Hardcoded

[Philipp_Thomsen]

Guys, since we can't share mods that change the executable, at least we can share what we managed to do ingame by desassembling the .exe.

Who have something to share?

[evan82]

I'm a XXI user. I know, I know I know... I dont know HTML, but I think I know where I must serch for resolved some problems with XXI, but I also think this is a tabu subject. :damn:

[Madox58]

Can you read Assembly Language?
I run a few programs that allow me to see the code
as I run the Game.
Game on one screen, code on the other.
It's pretty much a mote point.

The Game files are compressed in a wait state.
So you can't just mess with that.
Once you launch the Game it decompresses.

Depending on what is running?
memory addressing is different each time.

Is it possible to intercept the runng program?
Yes.

But you better be a VERY good programmer to do so!
And if your that good?

You wouldn't be asking.

[Jimbuna]

Guys, since we can't share mods that change the executable, at least we can share what we managed to do ingame by desassembling the .exe.

Who have something to share?

I think you should consider very carefully what you are contemplating PT.

Unless you know exactly what is involved in your proposal.

You do not want to inadvertently lead people down the garden path and possibly wreck their installations into the bargain.

I know you mean well and your intentions are good natured......but I honestly think you should heed those pearls of wisdom from Privateer. http://www.psionguild.org/forums/images/smilies/wolfsmilies/pirate.gif

[Letum]

Guys, since we can't share mods that change the executable

Why not?
The legality issues are no different to changing any other game file so long as copy
protection is not effected.

[ref]

Guys, since we can't share mods that change the executable
Why not?
The legality issues are no different to changing any other game file so long as copy
protection is not effected.

You're joking, no?
One thing is to modify data files and a completely different one to change the executables, in a very loose comparison it's like editing an MS word document and to modify MS word itself....

Ref

[Philipp_Thomsen]

Can you read Assembly Language?
I run a few programs that allow me to see the code
as I run the Game.
Game on one screen, code on the other.
It's pretty much a mote point.

The Game files are compressed in a wait state.
So you can't just mess with that.
Once you launch the Game it decompresses.

Depending on what is running?
memory addressing is different each time.

Is it possible to intercept the runng program?
Yes.

But you better be a VERY good programmer to do so!
And if your that good?

You wouldn't be asking.

I know C++ and delphi only.
I've just started learning assembly, on my own.
But don't missunderstand, I'm not encouraging people to try stuff.
I'm just asking what people managed to do so far, and what they've learned.
You said about intercepting values with the program running...
That I've tried before. But I was asking more like unassembling the .exe, changing values, and assembling again. Possible?
I'm just starting to learn it here. I saw some very interesting values in the .exe.
Just didn't mess with anything yet.
What I meant with this thread was something more like "I saw that we can fix the death screen by flooding screen" or "I saw that we can control each engine separatedly if we change this and that"
The purpose is sharing info, and not teaching how to mess with that.

I've just been much more curious than cautious... sorry!

:up:

[Philipp_Thomsen]

Guys, since we can't share mods that change the executable
Why not?
The legality issues are no different to changing any other game file so long as copy
protection is not effected.

You're joking, no?
One thing is to modify data files and a completely different one to change the executables, in a very loose comparison it's like editing an MS word document and to modify MS word itself....

Ref

As long we don't use the subsim forum to share the .exe...... :hmm:

[Philipp_Thomsen]

Guys, since we can't share mods that change the executable, at least we can share what we managed to do ingame by desassembling the .exe.

Who have something to share?

I think you should consider very carefully what you are contemplating PT.

Unless you know exactly what is involved in your proposal.

You do not want to inadvertently lead people down the garden path and possibly wreck their installations into the bargain.

I know you mean well and your intentions are good natured......but I honestly think you should heed those pearls of wisdom from Privateer. http://www.psionguild.org/forums/images/smilies/wolfsmilies/pirate.gif

I know! :up:

To be honest, I was waiting for his answer on this thread! :D

[Wolfehunter]

PT I think if you know what your doing you should explore. If its fixing the game go for it. I don't know those programing skill but you do.

Ubisoft has long forgoten SH3 so if an independent wishes to fix a few bad eggs then all means do it.

If you want to make it public I would suggest asking ubi for permission. Who knows?

Goodluck dude.;)

[Letum]

Guys, since we can't share mods that change the executable
Why not?
The legality issues are no different to changing any other game file so long as copy
protection is not effected.
You're joking, no?
One thing is to modify data files and a completely different one to change the executables, in a very loose comparison it's like editing an MS word document and to modify MS word itself....

Ref

No. Your user agreement forbids editing of any game files.
It does not say that editing some files is worse than editing others.

It is just as illegal to edit the .exe as it is to edit .tga files

It does get more illegal when you break other laws such as the EU's copyright
circumvention laws, but that is not a issue here.


What is more likely to lead to a actual prosecution is another matter.

[anzacmick]

total grey area this one is.........

I always wondered why is it ok to port SH4 ships over to SH3 for everyone to use(whether u have bought SH4 or not), its akin to stealing from a different game, but yet playing with the .EXE is a no no.....:88)
:hmm:
not being a **** stirrer.....but this makes no sense at all....none..

Im sure UBI would not like parts of a newer game being ripped en`mass for free use, but alas....nothing has been said by any of the legal eagles.....EVER....
not even a warning.......

Im also sure the film industry wouldnt like the ripping of a movies audio for a "game" the das boot movie has been raped for sounds.....
thing is, no one is doing any of this to make a profit, its kinda "in house", that is only us sub nerds use it.... Im sure thats why the blind eye is being used by these mega companys.... again.... just my 2 bobs worth:|\\

[JU_88]

Its double edged sword, there have been quite a few PC game expansions and gold editions where a developer/publisher has actually included modders work in th e product (providing its to high standard and doesnt break anything) why not?
Look at the way Halflife supported modders? as a result we have Team fortress Classic and Counterstrike.

[Madox58]

I got a really Cold reception when I fist joined here
when I asked about DLL stuff.

I've also asked, through channels since then,
how UBI would look upon this approach.

I never got a 'go for it' or a 'no way Dude'.

It's my feeling that UBI allows what we are doing now
because it does help them.

They may be waiting to see what can be done to the Hard code
before slapping our wrists?
:hmm:

If that is indeed the case?
I'd say make the adjustments,
then sent the example work to someone with UBI and
see what is said before posting ANYTHING here at SubSim.

And if this is to be attempted?
Discuss it on a private forum.
Again, to protect SubSim from any back lash.

To argue the EULA is pointless.
Some Courts would say UBI negated the EULA by allowing what they have
for over 3 years.
Other Courts would say We accepted the EULA and are still bound by it.
:doh:

Lawyer types can argue that stuff.
And who here can afford to fight UBI in Court?
:nope:

[Letum]

Could someone ask the subsim staff about this?#


If a private forum id required, could someone inform me about it. ;)

[Dowly]

Could someone ask the subsim staff about this?

SubSim has nothing to do with this. You need to ask from Ubi. Obviously, they allow their data files to be modified, no idea about the .exe. It's kind of a "silent rule" among modders all around the world not to tamper with the .exe, but I dont know what's Ubi's stance in it.

As for porting ships from SH4 to SHIII, again, that's Ubi's decision, whether to allow them or not. Take OFP for example, back in the day when the add-on, Resistance, was published someone made an winter version of the new island that was included. As an result the dev team contacted the modding sites to take down the mod as it was giving ppl stuff for free, from which the player should've had paid for to get.

[Letum]

Could someone ask the subsim staff about this?
SubSim has nothing to do with this. You need to ask from Ubi. Obviously, they allow their data files to be modified, no idea about the .exe. It's kind of a "silent rule" among modders all around the world not to tamper with the .exe, but I dont know what's Ubi's stance in it.


Perhaps we should assume they take the stance the did with the modification of the IL2 .exe

[skwasjer]

I don't know that stance, but in any case you should not assume anything, other than that they will not like it, unless they explicitly stated otherwise.

Modifying content is one thing, modifying binaries (read: compiled code) and sharing knowledge about it is another. Any reverse engineering of game logic can harm their intelectual property and knowledge, and as such they will not tolerate any tampering with the game binaries, unless they explicitly provide the tools, documentation and api's for it.

The fact that they allow modding of their content files is also somewhat risky to their business because their hard work on modelling etc, could easily be used by other people and companies around the world. The only thing that outweighs this is that it allows a community to keep a game alive longer that it's intented lifespan, thus generating more revenue, and free advertising.

In the end, the technology is worth more than the content, as without the core technology, you can have all the content in the world, you still won't have a game. Yet with technology, you could easily create new (and different) games easier (see SH4 and UBM, which are based on the same technology as SH3), something which any game developer will surely protect by all means (and with every right).

[AVGWarhawk]

Guys, since we can't share mods that change the executable
Why not?
The legality issues are no different to changing any other game file so long as copy
protection is not effected.
You're joking, no?
One thing is to modify data files and a completely different one to change the executables, in a very loose comparison it's like editing an MS word document and to modify MS word itself....

Ref

No. Your user agreement forbids editing of any game files.
It does not say that editing some files is worse than editing others.

It is just as illegal to edit the .exe as it is to edit .tga files

It does get more illegal when you break other laws such as the EU's copyright
circumvention laws, but that is not a issue here.


What is more likely to lead to a actual prosecution is another matter.

Let not find out on the last point mentioned.