SH III or SH IV? [Archive] - SUBSIM Radio Room Forums

nappy

05-12-10, 06:37 AM

Hi all, ive been away for quite some time and ive got a couple of questions.
I have currently SH III and SH IV in the drawer and im considering which one to install.
(SH V is not an option due to the current DRM scheme)

So.. the questions is.. which one should i install ? what im looking for is stability, having a good time, mods and being able to plot the torpedo solution the old way with calculaters and rulers.

Any reason for installing one over the other?

Any and all help appriciated.

nappy.

ps: i apologize if this is not the right forum

convoy hunter

05-12-10, 06:44 AM

you are at the right forum.
I would reccommend SHIII because it is more realistic. Also download the GWX it will make the game even better.
SHIV is for graphics with little realism.

sharkbit

05-12-10, 08:23 AM

Ummmmm....both?
There's no rule that you have to have only on SH game installed.

Install 'em both and play which ever one you're in the mood for.

:)

nappy

05-12-10, 08:32 AM

heh, as much as id like to, my computer time is somewhat limited, being a family mand and all, so im afraid im going to have to stick to one.. im also one of those guys that focus strictly on game at a time. having 2 careers in 2 different games would somewhat ruin my
immersion factor :88)

Realism is important for me so it seems SH III is the way to go :)

nappy

Ummmmm....both?
There's no rule that you have to have only on SH game installed.

Install 'em both and play which ever one you're in the mood for.

:)

Rockin Robbins

05-12-10, 08:42 AM

SHIII without wolfpacks is as real as SH4 without water. Realism is no reason to choose between the games because neither can claim much at all. The only thing to choose between them is gameplay quality and they are both about equal.

So it really comes down to whether you are interested in playing U-Boats in the Atlantic only or whether you are interested in playing both in the same game. Frankly, I have both of them and say that unless you do you're missing something important. The price is right!

With SH5 you are at the mercy of a company that requires you to be online with one if their miserly three servers for the entire world. The game won't operate unless you're logged on, which means that when they disconnect those servers, guess what? Your game has been pirated! Other game companies have blazed the trail, forcing upgrades and just abandoning customers who purchased games in good faith after periods as short as a year. Ubi is just imitating success. Don't be a fool. Give SH5 a pass.

nappy

05-12-10, 08:50 AM

quick reply before i leave work. As much as i admire and understand the battle
against softwar pirates, i will not buy a piece of software which requires me to be online when playing a single player game. It is a decision i have made, and will stand by it regardless :stare:

nappy

Don't be a fool. Give SH5 a pass.

Bilge_Rat

05-12-10, 09:04 AM

SH3 and SH4, modded, are equal in terms of realism and gameplay. Although the graphics are nicer in SH4.

SH5 will eventually surpass both of them, but it still requires work.

I have a campaign going on in SH4 now with RFB/RSRDC and it is very sweet..:up:

It really comes out to whether you want to play as U.S. or German sub commander (Sh4) or a just a German sub commander (SH3).

Stronghold

05-12-10, 09:31 AM

SH III with GWX 3.0 supermod installed, this is my suggestion.

trotter

05-12-10, 10:03 AM

Funny, I came here to ask the same question, although my situation is a bit different in the fact that I've never played SH4. Used to have SH3 GWX installed on my old computer several years ago, so I know what to expect from that at least.

Currently I'm giving up on SH5 until a supermod comes out.

I'm favoring just buying a cheap version of SH4, did not know there was an ATO mod, that pretty much seals my decision. Perhaps this is a question for the SH4 modding forum, but can someone briefly give the pros and cons of each SH4 supermod? Or is there one consensus pick, like GWX is with SH3.

Sailor Steve

05-12-10, 10:29 AM

SH3: Five years of modding. Any of the supermods gives an amazing experience. I stick with it mainly because SH3 Commander adds so much to the experience, on top of GWX's looks, feel and play.

SH4: Improved graphics and crew management, including the 'Battle Station' function, which really does make a difference in the way it feels. Many more improved items, including better TC and the way the radio messages are displayed. Three years of modding has vastly improved the game, though there are still some bugs which can't be fixed.

I play both, for the good that is in both of them.

BillBam

05-12-10, 11:57 AM

trotter

05-12-10, 12:44 PM

BillBam, couldn't I just buy the regular version and patch to 1.5?

Bilge_Rat

05-12-10, 01:17 PM

BillBam, couldn't I just buy the regular version and patch to 1.5?

unfortunately, the last free patch for the regular game is 1.4. To get the 1.5 patch, you have to buy sh4 + the U-Boat addon. With SH4 Gold, you get both.

regarding the supermods, the two main ones (for U.S. Subs) are TMO and RFB. Both are good, I prefer RFB since it is still being worked on by modders.

to that, you can add RSRDC ("Run Silent, Run Deep") which overhauls the entire U.S. Pacific campaign in 41-45 to be more realistic.

There are also supermods for the German U-Boats in SH4, but I am not familiar with those.

trotter

05-12-10, 01:40 PM

Thanks for the info Bilge.

I came across this thread here:

http://www.subsim.com/radioroom/showthread.php?t=157853

that has a list of supermods compatible with 1.4. Recent updates nonwithstanding (as I imagine there is no more support for any 1.4 supermods), are these mods considerably worse than their 1.5 counterparts?

For example, since there is no more support for TMO, I'd imagine the 1.4 compatible TMO and the 1.5 compatible TMO are pretty much identical. Same for RSRD..would those be correct assumptions?

Bilge_Rat

05-12-10, 01:47 PM

I dont remember what the 1.5 patch fixed, but you can probably track down a changelog.

I believe RSRDC should run more or less the same, RFB would have less content. You could also look at Webster's "Game only fixes" mod or TMO if you will stick with 1.4.

searching the SH4 mod forum should provide more info.

BillBam

05-12-10, 02:06 PM

Frumpkis

05-12-10, 02:42 PM

I have both games and I prefer playing SH4 (with the Real Fleet Boat and Run Silent, Run Deep mods). Here are a few reasons:

The graphics in SH4 are very good, especially the environmental stuff, like sea and sky. It does take a stronger computer to run at full graphic detail than SHIII, so that might be a consideration if you have an older computer.
Radar was more advanced in the U.S. fleet boats, and it was the primary method of acquiring targets. I like using the combination of radar and sonar when plotting an attack, especially when an "end around" is required to set up a convoy strike. If you prefer working mainly off the hydrophone, you may like SHIII better.
The Pacific map is much more tactically interesting to me, with all those little islands and choke points for navigation lanes. The map is dynamic too, with shifting areas of control between the Japanese and the Allies as the war progresses and Japan is gradually pushed back to the home islands. The European campaign map is much more static by comparison, and I end up always going to the same areas to hunt convoys.
SH4 has the occasional special mission in addition to tonnage goals, like dropping off insurgent supplies, or picking up downed air crew, or photographing harbors. The RSRD mod makes this even better.

About the only thing I don't like in SH4 is the long transit times to base, even with time compression, due to the size of the theater.

KL-alfman

05-12-10, 02:53 PM

Bilge_Rat

05-12-10, 03:40 PM

have only played SH3+GWX so far, but I'm really looking forward to install SH4.
water, environment and ships look so much better and once I like to get all the "luxury" (ice-cream!!) on a fleet-boat.
(SH5 does not interest me at all)

Unfortunately, no ice cream machine mod, but it's fun taking a spin in a Fleet Boat just to see how the other half lives.

Once you have used 10 torpedo tubes (6 bow+4 stern) just to take out one target, you will never go back...:arrgh!:

roverdog

05-12-10, 03:43 PM

It's been a long time since I've played SH3, although not with all the new MODS.

I prefer SHIV though, because I'm on the allied side. My father was a WWII vet as well as my uncle. Playing the German side in a WWII game just isn't my cup of tea.

Kpt. Lehmann

05-12-10, 03:51 PM

SHIII without wolfpacks is as real as SH4 without water.

Nah, given that most U-boat engagements were executed in the absence of other assisting boats, it isn't much of a loss in the grand scheme of things. We've just had to settle for an imperfect arrangement.

I don't have anything good to say about SH5/Ubisoft's DRM... so I won't comment about that.

My thoughts are, that as long as its got diesel and electric engines/mostors... as a player, you are well taken care of whatever your taste is, be it ATO or PTO regardless of SH5's current state or existence.

Admiral8Q

05-12-10, 04:37 PM

Actually Ducimus is still working on TMO and will be releasing a final 2.0 version in the coming weeks. Since he is one man working on a huge super mod it gets less updates but he has done a great job.
Yes, Trigger Maru Overhauled is what I like. It's much harded then stock sh4, (which is good) but I don't like how airplane contacts are set up, but overall I really enjoy it.:salute:

As for the choice between sh3 and sh4, I prefere sh4 because of the vast territory and islands you can explore. Plus my first subsims were Silent hunter 2 and before that Silent Service 2. There are U-boat campaigns in sh4 also:up:

KL-alfman

05-12-10, 04:54 PM

10 torpedo tubes (6 bow+4 stern)

this I call fire-power! :D

(felt unbeatable with 4+2 in my type IXB .....)

Admiral8Q

05-13-10, 12:38 AM

this I call fire-power! :D

(felt unbeatable with 4+2 in my type IXB .....)

Hey, I miss the "Narwhal"

magic452

05-13-10, 01:30 AM

I a fleetboat man all the way.
First in my option a Fleetboat is a better fighting machine than a U boat (ducks and runs for cover)
Second the PTO is a far more interesting theater. Many more great battles and invasions. You can participate in all of them if you study history.

Get the U boat addon if possible, it's worth it. The 1.4 mods are a little short of the 1.5 mods.

Sh4 is very stable and you can do all the figuring you want for plotting and firing solutions.
With TMO you have a very challenging game.
With RFB a very realistic one. With RSRD all the invasions and battles are recreated very well.

There are a lot of guys that don't like SH4 mostly because it's Fleetboats.
They love their U boats.

Magic

Rockin Robbins

05-13-10, 06:47 AM

My thoughts are, that as long as its got diesel and electric engines/mostors... as a player, you are well taken care of whatever your taste is, be it ATO or PTO regardless of SH5's current state or existence.

+2 on that one. Let's put it this way. If either SH3 or SH4 were alone in the world, I'd be very happy with either of them. I think computer hardware has to progress to the next level before we're able to properly configure wolfpack attacks or some of the more complex parts of submarine simulation. What is much worse than no wolfpacks? Badly executed wolfpacks.

One of the reasons SH3 and SH4 are so similar is that hardware didn't progress much between the two releases. There was an increase in graphics capability and that is what we got.

Now with SH5 we have a "solution" without a problem. Computers are just about the same as they were with SH4 and there are no awesome new capabilities to exploit. Therefore we get more of what we have plus a heaping helping of badly executed "The Sims" and the Sword of Damocles three servers which can be shut down at any time without notice. This is called progress nowdays I guess.

WarlordATF

05-13-10, 07:36 AM

I keep SH3 and SH4 on my hard drive. There are things about each that i love/hate, but i still enjoy playing both. My SH3 is stock, no mods at all. I play that once in awhile, but most of the time if i want to command a U-Boat i'll just use my Operation Monsun install.

My SH4 is heavily modded, i have spent many long nights tweaking,editing and debugging it and my install is still a long way from being finished. Instead of just downloading a megamod and being happy to play it, i downloaded all the megamods and picked them apart so i could use just the parts i wanted.

I would advise anyone not to do this, you will spend far to much time modding and much less time actually playing the game!

Things i really like about SH3 are the crew member control and detail and since most of my Subsimming has been for the Allies, its kinda edcational for me to see things from the German side.

Now SH4 has many things i like, The Water looks really good (with mods), Its a Fleetboat, so it takes me back to SH1 and i have some knowledge of the history. I really prefer the Pacific theatre, its huge and there are so many cool places to see/visit.

So i have to say that I prefer SH4 over SH3, but i wouldn't say either is better than the other.

Bilge_Rat

05-13-10, 07:51 AM

Now with SH5 we have a "solution" without a problem. Computers are just about the same as they were with SH4 and there are no awesome new capabilities to exploit. Therefore we get more of what we have plus a heaping helping of badly executed "The Sims" and the Sword of Damocles three servers which can be shut down at any time without notice. This is called progress nowdays I guess.

RR, we all know your feelings about SH5, but why do you have to drag it into every thread? Aren't tempers already frayed enough here at Subsim? Could we agree to keep discussions about SH5 on the SH5 forum ?

Diopos

05-13-10, 10:34 AM

RR, we all know your feelings about SH5, but why do you have to drag it into every thread? Aren't tempers already frayed enough here at Subsim? Could we agree to keep discussions about SH5 on the SH5 forum ?

Cmon Bilge,
members are entitled to post whatever they wish within forum rules (obligatory), good manners (optional) and good humor (hopefully). In the SH5 forum, if you "rant"about /critisize the game it is almost certain that another member (fed up with so called "SH5 bashing") will suggest to post elsewhere. Well this suforum is "elsewhere".

Bilge_Rat

05-13-10, 11:27 AM

Cmon Bilge,
members are entitled to post whatever they wish within forum rules (obligatory), good manners (optional) and good humor (hopefully). In the SH5 forum, if you "rant"about /critisize the game it is almost certain that another member (fed up with so called "SH5 bashing") will suggest to post elsewhere. Well this suforum is "elsewhere".

I respect RR, love to hear his thoughts on SH4 and agree with him on many issues. I don't agree with him on SH5, but I respect his opinion. Members are of course able to post where they wish, within the rules and no one is obliged to follow my reccommendantions (no one does anyway :ping:).

However, I think we all see what a zoo the SH5 forum is turning into, (without blaming any side). I like to drop by the SH4 forum to discuss SH4 and get away from the madness. I just think every one will be better served if we keep all the SH5 ranting and raving (again without pointing fingers at one side more than another) on the SH5 forum and not have it spill over in every other forum.