[wip] British Periscope view

[keltos01]

http://img686.imageshack.us/img686/3096/front3.gif (http://img686.imageshack.us/i/front3.gif/)

Uploaded with ImageShack.us (http://imageshack.us)

What the Officer in the Submarine sees through his periscope (http://www.heritage-history.com/books/gibson/war/front3.gif) in War Inventions and How they were Invented (http://www.heritage-history.com/www/heritage.php?Dir=books&MenuItem=display&author=gibson&book=war&story=_front)

http://www.heritage-history.com/www/heritage.php?Dir=wars&FileName=wars_greatwar.php


allright this is from the Great War (for you Iambecomelife)

I need the WWII equivalent..

keltos

[keltos01]

The excerpt from that book that deals with how the target solution was built is the web I linked to :DL

That should work, IIRC sergbuto did it long ago and it was fine :up:

Interestingly, the fruit machine worked like the current SH4 TDC (Which is in turn hugely inferior to the real US thing): You made an input of AOB, bearing and speed based on estimations, and then started the "simulation". If the next time you raised the scope the target was on the same bearing as the Fruit Machine indicated, then the solution was probably correct.

Here is the view through HMS Safari's periscope (Note the protrusion on the upper part for the bearing repeater, like in the german periscopes. The reticle is in mils and looks exactly like the first one you did for the Jap subs based on the old film, keltos):

http://img61.imageshack.us/img61/5498/hmssafariscope.jpg

BTW since the british submarines fought from bases in India and Malaysia as well as later from US bases in Australia, I guess that adding the T-class to the campaign as another playable submarine should be easy and realistic.

thanks Hitman !

does anyone have a better picture taken through a WWII British/Dutch periscope ?

keltos

[keltos01]

http://img22.imageshack.us/img22/5343/britishperi.jpg (http://img22.imageshack.us/i/britishperi.jpg/)
As you can see from the above picture which shows you the center of the reticle, there is no horizontal line, only a vertical one

reticle measured as seen on the negative picture :

http://img691.imageshack.us/img691/3189/britishreticle.jpg (http://img691.imageshack.us/i/britishreticle.jpg/)
it looks a lot like the WWI periscope but for that vertical line...

keltos

[keltos01]

I guess we can safely assume that they didn't change their periscope reticles :

http://img707.imageshack.us/img707/8058/peribritish.jpg (http://img707.imageshack.us/i/peribritish.jpg/)
.us (http://imageshack.us)

here both WWII and WWI periscopes are visible on the same picture



here is the new periscope reticle :

http://img186.imageshack.us/img186/1501/britishperi2.jpg (http://img186.imageshack.us/i/britishperi2.jpg/)

with vertical line added :

http://img535.imageshack.us/img535/3567/perifinal.jpg (http://img535.imageshack.us/i/perifinal.jpg/)


this here above should be the final version of the British Reticle

keltos

[keltos01]

I edited the periscopeSH3.dds and added the new reticle to it :

http://img684.imageshack.us/img684/9990/periscopesh3b.jpg (http://img684.imageshack.us/i/periscopesh3b.jpg/)
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seen here above with alpha channel visible

download :

http://www.mediafire.com/file/l2znkunoy3t/Periscope SH3.dds

it's been such a long time since I modified a periscope view that I'm not sure it's the right file I did...

will make it a mod tonight and see

keltos

[keltos01]

New British Periscope View :

http://img411.imageshack.us/img411/7641/britishperiscope.jpg (http://img411.imageshack.us/i/britishperiscope.jpg/)

http://img28.imageshack.us/img28/9573/britperi.jpg (http://img28.imageshack.us/i/britperi.jpg/)


For the Class T boat for now ;)

keltos

[keltos01]

see hitman !

the T class is equipped with it !

I'd need more picture taken through a real british scope to better this

regards

keltos

[Hitman]

Oh it's good :up:. The vertical one is in mils, and the horizontal in degrees, as usual. Horizontal in degrees is great for calculating the torpedo spread, while the vertical is good for measuring distance. The british periscopes had a stadimeter like the US one, anyway.

[keltos01]

Oh it's good :up:. The vertical one is in mils, and the horizontal in degrees, as usual. Horizontal in degrees is great for calculating the torpedo spread, while the vertical is good for measuring distance. The british periscopes had a stadimeter like the US one, anyway.


I still hope to improve it of course !;)

it was included in the mod and also in WDAD..

still don't know how to aim the boat realistically though, maybe this is why I set the torp angle at 15° instead of a realistic 0...

regards

keltos

[Hitman]

still don't know how to aim the boat realistically though

It's actually very easy with the US TDC, even if you set the torpedoes to the correct zero degree Gyro Angle. Here's how to do it:

1.- Determine target course, approximately, either by eyeballing AOB (To start) or plotting (Visual or radar). Get on a course that is perpendicular or, at least, something between 45º and 90º of the enemy track (So that the torpedo has enough angel of impact and does not make a dud)

2.- Feed the TDC with all the data, and start the position keeper. Make regular corrections as you see fit, by entering new data (New estimates of speed, distance, AOB, etc, as usual)

3.- Your reference for knowing when to shoot is the Gyro Angle needle on the "own ship" dial (The lower dial in the TDC). When that needle points exactly to the bow of the ship silhouette in the dial, you must shoot the torpedo. Why? Because at that moment the necessary Gyro Angle to hit the target is zero, which is exactly the only thing your torpedo is capable of :DL

That's more or less how the british TDC worked, only that when the GA was zero you also got an audible warning in the form of a bellring or buzz :up:

[Hitman]

Here's a graphical example:

http://img542.imageshack.us/img542/7454/tdc.jpg

The red arrow represents the direction your bow is pointing at. A torpedo that follows the same course as you, straight from your bow, is obviously a zero Gyro Angle torpedo, and it will follow the red arrow in its course -same as your ship's course.

Then the moving needle in the dial, highlighted in green represents what Gyro Angle must your torpedo do in order to hit the target that is shown in the upper dial.

Hence, when the needle matches the red arrow, that means that the torpedo must not turn at all to hit the target, i.e. it will be a Zero GA shot, and the moment of shooting has arrived.

Is it all understandable? :DL

[keltos01]

It's actually very easy with the US TDC, even if you set the torpedoes to the correct zero degree Gyro Angle. Here's how to do it:

1.- Determine target course, approximately, either by eyeballing AOB (To start) or plotting (Visual or radar). Get on a course that is perpendicular or, at least, something between 45º and 90º of the enemy track (So that the torpedo has enough angel of impact and does not make a dud)

2.- Feed the TDC with all the data, and start the position keeper. Make regular corrections as you see fit, by entering new data (New estimates of speed, distance, AOB, etc, as usual)

3.- Your reference for knowing when to shoot is the Gyro Angle needle on the "own ship" dial (The lower dial in the TDC). When that needle points exactly to the bow of the ship silhouette in the dial, you must shoot the torpedo. Why? Because at that moment the necessary Gyro Angle to hit the target is zero, which is exactly the only thing your torpedo is capable of :DL

That's more or less how the british TDC worked, only that when the GA was zero you also got an audible warning in the form of a bellring or buzz :up:

this could make it much more interresting to fight the T !

do you know what angle the french torpedoes were capable of ? and if they had also a fruitmachine or maybe a TDC equivalent ?

thanks !

keltos

[Hitman]

do you know what angle the french torpedoes were capable of ? and if they had also a fruitmachine or maybe a TDC equivalent ?

No idea, the french submarine arm is one of the less commented and studied from all the main WW1/2 combatants. Probably if you master the french language you might find more usable language than me :)

[keltos01]

found a couple more periscope shots in two books I got yesterday,

will post pictures later today :)

keltos

[keltos01]

http://img232.imageshack.us/img232/9711/britishperiscopeunruffl.jpg (http://img232.imageshack.us/i/britishperiscopeunruffl.jpg/)

A periscope photograph of the Italian merchant ship Loretto sinking on 13 October 1942 after being torpedoed by HMS Unruffled off Cape Gallo (image #94

Paul Kemp - British Submarines of World War two.

http://img204.imageshack.us/img204/9694/britishperiscoperyan.jpg (http://img204.imageshack.us/i/britishperiscoperyan.jpg/)


One of Our Submarines