View Full Version : Broken compass on VIIc tower
I'm using Flakmonkey's VIIc with lightmap and I have such a problem:
http://i53.tinypic.com/k3qjhx.jpg
The axis of the compass is in bad place, so it go outside of the frame when turning. It's probably a well known bug, but I didn't found any fix for it.
The two compass on the turm7x use the same place on the .tga and they are inverted in the 3d model UV. I fixed my turms rotating the UV map for one of the compass (is also possible to rotate the 3d model itself). Them both will end pointing to the same correct direction.
BTW the type 9 turms have only one compasson the deck, seems that the place for the second is just empty. I put the second compass on my type 9 turms too, but i donīt know if this is correct (historicaly) or not.
But i donīt have (yet) the FM's light mapped 7c turm, so i guess that mine turms arenīt usefull for you.;)
Thank for the answer. Could you be more precise? Here is what I found:
http://i52.tinypic.com/207rej6.jpg
And the 3d model for it:
http://i55.tinypic.com/288qe5t.jpg
I not fully understand what should I do now?
Hi волк,
the problem is the geomtry of the model "Turm7c_1_ac buso 1_High":
http://www.mediafire.com/imgbnc.php/a9c9d6881133a3df1b3c65a754259e256g.jpg
the model is not centerd in all dimensions. So you must export this model (with S3D) an center it - for example with "wings3D" (freeware).
Then import it and adjust translation and rotaion parameters. On the second scrennshot, you can see this new values:
http://www.mediafire.com/imgbnc.php/4504c0f3065afbcd248f832e474f1d526g.jpg
Sad to say, that the "Turm7c_2_Hd.dat" has the same problem.
Greetings
rowi58
@волк and Rowi,
The entire problem is this:
1. a lot of turms have this problem,
2. some big mods opted to adjust only the .tga, making only the main (the big one and more "useful") deck compass correct. The one in the pannel, near the telegraf continues showing the wrong uboat head direction (GWX as an example)
3. To really fix it, you need to make what I said above. I too use wings3D, a very simple and powerfull 3d tool, but you need to learn with that old tryal&error way...Itīs not possible to fix this bug with S3D only.
4. What Rowi said is also true...some compass are also off placed a bit, what is another problem, easily fixeable with S3D only.:up:
5. I have all them fixed for all turms...but you know, we have a lot of version of turms on a lot of mods, so...
Thanks for all the answers. I'm after a system reinstall so it will take time to test the proposed fix.
I have all them fixed for all turms...but you know, we have a lot of version of turms on a lot of mods, so...
But the 3d model of the compass in "Turm7c_1_ac buso 1_High" node in Turm7c_1_hd.dat should be the same in those mods, its not often changed. Could you maybe upload your exported, fixed 3d model, so I could import it to "Turm7c_1_ac buso 1_High" node, or at least I could open it in wings3d and see what you have changed? I've downloaded wings3d but its still some black magic to me.
----
Or there is another way to "fix" it - what to delete to disable the turning of this compass? This way it would be only a static graphics attached to one place. It will not correctly work in this way, but it also will not ruin the immersion.
Now I know why I couldn't understand your propositions for fixes - my compass is perfectly centered. The problem is other. I've tested it in game by making a circle with u-boat watching the compass and it is in right place, nicely turning. But as you see on the screenshoot in the first post, it looks like sometimes it jumps away from its place :hmmm: This screenshoot was from campaign game, so in the middle of a long patrol. I have no idea now what can be the reason of this?
These old known problems have been solved in the old forgotten mods a long time ago...
P.S.
...
I understand, to write such replies senselessly, therefore we will allow to invent bicycles for "the new wave" of modders.
P.P.S.
If you use original Turm7c_3_deck.tga, ... do Unwrap UV in Turm7c_3_int_coning7c_High for rear compass... If you use changed TGA (rotated compass-image), do Unwrap UV for forward compass... in 3D Editor. :03:
Now I know why I couldn't understand your propositions for fixes - my compass is perfectly centered. The problem is other. I've tested it in game by making a circle with u-boat watching the compass and it is in right place, nicely turning. But as you see on the screenshoot in the first post, it looks like sometimes it jumps away from its place :hmmm: This screenshoot was from campaign game, so in the middle of a long patrol. I have no idea now what can be the reason of this?
LOL... and just now I noticed that the bug that you was talking about was just the off place problem and not the head direction...:DL:damn:
Well, at least all this discussion bring some more light on the matter.
@Anvart: yes this is an old problem, but my game yet had them broked in some turms (inverted direction between the 2 compass). And i have GWX3.0, WAC, NYGM...all them with similar problems...
FIREWALL
10-13-10, 09:23 PM
Not wanting to mess with all of your discussion but, I showed this thread to a friend so he could see what you modders go thru for us.
Thx Guys. :salute:
...
, but my game yet had them broked in some turms (inverted direction between the 2 compass). And i have GWX3.0, WAC, NYGM...all them with similar problems...
:DL
All these old problems (dial's centre of co-ordinate and UV unwraping for compass) were discussed and have been solved long time ago...
I have already explained to волк, why i not wanted to correct UV error for GWX and others... and i wrote to Kpt. L. and Privateer about this problem (why are not corrected) for GWX 3... but ... "но воз и ныне там..."
... and i have removed these phrases (in previous post)... not to irritate anybody...
Solution to the problem in the first post:
It's exactly as rowi58 said - the compass was not centered... not in Turm7c_1_hd.dat, but in Turm7c_8_hd.dat :doh:
http://i53.tinypic.com/2lo1yfa.jpg
At first I've found similar turm in Turm7c_5_hd.dat, so I've fixed it there, but it didn't help. I didn't know that the game is using three files (Turm7c_1_hd.dat, Turm7c_5_hd.dat, Turm7c_8_hd.dat) for one turm :doh:
I didn't know how to center the 3d model in wings3d, so I've just exported the good, centered model from Turm7c_1_hd.dat, imported it in Turm7c_8_hd.dat, and copied the node positioning from the good compass.
The good thing is, that I know now how to repair it. The bad - I cannot share it because of the size of the files and as I see, the GWX external compassed are broken in this aspect, so it's a fix that must be repeated with change of u-boat type.
SquareSteelBar
10-14-10, 06:01 AM
...I didn't know that the game is using three files (Turm7c_1_hd.dat, Turm7c_1_hd.dat, Turm7c_1_hd.dat) for one turm ...No, no, no - the game uses only one file for one turm...
Tell me from what mod the affected turm files come, I'll try to fix them for you...
No, no, no - the game uses only one file for one turm...
I cannot agree with you. Certainly the game is using Turm7c_1_hd.dat and Turm7c_8_hd.dat at the same time in my campaign - I've had to fix the compass in 7c_8 to see it in game, and I see at the same time the lightmap that is in 7c_1.
Tell me from what mod the affected turm files come, I'll try to fix them for you...
Thanks! But it's now happily repaired :up:
Hi волк,
just for your information. Turm7c_1_hd.dat up to Turm7c_4_hd.dat are the "original" Turms by Stock SH3 and are only used for playable type VII C Uboats (see Basic.cfg)
Turm7c_5_hd.dat up to Turm7c_8_hd.dat are clones of the first four turms, used only for the AI-Uboat type "NSS_Uboat7c41", made by serguto and rubini (see rubini's "HarborTraffic 1.46 MOD"). So you can vary your AI-Uboats VII as you want.
Greetings
rowi58
Turm7c_5_hd.dat up to Turm7c_8_hd.dat are clones of the first four turms, used only for the AI-Uboat type "NSS_Uboat7c41", made by serguto and rubini (see rubini's "HarborTraffic 1.46 MOD"). So you can vary your AI-Uboats VII as you want.
It is possible, but now I completely don't understand why only a fix of the compass in Turm7c_8_hd.dat repaired the compass on my 7c in campaign game? The compass in Turm7c_1_hd.dat was good, but still bad in game. Only when I've fixed it in Turm7c_8_hd.dat the problem was repaired in game :doh:
SquareSteelBar
10-14-10, 01:11 PM
Maybe an ID conflict caused by bad cloning.
http://www.subsim.com/radioroom//showthread.php?t=168304
http://www.subsim.com/radioroom//showthread.php?t=168304
:yeah: It explains a lot.
Yeah...old issues with new lights in a new moment where we have a lot of more knowledge on Sh3 files...This is a very good discussion to we grow a bit more on sh3 mod work.:up:
Sergbuto made the first Ai uboats before Pack3d arrived on the scene. At first his files introduced that old frozen dials save reload bug on sh3. Clearly a ID conflict that was impossible to tarck that time. Later we learn that deleting the .cam from the AI turms files solved the problem. But a lot of others IDs conflicts remain since that time. And note that this isn't only with Ai uboats but also for any cloned plane or ship on the game made later using pack 3d. Obviously the Ai uboats ID conflicts are a more big and noticiable problem.
Some time ago (2 years ago) I recloned all my Ai uboats and turms and also some new planes. As the cloned ships were so much, i opted to make a new campaign without them, using only a few ones, using only HT 1.47. The final result was a ultimate sh3 (with all the accumulated improvements) with a basic but good campaign and the better: faster (like stock) load times!:DL
It's possible to clone correctly units using S3D and Pack 3D at same time. Firts use pack3D, them refine with S3D. S3D site have a good tutorial on how to "clone" with S3D.
http://s3d.skwas.com/manual/remap/
All this is just to say that a reclone "task force" could be a good idea for us, to we have a real stable modded sh3 disposable to our community. Perhaps isn't so much units for each one if we divide the work to be done.;)
Madox58
10-14-10, 05:57 PM
I just checked a fresh install of GWX 3.
The Turms mentioned have different ID's in GWX 3.
I just checked a fresh install of GWX 3.
The Turms mentioned have different ID's in GWX 3.
I'm using Flakmonkey's Turm7c_1_hd.dat with lightmap. Maybe this is the problem.
It clearly was id problem, because the compass was ok in trening/single mission (that is, taken from Turm7c_1_hd.dat), but bad in campaign game (that is, taken from Turm7c_8_hd.dat), when the AI u-boat files were also used.
It's possible to clone correctly units using S3D and Pack 3D at same time. Firts use pack3D, them refine with S3D. S3D site have a good tutorial on how to "clone" with S3D.
I tried it yesterday, but I was afraid to use s3d remap id's on ai turms because I don't know what files are using also those ids, and searching for each id with "search for file id" is too much work, as LGN1 said in the other thread.
Madox58
10-15-10, 05:53 PM
The problems with ID's of Subs Turms was fixed long ago with GWX as I recall.
I also remember finding that Pack3D does not do complete Cloneing,
and hand edited many ID's in GWX.
(More then I care to remember!)
The massive amounts of new mods increases the problem of ID conflict
with each and every mod done!
And it will only get worse as time goes by.
Extreme testing is the only way to find this problem at this time.
And I doubt that a program could be written to check for this issue
in a 'Modder useable' way that would make sense.
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