Using OM mod and omegu, how do you manually shoot torps?

[Bloomstomb]

Ive been trying to figure this out for about a hour. Cant find any documentation on it for shooting torps manualy.

I can get the range, angle, but when I try to time the speed it tells me there is not enough data.

Would appreciate a tip here.

[lurker_hlb3]

Ive been trying to figure this out for about a hour. Cant find any documentation on it for shooting torps manualy.

I can get the range, angle, but when I try to time the speed it tells me there is not enough data.

Would appreciate a tip here.


I don't have time right now, but I'll write something up tomorrow

[Bloomstomb]

OK thanks, I appreciate it. Hopefully someone else can jump in here and do the dirty work for ya. You gotta be busy with the mods :)

I might be missing some buttons too. Maybe thats the problem. I have to hit the N key to get the manual out, theres no tab. Maybe the resolution is cutting off part of the screen or something.

[lurker_hlb3]

I use this same procedure:

http://www.subsim.com/radioroom/showpost.php?p=1352830&postcount=3

[Bloomstomb]

Lurker is there any way to get the speed of the target from periscope view, or does it have to be done from the attack map.


For example, I dont see this.

"From the attack periscope, you have those two panels on either side of the view window that give you the torpedo settings. On the right panel there is a purple light, you can click that to lock and unlock the torpedo setting dials."


The only thing I have is 2 pullout thingies on the RIGHT side of the torp window. They are both the notepads.



Here is what I do see.

Type 7 uboat. Doing the 1939 campaign, started off in 7th flotilla.

Firt there is the attack perriscope window, I hit f4 to get to it. On the left side is my depth meter and periscope light. Periscope light does not work (no biggie for me but maybe its indicative of my prob). On the right edge I have to pull out tabs...

Top tab is Ship: Range: Angle on bow: speed:

Bottom tab is for my torpedo firing, shows I II III IV and under that V for fore and aft tubes. I also have a "lock" button, and a "fire" button , as well as a periscope up /down switch.

This is all I have. There are no dials, no lights to press and make torpedo dials pop out, nothing that pops out at me.

So is my install borked? Do I have to start from scratch?

I have uninstalled mods and reinstalled them several times with GME, snapshots show that my original copy of sh4 and uboat missions is the same when I uninstall all the mods. Mods seem to install fine, thoe I do get warning messages saying "might not work, do you wish to proceed", I click yes.





"If the light is on, then when you swivel the scope, you will see various dials spinning, and you will not be able to adjust them. Click the light off, this decouples the scope from the TDC and allows you to change the dials."


I dont see any of this in the attack periscope area.

[Sammi79]

when I try to time the speed it tells me there is not enough data.

Hi Bloomstomb, I have always found that trying to find the speed of a target by multiple range/bearing measurements over time to be problematic and unreliable. The quickest way to measure the targets speed is :-

Identify the target and read its length from the recognition manual either in yards (Ly) or meters (Lm). Whilst your boat is stationary (very important), use the stopwatch to time how long the target takes for its stern to pass the point where the bow is at the start of your timer. This gives you the (Ts) time in seconds it took for the target to travel its total length. Once you have that number a small calculation is required, so there is one for yards and one for meters :

In yards :
(178/Ts)*Ly = Yards travelled in 2 minutes 58 seconds (Yt)
Yt/100 = Target speed in knots.

In meters :
(195/Ts)*Lm = Meters travelled in 3 minutes 15 seconds (Mt)
Mt/100 = Target speed in knots.

you don't have to be looking at the target to do the calculations so one careful measurement is all that's required. There is probably a dozen ways to re-write the calculations, this just keeps it clearer for me. In fleet boats, I needed to use a calculator but in the German boats the AOBF dial in the attack scope will do the math for you -

Line up the targets speed in knots (outer edge of middle ring)
with the targets length in meters (outer ring)
and read under the red marker (inner edge of middle ring)

= target speed in knots. It is quicker than any calculator and it is on the screen. Hope that helps.

[Flopper]

Lurker is there any way to get the speed of the target from periscope view, or does it have to be done from the attack map.


For example, I dont see this.

"From the attack periscope, you have those two panels on either side of the view window that give you the torpedo settings. On the right panel there is a purple light, you can click that to lock and unlock the torpedo setting dials."


The only thing I have is 2 pullout thingies on the RIGHT side of the torp window. They are both the notepads.



"If the light is on, then when you swivel the scope, you will see various dials spinning, and you will not be able to adjust them. Click the light off, this decouples the scope from the TDC and allows you to change the dials."


I dont see any of this in the attack periscope area.

Sounds like you have a corrupted install.

[Sammi79]

I dont see any of this in the attack periscope area.

Hmmm... If you are definitely in the Attack Scope view then it sounds like maybe OM or OMEGU is not installed correctly?

[Bloomstomb]

Hey guys thanks for the replies.
First thing I did was installed the D2d version of sh4, and d2d version of uboat missions.

I am def in the attack periscope thingy and I installed the mods in this order

Opsmonsun_V705
OMv705_to_V720
OMv720_Patch4
OMEGU_v300_pkg
OMEGU_V300_Patch6_pkg

Ok here is how I installed them (according to GME instructions.)

I downloaded the content. Then I put gme in my sh4 folder, then I created a folder called sh4MODS in sh4 folder.

Then I extracted the mods into this folder. Each mod has its own seperate folder with the same exact name as shown above.

OPSMONSUN0v705, OMv705_to_v720 and OMv720_patch4 all have a "Data" and "support" folders in them.

The omegu_v300_pkg folder has these subfolders in it.
AOBG 16-9res
om_harder_escort_l1
Om_harder_escort_l2
OM-med_env
OM_multicmd_keys
OM_pac_env
OM_sh3_command_keys
Omegu_v300

The Omegu_v300_patch6_pkg folder has these sub folders in it
KiUB_English
OM_sh3_commend_keys
Omegu_english
Omegu_v300_patch6


Im getting the feeling I intalled them wrong?

Im sorry this is the first time I have used GME.

[Bloomstomb]

Sammi just posted this in another thread.

"the OMEGU_V300_pkg and OMEGU_V300_Patch6_pkg are folders containing multiple different optional mods, you have to pull out the folder OMEGU_V300 and OMEGU_V300_Patch6 from inside them, put them in your mods folder and try again."


I didnt do this!! Going to try now.

Sorry for the noobness.

heheh

[Sammi79]

Yes Bloomstomb the _pkg folders contain the mod folders, they aren't the mods themselves, when you have pulled out the mod folders and installed it should look like this :-

Opsmonsun_V705
OMv705_to_V720
OMv720_Patch4
OMEGU_v300
OMEGU_V300_Patch6

that is all you need the other options are well explained in the readme files if you want english labels on your tdc etc...
Hope it works out for you now.

[Bloomstomb]

Forgive the ignorance.

I think I know the problem..

[lurker_hlb3]

One question on the omegu and its patch.

OK i pulled out the folders from omegu, and when I pulled out the omegu 6 patch it wanted to merge and replace files. I clicked yes.

So now, if i want just vanilla omegu and its patch, I only have 4 mods I can activate.

Opsmonsun_705
OMv705_to_v720
OMv720_patch4
Omegu_v300 (this is the merged and replaced file with patch 6)

Does this look right ? (so far)

In another thread I told you to read the following "carefully"

http://www.subsim.com/radioroom/showpost.php?p=1334138&postcount=1

"IF" you had done what it said you would not be having problems

[Sammi79]

Opsmonsun_705
OMv705_to_v720
OMv720_patch4
Omegu_v300 (this is the merged and replaced file with patch 6)

Does this look right ? (so far)

Hold on there... Patch6 should not have merged with V300,

OMEGU_V300 is the graphical environment mod and OMEGU_V300_Patch6 is its update, they are 2 seperate folders. when installed correctly in JSGME it should look like this :-

Opsmonsun_V705
OMv705_to_V720
OMv720_Patch4
OMEGU_v300
OMEGU_V300_Patch6

Although... if somehow you did merge the update over the mod I think it would be the same as installing both, as the update files would have overwritten their intended files to be replaced. I'm not totally sure on that though it would be best to redownload and start fresh. Keep the mod folders elsewhere and just place copys into your SH4/Mods/ folder when you want them installed, that way you can be sure of keeping the original files intact even if your install messes up.

[Bloomstomb]

I think i got it. Thanks alot guys.

Now to learn how to actualy shoot torps:)

[Bloomstomb]

In another thread I told you to read the following "carefully"

http://www.subsim.com/radioroom/showpost.php?p=1334138&postcount=1

"IF" you had done what it said you would not be having problems

I cant argue that lol. Im in the process of reading it VERY carefully now.

I do have all the patches working now tho, without the options. Looks absofarkinlutely great.

[Bloomstomb]

Im reading the guides for manual targeting for kiub.

I have a question on calculating height milirads.

I will quote from the guide.


"At periscope zoom level 6X, lock on the target, press the green circle to turn on the stadimeter and move the mirror ship just above the real ship. Read the angle on the scale to the left. In this case, the ship is 1.1 milirads high (left picture). "

WHen calculating height, are you supposed to use mast of the ship to its water line (where ship meets water)?

Other question is, is the waterline the waterline of the of the ship where it meets the water, or is it the waterline where the sky meets water?

Also, when you are looking at the recognition manual, it says my ships mast is 24m high. Does this include only where ship meets water to the top of the mast or is it looking at the bottom of the ship (which is under water) to the top of the mast?

My calculations in aobf seem to be off slightly (target is 1850 meters away and Im getting a distance of 2000 and change).

[Sammi79]

Mast height should be measured from the waterline to the top of the highest mast, the draft is the depth from the bottom of the keel to the waterline. waterline is where the ship meets the water.

If you find you are getting bad results, check the screen ratio you are in. Karazmovnews AOBF comes installed for 4:3 but there is an optional 16:9 mod - I found until I enabled this AOBF 16:9 mod AFTER all OM/Omegu mods I was getting off results... very annoying when you are trying to learn.:damn: I used to play in 1024/768 (4:3) then last year I got more ram now I play in 1280/768(16:9)

It shouldn't make a difference but there must be some scale issue with the degree marks in different screen ratios.:06: anyway you could try and see if that helps. the markers and numbers are in visibly different positions on the different AOBFs.

[Bloomstomb]

oh that might be it. I was in 5/8.

Let me check that out.

Thanks.

And just to be clear, waterline is where ship meets water right?

[Sammi79]

And just to be clear, waterline is where ship meets water right?

Right. :up:

[Bloomstomb]

Im doing the uboat torpedo tutorial.

I tried to install that mod , use different ratios, it doesnt matter.

Cant seem to get it right. My calculations are always around 50-100meters longer distance than map/ruler .

Maybe target drone 1 is the wrong height?

[Sammi79]

Im doing the uboat torpedo tutorial.

I tried to install that mod , use different ratios, it doesnt matter.

Cant seem to get it right. My calculations are always around 50-100meters longer distance than map/ruler .

Maybe target drone 1 is the wrong height?

Well, 50-100 meters is not far off, I don't play with map contacts so I never knew the ruler distances. A torpedo travelling at 30kts will cover about 15 meters in a second (roughly) and In that time the ship could have moved maybe half that at 15kts so maybe a few (3-8) seconds time difference. If you aimed at the middle of a ship travelling 15kts or less you would still hit anything longer than 100 meters. Also, if the range is slightly longer, it will be aimed slighlty ahead, even with open tubes it takes a second to fire the torpedo.

Also either some info in the recognition manual is wrong or the target ships are sitting wrong in the water... I am kicking myself now that I didn't write down which ship it was but the draft in the manual said 9.3m I set running depths at 9m with magnetic pistols and fired 3 times then watched the torpedos from external view and they passed a full meter and some below the keel harmlessly, in calm seas. That has only happened to me once though in a lot of hours playing, and I thought, hey thats probably quite realistic, there would have been mistakes here and there.

You said target drone? I've never ever seen one, try something a bit meatier its way more satisfying! (and you might find it works better)

[Bloomstomb]

Well I made sure it was the target I was firing at and started a identical mission with auto aim on. It was the correct target.

Its the training mission for torpedoes. Target drone 1(stationary) and the moving one is target drone 2 i believe.

Well I nailed the first sucker from about 4600 meters out (of course it wasnt moving).

But I gotta say, I dont know how accurate I can get range when they are far and there is movement.

I guess thats realistic tho :)

[karamazovnew]

While making the periscope reticule and the AOBF finder wheel I spent a lot of time to make sure they're within 50 m of a correct range, even at 4000m up. I never used the map to check up my settings, I used the Mission Editor instead. During rough seas however you can be off by 200m no matter how good you are. So I can safely say that it's as good as it can be, the rest depends on your ability to estimate the miliradians and to interpret the AOBF data.

Accurate range is only important if you want to calculate speed through plotting. I never do that. If you can place yourself ahead of the target you have enough time to close in on a good angle, stop the sub completely and do a fixed wire speed calculation. If you're closing in on a FAST ship, you can also use the 45 mark bearing for that, and just add YOUR speed to the speed the AOBF gives you. Just before shooting, I usually get another range reading because I like to see when the torpedoes hit, on the stopwatch. As long as you keep the gyros lower than 30 degrees, you can mess up with the range by as much as 500m. Actually, I've never seen a torpedo hit exactly on the chronometer mark. They usually hit where I wanted them to do, but 10-20 seconds later. Maybe there's something wrong with how the game calculates range/time.

As for shooting at 4000m plus, that's a crap shoot. Unlike in SH3, the ships in SH4 actually get slowed by hitting the waves. As far as ship handling and convoy scattering is concerned, Lurker has managed to get a better result than you can find in SH5 :D So don't get used to shooting at ranges greater than 2000m.