[REQ] What about the Tupe XVII?

[Hitman]

So, the XVIII featured in the game was in fact not just never operational, but not even finished. But the XVII, equipped with a Walter turbine was finished and used by the KM for trials :DL, even got numerals as U-792 to U-795. Any modder would be interested in trying to make its 3D model for the game? We already have a working Walter turbine with corresponding interface, so it could be a nice semi-realistic addition :up:

http://www.uboat.net/types/xviia.htm

[Sledgehammer427]

If there's a fairly accurate set of blues for it, I'd love to take a whack. I thought that type looked really cool.

EDIT: Matter of fact, just a side picture will work, looking at some of the pics there are of the type in dry dock, that's a relatively easy hull shape to work with.

[Hitman]

I have something much better than a simple picture :D

http://img693.imageshack.us/img693/7771/45989999.th.jpg (http://img693.imageshack.us/i/45989999.jpg/)

[Sledgehammer427]

Whoo! Very nice! :yeah:
I'll install mm3d on this pc and get it started here in a couple days!

[Hitman]

Some more useful information and a nice render:

http://img10.imageshack.us/img10/8555/typexviiis.th.jpg (http://img10.imageshack.us/i/typexviiis.jpg/)

The Type XVII boats had both conventional diesel engines and a single Walter closed-cycle engine. They were designed for coastal operations. Few in numbers but rich in variants, the Type XVII U-boat was not a success, trying to press the Walter turbine into service before its time. Planned to run to a dozen boats (U- 1081/1092), the ‘G’variant was halted before any were complete. It was designed for an ultimate submerged speed of 25 kts.
There was little development of the basic submarine in the inter-war period, except that the once-popular saddle-tank design, in which the buoyancy chambers were located outside the pressure hull, gave way more and more to the double hull, in which they enclosed it almost completely and were themselves contained within a light enclosure which could be shaped to improve sea-keeping and performance. In Germany, developments in the late 1930s were aimed only at increasing the size and endurance of existing types, not making any radical changes to their design. However, by 1941, experimental boats with a new type of powerplant which did not need atmospheric oxygen had been produced, and were proving to be quite remarkable. The powerplant in question was, once again, the creation of the prolific Professor Hellmuth Walter, whom we have already met.
The key to the concept was the Walter closed-cycle propulsion system that relied on the near-explosive decomposition of concentrated hydrogen peroxide in the presence of a catalyst, The reaction produced a high-temperature mix of steam and free oxygen into which fuel oil was injected and fired, resulting in high-pressure gases that were made to drive .a conventional turbine. A weakness of the principle was that almost any impurity could act as a catalyst to initiate the process at a disastrously early stage.
Walter had constructed a small experimental boat, the V30, launched on 19 January 1940, which displaced just 73.8 tonnes (75 tons) submerged. He equipped it with a steam turbine, fed by a variant of the liquid-fuel motors which were to power the VI flying bomb’s launch catapult, producing their steam by the chemical reaction of hydrogen peroxide with a catalyst. Walter soon discovered that his submarine could make almost 30 knots submerged – around three times the submerged speed of any conventional submarine running on battery power – and that led him to suggest to the Kriegsmarine the construction of a fleet of similarly powered submarine warships. When asked where he proposed to store the large quantities of reagent and fuel that would be required, he produced a design for a two-decker submarine, in itself virtually two existing double hulls joined into a tigure ‘8′, the bottom portion of which would serve exclusively as ‘bunkerage’. Someone at this proposal meeting noted that it would be just as easy to fill that lower section with batteries.
More ‘Walter’ boats were built or at least were in the course of construction when the war ended. The two Type XVIIB boats which were successfully salvaged after having been scuttled in Hamburg harbour were later transferred to the US Navy and the Royal Navy, who operated them experimentally, but the powerplant required massive quantities of fairly exotic fuel and was most temperamental. It would perhaps become a valid solution in the fullness of time, but that was something the Kriegsmarine did not have, and it was essential to look at other suggestions.
#
Two prototype boats proved the machinery feasible, and the system was pressed into service in the Type XVIIs. A drawback was the extreme thirst of the system, dictating a small boat with a single propeller. For cruise purposes, this was driven by a conventional diesel/electric combination, with the Walter coupled up only to force or decline an engagement.
Externally, the hull was cleaned-up, with no guns and a minimum of proturberances. It was of figure-eight section, formed of two overlapping circular pressure hulls of unequal diameter. In practice, the length to beam ratio was too high, resulting in an unnecessarily high drag. This meant that the Type XVIIA never realized its theoretical top speed of 25 kts possible with two turbines on a common shaft. So only four such boats were built, the modified Type XVIIB (three completed) having only one turbine. Space was available for only two torpedo tubes, with but one reload for each, a deficiency offset by the increasing lethality of the weapon. A projected Type XVIIK would have abandoned the volatile Walter for conventional diesels aspirated with pure oxygen stored aboard.
TYPE XVIIB
Type: Coastal submarine
Displacement: 317 tonnes (312 tons) surfaced; 363 tonnes (357 tons) submerged
Length: 41.50m (136.17ft)
Submerged speed: 21.5 knots
Submerged range: 210km (130 miles)
Armament: 2 x 533mm (21 in) torpedo tubes
Crew: 19

[Hitman]

Forget those plans I posted before, they are from the WK-202 Type XVII

Apparently there were several different versions grouped as Type XVII, but the best looking and most advanced one was the XVIIB, which included also a sonar dome on the bow.

You can find the plans and in depth article here: http://www.u-historia.com/

Go to "Técnica---->U-Boote---->Tipo XVII" and scroll down until you see the plans for the Type XVIIB

What a beautiful looking boat :DL

[Sgtmonkeynads]

"ultimate submerged speed of 25 kts."

Stop......sob, cry, sob.....

You had me at Hello........



sorry, Jerry Mcguire moment.

[Kapitanleutnant]

You can find the plans and in depth article here: http://www.u-historia.com/

Go to "Técnica---->U-Boote---->Tipo XVII" and scroll down until you see the plans for the Type XVIIB


You can save images from sites which block right-clicks by dragging them into your address bar. :arrgh!:

http://img192.imageshack.us/img192/7043/1703i.jpg

[Hitman]

Thanks :up:

This last one is the best model to put in the game :DL as its historic performance figures are already good enough for patrol use in short range operations, i.e. the North Sea or Western Approaches departing from Norweguean bases in 1944/45

It also was equipped with a schnorkel :up: that allows saving hydrogen peroxide for the attacks and evasions.

The relevant figures for modelling this uboat:

Dimensions:

Length: 41,45 metres
Width: 4,5 metres
Depth under waterline: 4,3 metres

Propulsion:

1 (8 cylinder) supercharged diesel engine 230CV@1390 rpm
1 AEG electric engine 78CV@170 rpm
2 Walter turbines 2x2500CV@14500 rpm :o

Single Screw with 3 blades, 1,75 metres diametre

Speed:

Surfaced (diesel): 8.8 knots
Submerged (electric): 5 knots
Sumerged (Walter turbine): 25 knots

Endurance:

Surfaced (diesel): 3000 miles@8knots
Submerged (electric): 76 miles@2knots
Sumerged (Walter turbine): 123 miles@20knots / 163 miles@15knots

Weapons:

2xTorpedo tubes. 1 reload per tube (4 torpedos in total, 2 in tubes, 2 stored)

Diving depth:

Standard: 80 metres
Crush Depth: 150 metres

Periscopes:

2

Crew:

16 men

Constructed boats:

12 were ordered (U-1405 to U-1406) to Blohm & Voss and 3 were actually completed, but they did finally not enter war service:

U-1405 Dec 1944
U-1406 Feb 1945
U-1407 March 1945

According to those numbers, the only departure from historical reality would be to actually conduct a war patrol with them. But at least one was ready for combat in Dec 1944 :D even if due to shakedown and training, as well as the need to construct hydrogen peroxide storage facilities in the flotillas bases prevented them from actually making it to the front.

[keltos01]

wow nice boat !

would love to give it a spin !

gosh does my IJN subs look antiquated compared to this very one !

keltos

[Sledgehammer427]

I started on it but I was using the wrong blues and I haven't installed MM3D on this PC. gotta start over and I'm fine with that

[Hitman]

Excellent :up:

Looking at the plan, it seems to me that the Type II interior would fit perfectly considering the dimensions and general layout of the boat. The chair with a wheel you see there is actually the sonar seat and the sonar wheel. The rest of controls are evidently as in the Type II :DL

The only difference is that the two periscopes are directly in the control room, and the conning tower is mostly empty. Also no fixed heigth periscope, but just the standard up/down going ones. That minor tweak in the interior and making new graphics for the gauges using the Type XXI ones as templates should suffice to give it a nice and realistic look :shucks:

[Hitman]

BUMP!

Anything new? :DL

[urfisch]

the boat looks like it was far too modern, in its time..looks like a new uboat.

german engineers...

:salute: