H.Sie and the Track Angle [Archive] - SUBSIM Radio Room Forums

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makman94

12-18-10, 06:13 PM

H.sie ,

i know that you probably are about to get exhuasted (too sad that all - exept Stiebler - the ''hex editors'' of forum have left you alone to this more than promising effort) but i have to ask if it is possible to add at sh3 the track angle dial.

the code for the track angle is allready written in sh4's and sh5's code and ,as this dial is not interacting with player(it is just for reading the track angle), i assume (or..better say...i hope) that it will be a matter of just adding some lines to sh3's code

i open this new thread for track angle for avoiding this request to be ''vanished'' into all the other requests

for you (or whoever hex editor wants) to look at it when you got some time or...will

thank you

h.sie

12-19-10, 03:20 PM

makman94

12-20-10, 03:19 AM

Hey makman, mate.

You seem to over-estimate my abilities and possibilities. Only with Assembler, and without SDK I cannot add new things and even less graphical stuff. I can only modify simple dependencies between variables, as you could see in all the fixes I made so far. I am sorry for disappointing you again.

By the way: I am not an HexEditor. :)

h.sie

eh H.Sie ! surely you are NOT disappointing me ...don't even think about it ! i am 100% fan and user of your great achievements so far :up:

i will send you a pm for making some things more clear about the track angle

By the way: what are you ? (i am joking...:DL)

bye

edit: what is going on with the forum ? where are the english ?

h.sie

12-20-10, 03:57 AM

could you please post a sceenie from sh4?

greetings, h.sie

makman94

12-20-10, 05:13 AM

here you are (the first one is for us subs and the second for u-boats made from Karamazovnew) :
pic1
http://img824.imageshack.us/img824/8937/46135026.png
pic2
http://img69.imageshack.us/i/31474842.jpg/

(http://img69.imageshack.us/img69/3580/31474842.jpg)

h.sie

12-20-10, 01:16 PM

Thanks for the pictures, mate.

What I don't understand: What is that dial for? I never missed it.

makman94

12-21-10, 03:56 AM

Thanks for the pictures, mate.

What I don't understand: What is that dial for? I never missed it.

hello H.Sie

track angle dial is for showing you the angle between torpedo's run course and target's course .

when you are positioned for a 90 degrees attack(angle between your course and target course is 90) ,the track dial has no use as you can achieve a 90 degrees impact angle shot when your gyroangle shows the 0 degrees (as this is the most common attack set up ...that is why track angle has no interest and many players never 'missed' it)

the ideal is this angle (torpedo track or impact angle) to be always 90 degrees for many reasons.this dial(track angle dial) comes to use when you are not set uped for a 90 degrees attack .some senarios for this may be that you didn't have the time to get at a 90 degrees own course attack run or maybe there also another target coming with a different course than the one you positioned for. to aim to that second target without changing your course is where you need the track dial.
you setting up your tdc based on second target's data (course ,speed ,aproximate range) and then you are not looking at gyroangle dial anymore but you are looking at track angle dial and waiting to show you 90 degrees ...that will be the moment to fire.

the 90 degrees impact angle is very important for many reasons .three main reasons are : 1) becuase of the detonators the torps had back then ,there was the possibility for torp not to explode if this angle were greater than 90 +- 20 degrees (so good track angles are 70 to 110 degrees)
2) the distance that torp has to travel for a 90 degrees impact angle is minimum and this is reducing the possibilities for torp to miss becuase of some not so acurate target's data(distance-speed-course)
3) when torp is running on a 90 degrees impact course ,is 'looking' the full length of ship so target looks 'bigger' looking through torp's ''eyes'' and this ,also, reducing the possibilities for torp to miss becuase of some not so acurate target's data.

now, if you are asking me if it is neseccery to import this dial in game i will say to you that the answer is NO ! that is becuase we can calculate with our mind(and plotting) the gyro angle that we need to have in order to set the torpedo to a 90 degrees impact angle course run so this dial is there just to make our life easier and nothing more than this.
and another reason for this dial to be imported is becuase it was there on the real thing
...so if we can get it in-game ....i say ...why not ?

h.sie

12-21-10, 09:55 AM

LGN1

12-21-10, 01:49 PM

Hi makman,

here is a screenshot of my personal (non-historical) TDC which I made for myself from other TDC mods. It shows you the torpedo course, allows you to enter a ship's course and not only the AOB, and also allows you to see the track angle :yep:

http://img211.imageshack.us/img211/7454/tdc.th.jpg (http://img211.imageshack.us/i/tdc.jpg/)

Uploaded with ImageShack.us (http://imageshack.us)

Hitman

12-21-10, 02:54 PM

here is a screenshot of my personal (non-historical) TDC which I made for myself from other TDC mods. It shows you the torpedo course, allows you to enter a ship's course and not only the AOB, and also allows you to see the track angle :yep:

Hey that's very similar to a full screen TDC I have been working on, only mine follows the historically correct layout when possible. :up:

How did you manage to get a dial for target course??

LGN1

12-21-10, 05:57 PM

Hey that's very similar to a full screen TDC I have been working on, only mine follows the historically correct layout when possible. :up:

How did you manage to get a dial for target course??

Hi Hitman,

as you know bearing & own course & AOB determines target course. You have access to all three variables, however, I know only a method for showing a variable that depends on two variables. To circumvent the problem you have to set the bearing to 0 when you enter the course (you could also have a dial with different bearings, but in this case the dial is too cluttered).

It's not a perfect solution, but it works fine for me. As I said, you just have to set bearing=0 before you enter the course. If you are interested in more details I can send you the menu.ini and dials.cfg. IIRC, the real German TDC did not offer the possibility to enter the target course, did it?

Cheers, LGN1

makman94

12-22-10, 01:53 AM

Makman, mate!

I really don't like to say NO, especially to a guy like you that also spent much time to make a good sim.

BUT: Every little fix takes weeks to be programmed, tested and so on, since Hex-Coding has a huge potential for program crashes or side-effects.

I have only few time for modding because of certain reasons, and I ask for understanding, that I focus on essential issues.

Greetings,
h.sie

Thats ok H.Sie,sure....i understand !

although i have no idea on hex editing ,i can imagine how much 'painfull' it might be. thats why at my first post i told you to look at it when (and if ) you got some time or...will .

anyway, no matter what, i must thank you for listening

Hi makman,

here is a screenshot of my personal (non-historical) TDC which I made for myself from other TDC mods. It shows you the torpedo course, allows you to enter a ship's course and not only the AOB, and also allows you to see the track angle :yep:

http://img211.imageshack.us/img211/7454/tdc.th.jpg (http://img211.imageshack.us/i/tdc.jpg/)

Uploaded with ImageShack.us (http://imageshack.us)

you know LGN1...it is not the first time that you gladly surprising me with the 'secrets' that you are 'hiding' in your HD !:yep:

if i get it right ...you mean that you managed to have a working dial for the track angle ? ....mate ,this is wonderfull news !
i was trying to get this dial in game but there is no code for calculating the track angle in sh3's code.so ,i gave up trying as it was needed someone to add the code first but you say that you managed to get it working ?if yes...then please share all the needed files for the track angle dial ! i am looking forward to see it in action.:yep:

about the target's course dial ...i can't see what would be the use of such a dial(as once you enter the aob to tdc...you have ,in fact, 'feed' it with the target's course) but this is also something that i would like to see :yep:

amazing achievements LGN1 ! :up:

bravo !

h.sie

12-22-10, 04:12 AM

I would also like to have a look at LGN1's hard disk. Maybe I should implant a little sniffer in the next sh3.exe.

LGN1

12-22-10, 10:27 AM

Hi makman,

I am not hiding anything. I am just not releasing all my mods done for myself because of

a) they might not be 100% fool-proof
b) they can be difficult to install
c) I am too lazy to document all things (modding should remain a hobby and not become an administrative job)
d) they use input from many different modders and I doubt it's worth asking all of them for permission for a small mod.

But as you can see, I am quite willing to share the information/details.

You are right that the target course dial is not really needed because you control it via the AOB. However, I personally 'think' in terms of target course. That's the variable I determine during shadowing... In most cases it's constant (during a zigzag leg) and independent from what I am doing with my boat. So, I think it's the more 'natural' variable. Especially for non-90° shots the AOB is not that intuitive.

The situation is completely different if you do not determine the target's course, e.g., if you have to shoot quickly. In this case the AOB is a much better variable because you can 'see' it through the scope, not like the target's course.

To be exact, the track angle dial in my mod is a torpedo course dial. However, if you know the target's course (and you can read it in the other dial), it allows you to see the track angle. You do not have to do any math in your head. It's not a perfect track angle dial, but it works ok for me and I doubt you can do it better without modding hard-coded stuff.

Cheers, LGN1

LGN1

12-22-10, 04:32 PM

makman94

12-23-10, 04:32 AM

Here is a small explanation:

http://img810.imageshack.us/img810/5010/tdcv.th.jpg (http://img810.imageshack.us/i/tdcv.jpg/)

The 'track angle dial' is basically realized by a gyro angle dial on top of a ship's course dial. You just have to read the degrees between the torpedo course dial and the target course (I have not added all 360°, but just indicated the area 90°/270° +-20°, i.e., the value of the target's course should be in the green area when you are shooting).

hi LGN1,

i didn't said,seriously, that you are hiding data . i was joking but it is my english that make these misunderstandings ! (i have to 'cut' the....jokes ...i know)

now, about your 'track dial' . if i get it right the difference between the needle and the 'red line' (this 'red line' together with the two red 'ticks' at +-15 must be controled and setted by player ...right? ) is the gyroangle and the difference between needle and target's course is the track angle...right ?

yes, it is much more complicated from having a track angle but i am guessing that if the player get used to it will become ,indeed, a 'track angle' dial . as we don't have ,yet,the code for track angle in sh3's code i think that you made a very good and very clever approach to this LGN1

still i need to see how all these are working (and updating ) in action but i think that i got your point !

good job LGN1 ....really good job !:up:

Volk2

12-23-10, 06:16 AM

I am not hiding anything. I am just not releasing all my mods done for myself because of ...

H.sie is right, someone must send some hackers on your HD, LGN1 :arrgh!: I was waiting for such a TDC from Hitman, but it looks like it will be not released, neither by Hitman, nor by you. But I understand the problems, especially with obtaining all the big and tiny permissions. It is more than possible that much more people have some interesting mods only on their private HD's because of all the understandable hassle with releasing them.

Hitman

12-23-10, 08:19 AM

I was waiting for such a TDC from Hitman, but it looks like it will be not released, neither by Hitman, nor by you.

No, no, I'm still working in it, but it's just that progress is very slow due to other commitments. But the project is not abandoned, mainly because I myself want to have it :DL It will be part of my revised GUI, but it will take some time before I can start showing screens with some progress.

The idea is to produce a mod that can be compatible with any other mod by simply replacing the full menu.ini section that deals with the TDC. It will hence require a bit of copy & paste from the user, but nothing problematic.

Volk2

12-23-10, 10:45 AM

Oh, this is great news!

makman94

12-23-10, 11:12 AM

.... I was waiting for such a TDC from Hitman, but it looks like it will be not released, neither by Hitman, nor by you....

@волк : this look at tdc is allready released long time ago . Mikhayl was the first who had the idea to introduce it in his gui called ACM and later Karamazovnew reworked it in his gui called ACM reloaded . LGN1 just added these two dials (target's course and torpedo's course) that this thread is talking about . so have a look at these two guies and you will see it

probably Hitman is talking to you about a reworked new look on TDC which will be similar to this one