GWX3.0 Gold Star Shells

[Stew U-582]

Does Anybody have a mod that gives back the deck gun ammo
for Star Shells and AP rounds.
I have been able to work out how to change the Values for amounts and get
the ammo on board but the problem is that it doesnt show on
the gun interface so you cant select the deferent ammo types
as only the HE icon shows up.

Any ideas.

Stu

[bigboywooly]

As uboats carried neither AP or SS I dont think anyone has readded them in
Honestly cant remember what I did to remove them
Nearly 2 years and a computer ago
:rotfl:

[Stew U-582]

Dont worry about it,

I figured it out , the amount of each tupe of shell can be edited in the basic.cfg file
and the are parts of the menu1024 file that have been disabled were stoping the
shells from showing in the deckgun interface.
Ive managed to get it all working how I like it.
If anybody else is interested in having their AP and Star shells back
post here and ill make it into a JSME compatible mod pack.
By the way Im using GWX gold with OLC gold so any mod pack might only work with
these mods. But its prity simple to just edit the two files with a text editor.

Thanks anyway

Shears

[FIREWALL]

Thx Stew :salute: I see no harm in haveing a choice.

Those that don't want it don't, have to download it.

[Contact]

:down:

[NGT]

Dont worry about it,

I figured it out , the amount of each tupe of shell can be edited in the basic.cfg file
and they are parts of the menu1024 file that have been disabled were stoping the
shells from showing in the deckgun interface.
I've managed to get it all working how I like it.
If anybody else is interested in having their AP and Star shells back
post here and ill make it into a JSME compatible mod pack.



Hello Stew,

I hope you enjoy good weather in Australia this time. :sunny:

Thank you for your offer. As far as concerns me, I don't need a JSGME work, I would like to know just the lines inside menu1024 you tweaked. If is possible to copy paste here just the this piece of text, I will be very happy.

Thank you in advance. :salute:

[Stew U-582]

Im sorry I cant remember exactly witch lines I edited but ill give you the basic
run down.

I modified two files using the windows "notepad" as the text editor
file 1 : SilentHunterIII/Data/Cfg/Basic.cfg

I used the find function by typing in "AMMO_TYPE" this should take you
to this set of Lines

[AMMO_TYPE0];10.5cm SK C/32
Idx=0
Year=1939
Month=1
;AP=40
;HE=60
;SS=20
AP=0
HE=110
SS=0
Renown=0

After making a copy of the original file I changed the values to this

[AMMO_TYPE0];10.5cm SK C/32
Idx=0
Year=1939
Month=1
;AP=40
;HE=60
;SS=20
AP=110
HE=220
SS=50
Renown=0

There are follwing sections for the different guns and different years
that can bee changed in the same way.

you can set the ammounts to what you like but without changing
the next file you wont get the different ammo types on the deck gun interface
and wont be able to select the Ap or Star shells.
Thats where the next bit comes in.

File 2: SilentHunterIII/Data/Menu/menu_1024_768.ini

this one was a bit more tricky and I dont remember every change in exact detail
but the procedure is quite simple.
Backup your original.
use the find command to find "G38" there is a section about the deck gun
the text below is from the original.

#########################################

[G38 I1]
Name=Page deckgun
Type=1027;Menu page
ItemID=0x38000000
ParentID=0x0
Pos=0,0,0,0
LoadingMode=2
[G38 I2]
Name=;SS_label
Type=1029;Static text
ItemID=0x38000014
ParentID=0x38000000
Pos=901,212,27,20
Color=;0xB4B4B4FE
Font=;14
Text=;674
TextFlags=;0x5
[G38 I3]
Name=;SS_shell
Type=1031;Stat bmp array
ItemID=0x38000004
ParentID=0x38000000
Pos=904,320,21,128
Color=0xFFFFFFFF
Materials=3
Display=2;Linear
Mat 0=;data/menu/gui/Shells/SS_shell.tga
Crop 0=0,0,0.33,1
Mat 1=;data/menu/gui/Shells/SS_shell.tga
Crop 1=0.33,0,0.33,1
Mat 2=;data/menu/gui/Shells/SS_shell.tga
Crop 2=0.66,0,0.33,1
MatFlags=;0x1
TexFmt=;0x5
Drag=;false
BmpState=;1
NeedFocus=;true
SelOne=;true
IdGroup=;0
StatesColors=;0xFFFFFFFF, 0xFFFFFFFF, 0xFFFFFFFF, 0xFFFFFFFF
;ToolTipText=;2233


################################################## ####

and the text below here is a sample of what I edited.
by removing the ";" from some lines I was able to reinstate the
graphic for the star shells. Be carefull not every instance of ";" is to be
removed. Dont remove the ";" in the line

Type=1029;Static text

ther could be other instances you will have to look carefully. basically you only
want to remove the ones directly after an = sign. The ; simbol has been
placed to invalidate the following command , you want to put it back.

Further down the list are the other guns used in Sh3 you can apply this
technique to further lines , enabling the AP ammo you can allso make changes to
the flak guns enabling Ap + He ammo.

I have Deck guns with Ap , He or Star shells and flak guns with AP 7 He Shells.

[G38 I1]
Name=Page deckgun
Type=1027;Menu page
ItemID=0x38000000
ParentID=0x0
Pos=0,0,0,0
LoadingMode=2
[G38 I2]
Name=SS_label
Type=1029;Static text
ItemID=0x38000014
ParentID=0x38000000
Pos=901,212,27,20
Color=0xB4B4B4FE
Font=14
Text=674
TextFlags=0x5
[G38 I3]
Name=SS_shell
Type=1031;Stat bmp array
ItemID=0x38000004
ParentID=0x38000000
Pos=904,320,21,128
Color=0xFFFFFFFF
Materials=3
Display=2;Linear
Mat 0=data/menu/gui/Shells/SS_shell.tga
Crop 0=0,0,0.33,1
Mat 1=data/menu/gui/Shells/SS_shell.tga
Crop 1=0.33,0,0.33,1
Mat 2=data/menu/gui/Shells/SS_shell.tga
Crop 2=0.66,0,0.33,1
MatFlags=0x1
TexFmt=0x5
Drag=false
BmpState=1
NeedFocus=true
SelOne=true
IdGroup=0
StatesColors=0xFFFFFFFF, 0xFFFFFFFF, 0xFFFFFFFF, 0xFFFFFFFF
;ToolTipText=2233


I hope you are able to figure out what ive done.

if you want I could upload complete copies of my Basic.cfg and Menu1024 files.
just post here.

Ive found the Star shells most usefull as Im using OLC and at night time it
gets so dark I cant Identify Flags , even in exterior view. The Star Shells sort
that problem.

As far as captains not having Star Shells fortunatly Ive got a mate at the Lorient
supply deport and he slips me a few shells for a bottle of russian vodka each week.

Im the captain of my boat and ill take anything I can get to help me in completing
my mission. Remember this is total war.

Just one final word,
Make sure you backup your files before eiting. I am not a mod master and im
supprised I was able to work this out , I dont want to be responsible for messing
up anybodys SH3 install as I dont have the experience to help people fix it again if
they do.


Stu

[Stew U-582]

:down:



Sorry didnt get your message,
it seems you forgot to type anything.

If you have any questions or constructive sugestions I would
be glad to hear them.




Stu

[Laufen zum Ziel]

Well explained for an admitted non-modder. Thanks.

I may not use due to historical correctness but the dark
nights do bother me & the star shell appear interesting
to me.

would appreciate a posting with your correct changes.

[Stew U-582]

ive uploaded my modified Basic.cfg & Menu1024 files to
filefront. If your interested in looking at the changes you
could download these files and compare them to your own.
If anybody does download these files to be used as replacements
for thier existing files keep in mind Im using GWX3.0 gold with OLC gold.
They wont work on GWX3.0 alone.
Allso the Anti Aircraft shell will allso appear with the AP , HE and Star shells
this is only because I enabled them by accident and havnt bothered to change
it back.
You can apply the same changes as listed in the above post to any
version of GWX to enable the different types of ammo.

Link to Files
http://hosted.filefront.com/studickin


stu

[RoaldLarsen]

uboats carried neither AP or SS

Have you got a source to cite to back up that claim, or is it just that nobody has cited a source indicating that SS and AP were sometimes carried?

It seems to me that what we know is:
- the 88mm deck gun had the ability to fire SS and AP
- SS and AP rounds that could be fired by this gun were actually manufactured
- many u-boats did not carry SS or AP on many of their patrols

What I have not yet seen is any evidence that u-boats never carried SS or AP. This evidence could be in the form of:
- an exhaustive study of all loading manifests
- an order prohibiting u-boats from carrying SS or AP
- a technical manual giving reasons why AP or SS could not be used in a u-boat
- etc.
Nor have I seen any evidence that u-boats ever did carry SS or AP.

We can agree that at best SS and AP were rarely used. However, rarity of use doesn't prevent the game from providing us with Falke torpedoes, which as far as I can tell were only used operationally in three boats on one patrol each.

[Sailor Steve]

Campbell's Naval Weapons of World War Two doesn't say no, but it does say 'destroyers and minesweepers'. It doesn't say 'only', but there it is.

[Stew U-582]

Thankyou for your comments guys,
very interesting.

As was said , there were SS & Ap shells available and I think its up to
each captain to decide. I found a use for them and personaly I think its
good fun to shoot off a star shell in the pitch black of night. It looks Awsome ,
and as I said before im using OLC Gold and sometimes it gets so dark at night
its imposible to identify witch flag is being flown.
Ill try and get some screen shots next time I play.

Stew

[Trefoil]

I used to alter the files, in a similar fashion, to allow the use of star shells, to simulate the use of incendiary shells, which U-Boats did, routinely, carry. It was common practice to begin a bombardment on a ship by firing 10 rounds of incendiary shells in order to get a good marking point, before switching to HE shells. (Documented in 'The U-Boat Commander's Handbook' & other accounts). Not technically accurate, I know, as star shells & incendiary shells have totally different characteristics, but as you say, Stew U-582, they are good fun to shoot, especially at night:yep:.

I use OLC's UberMod & have the same problem identifying ships at night. You can use the Weapons Officer's 'Recommend Target' icon to confirm the ship's status. If you are stalking a neutral ship & click the icon, you will get a 'Cannot recommend target' response. I try not to overuse this feature & don't, necessarily, consider it a 'Cheat' as the First Officer did assist the captain in identifying targets etc., especially in night, surface attacks. (& probably has better, younger eyesight, than myself:).)

I have seen mention of SAP (Semi-Armour piercing) rounds being carried by U-Boats. For example -

'The very next night Degan ordered the U-701 to the surface, only to again find this pesky adversary nearby. Anxious to eliminate this threat to his patrol, Degan ordered the 88mm deck gun into action. The gun crew began a rapid fire barrage directed at the cutter, which returned fire from only machine guns. This gun battle lasted almost an hour and the deck gun crew of the U-701 used every type shell in the ready ammo locker, firing an unorthodox mixture of SAP, HE and incendiary shells at the target.'

Can any military expert explain what SAP rounds would normally have been used for?

[Laufen zum Ziel]

ive uploaded my modified Basic.cfg & Menu1024 files to
filefront. If your interested in looking at the changes you
could download these files and compare them to your own.
If anybody does download these files to be used as replacements
for thier existing files keep in mind Im using GWX3.0 gold with OLC gold.
They wont work on GWX3.0 alone.
Allso the Anti Aircraft shell will allso appear with the AP , HE and Star shells
this is only because I enabled them by accident and havnt bothered to change
it back.
You can apply the same changes as listed in the above post to any
version of GWX to enable the different types of ammo.

Why will it not work unless you have OLC gold?

I run GWX 3 with a bunch of mods but not OLC.

[Stew U-582]

Sorry I may not have explained verry well.

The editing procedure I outlined earlier will work on any version or mod as long
as you edit your own current instalation of " Baic & Menu " files.
Ive uploaded my edited versions specifically to enable people find &to compare
just the edited sections with their files. I am not 100% sure but
I imagine OLC Gold & GWX3.0 has modifications allready applied to these two files.
Its allso possible that other mods im using have changed other parts of these two files.
Basically dont download my filefront " Basic & Menu" files and use them to replace
your own. It may only work if you have exactly the same install as myself.
The reason for this is I never intended this to be a release of any sort and I only
supplied my data because I couldnt remember exactly what I had changed and
somebody requested a look at the sections I changed.
If anbody wants to go through the sections line by line and document the changes
and make a mod from it they are wellcome as ive provided the material to do so.

hope that makes sence

Stew

[NGT]

@Stew U-582

Sorry for the delay

Finally, I am online: Thank you for the answer from 9 Feb. 2009. :salute:

It was useful. Now I have SS shells. :up:

[FIREWALL]

Jimbuna made 2 deckgun mods for 3.0 Gold to give a choice. :up:

Sailor Steve imho is a library of information and he not saying yes or no.

I'm sure they had flare guns and, with the constraints of the game this is the only alternative.


SOooo... If you or anyone else has a mod to contribute by all means do so.:salute:

You need no one's vote or permission.

[Sailor Steve]

Actually I am saying no, but with reservations. I was out of library time and didn't get to qualify. Naval Weapons Of World War Two, by John Campbell, is the main source for all such questions, and under the 8.8cm and 10.5cm guns he says "Illuminating and Armor Piercing for destroyers and minesweepers", which is not absolute but does certainly indicate that they weren't used by submarines. That is what led to them being left out of GWX in the first place.

Secondly, while I can see having some starshells to light up the night, each one carried is one less round that could be used for sinking a ship. As for AP, what would a sub use it for? Destroyers? Destroyers carried no armor at all, except for a small amount on the turret faces. The smallest armored ship is a light cruiser, and if you want to take on eight-to-twelve 6" guns with your single 3.46" gun, then I guess you might need some.

All that having been said,
What I have not yet seen is any evidence that u-boats never carried SS or AP. This evidence could be in the form of:
- an exhaustive study of all loading manifests
- an order prohibiting u-boats from carrying SS or AP
- a technical manual giving reasons why AP or SS could not be used in a u-boat
- etc.
Nor have I seen any evidence that u-boats ever did carry SS or AP.

We can agree that at best SS and AP were rarely used. However, rarity of use doesn't prevent the game from providing us with Falke torpedoes, which as far as I can tell were only used operationally in three boats on one patrol each.
That is also true, especially the part about needing to see every single armorer's report to be absolutely certain, and that there is no proof that they never did.

It's good to have choices in the game, and while it's fun to argue fine points it's also true that we do a lot of other things they couldn't (I always joke about external views whenever anybody wants to make a better sea floor, but I use the externaly view myself).

So yeah, I'll argue that I'm pretty sure they didn't carry those types of shells, but even if I knew it for a fact I'd still say it's wrong, but it should be a choice for the player to make.:sunny: