read true bearing just my WO repeat relative bearing ,by periscope/Uzo bearing ...example 127° (127°)
i know this MY wrong but not understerand where


Those lines looks ok. It looks like the true bearings gets calculated too. Are you heading north?

[hauangua]

Those lines looks ok. It looks like the true bearings gets calculated too. Are you heading north?

All work good Fader Berg.. I'm bit stupid... Eheheheh.. Yes probed very fast, academy torpedo.... My sub heading north... I'm sorry.
:salute:

[Niume]

I have send the status report but i can't see it on the map.
My config
[PATSH3R]
AlertWatchOfficer=Yes
NightVisionFactor=0.45
RepairTimeFactor=25.0
SmarterPettyOfficers=Yes
Patsh3rBDU=Yes

[Fader_Berg]

I have send the status report but i can't see it on the map.
My config
[PATSH3R]
AlertWatchOfficer=Yes
NightVisionFactor=0.45
RepairTimeFactor=25.0
SmarterPettyOfficers=Yes
Patsh3rBDU=Yes


Yes. Makman94 noticed an unexpected behavior that I haven't looked into yet. This doesn't seem work with 'Send status report' from the Radio Messages screen. It only works if you click on the radio guy and send 'Patrol report'.
I'll have a look on it asap.

[Niume]

Yes. Makman94 noticed an unexpected behavior that I haven't looked into yet. This doesn't seem work with 'Send status report' from the Radio Messages screen. It only works if you click on the radio guy and send 'Patrol report'.
I'll have a look on it asap.
Yay it works you can see my uboat near the Gibraltar

[Niume]

Would it be possible to make more then one waypoint? Let's say if i make status report every 12h people could see my journey. something like this https://uboat.net/boats/patrols/patrol_889.html

[Fader_Berg]

Would it be possible to make more then one waypoint? Let's say if i make status report every 12h people could see my journey. something like this https://uboat.net/boats/patrols/patrol_889.html




Hmmm... interesting thought. I'll have a look on it.

[Blackswan1940]

Also... patSH3r isn't compatible with hsie-patched exe's anymore. It takes too much time to write two versions of everything. patSH3r will refuse to initialize if you're running a hsie-patched exe.


This is no good! Where can I download the prevous version that was still compatible?

[ericlea]

Hi Fader Berg,


thank you for your great job but it is true that today h.sie patch is an abolute must have in all sh3 supermods. play with patsh3r but without h.sie is a shame.

:Kaleun_Salute:

[Fader_Berg]

This is no good! Where can I download the prevous version that was still compatible?


Dunno.


Hi Fader Berg,


thank you for your great job but it is true that today h.sie patch is an abolute must have in all sh3 supermods. play with patsh3r but without h.sie is a shame.

:Kaleun_Salute:


Then don't do it. :03:

[Blackswan1940]

your patrol reports will be sent to the patSH3r BDU and your sub will be mapped in the patSH3r - War Room (https://fb.tuxxor.net/pbdu.html).

Can you also send them to Operation Spinnennetz?

I had been thinking that old thing was dead, but it is still around. Somebody helped me to find it again here: http://www.subsim.com/radioroom/showthread.php?t=239706

[Fader_Berg]

Can you also send them to Operation Spinnennetz?

I had been thinking that old thing was dead, but it is still around. Somebody helped me to find it again here: http://www.subsim.com/radioroom/showthread.php?t=239706


Some work has begun to make it possible. I'm not doing it my self but I'll give the code away for it.

[Blackswan1940]

Really? :Kaleun_Salivating: I would love to report my sub to Operation Spinnennetz using your patch! Cannot wait!

Please keep me informed!!

[Fader_Berg]

Source: https://github.com/cjwagenius/patSH3r

[Blackswan1940]

Yes. I didn't like that solution. It was horrible to play with. It made playing SH3 boring. I've been thinking about incorporate a little more clean and simple one, like hsies instead.

Ahaaa! And you should also consider taking back your last decision about rekoving the compatibilty to H.sie!

It is totally counterproductive when your patch is not compatible with Hasie and Stiebler. It will not be used then.

Hope this thought helps. Keep up your good work!

[Anvar1061]

Ahaaa! And you should also consider taking back your last decision about rekoving the compatibilty to H.sie!

It is totally counterproductive when your patch is not compatible with Hasie and Stiebler. It will not be used then.

Hope this thought helps. Keep up your good work!


+1
http://www.subsim.com/radioroom/images/smilies/Kaleun_Applaud-1.gif

[padi]

Ahaaa! And you should also consider taking back your last decision about rekoving the compatibilty to H.sie!

It is totally counterproductive when your patch is not compatible with Hasie and Stiebler. It will not be used then.

Hope this thought helps. Keep up your good work!


+1
http://www.subsim.com/radioroom/images/smilies/Kaleun_Applaud-1.gif

+2

:Kaleun_Applaud:

[Niume]

+2

:Kaleun_Applaud:
+++3

[Tricky]

+4
:Kaleun_Applaud:

[Hebe Vollmaus]

Source: https://github.com/cjwagenius/patSH3r

Thank you very much for releasing the Source.
This earns the highest honorable respect from me!

Greetings.

[Fader_Berg]

Ahaaa! And you should also consider taking back your last decision about rekoving the compatibilty to H.sie!

It is totally counterproductive when your patch is not compatible with Hasie and Stiebler. It will not be used then.

Hope this thought helps. Keep up your good work!

No, I should not. Look. Hsies code is horrible to work with. It's all over the place and he has made many poor design choices. It's too *******ing boring and time consuming to work with. Besides... I don't use many of his patches anyway.

Counterproductive...? I take that as an insult. Do you even know what that word mean? I may possibly have made something that you don't want to use. I use it though. That's pretty much all that matters for me. If any one else wants to use it - fine. If anyone else don't want to use it - perfect. I don't care.

I have given all the code away into the public domain for anyone to fiddle with and to merge with hsies work if that's wanted. How is that counterproductive?! Blame yourself or anyone else that have done nothing in this matter for being counterproductive instead.

D*mn I'm pissed... counterproductive my *ss.

[padi]

No, I should not. Look. Hsies code is horrible to work with. It's all over the place and he has made many poor design choices. It's too *******ing boring and time consuming to work with. Besides... I don't use many of his patches anyway.

Counterproductive...? I take that as an insult. Do you even know what that word mean? I may possibly have made something that you don't want to use. I use it though. That's pretty much all that matters for me. If any one else wants to use it - fine. If anyone else don't want to use it - perfect. I don't care.

I have given all the code away into the public domain for any one to fiddle with and to merge with hsies work if that's wanted. How is that counterproductive?! Blame yourself or anyone else that have done nothing in this matter for being counterproductive instead.

D*mn I'm pissed... counterproductive my *ss.


Creating something that isn't compatible to the standard is counterproductive because very few people are using it...

[Fader_Berg]

Creating something that isn't compatible to the standard is counterproductive because very few people are using it...
The fact that it's created for a small audience (if any at all) doesn't make it counterproductive. I'm sorry.

[propbeanie]

I have a quote in my signature from Jimbuna that perfectly fits this. I would also like to thank Fader_Berg for what he has accomplished with this. I would also like to thank Stiebler and h.sie for what they have done - in fact, I'd like to thank ~ALL~ the modders who have done anything for the modding community, conforming to "standards" or not (by whose definition are these "standards", btw?). It ain't easy doing this modding stuff, because as can be seen, someone seems quick to criticize. Do it constructively and politely please... whoops - my soapbox collapsed from my body weight... sorry. :salute:

[hauangua]

Ahaaa! And you should also consider taking back your last decision about rekoving the compatibilty to H.sie!

It is totally counterproductive when your patch is not compatible with Hasie and Stiebler. It will not be used then.

Hope this thought helps. Keep up your good work!

Maximum respect and gratitude is needed, for all modders, it is thanks to all of them if SH is still alive and always more beautiful.1000+ mods that are there may like it or not, or they may partially like it, anyone can "roll up their sleeves" and create the mod that they like most.
Defining a counterproductive Mod, it is an unfortunate expression and I want to hope for a simple "writing" error.
:salute:

[makman94]

..."standar"....:doh:...come on guys...lets get a little bit serious here.


i would not say such thing for ANY mod at all !! All these years in subsim , i can say ,for sure, this: if there were any "standards" now you would all play with mods made back at 2005-6.


for example, i use Fader_berg's patch and its obvious to me (for many reasons) that Fader_berg's skills are in no doupt.
I stongly believe that if someone can "judge" his work are ONLY those who can "see" what executables do (and probably will tell you that Fader_berg is one of the best around). I really trust this guy on whatever generously offers to sh3 :yep:


bottom line, someone can use it or not but can't "judge" it (unless he knows what work has been done in its files)

[areo16]

No, I should not. Look. Hsies code is horrible to work with. It's all over the place and he has made many poor design choices. It's too *******ing boring and time consuming to work with. Besides... I don't use many of his patches anyway.

Counterproductive...? I take that as an insult. Do you even know what that word mean? I may possibly have made something that you don't want to use. I use it though. That's pretty much all that matters for me. If any one else wants to use it - fine. If anyone else don't want to use it - perfect. I don't care.

I have given all the code away into the public domain for anyone to fiddle with and to merge with hsies work if that's wanted. How is that counterproductive?! Blame yourself or anyone else that have done nothing in this matter for being counterproductive instead.

D*mn I'm pissed... counterproductive my *ss.


I do sympathize here as concerns to working with other people's code that may not have the same disciplines as yourself, same education or even understanding of design principles.



It's quite frustrating (not to say that either of those developers in question used bad practices as I haven't spent much time looking at the source. I do know however, that working with assembly is so low-level that any design concepts, if they can be applied, that are common with higher level languages can't be applied to assembly.). I'd really hate to design a whole application in assembly to begin with, why not read the byte values in a higher level language and output the modified bytes to executable?

[areo16]

Ahaaa! And you should also consider taking back your last decision about rekoving the compatibilty to H.sie!

It is totally counterproductive when your patch is not compatible with Hasie and Stiebler. It will not be used then.

Hope this thought helps. Keep up your good work!



This comment pisses me off. Could have said this in a nicer way...




He did it for free, as all modders do. If you don't like it, learn ****ty assembly and rewrite it yourself.

[Fader_Berg]

I do sympathize here as concerns to working with other people's code that may not have the same disciplines as yourself, same education or even understanding of design principles.
hsie made a great deal of work that impressed me and others. I really don't care how his code looks like while it works and I don't need to get in touch with it.


It's quite frustrating (not to say that either of those developers in question used bad practices as I haven't spent much time looking at the source. I do know however, that working with assembly is so low-level that any design concepts, if they can be applied, that are common with higher level languages can't be applied to assembly.). I'd really hate to design a whole application in assembly to begin with, why not read the byte values in a higher level language and output the modified bytes to executable?
The problem is where the two patches interfere with each other. It can't be avoided and has to be dealt with.
I tried at first. In some parts of the patSH3r source code you can still see that I tried it. It's mentioned in the comments (which I've forgotten to update when I gave up).


If I make one patch I might end up having to write two or more patches to make it compatible with hsies. One when hsie.A i enabled. One more when hsie.A is disabled. Fu*k... it crashes. This because a variable in the hsie.A-code are also being used in hsie.C and -F-code too, and doesn't get updated correctly now. I have to figure out how this variable works in fragmented, disorganized and very sparse commented code in gerrman. By the way... which other hsie-features uses this variable also?! Not to mention all variables that are being used between A, B, G and O that I may have missed, and doesn't result in a crash. That's gonna affect the game somehow. It probably ends up in some "when I got 56% oxy left and the clock is 12:42 a friday the submarine crashdives"-bug.
I just puked in my mouth.



No! If I have to fill my my spare time with something extremely hard and boring. I rather work extra and make some money instead.

[areo16]

If I make one patch I might end up having to write two or more patches to make it compatible with hsies. One when hsie.A i enabled. One more when hsie.A is disabled. Fu*k... it crashes. This because a variable in the hsie.A-code are also being used in hsie.C and -F-code too, and doesn't get updated correctly now. I have to figure out how this variable works in fragmented, disorganized and very sparse commented code in gerrman. By the way... which other hsie-features uses this variable also?! Not to mention all variables that are being used between A, B, G and O that I may have missed, and doesn't result in a crash. That's gonna affect the game somehow. It probably ends up in some "when I got 56% oxy left and the clock is 12:42 a friday the submarine crashdives"-bug.
I just puked in my mouth.



This sounds like is using global variables here when he should be using local variables? Or he is referencing the same variable from the same package over and over again?


This is a design issue.


What about copying these globals to local variables in the scope you need to use it in, and edit them as such, not affect the global variable itself (assuming you don't need the edits on these variables to be outside of your current scope)?

[Fader_Berg]

This sounds like is using global variables here when he should be using local variables? Or he is referencing the same variable from the same package over and over again?


This is a design issue.


What about copying these globals to local variables in the scope you need to use it in, and edit them as such, not affect the global variable itself (assuming you don't need the edits on these variables to be outside of your current scope)?
Some of them are global for a reason, some of them are not. Believe me. If there was a easy way around this, I would have taken it a long time ago.

To be able to remedy this I (or anyone else for that matter) need to analyze and understand pretty much everything he has written. Since, like I told you, the code is very sparsely commented in german (with even most of the variable names being made in german, scattered around the source in a non logical way). it's damn frustrating and hard to cope with.

It's not impossible off course, Anyone can do it. It just takes time and effort I'm not willing to invest.

[padi]

i would not say such thing for ANY mod at all !! All these years in subsim , i can say ,for sure, this: if there were any "standards" now you would all play with mods made back at 2005-6.

If something is used by 90+% of all players it is the standard...

[makman94]

If something is used by 90+% of all players it is the standard...


i guess you would have said the same for the mods used by 90+% of players back at 2005-6

[John Pancoast]

<dead thread> Shame this wasn't developed further especially in regards to working with H.sie's/Stiebler's patches.
Some really great functions and work done with this patch.

[Niume]

I agree

[Fader_Berg]

Long time no see... everybody.



I was going through an old external harddrive and found the old patSH3r with sources. I thought it was lost when I couldn't find it years back. But there it was. I uploaded it for you guys who want to use this legacy version (which still has support for hsies patch). Mostly 'cause you want the WO & HY targeting I guess.


The binary can be downloaded here (http://fb.tuxxor.net/legacy-patSH3r_r32.zip) and the sources here (http://fb.tuxxor.net/legacy-patSH3r_r32-source.zip).



Have a nice day.

[Onkel Neal]

Nicely done!

[ivanov.ruslan]

Thanks!:up:

[John Pancoast]

Thanks, and thanks for the great work !

[Mister_M]

Is it possible to change the light intensity from which the AI uses starshells and searchlights ? It's so unrealistic when the AI uses them during daytime (typically when the sky is cloudy) ! ...

[Anvar1061]

https://www.subsim.com/radioroom/images/smilies/Kaleun_Thumbs_Up-1.gif