Bismarck-Tirpitz multiskin problem

[roadhogg]

I'm trying to add the Multiskin mod from Gerome73, and when i run a mission i made up to test it, the ships load fine, but the Tirpitz doesn't move.
Both the Tirpitz and it's props are stationary. Looks great though with the new skin lol.
Also, i can't get a periscope lock on it even at close range. It's like it's a dead target. The Renown class i put it up against sails straight past with neither ship firing a shot.
If i swap the DAT file for the standard one i get the movement, but not the new skin.
I've looked through the DAT's but can't find anything wrong, tho i'm no modeller so i must have missed something.

Anyone got any idea where i should look for the errors please?

I'd love to get the Tirpitz working with the new skin, she does look impressive.

[Jimbuna]

Send me your mission file http://www.psionguild.org/forums/images/smilies/wolfsmilies/thumbsup.gif

[roadhogg]

I think i found it Jimbuna, or part of it.

Seems that Thompsons ships 3.1 has some kind of error in the sim file, cos by keeping the old sim and editing the gc height, engine power etc in, it was ok. With the new sim i had been getting forward motion from the Tirpitz but no wake or sound.
But then i loaded lifeboats&debris_v4 and it messed up again, no target recognition or movement. I've not got round that one yet.
Is the (Unit_Ship) section necessary in the val's?, it's the section that has things like Hydro, propulsion, drag etc in it.
It appears to be missing in 3 of the ship val's i've looked at.
If(Unit_Ship) is not the problem i don't know what else is causing it.

Edit: just looked through some more val's and the (Unit_Ship) is also missing. Seems it's not needed.

I don't think it's the mission but i'll send it if you want.
Where do i send it?

[Jimbuna]

Unfortunately the mod your making reference to tended to break a lot of things in GWX.

I'm using Geromes multi skins without any problems.

My advice would be to give careful consideration as to whether you need to continue using the ships related mod.

[roadhogg]

I was just trying it out, (the ships mod) but it does make the ships real slow, bit too slow for my liking, so it's probably best i dump it.
It was only Thomsons anyway :D
I had 2 missions for the Tirpitz. One was a tester, as simple as it gets, Renown, Hood, and added the Glorious from VonDos, versus the Bismark & Tirpitz head to head.
The other was an all day mission protecting the Graf Zeppelin.

Do you not need the mission files now you've seen the ships mod?

Must admit i've had a few surprise ctd's lately too.

[Jimbuna]

I was just trying it out, (the ships mod) but it does make the ships real slow, bit too slow for my liking, so it's probably best i dump it.
It was only Thomsons anyway :D
I had 2 missions for the Tirpitz. One was a tester, as simple as it gets, Renown, Hood, and added the Gloriuos from VonDos, versus the Bismark & Tirpitz head to head.
The other was an all day mission protecting the Graf Zeppelin.

Do you not need the mission files now you've seen the ships mod?

Must admit i've had a few surprise ctd's lately too.

My plan would be to install your single missions file into my own folder and perform a test.....then replicate it with an identical (unit wise) mission of my own.

[roadhogg]

Ok, so how do i send you the mission files? i'm a technological dinosaur i'm afraid.
I've also JSGME'd VonDos's armed liners & Warspite into a folder to make it easier to add most of his ships. You can have that for your filefront if you like, subject to VonDos's permission, of course.
I could even add the Glorious to it :)
She's gorgeous, and takes a lot of damage too. Wish i knew where the edits for the damage model's were, i'd toughen up the other carriers a bit, so they wouldn't get sunk by destroyers.

[Jimbuna]

Just add it to your FF account....if you haven't got one, simply zip it up and send it as an attachment to jim_musgrove@hotmail.com it will only be half a MB at the very most.

No need for Warspite or Glorious et al.....I've got them all, plus a few not yet released :DL

[roadhogg]

No FF account i'm afraid, so i'll zip it.
I figured you'd have all the ships you want jim, i was thinking of people that aren't too accomplished at adding ships. I noticed you had the Warspite, Titanic etc on your FF, i just thought if you put it on there some people might be able to download and JSGME the whole pack.
Nearly all VonDos's ships are in there. To date it's got the Warspite, Titanic, Queen Mary, Queen Elizabeth, Aquitania, Normandie, S.S.Rex, Empress of Britain and Aquila A/C, tho i'll add the Glorious too if you want the folder, they're all armed and dangerous :)
I did it for ease for myself really, but it's available if you want to put it up for others. VonDos could undoubtedly have done it himself, but he's been a busy boy making ships lol.

No probs either way, mission files are on their way to you.

[Jimbuna]

No FF account i'm afraid, so i'll zip it.
I figured you'd have all the ships you want jim, i was thinking of people that aren't too accomplished at adding ships. I noticed you had the Warspite, Titanic etc on your FF, i just thought if you put it on there some people might be able to download and JSGME the whole pack.
Nearly all VonDos's ships are in there. To date it's got the Warspite, Titanic, Queen Mary, Queen Elizabeth, Aquitania, Normandie, S.S.Rex, Empress of Britain and Aquila A/C, tho i'll add the Glorious too if you want the folder, they're all armed and dangerous :)
I did it for ease for myself really, but it's available if you want to put it up for others. VonDos could undoubtedly have done it himself, but he's been a busy boy making ships lol.

No probs either way, mission files are on their way to you.

Just send the mission file mate....I'll sort the rest. People would only be able to add the ships if they already had them installed on their installation. http://www.psionguild.org/forums/images/smilies/wolfsmilies/thumbsup.gif

[roadhogg]

Erm . . . not sure i understand that last statement, but never mind.

If you're in testing mode . . .:DL i've been getting a ctd lately at about 13:50 in the Graf Zeppelin mission, and don't know why. It's only started since i tried adding the slower ships mod, but i removed the mod and it's still doing it. Always shows as a ntdll.dll error.

I'm on GWX 2.1 with the AOTD bugfix,
GWX 3 community units,
A Green Atlantic 8k
GWX lite harbor traffic
VonDos's armed liners
Q-ship mod
RN CV Glorious
Multiskin Bismark-Tirpitz,
Torpedo damage Final v2 .

That's all my enabled mods.
I've got GWX 3 on the other hard drive but the old comp seems to struggle more, might be the improved graphics in GWX 3, so i tend to play 2.1.

As you know i had problems . . and found anomalies i didn't like, with the sim files on the slower ships (thompsons) mod and and the val files with the lifeboats & rowers v4, so i disabled them cos they didn't agree with the Tirpitz ( no forward motion, no wake etc).
Then i disabled the multiskin, the Glorious and Torpedo Damage final v2, and reloaded them so that the ships went in before the Torpedo damage mod.
So it would imprint damage on the current skins.
I don't actually think that the Torpedo damage mod is anything to do with it, but just in case. . .
Problems with shipping i've found usually happens when the ship first enters the mission, or when it comes under fire, neither of which is the case here.

It was all working fine with all mods before the glorious, multiskin, slower ships and lifeboats mods were added. Last two are disabled, previous two seem to work ok in the Testing Tirpitz mission..

Sorry to waffle on, just giving you my set up and mods configuration.
And thanks for any help you can give, i'm no SH3 or computer expert, nor do i want to be lol.
It's nice when the game works tho :DL

[Jimbuna]

If I'm understanding you correctly and looking at the above information it would appear that you are trying to run your GWX2.1 installation with some files that were intended for GWX3.0.

I would disable them all and after ensuring your installation is working fine, add one mod/element at a time until you find the offending culprit.

I can't advise on third party mod compatability other than for those I have tried and tested myself.

When I get home this evening I will post a screenshot of the mods I am using in my test installs of GWX2.1 and GWX3.0 and of which I am confident are working fine.

[Jimbuna]

Here are screenshots of my testing installations for GWX2.1 and GWX3.0....everything on view is compatable...on my system anyway :DL


GWX2.1
http://img209.imageshack.us/img209/1640/jsgmegwx21.jpg (http://img209.imageshack.us/my.php?image=jsgmegwx21.jpg)

GWX3.0
http://img209.imageshack.us/img209/7366/jsgmegwx30.jpg (http://img209.imageshack.us/my.php?image=jsgmegwx30.jpg)

[roadhogg]

Wow, you've got almost every mod under the sun there lol.

The only mod intended for GWX 3 is community units, and after problems with certain ships in the original community units mod, i figured the latest version would be ' better '. And so it proved.
I can't remember exactly where the problem was with the original ( it's been available for a couple of years now) but i remember you gave it to me, ( and thank you kindly, i was begging for some new ships at the time) and i remember having to take every ship from the mod and install it individually to find the ones causing the ctd's.
I think theres a post about it somewhere, i'll have a look through my post history later. But i ended up with most of the ships in game and just a few left out.
CU GWX 3 went straight in with no probs, no ctd's.
When i get a ctd now i can normally trace it quite quickly, and i've run single missions time and time again with no issues. I don't do careers, because the save bug drove me mad and i got fed up with aborting careers or doing the same patrol time and again.
So i've done my own mission to keep me occupied when i fancied a change from the pre-installed ones, and until i messed about with some more mods it was running fine time after time. when i got problems it was usually an error in the mission build or with certain ships as previously explained.
Ironically the problems with exceptions to ships always involved warships, Community Units is civilian ships.
There are no civilian ships in my mission until 15:30 hrs, and no shipping at all enters the game or comes under fire at 13:50, ( except for the possible air attack on shipping that has been in the game for hours) which is why the latest ctd has me baffled. The ctd happens before any attack because i'm in view of the other shipping at the time and get no warning of aircraft spotted.
I've looked through every single ship in SH3 through the museum, and can't find a thing wrong with any of them.
I don't think it's the community units mod jim.
Only option left is to disable the mods one by one and see if the ctd still happens.
I've been trying to avoid that, tho i should have done it earlier i know.

I just want to see the Tipitz turn up to the rescue in her new colours :wah:

And then save the pretty lady from destruction. :D

[Jimbuna]

I'm not aware of anyone having been able to get the CU mod working with GWX3.0 yet....that is one I need to look at when I have some free time.

If anyone reading this post has succeeded, please let me know.

[roadhogg]

You mean the old CU or the GWX 3 version?

I presume you mean the former. On the other hard drive i've got the GWX 3 CU with gwx 3 gold and it seems to be ok, tho as i say i haven't played it lately cos it slows down the game a bit more.

I just noticed, having got another ctd at 13:50 ( game time), that i'd added a Fast freighter to a random group that appears at 13:00, (random1 in the mission you've got) and would be just coming in to visual range about the time of the ctd. The air attack had started at the time, tho the time of the air attack varies a bit, it did begin on this occasion, which reinforces my belief that it's not VonDos's Glorious that's the culprit.
That carrier certainly takes some sinking lol. I gather he used the hull of a battleship as a basis for it, but it absorbs so much damage, he must have used the battleship hull's damage model for it too :DL.

You don't happen to know how to alter the damage resistance of ships do you?

I'd love to make the others similar so they don't sink when you breathe on them lol. The Graf Zep and the Illustrious are so fragile.
Nearly forgot . . with the fast freighter i've deleted the group, then re-instated it, ( might be one of those random exceptions SH3 some times takes to a ship) if not i'll leave out the freighter and try again. It's another one that's fine in the museum tho.

[roadhogg]

Went back to the GWX 3 installation (which worked because it was before the latest round of alterations) and added the Multiskin.
Works fine.
From 20km away at least with an uzo lock.
It's not easy to make the rendevous cos the enemy keep getting in the way and shooting at me, as they're supposed to lol.
Can't say i know why the 2.1 doesn't tho :hmmm:

[Jimbuna]

Pleased to hear it....best to quit whilst ahead perhaps :DL

[roadhogg]

You're absolutely right about quitting, but i'm sure you know i won't till i've sussed it :DL.

Finding the solution is a lesson learned for next time i have problems etc, etc.

I must admit i've been side tracked a bit recently by playing the GWX 3 version instead tho, and the 2.1 version was in need of some improvement anyway in terms of the mission construction.
I'm almost happy with the GWX 3 mission, which is why i've been a bit slow with the fault finding on the 2.1.
I'll get round to it soon :)

Of course what i should have done to start with is only make one change at a time. . . as you suggested . . but you know how it is, you get carried away lol.


Just chuck that mission away if you want, and certainly don't bother going through the community units mods looking for errors. As i said previously i had some probs with CU for 2.1 and had to leave a few ships out, ( might have been my install of the game or incompatibility with another mod ) but CU for GWX 3 went straight in to 2.1. It works. That's not the problem.

And the fast freighter i added works too, i remember sinking enough of them in career mode with 2.1.

Thanks for trying to help :up:

[Jimbuna]

Any time matey http://www.psionguild.org/forums/images/smilies/wolfsmilies/thumbsup.gif

[roadhogg]

So far i've not contributed anything to subsim except opinions and questions.

The GWX 3 version of the mission is just about finished. It uses only stock ships, so CU for GWX 3 is not necessary.

If you want to try it or put it up for others to play, you and anyone else is welcome to it.

Edit:
Actually it does have the CV Glorious in it, tho i could replace it with an Illustrious for those that haven't got the Glorious, and it could really do with the engine damage parameters for the German heavy cruisers being sorted so they don't conk out under light damage.

So maybe it's best to wait until the latter is sorted first.

I say that having just played it myself again. Only damage was one shell hit from a light cruiser to the topside of the hull/deck area midsection, just forward of the funnel, and the Prince Eugen is dead in the water again. That's gotta be wrong. Almost every time, unless she's totally undamaged, she stops.

[roadhogg]

Did a bit more testing and the Lutzow class seems ok and doesn't stop so easily, so i swapped the Prince Eugen for the Lutzow, and the Gneisenau, which was with the Lutzow, is now with the Admiral Scheer.

Sorted :D

Looks like the cruiser problem is just with the Prince Eugen/ Hipper type.
I've tried them both repeatedly, they both stop. :cry: