Question for ALL JSGME users

[JScones]

As we all know, a separate copy of JSGME must be installed into each game that you want to use it with. So, if you want to use it with, say, five games, you need to install it five times. Mods are stored under each game.

A few people have, over the years, asked whether I would make a version that you install into one central place and "point" to each game that you want to use it with. Mods and config files for each game would be stored in this central place. You'd simply select the game you want from a drop down list in JSGME and take it from there.

Each method has its advantages and disadvantages...

Separate installs of JSGME
Advantages:
- self contained and managed within each game
- easy, simple interface; open and your mods for that game are all laid out for you

Disadvantages:
- requires multiple installations of JSGME, roughly a footprint of 570kb per installation

Combined install of JSGME
Advantages:
- centralised; all mods stored in one spot
- small once-only install footprint size

Disadvantages:
- requires users to manually add games into JSGME (albeit a simple select-and-click process)
- requires users to perform extra steps to change game profiles (ie select a different game from a drop down list of those you've added)
- requires extra options to be added to the interface, potentially making it less simple than it is now

There's prolly others, but these give you an idea.

So, as I don't want to maintain two separate developments of JSGME, which method would you prefer for the next major version (v3.0) of JSGME?

When answering, pls think of *all* games that you use it with. If you are a member of other game forums, feel free to forward this question on to those communities as well, but pls report back here with the consensus.

[Onkel Neal]

I'm pretty happy with a separate install for each game I use (SH3, SH4). The footprint is nice and small, and I can avoid confusion.

My 2 cents ;)

[melnibonian]

I would go for the separate intallation as well. Although the combined one seems better it has the potential to get things mixed up, and the required space is not really a problem for modern computers.

[NEON DEON]

I would say to avoid confusion that one install per game is the way to go.

Given the size of hard drives these days, I would say 500kb for each game install is not much of a disadvantage.

[Merchant Raider]

I would agree with the last 3 reply s,and keep it separate
Keep up the good work !,

[TheDudTorpedo]

Seperate installation is good

[Kaleu. Jochen Mohr]

seperate all the way :yep:

[jimbob]

I'd say separate. But the other option could probably
work just fine for me too.

I never really "install" the app after the first time.

I just copy the exe to where I need it. it's really not that big.
And then i have shortcuts on somewhere renamed after the game
im currently modding. (not always silent hunter games)

Awsome tool btw, many thanks for that.

:D

[nikbear]

Personally speaking.I'd say separate installation for each game,its less confusing,far simpler and as already mentioned JSGME hardly takes up any room so.......Dedicated JSGME for each game :yeah:

[Vikinger]

I would also say seperate cuz how many games do we actually use that have or use JSGME?

And also the fact that you will need to add more options to the other version.
Iam allways in for, keep it as simply it can be :) So therefor my vote goes to seperated version.

Vikinger.

And thx for doing this JScones :)

[TDK1044]

Separate for me.

[Carotio]

I only see one advantage with the combined solution:
radio mods

due to their size, one time only enabling would be nice.

But still, I go for the separate version.

[bert8for3]

I likewise prefer separate for the same reasons others have mentioned.

[Fincuan]

I'd prefer combined due to simplicity of use and reduced workload in some tasks.

At "worst" I had 15 JSGME installations, so when a new version came up it was quite a job to update them all. Same with mods: I have three installations of IL2 that I use JSGME for. All three share many of the same mods, so it would simplify things a lot if I didn't have to have three copies of the mods to update each time a new version of it is released. SH4 is in almost he same situation: separate installation for RFB and TMO, with the two having many other mods(OM and some others) that are the same for both. Again it would be easier if the both just loaded it from one place.

Whichever way you decide to go it's still an excellent program, as you can see from the 15 installations :haha:

[momo55]

Separate for me too . I have 3 installed now (2 SHIV and 1 SHIII) and i'm fine with them . Simple to use this way .

[onelifecrisis]

I voted "combined" but I'm more than happy either way - it's a great tool. :up:

[SilentAngel]

I think the simplicity of JSGME is what makes it so good, so I prefer the seperate install for different games.

[mr chris]

I like the idea of combined install.

[skwasjer]

JScones, I'd go for one install (easy to update/maintain), but with an option to simply use the working directory (via a shortcut) instead of the dir where the exe resides. The same program, same easy interface, started from different shortcuts... So, install JSGME central, but let it use the working directory. All the user has to do is drag a new shortcut from the exe, modify the shortcut to use the specific game dir as the working dir. If this could be an option, next to the default 'install in every game folder' behavior, then :up:.

[nfitzsimmons]

Disk space is cheap, so I have no problem with separate installations.

[SquareSteelBar]

Vote for 'Separate' :up:

[ETR3(SS)]

I vote combined. Combining into one JSGME doesn't have to be complicated, it can still retain some simplicity. For the Command and Conquer game series I've been using a program called TibEd. While not a mod enabler (more of a mod creator) the interface is quite simple when selecting the game you want to work with. It might be worth a look to get an idea for a beta.

[Soundman]

As the old saying goes, "If it aint broke...." Separate is fine. Thanks for your great utility! :up:

[irish1958]

Separate works fine for me, but I really like skwasjer's idea best.

[Sailor Steve]

I voted separate, but mainly because I'm a luddite when it comes to learning programs. In case you don't remember I actually had problems understanding the original JSGME, and posted years ago saying I didn't use it for that reason. And let's not remind me of my huge faux pas over SH3 Commander's 'Update' function!:oops:

I would probably sooner or later learn to love a combined version, but for now I'm thoroughly enjoying it the way it is.

And as for this:
Disadvantages:
- requires multiple installations of JSGME, roughly a footprint of 570kb per installation
Gee, I'd have to have it installed in roughly 100 games before it equalled the size of SH3 with GWX. I think I can live with that. The only downside for me is having a separate icon on the desktop for each install, and so far I only have it in SH3 and SH4, so it doesn't bother me a bit.:sunny:

[XLjedi]

Another advantage to seperate installation is that mega-mod builders can pre-bundle it with their mega-mod.

Personally, I don't mind paying 570kb for that extra convenience...

[tomfon]

I voted for "combined" but the alternative is still fine for me too.
Thanks anyway JScones. :yeah:

[FIREWALL]

I always subscribe to the K.I.S.S. theory. :D

aka separate. :yep:

[tonschk]

:up: my vote goes to seperated version :woot:

[Murr44]

Love your programs.:up: I'd keep it separate as it avoids possible confusion over which game has what mod(s).

[longam]

The separate version does work well, but I always wished you could reside the mod folder in a different location, so that leans toward central install :hmmm:

[AVGWarhawk]

Separate works for me also. Less confusion when things get a bit blurry late at night.

[Madox58]

I like the combined idea.
Skwasjer's thoughts are great on this.
Carotio makes a valid point also.
The footprint may be small but each install of the MODS
does an offset that defeats the small footprint.
Plus any upgrade to JSGME or any MODS
would be much easier and quicker.

But I'm happy we have what we have so I'll not complain.
:salute:

[jmardlin]

I think combined the way that Skwasjer described would be great as I already am using it on SHIII, SHIV, Star Trek Armada II and Starfleet Command III. One update is much easier than four or five or more which I will have shortly.

[Pisces]

I like Skwasjer's idea too. The best of both worlds. And that's also why I haven't voted. I like the mods and their backups to remain in the individual game folders. But I like a single JSGME application that administrates those MODS-folders.

I cant imagine the grief that would unfold if the drive containing the 'MegaMotherload'-Mods folder would crash. That would kill (or atleast allow no further mod-changes to) all games that get modded files from there. And would take longer transfer-wise if the files had to be moved between 2 physical harddrive units. (and more chance of curruption) Or in a Bernard-moment I put mod-files from one game accidentally into anothers mod-area.

The size of the JSGME application (the odd 500kb or so) is of no issue to me in this day and age of plenty of GBs. But needing to remember which game uses a JSGME application or has not, maintaining easy accessible shortcuts to all those individual JSGME exes, has prevented me from making more use of it.

Centralise mod-management (just the application), but seperate mod-storage/backup.

[Oneshot/Onekill]

If it aint broke don't fix it...I onlt have a few installations of it. Seperate is just fine with me.:)

[JScones]

With less than two days left to vote, your collective preference so far seems pretty clear to me. I'm certainly not complaining as it's work I no longer have to think about.

JScones, I'd go for one install (easy to update/maintain), but with an option to simply use the working directory (via a shortcut) instead of the dir where the exe resides. The same program, same easy interface, started from different shortcuts... So, install JSGME central, but let it use the working directory. All the user has to do is drag a new shortcut from the exe, modify the shortcut to use the specific game dir as the working dir. If this could be an option, next to the default 'install in every game folder' behavior, then :up:.
I toyed with this idea a while ago (when I first implemented the installer), but the words I bolded above stopped me from pursuing it with any seriousness. SH3Cmdr used to allow pointing to different locations through users modifying the shortcut (admittedly not in exactly the same way). The fact that it no longer does says a lot to me about avoiding the reliance on user-modifiable shortcuts in the future.

I also fear that incorporating this approach into JSGME will lead to file integrity problems through people forgetting to disable all mods across all games before updating the central exe installation (in instances where such action is required when installing an updated release). With this approach we go from a one-to-one relationship between the engine and the game to a one-to-many relationship, with the management of the relationship left solely to the user and their ability to maintain shortcuts correctly.

I know you suggested making it an option (perhaps even an "advanced" option), but TBH my preference is to keep everything together as IMHO that better aligns with the KISS principle...and limits the possibility of user snafu.

[U-Schultz]

Separate for me.

[Fish40]

If it aint broke, don't fix it! Keep it as is!:up:

[Jimbuna]

Separate......works just fine http://www.psionguild.org/forums/images/smilies/wolfsmilies/thumbsup.gif

[Marko_Ramius]

I think the simplicity of JSGME is what makes it so good


hi guys,

I totally agree with the above, so separate is fine for me.

So great tool it is :up:

[Aniuk]

hi guys,

I totally agree with the above, so separate is fine for me.

So great tool it is :up:

Do I need to say more? SEPARATE> A Simple and great tool as it is.:salute:

Aniuk

[JScones]

Thanks all. Poll is now closed. Outcome is conclusive. I'll start working on an update to JSGME in the next few weeks. See here (http://www.subsim.com/radioroom/showthread.php?t=141773) for updates and more info (my most recent post (http://www.subsim.com/radioroom/showpost.php?p=1082410&postcount=48) lists features to come in next release).