New modder

[Longknife]

Greetings folks,

I am reasonably new to SH but am a long time modeler & modder for Flight Simulator from FS5 to FSX.

I have just a few brief questions that I hope someone could answer & save me hours of surfing.

I am given to understand Ubisoft never released a SDK for any of the iterations of SH correct? Assuming so is there any single source/knowledge dump about file structure/file formats used in SH?

I am reasonably proficient in 3DS Max, has the community been able to successfully import new models into SH from 3DS or another 3d model program?

I am enjoying simming with SH for now & would like to make some high rez models of the playable subs for my own use (in fact I may make them anyway for my own entertainment) but would like to judge my chances of success before I start down the rabbit hole :D

Many thanks for any insight the group would be able to provide.

Bob

[ReallyDedPoet]

Welcome to SUBSIM :sunny:

Check out this thread: Here (http://www.subsim.com/radioroom/showthread.php?t=155786)

Many have used this mod tool on SH4:Here (http://www.subsim.com/radioroom/showthread.php?t=119571)

[Longknife]

Thank you for the welcome & the links!

Another slights more technical question. What is the upward limit on triangles for the mesh? Obviously less is better but all things are a compromise.

I suppose I could port some of my old models into the sim to see what she can take but I was wondering if there had been any experience with upper limit & still maintain playability on most systems.

[Jeff-Groves]

Depends on what you consider 'most systems'.
As all models are broken into parts? You can just break down a model to parts and get a big file.
I seem to recall a 32K or 64K limit for each part but I'm crazy so don't trust me too much on this.
:doh:

[THEBERBSTER]

A Warm Welcome To The Subsim Community > Longknife :subsim:
You Will Always Find Someone Here To Help You :sunny:
New To Silent Hunter <> Need Help <> Click On My Thread Link. :salute:
Subsim <> How To Donate <> See The Benefits <> Support The Community :yeah:
http://www.subsim.com/radioroom/showthread.php?p=2033119%23post2033119 (http://www.subsim.com/radioroom/showthread.php?p=2033119%23post2033119)

[jhapprich]

there is no limit to the game engine. biggest thing i implementet was a 250.000`single mesh. what really uses up cpu ressources are particle generators such as stern or bow waves(eg. using Karle94`s surface mods.

[Jeff-Groves]

What was the size of the largest single mesh imported?
Not over all parts in a dat but a single mesh such as the hull.

If one goes back through skwasjer's threads on S3D?
I'm thinking it was talked about when Collada was discussed.

[the_frog]

S3D can import meshes up to ca. 60 000 polys. The number of maximum vertices is also in that range. Had to break up models into smaller chunks after edge splitting and subsequent increase in vertices.

[jhapprich]

Nope, 60.000 is definitively not the limit (i am handling a 74k mesh in s3d in this moment). As mentioned before i already worked on a 250k single mesh (carrier model) in s3d

[the_frog]

... 120 000 polys imported as ONE SINGLE mesh?
Or broken up into several submodels?

[jhapprich]

i wrote it before.... YES A SINGLE MESH. and i dont think thats the limit either( but i would ask myself if a model of more than 200k makes sense in the game, you wont see any more detail...)

[the_frog]

... did a number of tests with several meshes. Import of meshes with either > ca. 65 000 vertices or > ca. 100 000 faces causes S3D to fail, with a messages appearing stating the model has either too many vertices or too many faces.

Seems on my (likely underpowered) machine handling large meshes in S3d is not possible. Most models require subdivision anyway, so not much of an issue.

[iambecomelife]

... did a number of tests with several meshes. Import of meshes with either > ca. 65 000 vertices or > ca. 100 000 faces causes S3D to fail, with a messages appearing stating the model has either too many vertices or too many faces.

Seems on my (likely underpowered) machine handling large meshes in S3d is not possible. Most models require subdivision anyway, so not much of an issue.

Got the same issue working on the "Lusitania" - over a certain number of vertices S3d crashes. It doesn't bother me because I need to separate her into destructible parts anyway, but I'm wondering why it works for you.

[nrnstraswa]

Welcome to Subsim and good luck in your future modding projects. :)

[the_frog]

IMBL,
thanks for confirming the too-much-vertices-cause-S3D-to-crash observation.
I am not very fond of many destructible parts; I dislike exploding vents and flying masts. However, breaking up a model into smaller pieces allows for easier handling of reflections, and also for using several repeated instances of certain items (which gives somewhat smaller *.dat fies).

[Jeff-Groves]

It's not the verts count that stops you.
It's the faces or triangle count.
Say you have any one face that numbers above 65535?
Such as 39/65536
You could crash S3D or it just won't import.
The reason is simple. The dat stores the face as 2 bytes. FF FF is the max you can store in 2 bytes. FF FF = 65535.
So you can have as many verts as you want as long as any one face does not number above 65535.

There's a reason S3D states Full Support yes or no for each Node and you'll notice full support for 3D Models is No.
I use 010 Editor to do what S3D can't.

[the_frog]

65 000 ... so, the number I memorised first was about correct.
Just checked again the largest model I tried the last day -- I was wrong; it had not 100 000 but just 60 000 faces ...

Well, as said before, there are other good reasons for not using large meshs.

Thanks for the explanation.

[Jeff-Groves]

That would explain why many textures are over lapped on UV's.
Once you understand how obj files do the faces? it becomes clear.
We can have a million verts coords as long as the actual faces do not go beyond the 65535 number.
(That is actually 65536 since hex starts with 0)