[REL] Depth keeping problem fixed

[TheDarkWraith]

This mod fixes the depth keeping problem with the VIIA, VIIB, VIIC, and VIIC41 subs. You'll be able to keep depth at 0knots down to 170m if you have incurred no damage to the sub (no flooding).

The external torpedo transfer time has been increased to 1000 in both versions

Stock game files and FX Update: http://www.gamefront.com/files/21093845/Depth_Keeping_Problem_TheDarkWraith_zip

Below is to be used if you have the mods UHS v1.4 or Magnum Opus installed. You install this after the mod to get rid of the depth keeping problem AND to make the sub go to the depth chosen (real deep depths will overshoot some)
UHS v1.4 or Magnum Opus: http://www.gamefront.com/files/21093845/Depth_Keeping_Problem_TheDarkWraith_zip

I'm working on versions now that will require you to have one knot of speed to hold depth (no hummingbird effect)


To install: unzip straight to MODS folder and enable via JSGME.

:|\\

[stoianm]

Downloaded and installed and wanted to thank you!:salute:

[Topo65]

Great THANKS, TDW!!! :yeah:

[Sepp von Ch.]

This mod fixes the depth keeping problem with the VIIA, VIIB, VIIC, and VIIC41 subs. You'll be able to keep depth at 0knots down to 170m with no damage to sub (no flooding).

I'll be making a version for those who use UHS also.

:yeah:

[Blauritter]

thank you, TDW

[reaper7]

Nice one. :up:

[Ragtag]

Not compatible with FX and SH5 enviroment 5 mods i guess since you say it's for stock?
Anyways, thanks. been waiting since day one for a fix for this bug :)
I'll wait for a compatible version for the above:yeah:

[ReallyDedPoet]

Nice :yep::up:

[Magic1111]

Many thanks TDW ! :salute:

[WillyVic]

Thank you TDW.

WV

[Reece]

Great stuff as usual TDW!:yeah:

[Akula4745]

Thank you, good sir. I find myself once again in your debt.
I will see if it works with the mod soup I currently have going...

[Seaman_Hornsby]

Excellent! I've downloaded and installed. Now if Ubi will get the servers back up and running I can actually try it out. :damn:

Edit: Finally back up and running and the mod appears to work great. VIIB held steady at 100m, and 150m as ordered, with motors stopped. My ballast tanks are no longer filled with lead! :D

[Ragtag]

It would be very nice with a standalone version compatible with SH5 enviroment and FX mod. I'm holding off on magnum opus untill a later version :)

thanks!

[TheDarkWraith]

UHS, FX Update, and Magnum Opus version released. Stock file version has been revised also. See post #1 for details :|\\

[stoianm]

Thanks!:up:

[ddrgn]

Nice work!

[TheDarkWraith]

Nice work!

your UHS files were a little trickier to fix the problem of. With the changes you made the sub will keep depth now with the fix but at deep depths it will overshoot the ordered depth. The deeper you dive the more overshoot that happens. I can't seem to fix that part of it. You really only start to see this at depths >120m with UHS.

[ddrgn]

Ya never could get it to balance proper....

[TheDarkWraith]

Ya never could get it to balance proper....

did you notice what an impact ship length and width do to depth keeping :06: I had to make the stock SH5 VIIA files mimmick the VIIB just to get it to hold depth. For the life of me I couldn't do anything right until I set the length and width to that of the VIIB :hmmm:

[ddrgn]

interesting... i did look into historical lengths and widths, but remember not having to change anything... i certainly didn't focus on that being a cause of the depth keeping issue but makes sense now that i think of it

[dcb]

Just a suggestion. Using the .sim files present in original Magnum Opus (not in the latest fix), I changed the submerged displacement to 770. In my game, it works great, the uboat levels at precisely the ordered depth, from PD down to 100 meters. I never had the chance to test it below this depth, as I am still stalking ships on the Eastern Approaches, but maybe you'll take it as a starting point.

[TheDarkWraith]

Just a suggestion. Using the .sim files present in original Magnum Opus (not in the latest fix), I changed the submerged displacement to 770. In my game, it works great, the uboat levels at precisely the ordered depth, from PD down to 100 meters. I never had the chance to test it below this depth, as I am still stalking ships on the Eastern Approaches, but maybe you'll take it as a starting point.

I've already adjusted the submerged displacements for all the subs to make them hold depth. I had to do a little more tweaking on the VIIA to make it hold depth though (length and width adjustments). Most subs were around 740-790 for submerged displacement :up:

[Bilge_Rat]

your UHS files were a little trickier to fix the problem of. With the changes you made the sub will keep depth now with the fix but at deep depths it will overshoot the ordered depth. The deeper you dive the more overshoot that happens. I can't seem to fix that part of it. You really only start to see this at depths >120m with UHS.

The overshooting is not necessarily an issue. A submarine is not an elevator. Depending on speed, rate of dive, water conditions/temperature/salinity, weight, weight distribution, you can easily overshoot. This is more of a problem the deeper you go since air compresses and the rate of sinking increases with depth. A certain oscillation around the ordered depth until the diving officer gets it nice and stable would not be abnormal.

from wikipedia, but close enough:

When submerged, the water pressure on submarine's hull can reach 4 MPa (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pascal_(unit)) (580 psi (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pounds_per_square_inch)) for steel submarines and up to 10 MPa (1,500 psi) for titanium submarines like Komsomolets (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Soviet_submarine_K-278_Komsomolets), while interior pressure remains relatively unchanged. This difference results in hull compression, which decreases displacement. Water density also increases with depth, as the salinity (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Salinity) and pressure are higher, but this incompletely compensates for hull compression, so buoyancy decreases as depth increases. A submerged submarine is in an unstable equilibrium, having a tendency to either fall or float to the surface. Keeping a constant depth requires continual operation of either the depth control tanks or control surfaces

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Submarine#Submersion_and_trimming

[Sepp von Ch.]

Stock game files and FX Update: http://www.filefront.com/17914870/TDW-Depth-Keeping-Problem-HB-1-0-0.7z/

Below is to be used if you have the mods UHS v1.4 or Magnum Opus installed. UHS v1.4 or Magnum Opus: http://www.filefront.com/17914878/TDW-Depth-Keeping-Problem-UHS-patch-HB-1-0-0.7z/



When I use UHS v1.4 and your FX_Update_0_0_11_byTheDarkWraith, FX_Update_0_0_11_UHS_Fix and FX_Update_0_0_11_BARF_1_3_Full_Fix, Which version should I use please?

[TheDarkWraith]

When I use UHS v1.4 and your FX_Update_0_0_11_byTheDarkWraith, FX_Update_0_0_11_UHS_Fix and FX_Update_0_0_11_BARF_1_3_Full_Fix, Which version should I use please?

the one for UHS :up:

[Sepp von Ch.]

Thank you TDW! Very important mod for me!:rock:

[Zedi]

The overshooting is not necessarily an issue. A submarine is not an elevator. Depending on speed, rate of dive, water conditions/temperature/salinity, weight, weight distribution, you can easily overshoot. This is more of a problem the deeper you go since air compresses and the rate of sinking increases with depth. A certain oscillation around the ordered depth until the diving officer gets it nice and stable would not be abnormal.

from wikipedia, but close enough:



http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Submarine#Submersion_and_trimming
This. I also think that is very normal that under a certain depth with minimal speed the sub will start to slowly sink, mostly because the bigger water pressure that will overcome the air pressure from the tanks. To have control on depth again, the only way is to increase the speed.

So I think is nothing wrong with the depth control in the game. Stretching the depth limit is only to escape from the sonar, but it has his risk. Problem is that no matter how deep we go, with IRAI enabled, the escort will still ping you down. Just last night I dived down to 258m and they still pinged me and drooped very precise dc's over me. At that depth is no way to survive with a dc near the sub, its insta kill.

[dcb]

This. I also think that is very normal that under a certain depth with minimal speed the sub will start to slowly sink, mostly because the bigger water pressure that will overcome the air pressure from the tanks. To have control on depth again, the only way is to increase the speed.

Back in the early days of SH3, when the buoyancy issue arose for the first time, there was a debate on whether to implement positive or negative buoyancy. IIRC, the general conclusion was that submarines (not just uboats) were built to have a slight positive buoyancy, precisely for the case of engine/battery failures. Eventually, one supermod took the positive buoyancy path, while the other went with the negative one. Though I'm no expert, common sense tells me positive buoyancy should have been norm back then, with less advanced batteries and electric motors, prone to failure.

[Magic1111]

UHS, FX Update, and Magnum Opus version released. Stock file version has been revised also. See post #1 for details :|\\

Many thanks for update ! :up:

But one question: What is UHS ? :hmmm:
Sorry for this dumb question.

Best regards,
Magic:salute:

[stoianm]

Many thanks for update ! :up:

But one question: What is UHS ? :hmmm:
Sorry for this dumb question.

Best regards,
Magic:salute:

here magic1111:

http://www.subsim.com/radioroom/downloads.php?do=file&id=1775

it is already in MO

cheers:salute:

[Magic1111]

here magic1111:

http://www.subsim.com/radioroom/downloads.php?do=file&id=1775

it is already in MO

cheers:salute:

Aaah, okay ! Many thanks !!!! :yeah:

Best regards,
Magic:salute:

[Zedi]

Back in the early days of SH3, when the buoyancy issue arose for the first time, there was a debate on whether to implement positive or negative buoyancy. IIRC, the general conclusion was that submarines (not just uboats) were built to have a slight positive buoyancy, precisely for the case of engine/battery failures. Eventually, one supermod took the positive buoyancy path, while the other went with the negative one. Though I'm no expert, common sense tells me positive buoyancy should have been norm back then, with less advanced batteries and electric motors, prone to failure.

Using stock settings I can dive and keep depth without using the engines down to 160m. Between 160 and 180m I need at least 1-2kts to keep the sub floating, under 200m I need 4 and at 250 and bellow I need full power to level up. I consider this a very normal situation for a sub in the 38-45 time period. We are not talking about nuclear subs here and the color markers on the depth dial are for a reason.

[stoianm]

Hi tdw

I would like to have a version where i will be able to keep my depth at any speed if is posible:hmmm:

i am working now at a mod who will increase the bank acount - we can make trade:haha:


thanks!

[Zedi]

...

i am working now at a mod who will increase the bank acount ...



You got my attention on this, any eta?! :P

[TheDarkWraith]

Hi tdw

I would like to have a version where i will be able to keep my depth at any speed if is posible:hmmm:

i am working now at a mod who will increase the bank acount - we can make trade:haha:

thanks!

the two versions at post #1 do this. You can maintain depth at any speed, even 0 knots.

[stoianm]

the two versions at post #1 do this. You can maintain depth at any speed, even 0 knots.

Thanks!

I misunderstood your post! i was thinking that i will be able to keep the dept only at 0 knots and because of that i did not used:DL

cheers

[Obelix]

Using stock settings I can dive and keep depth without using the engines down to 160m. Between 160 and 180m I need at least 1-2kts to keep the sub floating, under 200m I need 4 and at 250 and bellow I need full power to level up. I consider this a very normal situation for a sub in the 38-45 time period. We are not talking about nuclear subs here and the color markers on the depth dial are for a reason.
No movement can not keep the boat at a given depth, even on modern boats. The thing that is impossible to perfectly balance the boat for holding at the desired depth without motion. The boat will tend either to surface or the bottom. Therefore, to keep the depth of the boat had to be at least a minimum speed that seaplanes could keep a boat at depth.
Therefore, keeping the depth of no motion, I believe than the fantastic and the game it's always annoyed me. How, indeed, falling through to a depth at low speed.

[Vanilla]

No movement can not keep the boat at a given depth, even on modern boats. The thing that is impossible to perfectly balance the boat for holding at the desired depth without motion. The boat will tend either to surface or the bottom. Therefore, to keep the depth of the boat had to be at least a minimum speed that seaplanes could keep a boat at depth.
Therefore, keeping the depth of no motion, I believe than the fantastic and the game it's always annoyed me. How, indeed, falling through to a depth at low speed.

Now imagine yourself a real kaleun in a sub at 200m depth with a couple of DDs overhead. You are trying to be as quite as possible but notice that your submarine is constantly falling down to dangerous depth unless you keep 5 knots of speed. Do you think a kaleun would not 'politely ask' his LI to dump 50-100l of ballast so he can keep silent running? I would defenitely do rather than be forced to choose between dying of depth because of sinking or DCs because of giving out my position. LI and trim system are there for a reason.
The bouyancy is obviously tricky to control but not impossible. And there is more than enough boyancy in all the tanks to keep level or rise at any depth - remember that the tanks volume (read bouyancy) is almost constant (unless damaged or crushed) with changing depth. And 1-2 knots is pretty much enough for horizontal planes to be effective in precise depth control.

Given all that I would agree that it is realistic if we would see some vertical speed, but random and dependent on depth, speed and damage, i.e. -15m after 10 minutes and +17 minutes after another 10 minutes at 100m depth at dead stop. Not constant -1m/s sinking we see now in vanilla - I would kill my LI I guess, if I'd seen that in RL.
Moreover I would love to see some compressed air consumption when submerged to simulate trimming, ideally dependent on speed, depth and of course damage. And that would be awesome to see some radical drop down some 40-50m down with some generous compressed air dump when a tank is crushed to simulate neutral bouyancy disruption and consecutive stabilising efforts through ballast dumping.

[Obelix]

Now imagine yourself a real kaleun in a sub at 200m depth with a couple of DDs overhead. You are trying to be as quite as possible but notice that your submarine is constantly falling down to dangerous depth unless you keep 5 knots of speed. Do you think a kaleun would not 'politely ask' his LI to dump 50-100l of ballast so he can keep silent running? I would defenitely do rather than be forced to choose between dying of depth because of sinking or DCs because of giving out my position. LI and trim system are there for a reason.
The bouyancy is obviously tricky to control but not impossible. And there is more than enough boyancy in all the tanks to keep level or rise at any depth - remember that the tanks volume (read bouyancy) is almost constant (unless damaged or crushed) with changing depth. And 1-2 knots is pretty much enough for horizontal planes to be effective in precise depth control.

Given all that I would agree that it is realistic if we would see some vertical speed, but random and dependent on depth, speed and damage, i.e. -15m after 10 minutes and +17 minutes after another 10 minutes at 100m depth at dead stop. Not constant -1m/s sinking we see now in vanilla - I would kill my LI I guess, if I'd seen that in RL.
Moreover I would love to see some compressed air consumption when submerged to simulate trimming, ideally dependent on speed, depth and of course damage. And that would be awesome to see some radical drop down some 40-50m down with some generous compressed air dump when a tank is crushed to simulate neutral bouyancy disruption and consecutive stabilising efforts through ballast dumping.

All true, but I talked about that at speed 0 knots to keep the boat at a given depth is not possible. Will be a constant yaw in depth. The boat begins to sink - pump water tends to surface - fill the ballast. And this game (blowing ballast-ballasting) is constant. Another thing that we have a speed of 1-2 knots, it should already allow us to control the depth of the minimum consumption of compressed air.

[Stormfly]

All true, but I talked about that at speed 0 knots to keep the boat at a given depth is not possible. Will be a constant yaw in depth. The boat begins to sink - pump water tends to surface - fill the ballast. And this game (blowing ballast-ballasting) is constant. Another thing that we have a speed of 1-2 knots, it should already allow us to control the depth of the minimum consumption of compressed air.

it would be good to know what force whas used to press water out of the boat using the regulation cells, also which maximum dept was allowed because pressforce have to be stronger then outside water pressure.

[Vanilla]

it would be good to know what force whas used to press water out of the boat using the regulation cells, also which maximum dept was allowed because pressforce have to be stronger then outside water pressure.

We can guestimate it: to start a steady accent you'd need to blow 200-300l of water out (my wildguess). Here is a link (http://www.uboatarchive.net/DesignStudiesTypeIXC-S49.htm), it states:

The air flasks have a total capacity of 6200 liters (219 cu. ft.) at 2920 p.s.i. This is sufficient air to evacuate all main ballast, fuel ballast and bow and stern buoyancy tanks once at a depth of 180 feet, or 5.65 times the free air volume of these tanks. Most of them are located in the superstructure, but six flasks which are part of four banks are located in the maneuvering room and engine room.
2920psi is 198atm, that means that at least theoretically we could blow out at least 6200 liter of water at any depth up to 2000m (http://www.calctool.org/CALC/other/games/depth_press) in type IX. :woot: But then of course you'd spent some air trimming while going to that depth so it is more like 600-700m... All that means that one could easily trim (and keep trimming) a undamaged boat at any depth in the operating depth range, in particular at speed when planes help. With all that I see no reason why the boat should accent or decent at any speed except dead stop. And at dead-stop I would expect to see some random depth oscilations not constant accent or descent.

[Stormfly]

ohh i just asked me if it would be possible to use pumps instead of air at this dept... so if pumps and energy are not strong enough to trim the boat at this dept, i think they wont had waste theier valueable air for trimming, but used the planes with a minimum speed.

[Bilge_Rat]

TDW, If I try to instal this mod (stock game) before your other mods, I get conflicts in JSGME.

FX_update tells me it is overwriting the NSS_uboat7a/7v/7c/7c41.sim files;

TDW_UI_6.3.7 tells me it is overwriting the the NSS_uboat7b.cfg file.

Is this mod installed last? after:

1. fx_update:
2. UI_637;
3. IRAI_30:
4. Depth keeping fix?

[TheDarkWraith]

TDW, If I try to instal this mod (stock game) before your other mods, I get conflicts in JSGME.

FX_update tells me it is overwriting the NSS_uboat7a/7v/7c/7c41.sim files;

TDW_UI_6.3.7 tells me it is overwriting the the NSS_uboat7b.cfg file.

Is this mod installed last? after:

1. fx_update:
2. UI_637;
3. IRAI_30:
4. Depth keeping fix?

yes, last.

[Bilge_Rat]

yes, last.

that was quick. thanks. :DL

[Overboard]

Just a heads up the link for the UHS v1.4 and MO fix says its unavailable.

[NeonsStyle]

Something that drives me nuts, even using your Mod,
is my ship just won't completely surface. It sits at least
1m lower than it should. It did have hull at 88% but
after refit / end patrol (n I assume repairs), it still
sits 1m lower than it should.

Is there some way to fix this?

[stoianm]

Something that drives me nuts, even using your Mod,
is my ship just won't completely surface. It sits at least
1m lower than it should. It did have hull at 88% but
after refit / end patrol (n I assume repairs), it still
sits 1m lower than it should.

Is there some way to fix this?
throw some stuf or some members crew in water and the Uboat become easyest - then will be completly surfaced - problem solved:D - just kidding - i did not noticed that

[oscar19681]

Something that drives me nuts, even using your Mod,
is my ship just won't completely surface. It sits at least
1m lower than it should. It did have hull at 88% but
after refit / end patrol (n I assume repairs), it still
sits 1m lower than it should.

Is there some way to fix this?

I have the same problem. It was ok with the VIIA but as soon as i got the VIIB i get the low riding sub problem. Its extremely anoying.

[Sepp von Ch.]

I can confirm. I also have the same problem with this mod.

[oscar19681]

Well actually i dont have this mod but it happens in MO mega mod as well.

[Rykaird]

I have the UHS patch installed after MO, NewUIs, and the IRAI mod, and it worked great. I then installed a large series of mods very much like Stoianm's list and can no longer keep depth.

I've noticed some folks seem to have installed the depth keeping patch more than once, I gather to work around this. It shows up in their mod list both where I have it but also much lower down.

However, when I try to install it a second time, I just get a file copy window in JSGME and can't get it lower in the patch order.

Any ideas here? Or should I unload all my mods back up to the depth keeping patch, remove it, load the rest of my mods, and then just put it much later in the order?

Here's my mod loadout:

Magnum_Opus_v0_0_1 (patched)
NewUIs_TDC_6_4_0_ByTheDarkWraith
FX_Update_0_0_16_ByTheDarkWraith
FX_Update_0_0_16_UHS_Fix
IRAI_0_0_30_ByTheDarkWraith
IRAI_0_0_30_No_hydrophone_on_surface_No_Aircraft_s potting
AirTorpedoes
Depth_Keeping_Problem_UHS_patch_HB_1_0_0_TheDarkWr aith
1 degree bearing RibAr
A Fistful of Emblems v1.51
Black_Skin_albrecht
Church's Compass Dials Mod v2.2 - Option Two
Critical hits 1.1 Torpedos
EnahncedFunnelSmoke1.2
EQuaTool 01.01 by AvM - double set - Large plus Flat Style
Grossdeutscher Rundfunk
Icebergs v2.4
Naights Submaine Textures (internal) v1.1
Original map colors
North Atlantic Green 1.1
nVidia missing lights
Real Environment - Revision_2
Shadow Improvement Mod
SOAN - ship data
sobers base sky mechanics V1
sobers base wave mechanics V15 SH5
sobers real trees
SteelViking's Sky Banding Mod
Trevally Automated Scripts v0.5
Trevally Tutorials - All v0.2 (for TDW UI)
Window_Lights_Redone_V1
Unterseeboot II SFX
sobers talking conning crew mod
sobers 3D deck spray mod V7
NewUIs_TDC_6_4_0_Real_Navigation
AOB slide ruller for TDW UIs and MO by stoianm
Speech Recognition_v1.4_MiTons_NewUI_Editon _english
NewUIs_TDC_6_4_0_Waypoint_Contacts_No_Symbols
NewUIs_TDC_6_4_0_Waypoint_Contacts_No_Tails

[stoianm]

I have the UHS patch installed after MO, NewUIs, and the IRAI mod, and it worked great. I then installed a large series of mods very much like Stoianm's list and can no longer keep depth.

I've noticed some folks seem to have installed the depth keeping patch more than once, I gather to work around this. It shows up in their mod list both where I have it but also much lower down.

However, when I try to install it a second time, I just get a file copy window in JSGME and can't get it lower in the patch order.

Any ideas here? Or should I unload all my mods back up to the depth keeping patch, remove it, load the rest of my mods, and then just put it much later in the order?
This 3 mods change the tdw mod:
Real Environment - Revision_2
Real Environment - Revision
SUB SIM FOR====Depth_Keeping_Problem_UHS_patch_HB_1_0_0_Th eDarkWraith

If you use one of these than install after them the Depth_Keeping_Problem_UHS_patch_HB_1_0_0_TheDarkWr aith mod

[Rykaird]

That did it, thanks!

By the way, I really enjoy your YouTube tutorials. Given how much the interface has changed with all of the great mods, they were a great help in just learning my way through the interface. I also learned some TDC tricks, so many thanks for the effort.

[stoianm]

That did it, thanks!

By the way, I really enjoy your YouTube tutorials. Given how much the interface has changed with all of the great mods, they were a great help in just learning my way through the interface. I also learned some TDC tricks, so many thanks for the effort.
wlk

[ddrgn]

Are people installing MO and the UHS patch during patrols? If you install MO or the UHS patch I'm quite certain your boat will sit low and not completely surface....

[Teiwaz]

SUB SIM FOR====Depth_Keeping_Problem_UHS_patch_HB_1_0_0_Th eDarkWraith

If you use one of these than install after them the Depth_Keeping_Problem_UHS_patch_HB_1_0_0_TheDarkWr aith mod

Isn't "SUB SIM FOR..." based on "Depth_Keeping..." and therefore be installed AFTER "Depth_Keeping..."?:hmmm:

[stoianm]

Isn't "SUB SIM FOR..." based on "Depth_Keeping..." and therefore be installed AFTER "Depth_Keeping..."?:hmmm:
it was supouse to be ... but try it and you will see that your uboat will jump like a rabit... go for example from 25 metters and order periscope depth and you wil be like... 6meters... 13 meters.. and so on untill he will stabilize:DL

[Teiwaz]

it was supouse to be ... but try it and you will see that your uboat will jump like a rabit... go for example from 25 metters and order periscope depth and you wil be like... 6meters... 13 meters.. and so on untill he will stabilize:DL

Had the same idea and yes, you are totally right. Looks like one of those mechanical rodeo bulls to me:haha:

Is there a way to lower the overshooting effect a little bit? Going down to 40m and overshooting by about 10m (reaching 50m then going up and stabilizing at 40m) is a little bit to much IMO. For crash dive it would be ok, but for a normal dive order I would prefer something around 3m (max. 5m).

[DoveEgg]

TDW,

What's the status of this mod? Has it been incorporated into your UI mod? Or should we still be using this stand alone mod?

[TheDarkWraith]

TDW,

What's the status of this mod? Has it been incorporated into your UI mod? Or should we still be using this stand alone mod?

The latest version of my UIs mod has it already :up:

[sidslotm]

You'll be able to keep depth at 0knots down to 170m


Is this realistic.

[mobucks]

no it isnt, TDW said he will try to incoroprate something so you need some speed to maintain depth that low. The anti-hummingbird effect.

[TheBeast]

I started a new career and notice that the Typ-7A is holding depth approximately 1 meter below the depth specified.

This results in Observation Periscope being submerged when Periscope Depth is ordered. (Periscope Depth = 12m)

Changing Submerged Displacement from 702 to 701.55 corrects this issue for me. The boat now settles just shy of 12m (within inches) when ordering Periscope Depth.

Data\Submarine\NSS_UBoat7a\NSS_UBoat7a.SIM
Controller:
unit_Submarine @ NSS_Uboat7a --> unit_Submarine --> unit_Ship --> obj_Hydro --> Submerged --> displacement = 701.55

If the boat would continue to sink @ Zero (0) Knots, this would be kind of neat but it doesn't.

I think it was the SH4 OM Mod that had the Submarine Physics setup correctly for this to happen.

In SH4 OM when Submarine went all stop and speed dropped to Zero (0) Knots the boat began to float to the surface very very slowly.
Not sure if lurker_hlb3 did this or someone else.

Regards!:Kaleun_Periskop:
TheBeast

[THE_MASK]

Nice , TDW needs to read this and fix in his UI mod :yep:
Dont alter it while on patrol , you will ctd .

[Dermeister]

Links are dead :(

[kylania]

It's already part of TDW NewUIs 6.8.0, so you don't need to install the stand alone versions anymore.

[0rpheus]

Don't suppose there's any chance of another version of this that allows us to hold depth lower than 150m? Constantly sinking below 150m drives me mad and as for the 'realism' aspect, I'm pretty sure SH4 didn't do anything of the sort, no matter how low you went.

Pretty please? :O::salute:

[Halface]

guess you dont sacuba dive....kinda same princiaple...specilly useing drysuit....lower down you get the air get more compressed...had a ballon with me down and it was big first but down on 20m it was rather small...

neeed to read more about the historic facts but..to maintain depths below 150m you have to have some spead so the dive planes can maintain the depth ...kinda logical too but it all deppends how realistic you wont to play the game..

[0rpheus]

guess you dont sacuba dive....kinda same princiaple...specilly useing drysuit....lower down you get the air get more compressed...had a ballon with me down and it was big first but down on 20m it was rather small...

neeed to read more about the historic facts but..to maintain depths below 150*m you have to have some spead so the dive planes can maintain the depth ...kinda logical too but it all deppends how realistic you wont to play the game..

Yeah, I know buoyancy decreases the lower you go, but at the same time I'd be surprised to find that it was impossible to maintain a constant depth lower than 150m at any speed but stopped. I guess in reality your crew would be working the planes and trim tanks to keep you as stable as possible, rather than sitting there like idiots doing nothing while the boat sinks to its doom!

Problem with the current method is, unless you have 7 or 8 hours to spend at your PC dealing with DD depth charges after an attack, you're bound to use a little TC when escaping. Not holding depth lower than 150 makes this very difficult, and it also negates any extra depth a given hull might have over another (7a vs 7c41, for example, which has a lower test depth), except in circumstances where you've lost control and are sinking (and lets face it, by that point it's probably too late, regardless!).

Yo-yo-ing the boat manually is currently the only way to get around this, and that doesn't feel terribly realistic either! I think 'realism' is what you make of it, and everyone has different opinions on what isn't appropriate - so this is just me hoping someone will make my SH5 life a teeny bit easier, realism be damned :O:

*just realised it's 170m not 150 - but during play, sitting at 170m, a single DC close by will push you below the threshold and begin sinking. During heavy bombardments I get knocked up to 10m or so lower, depending on the circumstances, so I stay at 150 because it's the only way to be sure I won't get pushed past the sink line! ;)

[TheDarkWraith]

Yeah, I know buoyancy decreases the lower you go, but at the same time I'd be surprised to find that it was impossible to maintain a constant depth lower than 150m at any speed but stopped. I guess in reality your crew would be working the planes and trim tanks to keep you as stable as possible, rather than sitting there like idiots doing nothing while the boat sinks to its doom!

Problem with the current method is, unless you have 7 or 8 hours to spend at your PC dealing with DD depth charges after an attack, you're bound to use a little TC when escaping. Not holding depth lower than 150 makes this very difficult, and it also negates any extra depth a given hull might have over another (7a vs 7c41, for example, which has a lower test depth), except in circumstances where you've lost control and are sinking (and lets face it, by that point it's probably too late, regardless!).

Yo-yo-ing the boat manually is currently the only way to get around this, and that doesn't feel terribly realistic either! I think 'realism' is what you make of it, and everyone has different opinions on what isn't appropriate - so this is just me hoping someone will make my SH5 life a teeny bit easier, realism be damned :O:

Open up the sub's .sim file and play with the submerged displacement value. You have to tweak this to get what you're wanting :up: Change in small increments :yep:

[0rpheus]

Open up the sub's .sim file and play with the submerged displacement value. You have to tweak this to get what you're wanting :up: Change in small increments :yep:

Ahh ok, figured it was best to steer well clear of altering .sim files, but I'll give it a go :) Cheers TDW! :up:

[Akula4745]

TDW - since some of us with under-powered PCs can no longer use your New UIs - could the links to your depth keeping fix be restored? I think I need the stock and FX version instead of the UHS version...

Thanks in advance, sir.

[TheDarkWraith]

TDW - since some of us with under-powered PCs can no longer use your New UIs - could the links to your depth keeping fix be restored? I think I need the stock and FX version instead of the UHS version...

Thanks in advance, sir.

http://www.gamefront.com/files/21093845/Depth_Keeping_Problem_TheDarkWraith_zip

[Akula4745]

http://www.gamefront.com/files/21093845/Depth_Keeping_Problem_TheDarkWraith_zip

Many thanks kind sir!

[pedrobas]

Below is to be used if you have the mods UHS v1.4 or Magnum Opus installed. You install this after the mod to get rid of the depth keeping problem AND to make the sub go to the depth chosen (real deep depths will overshoot some)
UHS v1.4 or Magnum Opus: http://www.filefront.com/17914878/TDW-Depth-Keeping-Problem-UHS-patch-HB-1-0-0.7z/

:|\\

Link is off, could someone reupload it, please.
Thank you

[TheDarkWraith]

Link is off, could someone reupload it, please.
Thank you

I'll fix it when I get back home :up:

[pedrobas]

Link is off, could someone reupload it, please.
Thank you

Don't forget to reupload it. Thanks. :yeah:

[pedrobas]

Link for MO is still off. :wah:

[Echolot]

Link for MO is still off. :wah:

http://www.gamefront.com/files/20803548/Magnum_Opus_v0_0_1.7z

http://www.gamefront.com/files/20803204/Magnum_Opus_v0_0_1_Patch_2.7z

Regards.

Echol:ping:t.

[pedrobas]

This mod fixes the depth keeping problem with the VIIA, VIIB, VIIC, and VIIC41 subs. You'll be able to keep depth at 0knots down to 170m if you have incurred no damage to the sub (no flooding).

Below is to be used if you have the mods UHS v1.4 or Magnum Opus installed. You install this after the mod to get rid of the depth keeping problem AND to make the sub go to the depth chosen (real deep depths will overshoot some)
UHS v1.4 or Magnum Opus: http://www.filefront.com/17914878/TDW-Depth-Keeping-Problem-UHS-patch-HB-1-0-0.7z/

:|\\

I don't mean MO, i mean this "depth keeping problem fix" Mod for MO, as stated in the quote above.

[TheDarkWraith]

links updated :up:

[Echolot]

http://www.gamefront.com/files/21142701/TDW_Depth_Keeping_Problem_UHS_patch_HB_1_0_0.7z

[pedrobas]

Thanks :up:

[Michael13]

Is it already installed in NewUI TDC 6.9.0 or I should install Depth_Keeping_Problem_HB_2_0_0_TheDarkWraith above?

[TheDarkWraith]

Is it already installed in NewUI TDC 6.9.0 or I should install Depth_Keeping_Problem_HB_2_0_0_TheDarkWraith above?

I had incorporated it at one time but too many people complained so I removed it. Thus no, it's not already in the mod.

[TheBeast]

I had incorporated it at one time but too many people complained so I removed it. Thus no, it's not already in the mod.
Is there a MOD that adjusts Crush Depths im .zon to more accurate values?

[flostt]

Is there a MOD that adjusts Crush Depths im .zon to more accurate values?

ddrgn did something in his "U-boat Historical Specifications" Mod
http://www.subsim.com/radioroom/showthread.php?t=168012

[schnorchel]

This mod fixes the depth keeping problem with the VIIA, VIIB, VIIC, and VIIC41 subs. You'll be able to keep depth at 0knots down to 170m if you have incurred no damage to the sub (no flooding).

The external torpedo transfer time has been increased to 1000 in both versions

Stock game files and FX Update: http://www.gamefront.com/files/21093845/Depth_Keeping_Problem_TheDarkWraith_zip

Below is to be used if you have the mods UHS v1.4 or Magnum Opus installed. You install this after the mod to get rid of the depth keeping problem AND to make the sub go to the depth chosen (real deep depths will overshoot some)
UHS v1.4 or Magnum Opus: http://www.gamefront.com/files/21093845/Depth_Keeping_Problem_TheDarkWraith_zip

I'm working on versions now that will require you to have one knot of speed to hold depth (no hummingbird effect)


To install: unzip straight to MODS folder and enable via JSGME.

:|\\
Thank you very much DW. does that mean the boat willl not have a tendecy to sink if @1knot below170m?

[TheDarkWraith]

Thank you very much DW. does that mean the boat willl not have a tendecy to sink if @1knot below170m?

You can be all stop and not sink at that depth

[schnorchel]

Thank you, DW. if the boot goes to 200m for exaple, what will happen? 1 knot is enough to prevent she from sinking?

[TheDarkWraith]

Thank you, DW. if the boot goes to 200m for exaple, what will happen? 1 knot is enough to prevent she from sinking?

shouldn't have to have any speed to hold depth. I never tested it that deep though.

[Kark]

Thank you very much,sir!

I am new to modding and apparently this one works fine with the rather tiny "mod soup" of 9 i have installed. (so far)

Nochmals vielen Dank!

[Krauter]

Was just going to ask if you could make one that required you to maintain steerage but I see you're one step ahead of the game! Thanks TDW!

[Trevally.]

added to download section http://www.subsim.com/radioroom/downloads.php?do=file&id=3877:yeah:

[Macardigan]

This MOD has implemented in the last newUIs 7.3.0 or later must be activated?

[Fifi]

I think you don't need it anymore with latest TDW mods :yep:

[thadgar]

Dang! I just discovered a new problem – but Darkwraith already has the solution – again!

They should call this “Darkwraith Hunter 5”
Thanks for getting there first (6 years ago) TDW!

Now I'll have to turn the Non-Merchant detection Max/Min up to 1.0
Wish me luck :)

[Meereswolf]

Sorry, this link doesn't work.

[THEBERBSTER]

A Warm Welcome To The Subsim Community > Meereswolf
Subsim <> Make A Donation <> See The Benefits <> Support The Community (http://www.subsim.com/radioroom/showpost.php?p=2027002&postcount=1)
SH3 – 4 - 5 Tutorials And Other Information Links In My Signature Below

If you are not running a STEAM download version then your best option is to install TDW's Generic File Patcher which amongst all the patches has the fix you are looking for.
you can find the download link and full instructions on this and many others in my SH5 tutorials.

Download Link>
Depth_Keeping_Problem_TheDarkWraith > Enable Last JSGME (http://www.mediafire.com/file/37jrccdnvfjhove/Depth_Keeping_Problem_TheDarkWraith.zip)